I killed him.
I read that he wanted a future with hybrid human/Darkspawn...And considering the taint destroys the land and its inhabitants....Weeell...That pretty much speaks for itself.
Who here slew The Architect? Why?
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, mars 30 2010 01:55
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#128
Posté 16 juillet 2010 - 08:49
Hayllee
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I killed him. The way I took it, you would have to kill a Grey Warden to get their blood for the Darkspawn. There aren't as many Grey Wardens as there are Darkspawn, obviously, so if you're going to make Darkspawn "free", and you've got, say, enough blood for ten darkspawn out of one Warden, you're basically favoring sane Darkspawn over humanity. Or I misunderstood the conversion. Either one.
#129
Posté 16 juillet 2010 - 08:54
Giggles_Manically
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Because the Darkspawn would still be parasites who need females to spawn. That makes them a disease and something to be destroyed, since they can not exist without preying on people.
Sides' the first rule of Wardening is :See a Darkspawn kill a Darkspawn.
Sides' the first rule of Wardening is :See a Darkspawn kill a Darkspawn.
#130
Posté 16 juillet 2010 - 09:04
Costin_Razvan
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First rule of the Wardens is to protect humanity from them I think, not kill them all.
Would you please stop stating things as they were facts that everyone should follow Giggles?
Would you please stop stating things as they were facts that everyone should follow Giggles?
#131
Posté 16 juillet 2010 - 09:14
Giggles_Manically
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I wasent stating the fact (since it is) that Wardens are supposed to slaughther Darkspawn as an hard rule, simply the fact that I believe that as a Warden wiping out the Darkspawn is the ultimate goal of the GW.
Besides by protecting humanity from them we wipe them out, and by wiping them out we protect humanity. We both reach the same end, yet state it differently.
I was dissapointed in Awakening saying `No really the Darkspawn are just misunderstood!``. Sorry Mr. Architect but launching raids and assaults on people does not engender love and warm feelings.
Besides by protecting humanity from them we wipe them out, and by wiping them out we protect humanity. We both reach the same end, yet state it differently.
I was dissapointed in Awakening saying `No really the Darkspawn are just misunderstood!``. Sorry Mr. Architect but launching raids and assaults on people does not engender love and warm feelings.
#132
Posté 16 juillet 2010 - 09:43
saruman85
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Wow. People here are really cerebral. I'm an affection-**** - I whacked him 'cos my companions would stop loving me if I didn't. (damn you Coercion Level 3!)
Although I was playing a goody-goody Warden so I thought whacking him would be the "good" thing to do...then afterwards I wasn't so sure. (damn you David Gaider and your l33t writing skillz!)
Although I was playing a goody-goody Warden so I thought whacking him would be the "good" thing to do...then afterwards I wasn't so sure. (damn you David Gaider and your l33t writing skillz!)
#133
Posté 17 juillet 2010 - 07:25
Cloud20987
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This is why common people don't make good generals. The truth is sometimes you have to just exterminate an enemy, and no compromise can be reached, simply because while one survives, the other cannot. Sadly, most people don't have the stones to do what is necessary, which is why we need generals that can make the hard decisions. See they worry about how people misuse that power to choose to commit genocide, due to past mistakes, and so they see *any* act of genocide as evil. The truth is they are running from reality.
There are too many people who have misused their rank to claim the inability to survive with another group, but that doesn't not make it true some of the time. It is good to aspire to live in peace and harmony with all living things, but it's just not possible. You can only try to live with those that do not hinder your survival by their very presence. It's like not killing a plant that instead of producing oxygen actually poisons the atmosphere. Sure it may be nice looking, and have a good scent. It's obviously not *plant's* fault that it happens to be poisonous to you, so you might wish you didn't have to destroy it, but it's very existence is the antithesis to your own.
There can be no compromise, the mere existence of one, is a continued threat to the other. This goes for both the people and the darkspawn. They cannot exist peacefully for any true length of time simply by definition. Any "peace" between them is simply both sides taking a quick break to prepare for the next round.
The key isn’t in avoiding genocide at all costs, that’s for weak minded people who refuse to see reason simply because they lack the ability to do something they don’t want to. Like my cousin who punishes her son for being disrespectful and hitting his baby sister, then lets him off in an hour. He doesn’t change his actions, because the punishment doesn’t matter to him. She’s too soft to actually do anything to make the lesson stick.
I’ve sit back and watched how children who grow up never being punished for things turn out. Most (not all, but very close) of them turn out horrible. Not to mention stupid, and usually mean to others. A little punishment is a good thing. They key isn’t in avoiding it, but in making sure the person who does it, is only going to do it when necessary, for as long as necessary.
Likewise, the key isn’t in avoiding genocide, but only doing it when it is actually necessary, like in the case of darkspawn.
There are too many people who have misused their rank to claim the inability to survive with another group, but that doesn't not make it true some of the time. It is good to aspire to live in peace and harmony with all living things, but it's just not possible. You can only try to live with those that do not hinder your survival by their very presence. It's like not killing a plant that instead of producing oxygen actually poisons the atmosphere. Sure it may be nice looking, and have a good scent. It's obviously not *plant's* fault that it happens to be poisonous to you, so you might wish you didn't have to destroy it, but it's very existence is the antithesis to your own.
There can be no compromise, the mere existence of one, is a continued threat to the other. This goes for both the people and the darkspawn. They cannot exist peacefully for any true length of time simply by definition. Any "peace" between them is simply both sides taking a quick break to prepare for the next round.
The key isn’t in avoiding genocide at all costs, that’s for weak minded people who refuse to see reason simply because they lack the ability to do something they don’t want to. Like my cousin who punishes her son for being disrespectful and hitting his baby sister, then lets him off in an hour. He doesn’t change his actions, because the punishment doesn’t matter to him. She’s too soft to actually do anything to make the lesson stick.
I’ve sit back and watched how children who grow up never being punished for things turn out. Most (not all, but very close) of them turn out horrible. Not to mention stupid, and usually mean to others. A little punishment is a good thing. They key isn’t in avoiding it, but in making sure the person who does it, is only going to do it when necessary, for as long as necessary.
Likewise, the key isn’t in avoiding genocide, but only doing it when it is actually necessary, like in the case of darkspawn.
Modifié par Cloud20987, 17 juillet 2010 - 07:26 .
#134
Posté 17 juillet 2010 - 07:35
Costin_Razvan
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Cloud20987: I agree with that, however I feel that letting him live will weaken the Darkspawn through Civil Wars....and that will make it easier for me to wipe them out.
It's a tactical decision, not one born out of mercy for him or the Darkspawn ( as a Dwarf I can't feel mercy them ).
It's a tactical decision, not one born out of mercy for him or the Darkspawn ( as a Dwarf I can't feel mercy them ).
#135
Posté 17 juillet 2010 - 03:55
Giggles_Manically
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The architect is nothing more than a mutant among diseased parasites.
If he had sad that his new motives would rid the need of broodmothers than maybe I would have given him a chance but after starting the 5th blight, attacking vigils keep and murdering many civilians, and experimenting on the warden and company I lack any real sympathy for him.
That is my biggest gripe over the story in Awakeing: No really the big bad is just misunderstood and the darkspawn just want to be friends! Yah right. I wasent born yesterday.
If he had sad that his new motives would rid the need of broodmothers than maybe I would have given him a chance but after starting the 5th blight, attacking vigils keep and murdering many civilians, and experimenting on the warden and company I lack any real sympathy for him.
That is my biggest gripe over the story in Awakeing: No really the big bad is just misunderstood and the darkspawn just want to be friends! Yah right. I wasent born yesterday.
#136
Posté 17 juillet 2010 - 04:01
Thomas9321
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I killed him, but I felt bad about it. At the end of the day he was just trying to do what was right for his species and wasn't "evil" as it were. Unfortunately intelligent Darkspawn are much more dangerous than mindless ones. So sadly, he had to die. It was either the darkspawn or every other life form on Thedas.
#137
Posté 19 juillet 2010 - 08:25
Cloud20987
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Is there some reason why people are questioning whether or not the story of the darkspawn being some form of punishment is true? Sure the chantry full of non-sense about magic meant to serve man, (stuff they obviously just added to their doctrine to help them keep control over mages who could at any time become abominations or start using blood magic) but there probably is at least a little truth to the legend. I don't doubt that the mages got too powerful and hubris made them screw up big somewhere. Whether or not it was the Maker who punished them doesn't really matter. It does seem likely that the darkspawn came from some magical screwup.
But as for it being the Maker himself, why is that so hard to believe? I'm an atheist myself, but that doesn't mean that Gods of some sort aren't real in the games I play and books I read. Any game that has magic of any sort, if I even hear a whisper about some God, I'm on the lookout. Because it's usually true. Especially when most of the world believes in some kind of god or another, and therefore it's pretty safe to say that most of the people making our games would see fit to put at least one inside. A world without a God is not even up for discussion with most people after all. And hey, Gods make games and fantasy books more fun. Even I put gods in my fantasy stories I write. They make things interesting.
But as for it being the Maker himself, why is that so hard to believe? I'm an atheist myself, but that doesn't mean that Gods of some sort aren't real in the games I play and books I read. Any game that has magic of any sort, if I even hear a whisper about some God, I'm on the lookout. Because it's usually true. Especially when most of the world believes in some kind of god or another, and therefore it's pretty safe to say that most of the people making our games would see fit to put at least one inside. A world without a God is not even up for discussion with most people after all. And hey, Gods make games and fantasy books more fun. Even I put gods in my fantasy stories I write. They make things interesting.
Modifié par Cloud20987, 19 juillet 2010 - 08:31 .
#138
Posté 19 juillet 2010 - 09:47
Bahlgan
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Only rooster illusions would choose to spare the Architect...
#139
Posté 19 juillet 2010 - 11:15
errant_knight
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1. He's a darkspawn, and has their best interests in mind. Their method of reproduction alone makes that a bad thing.
2. He plans to continue his experiments with warden blood, which means he's planning on bleeding wardens. There are a lot of darkspawn, which means he's going to need a lot of warden blood. What are you going to do? Hand wardens over to the darkspawn? No. That's unacceptable.
3. He woke an archdemon once, and there's no reason to think he might not do that again.
4. We have no idea what his ultimate goal is for the darkspawn. To stay underground forever? That still leaves the dwarves in a very bad place. To merely free them from the archdemons control for other reasons? We don't know, but whatever he plans, it's probably not good for people.
5. Intelligent darkspawn with free will are even more dangerous than unintelligent ones. perhaps they won't mass in a blight, but they can still plan attacks, and better than they did before. Will they be content to stay underground, or will they want a place on the surface, spreading the taint as they go?
6. The Architect lied about the Orlesian wardens, saying that he didn't harm them, but we found a survivor in the mine, injured to the point of death by the Architect's minions. He was experimenting with Warden blood, and took theirs. We can't trust anything he says, and any promise he makes will be to protect darkspawn, not humanity.
There's just no reason not to kill him that doesn't create a bigger problem.
2. He plans to continue his experiments with warden blood, which means he's planning on bleeding wardens. There are a lot of darkspawn, which means he's going to need a lot of warden blood. What are you going to do? Hand wardens over to the darkspawn? No. That's unacceptable.
3. He woke an archdemon once, and there's no reason to think he might not do that again.
4. We have no idea what his ultimate goal is for the darkspawn. To stay underground forever? That still leaves the dwarves in a very bad place. To merely free them from the archdemons control for other reasons? We don't know, but whatever he plans, it's probably not good for people.
5. Intelligent darkspawn with free will are even more dangerous than unintelligent ones. perhaps they won't mass in a blight, but they can still plan attacks, and better than they did before. Will they be content to stay underground, or will they want a place on the surface, spreading the taint as they go?
6. The Architect lied about the Orlesian wardens, saying that he didn't harm them, but we found a survivor in the mine, injured to the point of death by the Architect's minions. He was experimenting with Warden blood, and took theirs. We can't trust anything he says, and any promise he makes will be to protect darkspawn, not humanity.
There's just no reason not to kill him that doesn't create a bigger problem.
Modifié par errant_knight, 19 juillet 2010 - 11:18 .
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#140
Posté 21 juillet 2010 - 10:45
Notsoevildm
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SuperMedbh wrote...
Killed him. I wavered a bit, as he seemed reasonable enough for an ugly demonic monster, but in the end Grey Wardens aren't really about making new, improved darkspawn, amirite?
Credit Sigrun with pushing me in that direction-- as I was ruminating, she piped up "This just smells of stupid." Gut instinct agreed with her.
+1 for Sigrun knocking sense into my Human Male Noble's head. We really don't need smart darkspawn. Will let him live on another playthrough with a less 'good' character though just to see what happens.
#141
Posté 21 juillet 2010 - 05:33
Bahlgan
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Notsoevildm wrote...
+1 for Sigrun knocking sense into my Human Male Noble's head. We really don't need smart darkspawn. Will let him live on another playthrough with a less 'good' character though just to see what happens.
He ends the Blights as promised, and the darkspawn sightings are said to grow scarcer and scarcer every day after the Mother is slain. Though it seems like an ending too good to be true anyway. I bet they're amassing an army.
#142
Posté 21 juillet 2010 - 06:43
saruman85
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Is that actually what happens in the epilogues? Ending the Blights is a bit of a downer for future Dragon Age games,Bahlgan wrote...
Notsoevildm wrote...
+1 for Sigrun knocking sense into my Human Male Noble's head. We really don't need smart darkspawn. Will let him live on another playthrough with a less 'good' character though just to see what happens.
Heends the Blights as promised, and the darkspawn sightings are said to grow scarcer and scarcer every day after the Mother is slain. Though it seems like an ending too good to be true anyway. I bet they're amassing an army.
no? Still, it IS what he said he'd do in the novel The Calling, anyway...
#143
Posté 21 juillet 2010 - 06:46
saruman85
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Correct. In the novel The Calling *minor spoilers* he says as much - once the Blights are ended the darkspawn will engage in massive civil wars. He calls it a "massive bloodletting" but one that's necessary.Costin_Razvan wrote...
Cloud20987: I agree with that, however I feel that letting him live will weaken the Darkspawn through Civil Wars....and that will make it easier for me to wipe them out.
However, without revealing too much, there are...other...consequences as well, such as what exactly he will put humanity through to become immune to the taint. Give it a read, it's a good novel.
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#144
Posté 21 juillet 2010 - 09:07
errant_knight
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saruman85 wrote...
Is that actually what happens in the epilogues? Ending the Blights is a bit of a downer for future Dragon Age games,Bahlgan wrote...
Notsoevildm wrote...
+1 for Sigrun knocking sense into my Human Male Noble's head. We really don't need smart darkspawn. Will let him live on another playthrough with a less 'good' character though just to see what happens.
Heends the Blights as promised, and the darkspawn sightings are said to grow scarcer and scarcer every day after the Mother is slain. Though it seems like an ending too good to be true anyway. I bet they're amassing an army.
no? Still, it IS what he said he'd do in the novel The Calling, anyway...
No, he doesn't end the blights. He left to continue his work. He doesn't know how to end the blights. There are too many darkspawn for his reverse joining to keep all of them from joining the horde--and there just isn't that much warden blood. He woke the last old god by waking it, trying to test a way to stop the blight. It didn't work, and caused the blight. We don't know about that, and they don't tell us. He may do it, he may not. He keeps his promise to keep the darkspawn from the surface, and there are fewer sightings, but who knows what he has planned--not us!
Modifié par errant_knight, 21 juillet 2010 - 09:07 .
#145
Posté 21 juillet 2010 - 11:41
BastasKnife
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I did, because my Dalish's motto is kill first, talk later. Buuut, my goody-two-shoes human noble did side with him. Seems like the right thing to do if (and that's the big IF, isn't it?) he really can stop Blights altogether. Aand just wanted to point out how adorable his messenger is, the "cloaked, lisping figure" who helps out travelers.
Modifié par BastasKnife, 21 juillet 2010 - 11:43 .
#146
Posté 22 juillet 2010 - 01:25
Bahlgan
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saruman85 wrote...
Correct. In the novel The Calling *minor spoilers* he says as much - once the Blights are ended the darkspawn will engage in massive civil wars. He calls it a "massive bloodletting" but one that's necessary.Costin_Razvan wrote...
Cloud20987: I agree with that, however I feel that letting him live will weaken the Darkspawn through Civil Wars....and that will make it easier for me to wipe them out.
However, without revealing too much, there are...other...consequences as well, such as what exactly he will put humanity through to become immune to the taint. Give it a read, it's a good novel.
I will have to sometime, or at least try, I got so much on my plate that it isn't even funny. Perhaps I should drop the Assassin's Creed II as well as the Final Fantasy 13 lol Sooo much to do...
So wait.. Archy here never actually ends the Blights if spared? Heh, well he dropped the only leverage for ME to spare him... There is NO reason to keep him alive then.
He woke the last old god by waking it
Errm sorry Knight, I have to make fun of you for this! Waking someone by waking it.
That's like killing something until it's dead.. Wait if you killed it once, doesn't it stay dead?
Modifié par Bahlgan, 22 juillet 2010 - 01:28 .
#147
Posté 22 juillet 2010 - 03:07
Aurelet
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I killed him just because of DS reproduction.
But about the blights...If the Chantry is wrong and the Arch Demon is just an Ancient Tainted Dragon there would be no end to blights.
But about the blights...If the Chantry is wrong and the Arch Demon is just an Ancient Tainted Dragon there would be no end to blights.
#148
Posté 22 juillet 2010 - 03:22
Heather Cline
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I slayed him for the Achievement then reloaded and let him live for the other Achievement.
#149
Posté 22 juillet 2010 - 04:22
Divine Justinia V
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Heather Cline wrote...
I slayed him for the Achievement then reloaded and let him live for the other Achievement.
Same lol.
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#150
Posté 02 décembre 2010 - 02:28
Litticafrost
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A bit of speculation but the broodmothers are the women who are violated mind, body and soul by the darkspawn and then act as breeders so all the darkspawn they breed have always been darkspawn. Now with the mother being given free will by architect she may have had her personality emerging pre corruption she may then see what happenned to herself and that's what has driven her so insane compared to any other darkspawn. Anyway just knowing what happens to women taken by darkspawn is enough for me to kill the architect, though in some ways I would thank the architect for causing the blight because it is probably the quickest blight in Thedas' history thanks to my warden being born when he was.
