701 réponses à ce sujet

[kraidy1117]

RyrineaNara wrote...

I'm not a idiot just because I actually pay attention to the story. They put his/her team in danger contently. Yet people defend them.

Yes you are in idiot because you refuse to see that without Cerberus Shepard would have failed.

[kraidy1117]

Shandepared wrote...

kraidy1117 wrote...

As Bucky said yesterday to me, you're an idiot.

Fixed that for you.

Thank you kind sir.

[TheLostGenius]

 Was Armistan's Bane's TIM? Also that agent that contacts you about the Cereberus operative who works for the Shadow Broker was intriguing. Pretty much state yu can choose to ally yourself with teh Shadow Broker, or get on his bad side. MTL Bioware will ignore that event even happened.

[SimonTheFrog]

Shandepared wrote...

SimonTheFrog wrote...


But BioWare missed the chance in ME1 to show the player any "good goals" of Cerberus at all. And i hope we can all agree on that one.

If wanting to advance humankind and protect human interests isn't a "good goal" then what is?

Please re-read the sentence. Take particular notice of the word "show". Then remember that i am talking about ME1. There is no reference to "advance humankind and protect human interests" in ME1 plus we never "see" any good result coming from their experiments. 

I agree that experiments don't necessarily have any good impact right away. But we also don't see any good results from earlier Cerberus experiments. It would have been so easy for BioWare to give as a more complex and ambiguous impression about Cerberus (still talking about ME1) if they only had wanted to. Just one NPC that justifies the experiments, one console with some interesting message about their noble goals, one message from Hackett that helps us understand their motivation. But there is nothing in that direction. They are simply put there as the "bad guys". 

[RyrineaNara]

kraidy1117 wrote...

RyrineaNara wrote...

I'm not a idiot just because I actually pay attention to the story. They put his/her team in danger contently. Yet people defend them.

Yes you are in idiot because you refuse to see that without Cerberus Shepard would have failed.

I don't refuse to see that actualy, but I still can call them terroist. <_<

[kraidy1117]

TheLostGenius wrote...

 Was Armistan's Bane's TIM? Also that agent that contacts you about the Cereberus operative who works for the Shadow Broker was intriguing. Pretty much state yu can choose to ally yourself with teh Shadow Broker, or get on his bad side. MTL Bioware will ignore that event even happened.

Thats what alot of people think. It's just strange that Banes is found "dead" by some men and they wind up dead, an admiral goes to look in to it and he dies by Cerberus.

[TheLostGenius]

Cereberus was shipping Rachni to settlements to "see what happens". Turns out they couldn't be controlled like intially hoped. Also Saren owned Binary Helix in part, that means Cerberus had dealings with Saren, and now you do Cereberus's biddings? Cereberus is evil. Thoomas was one of the murdered soldiers from the Thresher Maw, if you follow that story in ME1 he also was brought back to life by Cereberus, though he was severly unstable after the procedure. They did a lot of unethical experiments to bring Shep back to life. Also the sole purpose for TIM to bring Shep back to life was to gain Reaper technology for his own gains. Don't be blinded by the entity that gave you life. TIM IS EVIL.

[kraidy1117]

TheLostGenius wrote...

Cereberus was shipping Rachni to settlements to "see what happens". Turns out they couldn't be controlled like intially hoped. Also Saren owned Binary Helix in part, that means Cerberus had dealings with Saren, and now you do Cereberus's biddings? Cereberus is evil. Thoomas was one of the murdered soldiers from the Thresher Maw, if you follow that story in ME1 he also was brought back to life by Cereberus, though he was severly unstable after the procedure. They did a lot of unethical experiments to bring Shep back to life. Also the sole purpose for TIM to bring Shep back to life was to gain Reaper technology for his own gains. Don't be blinded by the entity that gave you life. TIM IS EVIL.

No they wernt, Rachni did that. Cerberus shiped some to attack pirates thats it.

[TheLostGenius]

kraidy1117 wrote...

TheLostGenius wrote...

 Was Armistan's Bane's TIM? Also that agent that contacts you about the Cereberus operative who works for the Shadow Broker was intriguing. Pretty much state yu can choose to ally yourself with teh Shadow Broker, or get on his bad side. MTL Bioware will ignore that event even happened.

Thats what alot of people think. It's just strange that Banes is found "dead" by some men and they wind up dead, an admiral goes to look in to it and he dies by Cerberus.

Yea I remember. I've replayed ME1 twice since ME2 was released! He was the only Illusive* character in the game besides the Shadow Broker, who I think is Miranda's father.

[RyrineaNara]

TheLostGenius wrote...

Cereberus was shipping Rachni to settlements to "see what happens". Turns out they couldn't be controlled like intially hoped. Also Saren owned Binary Helix in part, that means Cerberus had dealings with Saren, and now you do Cereberus's biddings? Cereberus is evil. Thoomas was one of the murdered soldiers from the Thresher Maw, if you follow that story in ME1 he also was brought back to life by Cereberus, though he was severly unstable after the procedure. They did a lot of unethical experiments to bring Shep back to life. Also the sole purpose for TIM to bring Shep back to life was to gain Reaper technology for his own gains. Don't be blinded by the entity that gave you life. TIM IS EVIL.

This is what I have been trying to say, but they will not listen.

[kraidy1117]

TheLostGenius wrote...

kraidy1117 wrote...

TheLostGenius wrote...

 Was Armistan's Bane's TIM? Also that agent that contacts you about the Cereberus operative who works for the Shadow Broker was intriguing. Pretty much state yu can choose to ally yourself with teh Shadow Broker, or get on his bad side. MTL Bioware will ignore that event even happened.

Thats what alot of people think. It's just strange that Banes is found "dead" by some men and they wind up dead, an admiral goes to look in to it and he dies by Cerberus.

Yea I remember. I've replayed ME1 twice since ME2 was released! He was the only Illusive* character in the game besides the Shadow Broker, who I think is Miranda's father.

Can't be human, SB was in power before humans came to the Citidal.

[Weiser_Cain]

kraidy1117 wrote...

Weiser_Cain wrote...

I wanted to get away from Cerberus the whole game. There should have been a way to get off that ship when you went to the council!

Why? The council does not beleive you nor do they beleive the Reapers exist. Also the Alliance only moves there ass hwne rumors that Shepard is alive and is working with Cerberus. Both the Council and the Alliance are useless. Shame the one group that wants to defeat the Reapers are pro-humans.....

I don't need the council to believe me I just need my Specter status back. I don't even need a ship. I have resources and friends. Deciding what type of ship I wanted and working to get it would have been FUN. and it would have added even more replay value to the game.
[/i]

[Whitering]

I actually have one problem with ME1, the way the choice is presented at the end of the game, it's more save the council or destroy Sovereign. You are supposed to take a leap of faith that somehow diverting your fleet to save the council will still allow you to kill Sovereign because the text makes it sound as though that will not be the outcome.



After all the crap the council has put you through how many people chose to save them the first time around? I didn't. On subsequent replays it is still hard for me to make that choice even knowing what will result. I would save the Asari, she was at least reasonable, but damn the other two deserve their fate.



The thing is, it sounds as though Cerberus formed with the knowledge and support of the Alliance. Whether they changed over time or it was just inevitable that they would go rogue is an open question. We also don't know when TIM came into play and took the reigns. I believe Cerberus predates his involvement.



Maybe when he came in is when they went rogue and started doing the odd nasty thing. The thing is, it seems clear that some support for them still exists at the highest levels of the Alliance, perhaps not overt, but at least quiet support. Kahoku cannot get any traction in his inquiries likely because of that quiet support by his superiors and remember, he is an admiral.



I do not believe in "grey". If you do something you are evil, you are evil, it is not washed away by doing something good. Sheppard did more to raise humanity's profile than anything Cerberus has ever done. No shadowy organization with a substandard set of morals has never helped a nation become a better place to live for its citizens.

[SimonTheFrog]

kraidy1117 wrote...

RyrineaNara wrote...

I'm not a idiot just because I actually pay attention to the story. They put his/her team in danger contently. Yet people defend them.

Yes you are in idiot because you refuse to see that without Cerberus Shepard would have failed.

Let's not forget that we are discussing how BioWare constructed the plot and characters and whether we think they made a good job or not.

If you say that Shepard would have failed without Cerberus its because BioWare wouldn't let us try to convince the council 
No, but seriously. If we are forced to accept that the resurrection thing (which is the next big stupid plot issue ) was necessary and that Cerberus did a good job there, that still doesn't clear up the mess that BioWare produced with having (paragon even!!) Shep working with Cerberus and all the people aboard the Normandy that tell us that the "methods are harsh but noble is the goal" as if they are brainwashed or something. 

[RyrineaNara]

Weiser_Cain wrote...

kraidy1117 wrote...

Weiser_Cain wrote...

I wanted to get away from Cerberus the whole game. There should have been a way to get off that ship when you went to the council!

Why? The council does not beleive you nor do they beleive the Reapers exist. Also the Alliance only moves there ass hwne rumors that Shepard is alive and is working with Cerberus. Both the Council and the Alliance are useless. Shame the one group that wants to defeat the Reapers are pro-humans.....

I don't need the council to believe me I just need my Specter status back. I don't even need a ship. I have resources and friends. Deciding what type of ship I wanted and working to get it would have been FUN. and it would have added even more replay value to the game.
[/i]

I agree it would have added more replay value to the the game, if that was the choice in the games.

[kraidy1117]

RyrineaNara wrote...

Weiser_Cain wrote...

kraidy1117 wrote...

Weiser_Cain wrote...

I wanted to get away from Cerberus the whole game. There should have been a way to get off that ship when you went to the council!

Why? The council does not beleive you nor do they beleive the Reapers exist. Also the Alliance only moves there ass hwne rumors that Shepard is alive and is working with Cerberus. Both the Council and the Alliance are useless. Shame the one group that wants to defeat the Reapers are pro-humans.....

I don't need the council to believe me I just need my Specter status back. I don't even need a ship. I have resources and friends. Deciding what type of ship I wanted and working to get it would have been FUN. and it would have added even more replay value to the game.
[/i]

I agree it would have added more replay value to the the game, if that was the choice in the games.

Well gues what, then go work for Bioware and program it. Video games are very hard to make and expansive.

[ottoenki]

Isn't Cerberus organized in cells, where one cell doesn't know what the other is doing? I think i read that ingame somewhere.

[TheLostGenius]

kraidy1117 wrote...

TheLostGenius wrote...

kraidy1117 wrote...

TheLostGenius wrote...

 Was Armistan's Bane's TIM? Also that agent that contacts you about the Cereberus operative who works for the Shadow Broker was intriguing. Pretty much state yu can choose to ally yourself with teh Shadow Broker, or get on his bad side. MTL Bioware will ignore that event even happened.

Thats what alot of people think. It's just strange that Banes is found "dead" by some men and they wind up dead, an admiral goes to look in to it and he dies by Cerberus.

Yea I remember. I've replayed ME1 twice since ME2 was released! He was the only Illusive* character in the game besides the Shadow Broker, who I think is Miranda's father.

Can't be human, SB was in power before humans came to the Citidal.

You don't know that Miranda's father is human. Remember, she was genetically engineered.

[RyrineaNara]

kraidy1117 wrote...

RyrineaNara wrote...

Weiser_Cain wrote...

kraidy1117 wrote...

Weiser_Cain wrote...

I wanted to get away from Cerberus the whole game. There should have been a way to get off that ship when you went to the council!

Why? The council does not beleive you nor do they beleive the Reapers exist. Also the Alliance only moves there ass hwne rumors that Shepard is alive and is working with Cerberus. Both the Council and the Alliance are useless. Shame the one group that wants to defeat the Reapers are pro-humans.....

I don't need the council to believe me I just need my Specter status back. I don't even need a ship. I have resources and friends. Deciding what type of ship I wanted and working to get it would have been FUN. and it would have added even more replay value to the game.
[/i]

I agree it would have added more replay value to the the game, if that was the choice in the games.

Well gues what, then go work for Bioware and program it. Video games are very hard to make and expansive.

Yet, I know that I'm majoring in Video game design.

[kraidy1117]

SimonTheFrog wrote...

kraidy1117 wrote...

RyrineaNara wrote...

I'm not a idiot just because I actually pay attention to the story. They put his/her team in danger contently. Yet people defend them.

Yes you are in idiot because you refuse to see that without Cerberus Shepard would have failed.

Let's not forget that we are discussing how BioWare constructed the plot and characters and whether we think they made a good job or not.

If you say that Shepard would have failed without Cerberus its because BioWare wouldn't let us try to convince the council 
No, but seriously. If we are forced to accept that the resurrection thing (which is the next big stupid plot issue ) was necessary and that Cerberus did a good job there, that still doesn't clear up the mess that BioWare produced with having (paragon even!!) Shep working with Cerberus and all the people aboard the Normandy that tell us that the "methods are harsh but noble is the goal" as if they are brainwashed or something. 

Your point is. Cerberus is the only one doing anything, would you realy work with the Aliance/Council, even if you are a Paragon even when they are doing nothing, or work with Cerberus, while it might conflict with your feelings, they have the same goal as you and you can quit at the end. Sorry I rather work with Cerberus for the time being.

[kraidy1117]

TheLostGenius wrote...

kraidy1117 wrote...

TheLostGenius wrote...

kraidy1117 wrote...

TheLostGenius wrote...

 Was Armistan's Bane's TIM? Also that agent that contacts you about the Cereberus operative who works for the Shadow Broker was intriguing. Pretty much state yu can choose to ally yourself with teh Shadow Broker, or get on his bad side. MTL Bioware will ignore that event even happened.

Thats what alot of people think. It's just strange that Banes is found "dead" by some men and they wind up dead, an admiral goes to look in to it and he dies by Cerberus.

Yea I remember. I've replayed ME1 twice since ME2 was released! He was the only Illusive* character in the game besides the Shadow Broker, who I think is Miranda's father.

Can't be human, SB was in power before humans came to the Citidal.

You don't know that Miranda's father is human. Remember, she was genetically engineered.

Don't start this crap. Miri has matrial from her father, he surpoted  Cerberus and is a wealth human buisness man.