369 réponses à ce sujet

[ObserverStatus]

Major Truth wrote...
* Liara - For me something just isn't right with her. From historian to information dealer their seems to be a huge change in her character from ME1 to ME2. Also the fact that she is a "pure blood" leaves the door open for an Ardat - Yakshi storyline

If Liara was an Ardat-Yakshi, wouldn't the Shepards who slept with her be dead?

[Zan Mura]

bobobo878 wrote...

Major Truth wrote...
* Liara - For me something just isn't right with her. From historian to information dealer their seems to be a huge change in her character from ME1 to ME2. Also the fact that she is a "pure blood" leaves the door open for an Ardat - Yakshi storyline

If Liara was an Ardat-Yakshi, wouldn't the Shepards who slept with her be dead?

Yup, but additionally the OP was written several months back. The events in LotSB would push any kind of betrayal by Liara well beyond the boundaries of my belief. She's way too attached to Shepard for that. Especially as a LI. Plus she's exactly the kind of person that if she turned out to be a backstabber, I would ignore the whole part as extremely poor,  illogical and borderline malicious writing, and choose to accept my own version instead. Way too important for my story and my Shepard.

Strong text, I know. But I have an emotional investment in this case.

Modifié par Zan Mura, 28 septembre 2010 - 09:03 .

[Pumpeho]

Jacob will defo stab me in the back for the sole reason that someone offered him a job in an office where he would be seen as the most fun and interesting character. Always brought along to lunch and all that.

[belwin]

Zaeed will destroy the normandy SR2 by himself.
Then make out like a bandit.

I hear nothing is as good as watching ships crash planetside.

Modifié par belwin, 28 septembre 2010 - 11:18 .

[HazelrahFiver]

Zan Mura wrote...

I doubt any kind of betrayals. And if it's there, it's redeemable. As said so many times, BW is typically against those gotcha moments where the player will feel deceived by the game. Having someone you've been loyal to since 1-2 games back stab you in the back - someone you might even be in a relationship with -, would not make for a dramatic story. It would destroy the story for a lot of players. They would feel betrayed personally, their image of that NPC shattered, their Shepard they've invested emotionally in, broken. Not just in-game broken, but irl broken as the entire concept of that particular Shepard revolved around the potential LI.

It's a dangerous path to take. There is a reason few movies and games have ever managed to pull such a thing off effectively, and even then they are questionable. Drama is good, some darkness and angst is good. But to reward someone who has invested over a hundred hours into an entertainment by putting a "haha! screw you!" ending in there, to reward them with a feeling of disappointment, sadness and anger, is NOT good business.

If there is to be betrayal, it will be by someone no-one's likely emotionally tied with. Like Udina, the Council, or some random new acquaintances.

I understand what you are saying, but it doesn't have to be as negative as you are saying.  Especially if you make the right decisions and dialogue options, the betrayel by a potential LI can end in a positive fashion.  You could even end up back with Ashley/Kaiden near the end of the game, a wonderful reunion that now has an extra source of passion built up.

[Hopefire]

I think that when it comes down to it, for a Judas plot to work, it has to be the same person each time. There's only one teammate in Mass Effect who is certain to be alive going into ME3. Which means, as much as it potentially breaks the only romance that I ever do in Mass Effect, that Liara would be the potential Judas.



On the other hand, one of my theories about ME3 is that at some point Shepard is going to need to choose between the Shadow Broker (Paragon choice, generally speaking) and the Illusive Man (Renegade choice, generally speaking), and probably leave the other to die/become an indoctrinated villain.

[PsyrenY]

There's heavy foreshadowing that you'll have betrayal to deal with. Garrus' loyalty mission:



"What would you do if someone betrayed you?"

"I don't know Garrus. But I wouldn't let it change me."

"Before it happened to me, I would've agreed with you."

[Cra5y Pineapple]

Garrus is incredibly unlikely. He is clearly the "bro" character, he acts as Shepard's loyal friend and sidekick. Besides, he knows what betrayal feels like and wouldn't let Shepard go through that.



Miranda on the other hand, highly highly likely.

[PsyrenY]

I'm not saying Garrus himself would necessarily be the traitor; rather, I'm saying that bit of dialogue is the writers making us think about the possibility of Shep being betrayed.

I agree, Miranda is highly likely, simply because TIM has leverage on her. She is one of the few I can imagine turning against you even post-loyalty.

[Babli]

No one from ME 2 squad will betray Shepard. Why? They can die before ME 3.



But someone indoctrinated can.

[JaegerBane]

HazelrahFiver wrote...

I understand what you are saying, but it doesn't have to be as negative as you are saying.  Especially if you make the right decisions and dialogue options, the betrayel by a potential LI can end in a positive fashion.  You could even end up back with Ashley/Kaiden near the end of the game, a wonderful reunion that now has an extra source of passion built up.

Actually the idea of Shep ending back with his love interest after a betrayal - given how high the stakes that we know will be in ME3 - is nothing short of absurd.

I'm sorry, but the only way they'll be able to get a betrayal into ME3 without it damaging the drama of the story is the Wrex-style situation seen in ME1 - i.e. a potential betrayal that will depend on how charismatic and moralistic shep has been. In that event, the betrayal will be a result of tensions and impossible choices having to be made - it'll underline the desperation of what is going on and how charisma and camaradrie will ultimately influence how cohesive the team is.

Trying to wedge in a betrayal just for OMG value from a team mate who's been to hell and back with Shep will just leave a sour taste in the mouth of many ME fans. It'll be like that daft part in the Matrix where Cypher randomly decides to kill everyone because he's sick of porridge, only without the benefit of the doubt the audience gives Cypher and his state of mind.

[JaegerBane]

Optimystic_X wrote...
I agree, Miranda is highly likely, simply because TIM has leverage on her. She is one of the few I can imagine turning against you even post-loyalty.

I'm not so sure. Miranda, of any character, is someone who'd have a contingency plan regarding her sister should she ever choose to leave Cerberus. She doesn't strike me as the kind of person who'd just leave the safety of her only family in the hands of fate and TIM's good graces.

Paragon Miranda makes it pretty clear at the end of ME2 that she isn't quitting just for the lolz - in her eyes TIM has gone beyond his stated remit and reneged on the whole point behind what Miranda was trying to achieve working for Cerberus. As she herself states, she's good at gauging people's thoughts and motivations, and I think she'll have picked up on the fact that TIM's enthusiasm for the advancement of humanity only extends as far as his ability to control it and the fact that, ultimately, the Illusive Man propensity for collateral damage is something to be aware of.

[ObserverStatus]

Barry Burton. I never trusted that guy.

[PsyrenY]

JaegerBane wrote...

Optimystic_X wrote...
I agree, Miranda is highly likely, simply because TIM has leverage on her. She is one of the few I can imagine turning against you even post-loyalty.

I'm not so sure. Miranda, of any character, is someone who'd have a contingency plan regarding her sister should she ever choose to leave Cerberus. She doesn't strike me as the kind of person who'd just leave the safety of her only family in the hands of fate and TIM's good graces.

I have no doubts that she wants to keep Oriana out of his clutches, but whether she can is another matter entirely. He knows where she was moved to. Worse: between TIM and Daddy, the two men taught her just about every trick she knows. And if they lay hands on her, Miranda will be in a sticky situation indeed.

[Dean_the_Young]

I see the Virmire survivor as the most likely 'personal' betrayer, while either the Alliance or the Council turning on you and arresting you early on in ME3.

[Kargan1167]

Personally am hopeing Ashly betrays the team.....just so i can put a bullet or maybe an entire magazine into her

[Paladin Latham]

Indoctrination could lead anyone to betray shepard. Just look for diminished abilities.

[mopotter]

Babli wrote...

No one from ME 2 squad will betray Shepard. Why? They can die before ME 3.

But someone indoctrinated can.

Someone who was left behind and assumed dead, picked up by the geth, indoctrinated and rescued.    

If any of the living LI do a betrayal without some way of stopping it, I will probably put BW on my no buy list.  DA:O ending sucked, but this would be a deal breaker for me.  I trust them enough not to worry about it, they are good at making things choices. 

I like the idea of someone being indoctrinated and working for the reapers.  We know from Ilos that the indoctrinated helped destroy their own worlds, but I don't see how any of the crew could be indoctrinated, since it seems you need to be near one in order to hear them.  

As much as I'd love TIM to be the betrayer, unless he gets indoctrinated (a long shot), he knows the reapers need to be destroyed and will work towards that no matter how angry he is with Shepard.   

[Cjrdrifter]

anderson -the stealth judas

[AdamNW]

Your picks are awful.



Most likely: Jack, Samara (in Renegade)

Least likely: Garrus, Tali (in Paragon)

[Mox Ruuga]

AdamNW wrote...

Your picks are awful.

Most likely: Jack, Samara (in Renegade)
Least likely: Garrus, Tali (in Paragon)

Agreed with Jack and Samara (tho I bet Samara would give a fair warning before turning, so it wouldn't really be "betrayal" betrayal). Also, Garrus (tho I wouldn't say he's "more" loyal than other characters).

Tali however... I can see the chicken leg flotilla and Shepard having opposite goals, perhaps even violently opposed. Especially if Admiral Morrigan gains influence. Which side would Tali pick, her people or Shepard?

[hooahguy]

Building from the idea that the betrayal would be from team members you didnt use very much, Id like to see a team mutiny where the half of the team that wasnt used very often (for me that would be everyone but Miranda, Grunt, Legion and Garrus, but I do use Zaeed, Kasumi and Tali every now and then) revolt and rally around the "strongest" member of them, which for me would probably be Jacob, since he was an officer and an option to lead your other team in the suicide mission.

[exterminator_]

bobobo878 wrote...

Major Truth wrote...
* Liara - For me something just isn't right with her. From historian to information dealer their seems to be a huge change in her character from ME1 to ME2. Also the fact that she is a "pure blood" leaves the door open for an Ardat - Yakshi storyline

If Liara was an Ardat-Yakshi, wouldn't the Shepards who slept with her be dead?

Exactly what i said earlier lol

[Zan51]

EDI a betrayer? Who set her free? My pilot Joker. Who shakled her and may try to again? Cerberus. As she herself said when Miranda bit*&ed about unshackling her, "You are my crewmates," Nuff said.