162 réponses à ce sujet

[Collider]

DVDs are really cheap, especially nowadays. And most typically unless there is some hardware involved (Guitar Hero, etc), retail Xbox 360 games are universally $60 or $40 in some cases out of release.

[Xaijin]

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

Yeah DVD's are dirt cheap. However the Console Makers control the SPECIFIC facilities and that aint cheap. Back in the day Nintendo were complete bastards in this regard.

Funny how people forget having to incur 75-90 US for 16 meg carts, cause their parents did it.

[SL22]

Xaijin wrote...

Has nothing to do with the medium, has everything to do with BEING CHARGED for them. M$ does the charging. For their console. Hence the problem is M$ and the Xbox, unless you like paying 90 bux for a three disc game. M$ decides how much royalties cost.

Once again, the problem is with DVD and its lack of space. And I doubt M$ would increase the price just because there are more discs, no one has ever done that (not that I know of)and I doubt people would let it slide.

Modifié par SL22, 29 mars 2010 - 09:38 .

[Xaijin]

DUDE.



I WORK AT A DEV.



M$ charges royalties PER DISC, EVERY DISC.



The end.

[InvaderErl]

Xaijin wrote...

DUDE.

I WORK AT A DEV.

WHEN IS DUKE NUKEM COMING OUT!?!

[IccaRa]

Collider wrote...

Tali came for her pilgrimage, not to mention wanting to see the galaxy and help against Saren (who indirectly tried to kill her). Garrus and Wrex wanted to see Saren taken down.

And? All I'm saying is that those reasons aren't exactly earth-shattering reasons to join up. Tali didn't have to join the Normandy to continue her pilgrimage. Wrex comes along just for the action. Garrus comes because he wants to see what it's like working with a Spectre. None of these are integral plot reasons. They're just "I want to, please take me?" reasons.

So when people say that the ME1 team had better reasons for joining then I have to say no, no they didn't. They made a personal choice to join, for personal motivations, just like the ME2 team does.

The only difference is that the ME1 team each had a little segment in the story (except for Kaidan and Wrex/Garrus.) Tali gives you geth data, Ashley helps you on Eden Prime (and even then some can argue that's not really plot critical), and Liara deciphers your visions. Technically there are only three ME1 team mates with any real plot value, those being Tali, Liara and Wrex/Garrus (whichever one leads you to Fist first.)

But the ME2 team also has individual plot value. Some are utilized earlier on (Miranda, Mordin) but the difference is that the ME2 team's value isn't integrated at the beginning of the game (Tali, Wrex/Garrus), or the middle (Liara) but at the end for the suicide mission. That's when they become integral.

It's different from how ME1 interwove it, but it's still there.

Either way both games approached this somewhat differently. Some people will prefer how ME1 did it, but I didn't mind ME2's take in the least.

FWIW, I like both sets of squadmembers. I don't think any one is "better" than the other, although ME2's *is* more diverse and exciting.

[Onyx Jaguar]

Xaijin wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

Yeah DVD's are dirt cheap. However the Console Makers control the SPECIFIC facilities and that aint cheap. Back in the day Nintendo were complete bastards in this regard.

Funny how people forget having to incur 75-90 US for 16 meg carts, cause their parents did it.

Chrono Trigger was ****ing worth it!  Except I couldn't afford it =(

Still probably spent over 100 bucks renting that damn thing.

Also Perfect Dark was like 70-80 bucks?  Luckily I waited a couple years and got it for ONE BUCK brand ****ing new.  Eat that economic trends EAT IT

[Xaijin]

InvaderErl wrote...

Xaijin wrote...

DUDE.

I WORK AT A DEV.

WHEN IS DUKE NUKEM COMING OUT!?!

That, is a question for the lawyers.

Literally.

[SL22]

Xaijin wrote...

DUDE.

I WORK AT A DEV.

M$ charges royalties PER DISC, EVERY DISC.

The end.

SAY YOU WORK AT THE DEV

THINK IT'S THE END OF THE DISCUSSION

Do you honestly believe M$ would charge over the standard retail price? That's suicide for game sales unless the game is stupidly popular and has fans who would buy a piece of tissue with the games name on it. There have been plenty of games with more than two discs such as Lost Odyssey that never cost more than the standard retail price.

[Onyx Jaguar]

If thats true than that sucks something fierce. Was surprised about the leak footage...

[Collider]

IccaRa wrote...
But the ME2 team also has individual plot value. Some are utilized earlier on (Miranda, Mordin) but the difference is that the ME2 team's value isn't integrated at the beginning of the game (Tali, Wrex/Garrus), or the middle (Liara) but at the end for the suicide mission. That's when they become integral.

Unfortuantely, for some reason Thane, Grunt, Zaeed, and Mordin don't really have an appointable role that they excel at. Kind of strange.

[Nightwriter]

Xaijin wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...

None of the characters in 1 or 2 are really integral to the story.

But they are integral to my experience of the story.

*DING DING*

Ooh. A ding ding. I have never been ding dinged before.

It feels good.

[Xaijin]

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

Xaijin wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

Yeah DVD's are dirt cheap. However the Console Makers control the SPECIFIC facilities and that aint cheap. Back in the day Nintendo were complete bastards in this regard.

Funny how people forget having to incur 75-90 US for 16 meg carts, cause their parents did it.

Chrono Trigger was ****ing worth it!  Except I couldn't afford it =(

Still probably spent over 100 bucks renting that damn thing.

Also Perfect Dark was like 70-80 bucks?  Luckily I waited a couple years and got it for ONE BUCK brand ****ing new.  Eat that economic trends EAT IT

Ah, working my ass off all summer to afford SFII AND Metroid, Rocket Knight for the Genesis, and then stupid FF III (6) came out.

SO MUCH WORKING.

><.

[Xaijin]

SL22 wrote...

Xaijin wrote...

DUDE.

I WORK AT A DEV.

M$ charges royalties PER DISC, EVERY DISC.

The end.

SAY YOU WORK AT THE DEV

THINK IT'S THE END OF THE DISCUSSION

Do you honestly believe M$ would charge over the standard retail price? That's suicide for game sales unless the game is stupidly popular and has fans who would buy a piece of tissue with the games name on it. There have been plenty of games with more than two discs such as Lost Odyssey that never cost more than the standard retail price.

...

You need to do some research.

[jlb524]

Nightwriter wrote...

I think one of the reasons some people may not feel as attached to the ME2 characters as opposed to ME1 is the way the ME2 characters were presented.

You HAD to go after these people, for your mission, and you HAD to do their loyalty quests. It was required. This was what the game was about. This has the unfortunate side effect of sometimes making them seem less like people and more like have-to's. The limited dialogue with them doesn't help.

I didn't mind the 'have to' of recruiting these people.  You 'had to' recruit all the ME1 squad mates, in a sense. My problem with these characters is that they have their 'one moment in the sun' and then they are forgotten by the game (and by me).   After Miranda's 'special time' in the game, she stops talking to me and I move on to help Jacob.  After I'm done with him, it's Jack's turn for the spot  light.  OK, Jack's done, now it's time for some KROGAN Thresher Maw killing!!!    By this point, I forget about Miranda, Jacob, and Jack.  Oh, and there's still like 7 more loyalty quests to go!!

It's all very episodic as opposed to having the characters weaved into the whole story.  Even if the ME1 crew had less dialog it was triggered by story progression and paced well.  I don't think ME2 did a good job with this and it leaves me with a 'meh' feeling regarding most of these characters.

[SL22]

Xaijin wrote...

SL22 wrote...

Xaijin wrote...

DUDE.

I WORK AT A DEV.

M$ charges royalties PER DISC, EVERY DISC.

The end.

SAY YOU WORK AT THE DEV

THINK IT'S THE END OF THE DISCUSSION

Do you honestly believe M$ would charge over the standard retail price? That's suicide for game sales unless the game is stupidly popular and has fans who would buy a piece of tissue with the games name on it. There have been plenty of games with more than two discs such as Lost Odyssey that never cost more than the standard retail price.

...

You need to do some research.

Really because I bought Lost Odyssey for £40 when it was released which is the standard RP in the UK.

You tell me to do research yet randomly spout that you work at a dev with no evidence and then don't counter my point.

[Xaijin]

It's all very episodic as opposed to having the characters weaved into
the whole story.  Even if the ME1 crew had less dialog it was triggered
by story progression and paced well.  I don't think ME2 did a good job
with this and it leaves me with a 'meh' feeling regarding most of these
characters.

So what would the solution be?

Modifié par Xaijin, 29 mars 2010 - 09:50 .

[Xaijin]

SL22 wrote...

Xaijin wrote...

SL22 wrote...

Xaijin wrote...

DUDE.

I WORK AT A DEV.

M$ charges royalties PER DISC, EVERY DISC.

The end.

SAY YOU WORK AT THE DEV

THINK IT'S THE END OF THE DISCUSSION

Do you honestly believe M$ would charge over the standard retail price? That's suicide for game sales unless the game is stupidly popular and has fans who would buy a piece of tissue with the games name on it. There have been plenty of games with more than two discs such as Lost Odyssey that never cost more than the standard retail price.

...

You need to do some research.

Really because I bought Lost Odyssey for £40 when it was released which is the standard RP in the UK.

You tell me to do research yet randomly spout that you work at a dev with no evidence and then don't counter my point.

You've had no point to counter. Do some googling.

[TMA LIVE]

Collider wrote...

TMA LIVE wrote...
The Mass Effect 1 team my have come along for the ride, but they still felt like they needed to come with you in order to prove themselves, and because Saren ment something to them (He tried to kill Tali. He screwed Garrus's investigation because he was a Spectre, and is a disgrace to all Turians. And Wrex was hired to kill him, but finds out he was developing a cure. Ash lost her team on Eden Prime and wants some pay back. Kaidan... well, he's bland, so I got nothing). They at least had something invested into the plot. While with MS2 characters, they're there because of money, killing, honor, or friendship. That's it.

There is no central villain in ME2, unlike ME1, so it's not quite the same. The game was structured more for Shepard to gain the squad mates's loyalty, not really loyalty against Harbinger. I'd consider someone saving you a more compelling debt than just revenge. Then again, that's more up to the individual.

Well, you could probably also argue that the main problem is the Colector's themselves. Because we know so little about them (including Harbinger), and because we only encounter them 3 times (4 if you include Joker's level), we don't really have anything to make the character's care about them (besides Mordin, Jacob, Maranda, and crew). I had the similar problem with Saren and Benezia. You didn't get to know them that well, thus you never developed a "hate" or "need" to stop them. But they seemed more interesting villians then the Collectors, who are honestly just drones. They tried to make things better by having the Collector's take your crew (which did kind of worked for your character) but it didn't make a need for your teammates. MS1 characters at least had small revenge needs, plus they learned to like you as a character. In MS2, you have the "we learned to like and respect you" part, but not the need.

[SL22]

Derp

Modifié par SL22, 29 mars 2010 - 09:52 .

[SL22]

Xaijin wrote...

SL22 wrote...

Xaijin wrote...

SL22 wrote...

Xaijin wrote...

DUDE.

I WORK AT A DEV.

M$ charges royalties PER DISC, EVERY DISC.

The end.

SAY YOU WORK AT THE DEV

THINK IT'S THE END OF THE DISCUSSION

Do you honestly believe M$ would charge over the standard retail price? That's suicide for game sales unless the game is stupidly popular and has fans who would buy a piece of tissue with the games name on it. There have been plenty of games with more than two discs such as Lost Odyssey that never cost more than the standard retail price.

...

You need to do some research.

Really because I bought Lost Odyssey for £40 when it was released which is the standard RP in the UK.

You tell me to do research yet randomly spout that you work at a dev with no evidence and then don't counter my point.

You've had no point to counter. Do some googling.

Google what? It would help if you pointed out my apparent "mistakes."

Modifié par SL22, 29 mars 2010 - 09:53 .

[Nightwriter]

jlb524 wrote...

I didn't mind the 'have to' of recruiting these people.  You 'had to' recruit all the ME1 squad mates, in a sense. My problem with these characters is that they have their 'one moment in the sun' and then they are forgotten by the game (and by me).   After Miranda's 'special time' in the game, she stops talking to me and I move on to help Jacob.  After I'm done with him, it's Jack's turn for the spot  light.  OK, Jack's done, now it's time for some KROGAN Thresher Maw killing!!!    By this point, I forget about Miranda, Jacob, and Jack.  Oh, and there's still like 7 more loyalty quests to go!!

It's all very episodic as opposed to having the characters weaved into the whole story.  Even if the ME1 crew had less dialog it was triggered by story progression and paced well.  I don't think ME2 did a good job with this and it leaves me with a 'meh' feeling regarding most of these characters.

That's what happens when you don't really have an event-based plotline.

Just a plotline that involves one... characer... at... a time...

Whereas plotlines like KOTOR and Dragon Age could involve all the characters at the same time, making personal quests just a way of enriching individual characters for us as a way of enhancing, not hurting, the big picture.

[Xaijin]

How about publishing versus pressing costs first off, and then "royalties" and "per disc" are good things to put in the appropriate fields, and batch title allocations while you're at it.

Modifié par Xaijin, 29 mars 2010 - 09:55 .

[InvaderErl]

jlb524 wrote...

I didn't mind the 'have to' of recruiting these people.  You 'had to' recruit all the ME1 squad mates, in a sense. My problem with these characters is that they have their 'one moment in the sun' and then they are forgotten by the game (and by me).   After Miranda's 'special time' in the game, she stops talking to me and I move on to help Jacob.  After I'm done with him, it's Jack's turn for the spot  light.  OK, Jack's done, now it's time for some KROGAN Thresher Maw killing!!!    By this point, I forget about Miranda, Jacob, and Jack.  Oh, and there's still like 7 more loyalty quests to go!!

Except Garrus and Tali end up suffering from just this in the first game except they have NO moment in the sun. Sure you can do their quest but other than their introductions they have no importance to the plot whatsoever.

I mean hell you could argue ME1 forgets about Kaiden/Ashley after their moment in the sun.

Modifié par InvaderErl, 29 mars 2010 - 09:59 .