70 réponses à ce sujet

[darkshadow136]

Sarah1281 wrote...

If Bioware is going to make DLC though they should make one where you take Highever back and rebuild it.

Why would a non-HN care about Highever?

Good point if you are a city elf or a dwarf the DLC would be pointless. I guess we will have to wait for the modders to come up with something for HN's.

[sylvanaerie]

Caldarin V wrote...

Information about Howe and what a messed up bastard he is- it'd help to justify saving Loghain as well

also, if could be a Human Noble add on

Considering while he had nothing to do with the actual attack Loghain DID protect Howe and give him the title of Teryn of Highever knowing what Howe did, HOW precisely would this justify saving Loghain?  In my mind his complicity is just one more nail in the coffin for him.

[Caldarin V]

suppose you're right, and Loghain was the one directly implicated in the elven slaving, which pissed me off a bit



honestly, Loghain's all over the place on my evil-o-meter... like I can understand his motivations, but then he does some really messed up stuff that don't fit in with the rest of his character (allowing the tevinter slavers in the Alienage )

[Caldarin V]

darkshadow136 wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...

If Bioware is going to make DLC though they should make one where you take Highever back and rebuild it.

Why would a non-HN care about Highever?

Good point if you are a city elf or a dwarf the DLC would be pointless. I guess we will have to wait for the modders to come up with something for HN's.

actually, I'm working on a mod for that in my spare time, admittedly, I'm kinda limited in my ability, but I'll see what I can do...

[Srau]

Yeah more tumbs down for Loghain after what he told HN at his tent before the battle of Ostagar.

[Sarah1281]

Yeah more tumbs down for Loghain after what he told HN at his tent before the battle of Ostagar.

What? He just said that he heard about Howe and thought Cailan had every intention of keeping his promise of exacting retribution. Or are you talking about how that conversation makes it clear that he absolutely knew what Howe was capable of and some of what he was guilty of no matter what he may have claimed later and that just made his claiming Howe was the Teyrn of Highever more repugnant?

[sylvanaerie]

Caldarin V wrote...

suppose you're right, and Loghain was the one directly implicated in the elven slaving, which pissed me off a bit

honestly, Loghain's all over the place on my evil-o-meter... like I can understand his motivations, but then he does some really messed up stuff that don't fit in with the rest of his character (allowing the tevinter slavers in the Alienage )

Yea it is the slavery thing that dooms him every time in my games.  I can forgive Ostagar and sending assassins after my PC even the character assassination but when I get to Caladrius and his "spare me and I will sacrifice these slaves for you to gain power" thing...ummm yea.  That's the final nail in Loghain's coffin every time.  All his talk of "I did it for Ferelden" is so much bullsh*t to me at that point because he's betraying everything good in Ferelden for his own ambition.  When I see him pointing at Eamon (and I DESPISE Eamon) and telling him he has ambitions to the throne I wish my PC could say "Pot meet Kettle" 

[sylvanaerie]

Sarah1281 wrote...

Yeah more tumbs down for Loghain after what he told HN at his tent before the battle of Ostagar.

What? He just said that he heard about Howe and thought Cailan had every intention of keeping his promise of exacting retribution. Or are you talking about how that conversation makes it clear that he absolutely knew what Howe was capable of and some of what he was guilty of no matter what he may have claimed later and that just made his claiming Howe was the Teyrn of Highever more repugnant?

Yea everyone knows about it and Loghain certainly does as well (Kinda hard to miss the entire castle being slaughtered by Howe's men) but goes along with giving the Terynir to Howe knowing what Howe did to get it.  And then has the gall to call him Teryn right to the HN's face. 

[Srau]

Sarah1281 wrote...

Yeah more tumbs down for Loghain after what he told HN at his tent before the battle of Ostagar.

What? He just said that he heard about Howe and thought Cailan had every intention of keeping his promise of exacting retribution. Or are you talking about how that conversation makes it clear that he absolutely knew what Howe was capable of and some of what he was guilty of no matter what he may have claimed later and that just made his claiming Howe was the Teyrn of Highever more repugnant?

The one at begining of the game, he is with a very sorry voice and a way to say things that let think he backs up Cailan on this one.
During my first playthrough i wasn't aware of his treachery at this time and i really felt he would be helping with this mess after the battle.

[darkshadow136]

Caldarin V wrote...

darkshadow136 wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...

If Bioware is going to make DLC though they should make one where you take Highever back and rebuild it.

Why would a non-HN care about Highever?

Good point if you are a city elf or a dwarf the DLC would be pointless. I guess we will have to wait for the modders to come up with something for HN's.

actually, I'm working on a mod for that in my spare time, admittedly, I'm kinda limited in my ability, but I'll see what I can do...

Well let me give you a big thank you ahead of time for your work.

[Danielsun2]

zahra wrote...

Danielsun2 wrote...

zahra wrote...

Danielsun2 wrote...

yes but bioware could have made leads for example you could meet a chasind who gives you details about survivors

much like you find the book in the cave or you find a scavenger

Took the words right out of my mouth.

hehe sorry

hopefully in dragon age 2 if they keep an origins story like you have in DAO where you are your person until you get drafted something like that, you do get to complete your personal quest and tie up loose ends

because to me it doesnt seem right that your character goes out of his/hers to help everyone else get closure except yourself lol

I know! The Warden has to tend to all his/her companions feelings, but no one wants to ask if the Warden has any personal quests. What about I give you -50 disapproval, you swamp witch. lol

(and I personally think the worst was when the dalish elf origin warden has to kill tamlen-turned-darkspawn. Everyone is like "oh, friend of yours. Too bad." No one asks you if you're alright, or if you want a proper burial. My poor elf.)

yeah when i was talking to tamlen i was like no no dont die we could cure you or something but nope chop his head off talk to my companions Alistair still whinning about a man he knew for only 6 months leliana still telling fairy tales sten saying bugger all shale sighing morigan being a nasty girl zevran flirting wynne boring me and oghren falling over

not one went  'aww i saw you two talking before kiilling you know that guy you alright?'

not cool man im not made of stone i have a heart! 

[sylvanaerie]

Danielsun2 wrote...

zahra wrote...

Danielsun2 wrote...

zahra wrote...

Danielsun2 wrote...

yes but bioware could have made leads for example you could meet a chasind who gives you details about survivors

much like you find the book in the cave or you find a scavenger

Took the words right out of my mouth.

hehe sorry

hopefully in dragon age 2 if they keep an origins story like you have in DAO where you are your person until you get drafted something like that, you do get to complete your personal quest and tie up loose ends

because to me it doesnt seem right that your character goes out of his/hers to help everyone else get closure except yourself lol

I know! The Warden has to tend to all his/her companions feelings, but no one wants to ask if the Warden has any personal quests. What about I give you -50 disapproval, you swamp witch. lol

(and I personally think the worst was when the dalish elf origin warden has to kill tamlen-turned-darkspawn. Everyone is like "oh, friend of yours. Too bad." No one asks you if you're alright, or if you want a proper burial. My poor elf.)

yeah when i was talking to tamlen i was like no no dont die we could cure you or something but nope chop his head off talk to my companions Alistair still whinning about a man he knew for only 6 months leliana still telling fairy tales sten saying bugger all shale sighing morigan being a nasty girl zevran flirting wynne boring me and oghren falling over

not one went  'aww i saw you two talking before kiilling you know that guy you alright?'

not cool man im not made of stone i have a heart! 

Umm Alistair wasn't whining about Duncan at that point.  He was the ONLY companion who asked after you and tried to offer what small comfort (it was a mercy) to you at that point.   I realize you were probably being snarky in your reply but lets at least give the poor boy some credit for trying to be understanding to your PC.

[Costin_Razvan]

Well... you can save around 7 guards before reaching the gate, with the 3 guards there + Dog and your Mother you sure as hell could have given them a real fight.



Duncan or no, you could have held off for a long time,

[Caldarin V]

again, I think Howe would have burned the place down around your ears

he's an evil enough bastard...

I mean just look what Tim Curry did to the Pride Lands!

[Darthbill52]

Lady Jess wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...

He IS voiced by Tim Curry, though. That's got to count for something.

It counted for making me want him dead the second he spoke even before I knw he was going to betray my family...lol. That man's voice always has the effect on me, ever since I watched Congo.

(Amy was good Gorilla!)

I happen to be a movie buff half of me went ...this is the man pulling the strings is Dr Frank N Futer
while the other half went yeah but he also played the party line dr in hunt for red october.  I think the Human Noble story has effect on the logain end of the story in a sense where you were thought to be killed and are not espically when you meet logain with arl eamon, 3 playthroughs 3 couslands ..all times death threats made to howe ..even in awaking my warrior(avitar pic) killed Nate Howe with out a doubt.  

[Ulicus]

Caldarin V wrote...

suppose you're right, and Loghain was the one directly implicated in the elven slaving, which pissed me off a bit honestly, Loghain's all over the place on my evil-o-meter... like I can understand his motivations, but then he does some really messed up stuff that don't fit in with the rest of his character (allowing the tevinter slavers in the Alienage )

It's not like he did it for the lulz, or to buy himself a new house. Making the deal with the slavers had nothing to do with ambition and everything to do with his desperately needing money to fund his efforts in the civil war and stand a hope in hell of winning it.

Morally reprehensible? Yes. But Loghain's the do-whatever-it-takes, ends-justify-the-means type. As a last resort by which to amass funds, I didn't find it out of character at all.

My city/dalish elves will always kill him for it, though.

Modifié par Ulicus, 06 avril 2010 - 10:39 .

[Caldarin V]

true, but thought he would have valued freedom as a whole more than that

[Ulicus]

Caldarin V wrote...

true, but thought he would have valued freedom as a whole more than that

He couldn't win the civil war without money. (I've summarised his reasoning in my edited post, above)

Though, I've forgotten: did the mages take advantage of the plague to do their slavery stuff, or did they create the plague and then use it? I've always thought it was the former. Part of how Loghain justifies it is that "the elves are dying horribly anyway, I might as well make money off the back of them".

Modifié par Ulicus, 06 avril 2010 - 10:40 .

[Sarah1281]

If you ask Shianni about it, she says that it started up when the refugees from Ostagar came so it probably originated from them.

[Costin_Razvan]

Darkspawn taint? Now that is... horrible.

[EmperorSahlertz]

We also need to remember the mindset of the people of Ferelden. After all, it is "just" Elves being sold. I've read enough arguments about this slavery deal to see that a lot of people apply meta-gaming to argue against Loghain on this one. But we need to remember that, while slavery is bad, selling Elves aren't just as bad.