71 réponses à ce sujet

[ODST Steve]

galbergoth wrote...

Ok, then if killing isn't a big deal, why does he boast about it? And if he had half a brain he would never let on how dangerous he really is, especially if he was already betrayed by someone he trusted. He doesn't know Shepard from Adam, why would he trust him/her with the truth of what he's capable of? A man of action like he claims to be would always show his ability through action, and never with his mouth. That's why I like Thane. He IS dangerous and deadly, but he doesn't brag about what he's done or how he did it. He sees it as his body was a well-crafted tool for taking life. Which makes a hell-of-lot more sense psychologically.

Too Zaeed killing is a big deal but in a different way. To you and I killing is a BAD big deal. To Zaeed and other people we may call "Red Necks" (I hate to use that term but it is the best way to describe Zaeed) killing is a big deal in that it is fun and adrenalin pumping.

PS: I knew right away talkning to you that you would like Thane. Someone who is remoseful for his actions for he knows they are bad. That is why Zaeed boasts and brags because killing to him isn't bad. To him it is fun. Again that is why I love this game because it brings forth many different personalities.

Modifié par ODST Steve, 28 mars 2010 - 12:56 .

[Kurupt87]

Zaeed is a merc, he gets jobs and pay based on his skills and reputation. So a big part of who he is comes from his mouth, it drives up his price. Zaeed is hired to perform anything his employee wants, from bodyguarding to escorting to wiping out a rival gang to stealing something from dangerous people.

Thane would have a rep too, but only with people "in the know", like Liara, SB and people like that. He is based on stealth and is tasked to kill one person, anyone else that dies is collateral. I would like Thane, if not for his epic levels of self delusion he'd be one of my favourite chars, as it is, I prefer Zaeed.

[galbergoth]

That is just plain ignorant. Someone's reputation as anything has NOTHING to do with what they say. I don't care how good someone says they are at skateboarding, or drawing, or fighting until I SEE it. And when someone wants me to PAY them to do something, they better have more than words. And I guarantee that a real life Zaeed would sock the in-game Zaeed in the nose for running his mouth. If it were all about running your mouth than that loser in Infinity come back from the first ME might as well have taken his place because he does the same thing. Just walks around talking about how awesome he is.



And I don't know how else to say this, but I didn't say anything about right and wrong concerning killing and it's getting redundant that you continually put those words in my mouth. Psychologically, Zaeed's character is false. Has nothing to do with society or the way the world is. Zaeed reminds me more of Beowolf from the newest Beowolf movie. Sure he's done some impressive stuff, but he just looks like an ass when he boasts about it.



Like I said to begin with, I've met people who have killed people. They don't act like that and would probably laugh someone out of the room for talking like Zaeed does.

[Radahldo]

well at this point you are just having a problem with how mercenaries, in general, are potrayed in-game.. since they are all boasting, haranguing, blowhards. Just looking at Zaeed says a lot to legitimacy.

Moreover, Zaeeds dossier mentions him as drinking and getting into fights on omega-- so he does open his mouth, and it seems no one successfully shuts him up.

[DiatribeEQ]

I like battles that have got Zaeed & Garrus as my squadmates when I'm on my Engineer or Infiltrator.

[Kurupt87]

galbergoth, the societal difference is important. You may have met soldiers in real life. That doesn't change the fact that you haven't met soldiers from the ME universe. You are expecting them to behave like they are from our society, they are not from our society. Psychologically we can't comment on Zaeeds character because we don't know how he was raised, what morals the ME universe has etc. Each of us is the sum of the influences that have shaped us. The ME universe is closest to, as far as I can tell, the "Wild West" period of NA history.

Also, as to Zaeed driving his price up by his mouth, it also drives up the difficulty of his missions, the two go hand in hand. If he succeeds his mission, coming back alive, then it proves he was/is right to big himself up. Anyone that bigs himself up that isn't up to task would die on the mission or refuse it, and that would become common knowledge to everyone in the merc hiring business.

[Bill569]

I like Zaeed. Especially his voice and his style. He may be ruthless, but he is not heartless. Do you remember what he said when Vido started hiring batarians: "Cheap labor he said. Goddamned terrorists I said". Hell, Jack is way more ruthless than he is. You need to romance her in order for her to say one whole sentence without using the word f***. And he does have a background. He founded the Blue Suns. You need more than that?

Modifié par Bill569, 28 mars 2010 - 07:59 .

[casedawgz]

I like him a lot, actually. There's no BS with Zaeed. He doesn't have emotional baggage for you to fix, and he doesn't want to be your friend. He's there because he's being paid to follow your orders and shoot whoever you tell him to shoot, and he does it without question. A bad person? Probably, but he's entertaining as hell, and he's one of the most useful squadmates as far as combat is concerned.

[Prophet of Rage]

Zaeed's voice actor alone makes him the best character on the crew.





aside from Grunt, maybe. ;>

[Mutantcadet14]

KOKitten wrote...

I made sure Vido died at the end of Zaeed's loyalty mission with both my Renegade and Paragon characters for the same reason that I always kill Balak in Bring Down the Sky. We're getting rid of a dangerous character who otherwise would be allowed to escape and continue to kill.
When we arrive on Zorya, we come across a pile of innocent workers that Vido killed and left to rot as a warning. The Blue Suns took over that refinery and forced the workers into slave labor. How many innocent people did Vido kill or enslave over the past 20 years? If allowed to escape, how many more will he continue to kill and enslave?
During the game we find other evidence showing the sort of person Vido is at the archaelogical dig site at Joab, on the MSV Strontium Mule and at the Blue Suns base on Sanctum. The Blue Suns are hired to help with transporation on an archeological dig and Vido tells his men to torture the contact until they find out what's being transported, kill him afterwards and then double-cross (and kill) the employers to steal their Prothean artifact.
Zaeed is not a saint by any means. I think BioWare created a very complex character in Zaeed and then implemented him in a poor manner. The missing dialogue wheel seems to give a lot of people hesitation to take him on missions or to listen to his stories after each mission. I know I didn't think there was anything special about him, besides his inferno grenade, until I took him with me on Jack's loyalty mission. Hearing his opinions on what was done to those children made me look at him in a different light.
On one hand you have a hardened mercenary who seems like he doesn't care about anything but revenge or pay. But through missions and stories you find out that Zaeed rescued an 8-year old girl from slavers, fought kidnapping and slaving rings, was shot in the head by Vido for refusing to hire terrorists, was disgusted by the volus Pitne For since he'd "sell out his friend for money," said any CO who did what Jacob's father did to his men deserved a knife in his spine, was absolutely horrified by what was done to the children at the Pragia facility and tells you that he realizes that fighting the Collectors and Reapers make everything else he's been paid for seem like small time.
It's just my opinion, which is neither right nor wrong, but that sort of character is much more interesting and realistic to me that someone who is 100% noble or 100% evil.

I couldn't agree more. on every point. Well zaeed wasn't as well traveled in my game but still.

also i feel Zaeed is a valuable addition to the cast. IF anyone was a weak character in my mind it is samara. Flat background, flat morals, and flat existance. She lacks the intrigue that seemingly every other character has. She is ALMOST redeemed in my mind by the fact that she has a decent loyalty mission but even then i feel all of the intrigue is from the similar but far more interesting Morinth but thats a different discussion.

Modifié par Mutantcadet14, 29 mars 2010 - 02:21 .

[incinerator950]

galbergoth wrote...

That is just plain ignorant. Someone's reputation as anything has NOTHING to do with what they say. I don't care how good someone says they are at skateboarding, or drawing, or fighting until I SEE it. And when someone wants me to PAY them to do something, they better have more than words. And I guarantee that a real life Zaeed would sock the in-game Zaeed in the nose for running his mouth. If it were all about running your mouth than that loser in Infinity come back from the first ME might as well have taken his place because he does the same thing. Just walks around talking about how awesome he is.

And I don't know how else to say this, but I didn't say anything about right and wrong concerning killing and it's getting redundant that you continually put those words in my mouth. Psychologically, Zaeed's character is false. Has nothing to do with society or the way the world is. Zaeed reminds me more of Beowolf from the newest Beowolf movie. Sure he's done some impressive stuff, but he just looks like an ass when he boasts about it.

Like I said to begin with, I've met people who have killed people. They don't act like that and would probably laugh someone out of the room for talking like Zaeed does.

Quoting on legitamacy, most people who kill for a living, or are military and do their jobs, are usually not on the line of talking about their exploits, even if they are de-classified. 

The Dossier came strait from TIM, saying that he is the most notorious Bounty Hunter in the Terminus, not to mention Co-founder of the Blue Sons, and well experienced Ground Combat Mercenary.

[KenKenpachi]

galbergoth wrote...

That is just plain ignorant. Someone's reputation as anything has NOTHING to do with what they say. I don't care how good someone says they are at skateboarding, or drawing, or fighting until I SEE it. And when someone wants me to PAY them to do something, they better have more than words. And I guarantee that a real life Zaeed would sock the in-game Zaeed in the nose for running his mouth. If it were all about running your mouth than that loser in Infinity come back from the first ME might as well have taken his place because he does the same thing. Just walks around talking about how awesome he is.

And I don't know how else to say this, but I didn't say anything about right and wrong concerning killing and it's getting redundant that you continually put those words in my mouth. Psychologically, Zaeed's character is false. Has nothing to do with society or the way the world is. Zaeed reminds me more of Beowolf from the newest Beowolf movie. Sure he's done some impressive stuff, but he just looks like an ass when he boasts about it.

Like I said to begin with, I've met people who have killed people. They don't act like that and would probably laugh someone out of the room for talking like Zaeed does.

Ehh I mainly just lurk around here, haven't even changed my display name but, I have to say I dissagree on this score. I've spent time with the 82nd and Rangers as well with on base soldiers of the GB out at Fort Bragg while in uniform, and I'll tell you some of them would brag on the skills and "war stories" they had, hell I think in the mess we had a conversation on how to kill a man with a spoon, but these are elite soldiers and when I've seen "normal" Army the differances are striking. But they never did this in public mainly with fellow unit mates. My Wifes Father actully was a forced conscripted for the Viet Cong and he often tells war stories to me with a "Glee" in his eyes as if relishing those times he fought and killed, I never questioned this given he field striped an AK-47 of mine and made comments about the Chinese made one and he further more placed his shots well with it. And my Grand Father fought in the 2nd world war, and he would tell me his war stories all the grizzly detials too, and I've seen his service record to support those claims.

Shepard in Zaeed's mind I'm sure is someone he thinks he can talk openly too on this. Hell I myself will "brag" on exploits I had durning my time to those I know and even on my spars and such in hand to hand to other guys into that sort of thing. Some people are just more agressive and take pride in the challanges they overcome. I suspect Zaeed won't go up to a stranger and go

"Yeah I killed 50 men with a knife!" But he would to another soldier with as we called it "the look". Some people take pride in naked aggression and the power you have in your own hands. Some Armies in present day Earth even encourage this way of thinking, even some units in modern Western Forces. For instance in Iraq typical infantry responses when attacked is bunker down and call for support, and travel in armor. In the 82nd among the local jihad's had a rep for charging, chassing down and killing who placed a shot at us and often patroling on foot. Course most of the other infantry units seen that as being a bunch of fruit cakes so to speak.

But no I don't find what he does strange at all, I mean at least he doesn't laugh about the guy he tricked coming over a log from the enemy side and blasting him in the face, or how his buddy got hit by a rocket and was missing half of his body. Some soldiers do talk. When you've been around soldiers and fighters as long as I have..you can tell who's talk and whos to keep an eye on, just by how they stand.

Modifié par KenKenpachi, 30 mars 2010 - 02:48 .

[spacehamsterZH]

I dunno, it's pretty simple for me - Zaeed's loyalty quest is the only one in the game where you're confronted with a difficult question and basically have to ask yourself if what this guy's asking in return for his loyalty is worth it. With all the others, it's pretty simple stuff, except maybe for Garrus, but IIRC you end up gaining his loyalty either way. On my second playthrough with my "canon" Shep, I made a point of NOT going along with Zaeed's request and didn't get the necessary dialogue option to gain his loyalty anyway, and to me, that's one of the biggest decisions in ME2 that make my Shepard the kind of character I want him to be. I'd say that makes Zaeed's loyalty quest a pretty "goddam" good piece of RPG-in'.

[Shep309]

You all have done some good convincing. I tended to avoid him like the plague when choosing my party, he just never interested me that much, but after reading this thread I think I'll try a playthrough with him in my party at all times just to experience what you're all talking about.

If it goes badly, I'm going to personally blame all of you and I know where you live.

[Darthslim40]

Zaeed is a great character. He has history, and its a history of hard knocks and knocking back. I like his gravelly, screw you, attitude. Perfect team member for my renagade shepard!

[Baskervore]

galbergoth wrote...

I have come to love the Mass Effect series more than most games I've ever played and I've played quite a few, but BioWare, you did something that seriously disappointed me.

Every character on Sheperds crew has a purpose, a personality, a role to play and a history.  No matter how different they all are, they all have something likeable and realistic about them.  They all feel like real people who belong in the story.

Zaeed does not.  Not even a little bit.  If I were Shepard, I'd tell the Illusive Man to go screw himself because I'm not taking this ego-maniac on my ship.  Sure, Jack is dangerous but she's been through alot and that leaves emotional scars.  And regardless of this, she feels like a real person who wants to be on the crew.  Zaeed is like a chapter no one wanted being added to a book that was already perfect.  I'm considering reistalling Mass Effect 2 and even losing my savegame, just so I can get rid of Zaeed.

Like I said, I am instensely disappointed that this happened.  That you would add a character that has virtually no background and pretty much does nothing but boast about what a badass little bounty hunter he is.  If I were on the Normandy, I'd pretend he didn't exist, I'd never talk to him, I'd be asking Shepard to kick him the hell out.

So I'm begging the powers that be to just forget Zaeed ever existed.  I pray that in Mass Effect 3 he is cleanly swept under a rug, rolled in the rug, and tossed in a dumpster.  In my oppinion, Zaeed was a mistake.  I seriously doubt there was anyone in the forums whining about how they wish there was an egotistical australian bounty hunter with no life, no history, no family, no emotions and nothing to say that doesn't have something to do with how awesome he is.

In closing, I hope to never see Zaeed in ME3 and if I do, I'm probably not going to play it.  That's how disappointed I am that BioWare allowed this polution in their game.

  Zaeed does seem a bid hodgepoge, but he's better than the mako.

[mopotter]

When I first brought him on the team I didn't care for him. Joker said he was like Shepard except he gets paid which I did find interesting. I've gone down and listened to his stories more and he's starting to grow on me. As far as taking him with me, it depends on my character. I've found him useful.

[CrazyCatDude]

My biggest problem with Zaeed is, if I do his loyalty mission before the collector base, there's no option to kill him, and my Shepard *would* shoot the scum bag, right through his good eye. Then through his bad eye. Then between them. Then through the heart, just for good measure.



Rage may be a hell of an anesthetic, but he ain't living through that.

[MyChemicalBromance]

Just burn him...

[imnotjakeybot]

@ the OP



Actually, I loved Zaeed. He's a cool, hardened bounty hunter. In fact, since you mention Jack, I'd have rather just left her on the Purgatory. Laughing at her the whole time from the Normandy observation deck as the turians escort her back to her cell.



To each their own I guess.

[NaclynE]

I am mixed feelings with him.

I think he goes with with Sheeda whoes one of my adapts because in my hand written stories shes a bounty hunter whoes a bit of a snoot herself and her tagging along with a more experinced old snoot like Zaeed seems to go hand and hand. although yeah I went paragon but I hated the paragon actions you make in his loyalty mission like the first one where you punch him in the face for shooting the crap out of the place to tsrat a fire. She would more likely tell him "Hey! Because of you and your lil rampage this whole place is on the verge of blowing the **** up. May I suggest we do what we need to do then get the **** out of here." without popping him in the face. That seemed out of character for her beacuse she repects fellow bounty hunters since she's one. However I was glad the rest went well even though my character would of appologized and told him that she would do whatever the heck it would take to take down the guy and send him to the fryer.

On the flip side I do agree there are a few things I don't like like limited diolog and rarely shows up in cinematics and when you talk to him in the Normandy he has no zoom shot like everyone else does. I don't know if he was a last minute entry put in by bioware or a lackluster made by Bioware where they put him in and realized he wasn't working out to be a actual cast memeber so they merely had him as a semi add on as an option for the gamer if interested.

He's ok storywise but not all that great. combat wise he's awsome. He's semi worth it but He can be lived without.



PS: How do you kill Zado in the loyalty mission if you go paragon? Snipe him to death? He escaped for me.