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[Rhys Cordelle]

The fact that Bhelen could bribe meant he acquired
control over ressources (with no one noticing), made himself credible
and acquired the trust of 50% of the Assembly (over his two siblings,
one of which was the rising star) and only 2 years back, everyone
considered him a child. That's really not to be underestimated.

He didn't get their trust over his siblings. Your character is the one the assembly favors. Bhelen wouldn't have stood a shot at the throne without discrediting or killing you first. The fact that the majority that favored you didn't all back Bhelen says that he is clearly not as popular as you are.

And as was pointed out, the Silent Sisters only support him because he's an Aeducan. That's probably true for quite a few others as well.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Costin_Razvan wrote...
Obviously not. But I would stick with what Zevran says about Harrowmont, that is by far the most convincing argument to side with Bhelen.

"So is this to be your king? A man who cannot even get his own troops to fight."

You can say he is an assassin, but an assassin who knows the workings of the political system very well. So do you really want a king who cannot even get troops to fight? Especially when you are recruiting an army for the Blight? 

That is of course a very strong argument against Harrowmont. The fact he does not command full loyalty. But that's not the army, those are fighters. If Harrowmont is king, then he could (and he does) command the army regardless. And the house that defects, does so under both Bhelen and Harrowmont (though I suspect Bhelen would punish it much more severly).

And this does not show that Bhelen is a better administrator than Harrowmont or if he understands anything about economics, trade and all that (turns out Harrowm ont clearly doesn't either).

But of course, if you are looking at who commands more loyalty, it's definately Bhelen. And when asked about helping against the Blight, Bhelen says that he will committ his forces, while Harrowmont promises to put the matter up to the Assembly (the same Assembly that couldn't bloody do anything a few hours ago).

I am not making a case for Harrowmont here. But it's not clear that Bhelen is a good administrator and ruler, even if he does inspire loyalty and is a good schemer. Of course it turns out that he is all those things. And I personally want Bhelen and Anora to have a kid. 

[Costin_Razvan]

Now that is an enticing thought Knight....especially for my FF 

Though I am probably sure my DC would murder Bhelen in a 1000 ways if he ever cheated on Rica.

Modifié par Costin_Razvan, 19 mai 2010 - 01:23 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

Rhys Cordelle wrote...
He didn't get their trust over his siblings. Your character is the one the assembly favors. Bhelen wouldn't have stood a shot at the throne without discrediting or killing you first. The fact that the majority that favored you didn't all back Bhelen says that he is clearly not as popular as you are.

The fact is, Bhelen had acquired the support of half the Assembly prior to his plot, so no. They favored him before his plot, even if they didn't know about it (and I suspect most of them didn't). and all this was done in secret, so half the Assembly already secretly was dealing with Bhelen.

The DN is the one that seemingly is supported by the Assembly. But the fact Bhelen turned  half of them against you shows that this support was shallow at best.

Rhys Cordelle wrote...
And as was pointed out, the Silent Sisters only support him because he's an Aeducan. That's probably true for quite a few others as well.

It's irrelevent, the point is he has them at his side. His family name is a good instrument.
The smae can be said about Harrowmont supporters, most of whom are against Bhelen for being an Aeducan (it's clear many do not like the idea of another Aeducan ruling).

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 19 mai 2010 - 01:26 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

Costin_Razvan wrote...

Now that is an enticing thought Knight....especially for my FF 

Though I am probably sure my DC would murder Bhelen in a 1000 ways if he ever cheated on Rica.

TEchnically, he still isn't married to Rica, so unless he marries her, he probably will cheat on her.

And yes, my DN did kill Trian, in what he percieves as self defense.

[Costin_Razvan]

He marries her in the DC playthrough, as the DC becomes Paragon and thus Rica gets noble status.

[Sarah1281]

And yes, my DN did kill Trian, in what he percieves as self defense.

I probably would have were there any option to do so without first telling Bhelen. Even if I had trusted him why bother informing him? It's just another variable. He doesn't even promise help, just delaying the expedition for all of five minutes.

[Sarah1281]

Costin_Razvan wrote...

He marries her in the DC playthrough, as the DC becomes Paragon and thus Rica gets noble status.

He could marry her without causing a scandal but we don't know if he does.

[Costin_Razvan]

It's just another variable. He doesn't even promise help, just delaying the expedition for all of five minutes.

Which is still help.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Sarah1281 wrote...

And yes, my DN did kill Trian, in what he percieves as self defense.

I probably would have were there any option to do so without first telling Bhelen. Even if I had trusted him why bother informing him? It's just another variable. He doesn't even promise help, just delaying the expedition for all of five minutes.

He does promise help and makes it clear he isn't confortable with Trian around, suppossedly planing to kill his brother. In fact, Trian is frustrated at my DN because he "found out" that Bhelen was plotting with the DN against him.

Every time I think about this scheme and how perfectly executed it is, I get a pseudo erection, if you would pardon my vulgarity

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 19 mai 2010 - 01:47 .

[Radahldo]

I think Trian was angry for what he perceived as the DN corrupting Bhelen, I don't think he realized before he died how they both were played. I don't get pseudo-erections, but I really like how Sarahs fic deals with it, and all the eating paste jokes.

[Gilsa]

Heh, here's a drawing both Sarah and soignee will appreciate. This dwarf ain't happy after seeing Gorim in Denerim so her companions are trying to cheer her up.


Source: Down in the Dumps

[BigBad]

I wouldn't drink anything Oghren offers you.



Especially seeing his reaction to the Joining in Awakening.

[Sarah1281]

Gilsa wrote...

Heh, here's a drawing both Sarah and soignee will appreciate. This dwarf ain't happy after seeing Gorim in Denerim so her companions are trying to cheer her up.


Source: Down in the Dumps

Aw...that's so OOC thoughtful of them!

And nice new sig.

[Gilsa]

Heh. Think of it as subliminal advertising to get dwarven converts.

[Gilsa]

BigBad wrote...

I wouldn't drink anything Oghren offers you.

Especially seeing his reaction to the Joining in Awakening.

Did you pass out when he offered you a taste of his Oghren brew? =p

[BigBad]

Never got him to offer, actually. Not sure what the trigger is, but I went through his entire dialogue tree, completed his quest, and got his approval at max.

[soignee]

I'M WRITING NOW OKAY

fffffffffffffff-

[Verly]

My DN was going to side with Harry I even did the quests for him...but i asked him HOW he was going to rule...and he sounded so unkinglike.... "Oh, the king isn't really in charge and I'll just do whatever the counsel says, because they know what's best for the dwarfs. " and went on like that.. I mean some of that might even be true, but really...what a whimpy sounding king . and she couldn't get what her lover Zev had to say about Harry either. I didn't even need meta-gaming to know that my Aeducan could NOT in good conscience choose Harry. She had her problems with Bhelen, but she knew he was smart and she was hearing the gossip about how he was going to change things and after being on the surface and seeing how dwarfs were respected she thought his plans were sound.

[Costin_Razvan]

Really Oghren? Just really?

[soignee]

leading drunks against the darkspawn? well alright. GO OGHHHHREN!

[KnightofPhoenix]

Ok this DLC was definately made for the lulz.

[Costin_Razvan]

The tavern is actually a spawn point for City Guards and Mabari, once you kill a good number of them does he spawn.

[soignee]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Ok this DLC was definately made for the lulz.

I just got this delicious image of all the writers and programmers of Bioware leaning back in their chairs being all CRY MOAR, YOUR TEARS ARE DELICIOUS, FANDOM.

Ah, good times.

[Herr Uhl]

soignee wrote...

I just got this delicious image of all the writers and programmers of Bioware leaning back in their chairs being all CRY MOAR, YOUR TEARS ARE DELICIOUS, FANDOM.

Ah, good times.

I know for a fact that Gaider does that. I don't know about the others though.