11146 réponses à ce sujet

[Costin_Razvan]

Sten treats Shale as a Kadan. Of course they agree.

Once again Wynne shows she is a great ignorant moron.

Modifié par Costin_Razvan, 04 mai 2010 - 09:29 .

[Sarah1281]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Who here loves the Aeducan symbol?
I would choose Bhelen just to keep this as the Dwarven symbol.

I  the Aeducan insignia. I know we never see the Harrowmont one but I'm willing to bet that it fails in comparison.

[Gilsa]

Oh! Knight! You just reminded me of something I had been meaning to bring up, but kept forgetting! I wanted to discuss the dwarven heraldry because some of them didn't make sense to me and maybe someone could shed some light for me.

Source: http://dragonage.wik...m/wiki/Heraldry

Aeducan = bearded dwarf
Legion of Dead = armored face
Arena = circle (ring) with sword and warrior face
Shaperate = open book
Caridin = anvil

The symbolisms I do not "get" are Harrowmont, Branka, and Beraht.

Edit: I really like how the arena heraldry has the extended tongue under the sword as to symbolize "the ancestors have spoken." That is a very, very nice touch.

Modifié par Gilsa, 04 mai 2010 - 09:46 .

[Sarah1281]

So...shield? Because shields are useful. And unimaginative. I was right about it failing in comparison. 
Either another shield or some sort of mechanical eye. It definitely looks like a device of some sort. If Branka was expected to come up with this herself and didn't care, that might explain it.
Beraht...evil eye. Definitely evil eye. If they weren't dwarves I'd say it could be an eclipse but has he ever been to the surface? What caste is he suppose to be, anyway? Not casteless, that's for sure, and not noble either. Why does the illegal criminal carta have theirown heraldry that can make it easy for the deed to be traced back to Beraht anyway? Was he just that much of an idiot?

[soignee]

I need to design a Brosca one for the lulz. Missa would probably have something defiant as it would amuse her. LOLOLOL LOOK BRAND

oh and Beraht was merchant caste.

Modifié par soignee, 04 mai 2010 - 09:51 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

Harrowmont's shield represents conservatism and the defense of tradition.

I thought Branka's insignia simply showed that she is from the smith caste.

[Herr Uhl]

Gilsa wrote...

The symbolisms I do not "get" are Harrowmont, Branka, and Beraht.

I don't know about Harrowmont, Behrat's family trades with the surface (hence sun I think) and Branka seems to have spanners, symbolizing her building things. I have to admit Branka had poor taste.

Modifié par Herr Uhl, 04 mai 2010 - 09:52 .

[Gilsa]

soignee wrote...

I need to design a Brosca one for the lulz. Missa would probably have something defiant as it would amuse her. LOLOLOL LOOK BRAND

oh and Beraht was merchant caste.

Do eeet!

[Gilsa]

Very good explanations, Knight and Herr. I never considered the surface trade aspect for Behrat, but that certainly does work. Orzammar's prosperity is mostly tied in with the lyrium trade to the surface, which makes me wonder how those mages even get the money for the lyrium if they're shut up in the tower. =p

[Herr Uhl]

soignee wrote...

I need to design a Brosca one for the lulz. Missa would probably have something defiant as it would amuse her. LOLOLOL LOOK BRAND

oh and Beraht was merchant caste.

*throws more shoes*

[Sarah1281]

What I want to know is why Oghren isn't considered a noble? I mean, he was raised up to noble House Branka, right? And she never divorced him or through him out of her House because if she did then since their Houses merged he would be in roughly the same boat as the DN is after returning: technically casteless. Does it just not occur to Oghren he could go off and be a deshyr or is there something preventing the only living member (especially after Branka dies but presumed even before then) of a noble House from claiming those priveleges? House Ortan is reestablished because of some ancient documentaion even though you know none of the other Houses were happy to have to pay up on ancient debts and Oghren being a member of House Branka is even more widely known.

[Gilsa]

I don't know if he actually was House Branka. I was under the impression that you can marry well, but only the children actually get the status of the parent. So maybe he was still warrior caste even though he was married to Branka of the smithing caste (before she became a paragon). And I'm guessing he lost his status when he accidentally killed another warrior while drunk. If that didn't do it, leaving for the surface with the warden certainly did.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Gilsa wrote...

I don't know if he actually was House Branka. I was under the impression that you can marry well, but only the children actually get the status of the parent. So maybe he was still warrior caste even though he was married to Branka of the smithing caste (before she became a paragon). And I'm guessing he lost his status when he accidentally killed another warrior while drunk. If that didn't do it, leaving for the surface with the warden certainly did.

That, plus being seemingly abandonned by his wife and her house. I am nto sure that's good for anyone's reputation.

[soignee]

Why is the Grey Warden expected to help with chosing a side in the Harrowmont/Bhelen debate? Why do they have political clout? I am fumbling for a reason here, and probably have been eating too many crayons again.

why yes this is for fanfic why do you ask hahahahah >.>

Modifié par soignee, 04 mai 2010 - 10:30 .

[Sarah1281]

According to the DA wiki...

Oghren used to be a promising warrior of House Kondrat in Orzammar. He married a Smith Caste girl named Branka, who would later become a Paragon. Soon after founding House Branka – which absorbed the entire House Kondrat – Branka took her household, with the sole exception of her husband, and entered the Deep Roads in search for the secrets of the legendary smith Caridin. They were not heard from again. Oghren, left behind, became a laughing stock. He started drinking, making his situation worse as he challenged another warrior over an insult and killed him in a first-blood match while drunk. Oghren was stripped of his house name and barred from bearing weapons within the city, a punishment considered worse than exile for a warrior.

So that seems to indicate he's not House Branka since that fight but why not take advantage of it earlier? Branka's House was raised up to Paragon-hood and Oghren's House became a part of her House. They were all House Branka. After Branka left, laughingstock or not, he could have gone into the Deep Roads and lead some sort of search party. If you don't side with Bhelen, the mine guards even let you into the Deep Roads as Oghren COULD have claimed the deshyr seat. Was he just not interested?

Why is the Grey Warden expected to help with chosing a side in the Harrowmont/Bhelen debate? Why do they have political clout? I am fumbling for a reason here, and probably have been eating too many crayons again.

The dwarves greatly respect the GW for being the only people besides them to actually fight the darkspawn and instead of just having the occassional expedition, that's the GW's sole purpose. They fight darkspawn and they kill Archdemon. They may not have any more legal power to control the election than a Paragon does, but they are respected enough to be able to do so (and if you admit the Paragon didn't care you actually get to say who you want instead of claiming Branka/Caridin wanted whoever).



As for why you need to get involved at all...the two important things they both want done is wiping out the carta and finding the Paragon. The first task is just to prove your loyalty so they know you won't spy on/assassinate the candidate you meet with. Bhelen and Harrowmont's men are being bribed and are kind of busy so since the GW are really good fighters and have an interest in seeing someone on th throne so they can enforce the treaty and leave, why not have them do it? And when it comes to Branka only a GW is believed to be able to make it all the way after someone with a two-year head start in the Deep Roads surrounded by darkspawn. Respect for the GW skill is so great they just kind of assume you can handle it and, if not, at least they didn't lose any men.

[Costin_Razvan]

Grey Wardens are highly respected in Orzammar for starters.

For your FF specifically. The Warden can help Bhelen because she can seem as a neutral party to House Helmi and Dace and can shows the documents. Against Jarvia she is a very good fighter and is also a duster who knows her way with the Carta. In the last task she is sent to persuade Branka to come back and vote for Bhelen.

You don't have any actual political power. Just that Branka/Caridin doesn't care all that much who becomes king and leave the decision all up to you. Either of them is pleased you destroyed/preserved the anvil, so they don't care about the rest.

  If you don't side with Bhelen, the mine guards even let you into the Deep Roads as Oghren COULD have claimed the deshyr seat. Was he just not interested?  

Oghren, a politician?   Let's be serious for a second here.

He is of noble cast though, That is for sure. Thanks for making me laugh though.

Modifié par Costin_Razvan, 04 mai 2010 - 10:48 .

[Gilsa]

soignee wrote...

Why is the Grey Warden expected to help with chosing a side in the Harrowmont/Bhelen debate? Why do they have political clout? I am fumbling for a reason here, and probably have been eating too many crayons again.

why yes this is for fanfic why do you ask hahahahah >.>

1. It's a scratch-my-back-and-I'll-scratch-yours situation. You can't do jack until there's a king and they can't do jack unless you do the dirty work on their behalf.

2. The paragons transferred their political power to you when they gave you the crown. Even when you say something like, "It was the will of the paragon that I choose," they have to respect that paragon's wishes and abide by your choice.

Modifié par Gilsa, 04 mai 2010 - 10:50 .

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

My favorite character, my original mage, loved the dwarves and Orzammar. Not only did they lack the hatred of magic and mages, as well as Chantry dogma, but the dwarven endurance and single handedly dealing with darkspawn between blights with little complaint was also highly commendable for her. I regret that at the post coronation, that my mage wasn't given the option to send surface troops to Orzammar to help the dwarves, the dwarven origins get. That certainly would have been her first choice, even above liberating the circle.



I've often RP'd my mage, mentally, as running off to Orzamar after the epilogues and opening up a Grey Warden branch in Orzammar, and making it a permanent priority to take the fight to the deep roads.

[Sarah1281]

He is of noble cast though, That is for sure. Thanks for making me laugh though.

If he is a noble, though, why did he keep begging other people to form a search team for Branka instead of doing it himself? Only nobles get free reign of the Deep Roads and can send whoever they want to in there.

[Sarah1281]

(IF: failed persuade) Vartag: "As if you would give up the throne of Orzammar to throw your lot in with these surfacers." (VO: scornful)

I am really having problems getting past this. Dulin just fears you're spying for Bhelen but Vartag and, by extension, Bhelen seem really convinced that you're out for the throne. I know you have a ridiculously good case to be Harrowmont's successor later, but you can't realistically know when you pick Harrowmont that you'll be restored and made a Paragon. Since, as both Nerav and Harrowmont mention if you get nostalgic about how the Assembly used to want you in charge, you don't have the backing of any noble House and two candiates are already vying for the throne, how the hell do they think you'll manage to pull that off? Are they really that paranoid about you? It's kind of like how Bhelen was so paranoid he wouldn't even give you a show trial that he knew he'd have the advantage in because he'd bribed half the Assembly and you either actually did it or had strong circumstantial evidence that you did AND giving you a trial would probably have lessened the rumors that he framed you.



Although I must say, I do like the thought of Bhelen being that paranoid about the DN who may very well be oblivious to his fears....

[Herr Uhl]

Sarah1281 wrote...

I am really having problems getting past this. Dulin just fears you're spying for Bhelen but Vartag and, by extension, Bhelen seem really convinced that you're out for the throne. I know you have a ridiculously good case to be Harrowmont's successor later, but you can't realistically know when you pick Harrowmont that you'll be restored and made a Paragon. Since, as both Nerav and Harrowmont mention if you get nostalgic about how the Assembly used to want you in charge, you don't have the backing of any noble House and two candiates are already vying for the throne, how the hell do they think you'll manage to pull that off? Are they really that paranoid about you? It's kind of like how Bhelen was so paranoid he wouldn't even give you a show trial that he knew he'd have the advantage in because he'd bribed half the Assembly and you either actually did it or had strong circumstantial evidence that you did AND giving you a trial would probably have lessened the rumors that he framed you. 

A king can reinstate people. That is just what Harrowmont does with his kingly powers, and it's pretty predictable that it would happen if you get him elected.

That he then would choose his favorite of the rightful rulers (Aeducan) as heir wouldn't be that much of a stretch.

[soignee]

bollocks bollocks bollocks. My dwarf fangirl side is showing and I've written too much ....stuff this chapter and not even half done with what I want to cram in.



fffffffffffffffffffffff-

[Herr Uhl]

soignee wrote...

bollocks bollocks bollocks. My dwarf fangirl side is showing and I've written too much ....stuff this chapter and not even half done with what I want to cram in.

fffffffffffffffffffffff-

Oooh, I like "....stuff".

But still *shoethrow for great justice*

[soignee]

Herr Uhl wrote...

soignee wrote...

bollocks bollocks bollocks. My dwarf fangirl side is showing and I've written too much ....stuff this chapter and not even half done with what I want to cram in.

fffffffffffffffffffffff-

Oooh, I like "....stuff".

But still *shoethrow for great justice*

whyyyy whyyy are you so delicious to write, dwarf politics, whhhhhhhhhy

[Sarah1281]

whyyyy whyyy are you so delicious to write, dwarf politics, whhhhhhhhhy

Because it's awesome?

A king can reinstate people. That is just what Harrowmont does with his kingly powers, and it's pretty predictable that it would happen if you get him elected.

I don't know, I think reinstating someone from another House might be stepping on the toes of the other nobles. If their House wants to take someone back then they'll do it so the King wouldn't need to get involved unless that House doesn't want them back. Since you're a hero that's being considered for Paragonhood and have killed so many members of House Aeducan in the coup (and more surely would have died in the time between leaving and being reinstated) that their best candidate for heir is Bhelen's infant son...kind of special circumstances.