52 réponses à ce sujet

[Cypher0020]

Doesn't that mean the throne of Ferelden, and effectively both of their famile's lines are doomed?


Maric's dead, Rowan's dead, Calin's dead..... and yeah Alistiar has Goldana and her brats.... but she's obviously bitter and could care less about riches and titles


On that note, on the Cousland side, the PC's parents are dead, and Fergus is alive... but with no wife and kid....  and the PC cannot have kids

Regarding the PC/Alistiar.... they're both Wardens so that's automatically no kids, and their reign would be thirty years.... give or take.... 

So they'd endure their Callings and leave the throne empty? 

[ejoslin]

Well, Alistair and the Warden can't have children together, but that doesn't mean they can't have children. When I play a HNF, she and Alistair don't even always like each other, but they end up married, my Warden tells Alistair she's going to try for a baby with someone else, and she and Zevran stay together.



Hopefully Ali is trying with someone else as well. And Fergus, I'm sure he will remarry.

[LadyZaria]

Possibly. I prefer to assume that the Circle is able to find some way to shelter the baby from the taint, leaving the bloodline intact.

[Addai]

LadyZaria wrote...

Possibly. I prefer to assume that the Circle is able to find some way to shelter the baby from the taint, leaving the bloodline intact.

The issue is not the taint, as Warden babies are born without the taint (it does not pass the placenta).  The issue is infertility.  The only way that 2 Wardens can have a child is by "unnatural" means.  Since the game is full of "unnatural" things, I don't know why it should be considered an impossibility, except that the devs have decided for story purposes that no matter who is on the throne, Ferelden will be without a royal heir in the next generation.

[LadyZaria]

Addai67 wrote...

LadyZaria wrote...

Possibly. I prefer to assume that the Circle is able to find some way to shelter the baby from the taint, leaving the bloodline intact.

The issue is not the taint, as Warden babies are born without the taint (it does not pass the placenta).  The issue is infertility.  The only way that 2 Wardens can have a child is by "unnatural" means.  Since the game is full of "unnatural" things, I don't know why it should be considered an impossibility, except that the devs have decided for story purposes that no matter who is on the throne, Ferelden will be without a royal heir in the next generation.

Ah, havent' looked at the exact mechanics.

But, depending on what happens with DAO2 (where it might be fully explained), there are a few possibilities you can picture, based on what fits your personal RP story or idea of the plot best.

1) Both die, Ferelden is plunged into another civil war.
2) Grey Warden and Alistair choose to adopt a child to name as heir.
3) The Fem PC calls in herbal experts (perhaps the Dalish, or could even be something found in Flemeth's real grimoire) and finds a remedy that will make her able to bear children, or at least, one child.

[Efesell]

Or in the case of Alistair/Anora there could still be an heir.

But man would that scenario ****** people off if it was defaulted..

[Addai]

The commentary about Anora either as sole ruler or married to the PC suggest that even if she is on the throne, an heir is unlikely. It just sounds to me like they're setting up a scenario where Ferelden is back to square one.

[Sarah1281]

If the PC and Alistair do find a way to have a child together, I'm betting Avernus will have something to do with it. He understands more about the taint than virtually anyone else alive and he's slowed his down enough to still be alive after all this time.



I don't really get why two GW absolutely can't have a child together. If a GW and a non-GW can, with difficulty, have a child together then what's stopping two GW? The taint is not an issue, apparently, though having both egg and sperm contain the taint being too much for the fetus to survive but only havng one be tainted is alright and would cease to be a factor before birth would make sense. If it's just that both parents have extremely low fertility then it should be possible to have a child, just infinitely more difficult than having one with a non-GW. Why doesn't it work that way?

[LadyZaria]

Addai67 wrote...

The commentary about Anora either as sole ruler or married to the PC suggest that even if she is on the throne, an heir is unlikely. It just sounds to me like they're setting up a scenario where Ferelden is back to square one.

In the Return to Ostagar quest and I think a couple other places, it's said that Anora seems to be completely barren (rumors saying that it's because she's a "commoner" with no royal lineage). In fact, Cailan was considering divorcing her because of it.

So even if Anora stays queen, it's assumed she won't concieve with any one else, as she wasn't able to with Cailan.

[Cypher0020]

Uhhhhh whose Avernus?



Think Morrigan's little demon baby could come into play?



I just think that it'd totally suck to have Ferelden lose their king and queen in a short time span



Oh yes...... and since they have the taint.... doesn't that mean they go a little bonkers after a while? If they're becoming Ghouls.... well.... we saw Hespith....that creepy dwarf



Is that what they're starting to become?!

[Servant of Nature]

Alistair and Fem!PC can't have a child, period. Since being Queen makes this an issue, there are a number of ways to solve it. However, I firmly believe that no amount of fertility rituals or herbs or what have you will have any effect, so:



1) Fergus gets remarried and has a child. Politically it would be best to pawn Anora off on him, but we don't know if the former Queen is barren or Cailan was just too busy with elves to bother with his wife, so it'd have to be someone else. At least the Couslands are an old family that are as close to the Throne as possible without being of Calenhad's blood.



2) Teagan's kid. Encourage him to get married (if he isn't already due to your choices) and have him pop out an heir. They're royalty by marriage; better than nothing.



3) Finally, the King and Queen could perhaps find someone to sire Alistair's child. That keeps the Theirin bloodline going, at least.

[Efesell]

Pretty sure the RtO part is just Eamon worrying that she's getting too old to produce an heir.

[Addai]

Avernus is the Warden blood mage you encounter in the Soldier's Peak DLC. He can't be story-dependent, however, because you can kill him. And judging by the note you find in his journal, he is close to being off the scene regardless (he talks about hearing the Calling). I'm not sure my HNF would trust him. My PCs would trust Morrigan, though. It would be an interesting development if the Warden Queen disappears in order to look for Morrigan for some fertility advice.

[Cypher0020]

ooooo.... isn't Teagan's kid Connor? My last run I think he's off to the Circle Tower o.o



There's an option to talk about marriage to him?

[Sarah1281]

So even if Anora stays queen, it's assumed she won't concieve with any one else, as she wasn't able to with Cailan.

Loghain hints in Awakening that she just really doesn't want to get pregnant (probably as that would keep her out of things for at least a few weeks and threaten her power/Ferelden) but that, too, would make the chances of an heir unlikely.

Alistair and Fem!PC can't have a child, period.

I don't think we can say that. We just know that they can't have a child 'by natural means.' Since this isn't talking about a GW/non-GW child the 'by natural means' can't refer to the Morrigan ritual so there must be some reason it was added. That seems to indicate that there is, in fact, at least one non-natural way for a child to happen although whether the PC and Alistair will discover it is anyone's guess.

Avernus is the Warden blood mage you encounter in the Soldier's Peak DLC. He can't be story-dependent, however, because you can kill him.

His research would still be around, though, and that would make a good starting point on trying to have a child.

ooooo.... isn't Teagan's kid Connor? My last run I think he's off to the Circle Tower o.o

Connor is Eamon's kid, not Teagan's and mages cannot legally inherit anyway (which was part of Isolde's problem with him being a mage).

Modifié par Sarah1281, 02 avril 2010 - 07:19 .

[blademaster7]

Addai67 wrote...
the devs have decided for story purposes that no matter who is on the throne, Ferelden will be without a royal heir in the next generation.

Makes you wonder why would they do that. It can't be coincidence.

If the PC supports Alistair as a lone king at the Landsmeet then maybe he'll find a bride and get to work. Every other outcome pretty much leaves Ferelden without a royal heir.

Modifié par blademaster7, 02 avril 2010 - 07:20 .

[nos_astra]

blademaster7 wrote...

Addai67 wrote...
the devs have decided for story purposes that no matter who is on the throne, Ferelden will be without a royal heir in the next generation.

Makes you wonder why would they do that. It can't be coincidence.

If the PC supports Alistair as a lone king at the Landsmeet then maybe he'll find a bride and get to work. Every other outcome pretty much leaves Ferelden without a royal heir.

In "The Calling" I think Fiona's son is called a miracle. That should tell you how the chances are to conceive by natural means if one parent is a Grey Warden - very slim.

Modifié par klarabella, 02 avril 2010 - 07:36 .

[Srau]

If i got things right, seconds in line for the throne if the king dies are the Teyrns (Gwaren and Highever) and the Guerrin familly, Arls of Redcliff, by marriage with Marric.

In the case of Alister + Warden wedding it gives 5 possibilities :

- Arl Eamon Guerrin --> Is old and Connor is sent at the circle and the chantry would never allow a mage to be king. If second child is born we know it is a girl and she also is a mage and sent to the circle.
- Bann Teagan Guerrin --> young, single, no child.
- Loghain Mac Tir, Teyrn of Gwaren --> head chopped.
- Anora Mac Tir, Teyrna of Gwaren, former Queen of Ferelden --> No clue on her, is she still in the dungeon ? (I know for sure that my Queen Cousland disposed of her : she made a nasty fall from the top of the tower, mourning the lose of both husband and father
- Fergus Cousland, Teyrn of Highever --> young, widower, no child alive; sister is Queen.

By marriage + nobility rank it would be Fergus Cousland, but that could very much trigger a war

Also, from Morrigan's dialogue, you learn that when the taint of a warden is recent he/she can still have a child.
I guess that since they started *very early* Al' and HNF could still have one with some help.

EDIT : ops forgot Anora

Modifié par Srau, 02 avril 2010 - 07:50 .

[Srau]

double post

Modifié par Srau, 02 avril 2010 - 07:50 .

[LadyDamodred]

klarabella wrote...

blademaster7 wrote...

Addai67 wrote...
the devs have decided for story purposes that no matter who is on the throne, Ferelden will be without a royal heir in the next generation.

Makes you wonder why would they do that. It can't be coincidence.

If the PC supports Alistair as a lone king at the Landsmeet then maybe he'll find a bride and get to work. Every other outcome pretty much leaves Ferelden without a royal heir.

In "The Calling" I think Fiona's son is called a miracle. That should tell you how the chances are to conceive by natural means if one parent is a Grey Warden - very slim.

I always saw Fiona calling the baby a mircale in the sense that what are the odds that she would find and fall in love with someone, and after just a couple night together they would have a child.  She also says that the GW do have babies, often enough that there's a protocal in place to deal with them.

Also, so going with 'unnatural means' for having a baby for my Cousland and Alistair. 

[Zeleen]

Fergus remarries, has a son - the Nephew of the King & Queen the natural heir to the throne - (after all the Couslands are nobility you know) wah lah - problem solved. or one of Alister's nieces and nephews, as his sister is VERY interested in money and power.

Modifié par Zeleen, 02 avril 2010 - 07:59 .

[nos_astra]

Zeleen wrote...

Fergus remarries, has a son - the Nephew of the King & Queen the natural heir to the throne - (after all the Couslands are nobility you know) wah lah - problem solved. or one of Alister's nieces and nephews, as his sister is VERY interested in money and power.

My favourite take on the issue.

[red dragon of baldur's]

It's not impossible for two wardens to have children it's just that Alistair says it very hard for two Grey Wardens to have them.

[jpdipity]

LadyDamodred wrote...

klarabella wrote...

blademaster7 wrote...

Addai67 wrote...
the devs have decided for story purposes that no matter who is on the throne, Ferelden will be without a royal heir in the next generation.

Makes you wonder why would they do that. It can't be coincidence.

If the PC supports Alistair as a lone king at the Landsmeet then maybe he'll find a bride and get to work. Every other outcome pretty much leaves Ferelden without a royal heir.

In "The Calling" I think Fiona's son is called a miracle. That should tell you how the chances are to conceive by natural means if one parent is a Grey Warden - very slim.

I always saw Fiona calling the baby a mircale in the sense that what are the odds that she would find and fall in love with someone, and after just a couple night together they would have a child.  She also says that the GW do have babies, often enough that there's a protocal in place to deal with them.

Also, so going with 'unnatural means' for having a baby for my Cousland and Alistair. 

My thought on the miracle was because when Fiona got pregnant, she was experiencing advanced stages of the taint and it was assumed that she would be sent on her calling.  So, for her to get pregnant at that stage of corruption is the miracle.  She says that it is "uncommon" for Grey Wardens to become pregnant.

[LadyDamodred]

Maybe it's both! A miracle from every direction.



Uncommon to me does not mean very rare/slim. Just that it's not common. Just different takes on the word. Regardless, the GW have a way of dealing it, so it must come up with some regularity. Makes me wonder what happens more: GW having kids or mages.