266 réponses à ce sujet

[SnakeStrike8]

Bluerall wrote...


US military considers Korea a police action, Vietnam wasnt a declared war, and the war of 1812 they consider a victory based on the battle of New Orleans even tho the war was over at the time of that battle cause England had to pull out to face the threat of Napolean on the mainland.
So the US military in their eyes sees it as No Wars lost
thats why I said   Supposedly

Sopthistry, Commander! You know I'm right! DON'T QUOTE REGS AT ME!

[Grizzly46]

Darth_Trethon wrote...

Things CHANGE.....shocking I know....DEAL with it. Expecting saluting or any other bit of today's protocol to be the same in a world that is NOTHING like ours is the highest pinnacle of silliness I've ever seen.

Your precious military training and protocol, be it US or UK or whatever other countries' is completely irrelevant in a fantasy setting.

Now stop spamming the forums.

No, they are not, because such details provide a basis for the sci-fi. Whenever I play a game like this, I fully expect my weapon to shoot in a straight line, that the sun is hot, people are solid objects  and that if someone drops something, it will fall to the ground.

I know you are just trying to be a fanatical fanboy, but some things don't change, and mustn't change in any game setting - otherwise the world or universe will be to alien and strange and not interesting or exciting - it will simply be the result of too many acid trips.

[Darth Drago]

Lake88 wrote...

Since we're talking about ME's consistency with boring 21st century stuff, i might as well spill some here.

If alliance space ships carry over our current naval traditions...

Shouldn't the restrooms be referred to as the 'heads'?
The elevator menu refers to Joker & EDI's happy-land as the cockpit, isn't it more accurate to call it the 'bridge'?
The above two are not even military terms. They are standard terms still used on civilian ships today.

And for warships...
I am not sure about this one, but 'Magazine' would be the naval term for Jacob's compartment. Armory is more for weapon/ammunition stores on dry land i *think*.
Again, the elevator menu refers to part of Deck 04 as 'Hammerhead Garage'. Garages are more for cars. 'Hangar' would be more accurate to describe holding areas for smaller vehicles on a sailing vessel.

And if you really really want to nitpick, Miranda's office is really a 'cabin'...

True on most accounts I would say. But if your referring to the Normandy 2 then its not a true military ship.

-The cockpit could be used in reference like in a jet since Joker is the pilot.
-Jacobs room is actually the ships armory, it has all your weapons in it. Garrus is in the ships weapon magazine.
-I believe Deck 5 is listed as the Hanger.

Modifié par Darth Drago, 03 avril 2010 - 03:33 .

[Lake88]

I found one inconsistency in ME2's Alliance navy vs 21st century Navy that I prefer very much: They use Metric units in the future instead of Imperial Units!



Could never get used to those fathoms, feet, nautical miles and knots. I believe most ships today are still using Imperial Units( because its actually more convenient for sailing). Glad they didn't bring it to space.

[Darth_Trethon]

Grizzly46 wrote...


No, they are not, because such details provide a basis for the sci-fi. Whenever I play a game like this, I fully expect my weapon to shoot in a straight line, that the sun is hot, people are solid objects  and that if someone drops something, it will fall to the ground.

I know you are just trying to be a fanatical fanboy, but some things don't change, and mustn't change in any game setting - otherwise the world or universe will be to alien and strange and not interesting or exciting - it will simply be the result of too many acid trips.

Your whole post is a huge misrepresentation. Which hand to salute with has NOTHING to do with how hot the sun is or how gravity behaves and all the rest of the universal laws. How to salute is mostly a historic and nothing about the military remained the same. There is nothing set in stone about military protocol, tomorrow any given military organization can say they'll start saluting with their left hand and completely change every aspect of their formal protocol and the world wouldn't end and humanity would survive....unlike if the sun's temperature of the sun or gravity drastically changed.

Trying to make a minor custom that is just a matter of preference for each organization seem like a universal truth is a missrepresentation of facts and a lie.

[Izhalezan]

Dang Darth, that wall hasn't cut your head open already?

[incinerator950]

Don't worry, Boot camp reinforced his skull.

[Roelandtstorme]

gmartin40 wrote...

I find this quite interesting seeing as I go to boot camp for the Marines on October 15th of this year. That is a good thing for me to remember. Good find Roelandtstorme.

Edit: I go October 18th...

Good luck to you brother.  Semper Fi.  And thanks for standing in the gap for us.  I'd salute you but, not only am I out of uniform, if I did, Darth Troll would start ranting again.

[WarAxe7]

incinerator950 wrote...

Don't worry, Boot camp reinforced his skull.

I don't think he lasted more than 3 days in boot camp, if he ever went at all.  He knows nothing about the military... just listen to him. 

[kromm71]

Darth_Trethon wrote...



Your whole post is a huge misrepresentation.

Trying to make a minor custom that is just a matter of preference for each organization seem like a universal truth is a missrepresentation of facts and a lie.

Darth, you're exaggerating again.  How many times do I have to tell you?

[Darth Drago]

The basic salute has been used for centuries.

It is not going to change, period.

Ever!
 
End of discussion.

[Shin Yodama]

Best of luck gmartin40, it is an honourable goal.



Good finds Lake88, though Darth Drago puts up a good counter too.

[GOYAFIDO]

AT EASE YOU PALE PULING REFUGEES FROM MOMMIES APRON STRINGS!!! YOU WOULDN'T KNOW A HARD DAYS WORK IF IT MUGGED YOU AND STOLE YOUR WALLET! YOU DON'T EVEN KNOW WHICH END OF THE KNIFE THE BULLETS GO IN! DROP AND BEAT YOUR FACES!!!



(Just trying to add some civility to this thread...>.>)

[GOYAFIDO]

gmartin40 wrote...

I find this quite interesting seeing as I go to boot camp for the Marines on October 15th of this year. That is a good thing for me to remember. Good find Roelandtstorme.

Edit: I go October 18th...

Thank you in advance for your service.

Oh and a few tips:

Keep your weapon, your junk and your feet maintained at all times.  This cannot be overemphasized.

Know where your buddies are as much as possible when in the field.  This too cannot be overemphasized.

Assume that almost nothing will go as planned.  You will be pleasantly surprised.

Good fortune and come home safe and in one piece.

[incinerator950]

GOYAFIDO wrote...

gmartin40 wrote...

I find this quite interesting seeing as I go to boot camp for the Marines on October 15th of this year. That is a good thing for me to remember. Good find Roelandtstorme.

Edit: I go October 18th...

Thank you in advance for your service.

Oh and a few tips:

Keep your weapon, your junk and your feet maintained at all times.  This cannot be overemphasized.

Know where your buddies are as much as possible when in the field.  This too cannot be overemphasized.

Assume that almost nothing will go as planned.  You will be pleasantly surprised.

Good fortune and come home safe and in one piece.

Aye, true words for the new guys, for any branch.

[Epic-In-A-Box]

Its kind of a game man..... You cant expect Bioware to go do some research about military for a game theyre making that exists thousands of years in the future, where everyone magically speaks the same language......

[Lake88]

Darth Drago wrote...

-The cockpit could be used in reference like in a jet since Joker is the pilot.
-Jacobs room is actually the ships armory, it has all your weapons in it. Garrus is in the ships weapon magazine.

That makes sense, the way Joker steers the ship is more akin to a fighter aircraft pilot than a ships' helmsman. A helmsman role is solely to follow the orders of the Officer on deck and does not initiate any maneuvers. Normandy's pilot/helmsman seem to be an all-in-one role.

I still think 'magazine' would be more accurate over 'armory'. Its a very general term for a ship's compartment to store ammunition and small arms. Just like how 'mess' is the general term for areas where much of the crew gather/live.

Anyway, on actual ships, no one really cares what's the proper name for a compartment as long as everyone onboard calls it the same name and know instantly which specfic compartment it is referring to.
(ie. if CO Shepard decides to rename Miranda's Office to 'Happy-Fun-Place', all personnel need to know it by heart)

Modifié par Lake88, 03 avril 2010 - 12:00 .

[Grizzly46]

Darth_Trethon wrote...

Your whole post is a huge misrepresentation. Which hand to salute with has NOTHING to do with how hot the sun is or how gravity behaves and all the rest of the universal laws. How to salute is mostly a historic and nothing about the military remained the same. There is nothing set in stone about military protocol, tomorrow any given military organization can say they'll start saluting with their left hand and completely change every aspect of their formal protocol and the world wouldn't end and humanity would survive....unlike if the sun's temperature of the sun or gravity drastically changed.

Trying to make a minor custom that is just a matter of preference for each organization seem like a universal truth is a missrepresentation of facts and a lie.

Bold style by me. Haven't you already been bashed over the head about this? The saluta has been around for hundreds of years, and is a basic military greeting for military personnel all over the world! And this is just as basic as the hot sun or gravity, even if it admitedly is sorted under a different label.

You are very alone in this. Get out, take a deep breath and realize  you won't win discussion.

[Element Zero]

Epic-In-A-Box wrote...

Its kind of a game man..... You cant expect Bioware to go do some research about military for a game theyre making that exists thousands of years in the future, where everyone magically speaks the same language......

This is true, but ME is somewhat unusual in that its setting is the not so distant future of our real world. ME is our world, our galaxy, as it might be if all these other sentient races had and have existed all along. That being the case, all the little things the devs do to make the ME feel like the near future of our world, those things create the overall verisimilitude of the game.

I am not a military man, but I am familiar enough to have recognized a good number of the errors made. They aren't huge errors, and I don't think anyone has suggested they've ruined the game. They are small things, though, that could be corrected in ME3. I think it's great that part of the Bioware team has acknowledged as much and thanked the OP for his criticism.

[Rayne1967]

First off, I was in the USMC reserves for 6 years, deployed to Iraq and left the service as a Sgt to finish off my college education before I return as an officer.



The point of matter here is consistency and lore. Sci-fi tends to be very in depth and have deep stories and reasons for everything. You can find history of the races, events in time and such in game, however there does not seem to be an established "military protocol." Obviously, some aspects would be different but everything else there would be standards. The left handed salute mentioned is different from every other salute in the game and the devs have pretty much eluded that it was a mistake previously in the post. This is a minor detail, but for me... it is the attention to minor details that really make sci-fi great or just mediocre. Even if the protocol is not available to us in game, the devs should have it written out so that they can follow it throughout the game.



In response to earlier posts:



I have seen a single left handed salute in the Marines. He was just promoted to LCpl and the LtCol handed him the certificate to the wrong hand and he failed to switch it over to his left. When "hand salute" was called for the second time, he froze and saluted with his left. This is the only time I have ever seen a left handed salute, and I am sure he will NEVER make that mistake again (nor will anyone else that was there).



Trethon is a troll, anyway you look at it. He has some points shadowed under that bridge of his...



I agree mostly with the OP, and also would offer my knowledge to Bioware if they need it.

[kyle-mac]

i have never been in the service, but i still notice at least some of the things the OP mentioned and it does bug me. i also agree with rayne1967 that the game is pretty in-depth in it's back story and codex of different cultures and things you don't really need to know for the game but are an interesting insight to the universe, so different military and civilian or cerberus protocols could be included. at the very least, consistency would be nice.

[Zulu_DFA]

This thread is delightful. So I'm pulling a Lazarus trick at it.

[LPPrince]

Stanley Woo wrote...

I knew I "done a good thing" when I remarked that some dude was saluting with the wrong hand. It's a shame I couldn't catch them all.

I am a big fan of verisimilitude in media. Things don't have to be perfect in fiction, or conform 100% to the way things work in real life, but having it be consistent and seem like real life is always good. I feel just as strongly about the way computers and the internet are portrayed in media, and get a little annoyed when things work as if by magic.

My favourite show, NCIS, is, of course, exempt from my ire.

NCIS is one of my favorite shows! I wish I read this 3 months ago.

[Splinter Cell 108]

Although I'm not sure if this has anything to do with the thread but doesn't everybody find it ridiculous that Garrus and Zaeed aim their sniper rifles at Thane in close quarters. If I know anything about weapons it's that Sniper Rifles are not close quarter weapons. The same goes for Overlord, when Garrus shoots that Geth in the Geth ship he shoots it in close quarters with a sniper rifle. It just looks stupid, it's not like it's COD and someone thinks he's great because he got a "no scope" with a sniper rifle at close quarters.