11146 réponses à ce sujet

[Sarah1281]

Harrowmont couldn't take in a casteless according to tradition, and he is traditional.

He takes in the DNM's son and Mardy, mostly as he's King Endrin's grandson and the same holds true with Endrin Jr. Still, the Assembly isn't going to wipe everyone who helped in the rebellion from the records because that was at least a thid of the Assembly right there and their Houses are never going to stand for it. A lot of the problems the DN faces going back is that House Aeducan refuses to admit that they exist and since the Aeducans were behind Behlen and blame the Warden for his death, they're not going to disclaim him.

[Cypher0020]

Ok how is it possible for a DN to possible become next ruler and kill Behlen in the process?



That qualify as a 'bad' ending.... to me, Orzzmar always gets screwed no matter what happens

[Sarah1281]

Ok how is it possible for a DN to possible become next ruler and kill Behlen in the process?







That qualify as a 'bad' ending.... to me, Orzzmar always gets screwed no matter what happens

What do you mean how is it possible? Just side with Harrowmont. If the golems are gone nothing BAD happens and he's dead in a few years anyway so as long as you make sure to be his successor or find someone strong enough to get things done that isn't as 'practical' as Lady Dace (good luck) it will be fine and might even work out better than Bhelen's tyranny although that would really depend on how you play your DN or if you think any third option would be available later that Harrowmont could endorse.

[Herr Uhl]

Sarah1281 wrote...

Harrowmont couldn't take in a casteless according to tradition, and he is traditional.

He takes in the DNM's son and Mardy, mostly as he's King Endrin's grandson and the same holds true with Endrin Jr. Still, the Assembly isn't going to wipe everyone who helped in the rebellion from the records because that was at least a thid of the Assembly right there and their Houses are never going to stand for it. A lot of the problems the DN faces going back is that House Aeducan refuses to admit that they exist and since the Aeducans were behind Behlen and blame the Warden for his death, they're not going to disclaim him.

He sees the DN and in turn his son and therefore concubine as unfairly cast out, there is no conflict there. It would be a dishonor not to take them in in that case, since his opinion differs. Well, that is at least what I think.

Would he think the same of Bhelen, who conspired to kill both his siblings and tried a coup d'etat at the assembly? And is it house Aeducan, or just Bhelen's goons that attack you? (after the assembly debacle ofc)

[thegreateski]

Support Harrowmont from the beginning.
Destroy the anvil.
ask for Human aid against the blight.

Orzammar is just fine and dandy . . . it just has to look for a new king again. This time without Harrowmont and Behlen to screw things up.

and the Dwarf noble is pretty appealing candidate . . .

Modifié par thegreateski, 11 avril 2010 - 09:59 .

[Sarah1281]

Would he think the same of Bhelen, who conspired to kill both his siblings and tried a coup d'etat at the assembly? And is it house Aeducan, or just Bhelen's goons that attack you? (after the assembly debacle ofc)

Does he have different dialogue concerning your child if you did kill Trian and tell him you enjoyed it?



Not all of House Aeducan attacks you (although they are all pissed) but several prominent members do at the Palace and the Proving. The Aeducans would likely just hold you responsible for losing power as Harrowmont was the one that needed the Paragon to win and once he does everyone is absolutely shocked that he pulls it off so I don't see why they'd strike Bhelen from the records. And don't they name Endrin Jr. heir to House Aeducan anyway (at least if you play DC)?

[Sarah1281]

Support Harrowmont from the beginning.

Destroy the anvil.

ask for Human aid against the blight.

I know that Harrowmont initially turns down the aid (or I know he's supposed to but if it never shows up in my epilogue it never happens) but I'm sure that the DN can eventually convince him to let highly-supervised human troops go straight to the Deep Roads and spend maybe five-ten minutes in Orzammar itself.

[Herr Uhl]

I wouldn't think that the house would condone an attempted assassination of the king, and if they did the other nobles would more than likely lash out, in violent ways. Not striking someone like Bhelen from the records and getting publicly despised for being a kinslayer just doesn't add up to me.

[Radahldo]

So DNM jr isnt branded? Why is that? Months pass and it isnt until the DN shows up that the situation can be rectified.

Modifié par Radahldo, 11 avril 2010 - 10:17 .

[Sarah1281]

I think too many Houses were involved to get rid of everyone involved and Harrowmont would probably not have time to push the issue since he spends most of his time dealing with the rebellion. And if Bhelen were cast out Endrin Jr. would be, too, and we don't hear anything about that (I know Harrowmont promises the DC he won't touch her but if her son's father is now casteless he wouldn't have to).

He sees the DN and in turn his son and therefore concubine as unfairly cast out, there is no conflict there.

Would that be enough for him? The lack of a trial and whole decision to feed the DN to darkspawn may have been a farce but it was still a legal decision and all an honor-before-reason type like him was willing to do was give a better-than-regulation sword and have someone mention who the DN might run into as they were seeking redemption in death.

[Herr Uhl]

Radahldo wrote...

So the DNM jr isnt branded? Why is that? Months pass and it isnt until the DN shows up that it can be rectified.

Might be done with the naming. He still doesn't have a name.

[Sarah1281]

So DNM jr isnt branded? Why is that? Months pass and it isnt until the DN shows up that the situation can be rectified.

How old are casteless when they are branded? The child would be three months old or so by the time the DN came back so if the branding occured at, say, the six month or one year mark then it wouldn't have happened yet. Not to mention there was still the uncertainty about who the father was and thus the caste of the child.

[soignee]

Sarah1281 wrote...

So DNM jr isnt branded? Why is that? Months pass and it isnt until the DN shows up that the situation can be rectified.

How old are casteless when they are branded? The child would be three months old or so by the time the DN came back so if the branding occured at, say, the six month or one year mark then it wouldn't have happened yet. Not to mention there was still the uncertainty about who the father was and thus the caste of the child.

I think we're in the grey area of OH FECK THERE'S NO LORE WRITTEN ABOUT IT here, and barrel scraping through codexes and stuff. I would guess the brand thing would be as soon as it was born, surely... or else children could be passed off too easily into another caste.

I really should get around to buying the Dragon Age RPG book...

[Cypher0020]

Hmmm I may side with Harrowmont... but I really don't like the idea of the rest of house aeducan attacking me....



but we fight in the proving if we side with harrowmont? Even as a DN... I still want the best for Rica and Endrin Jr....



So I'd have to side with Behlen.....right?

[Herr Uhl]

soignee wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...

So DNM jr isnt branded? Why is that? Months pass and it isnt until the DN shows up that the situation can be rectified.

How old are casteless when they are branded? The child would be three months old or so by the time the DN came back so if the branding occured at, say, the six month or one year mark then it wouldn't have happened yet. Not to mention there was still the uncertainty about who the father was and thus the caste of the child.

I think we're in the grey area of OH FECK THERE'S NO LORE WRITTEN ABOUT IT here, and barrel scraping through codexes and stuff. I would guess the brand thing would be as soon as it was born, surely... or else children could be passed off too easily into another caste.

I really should get around to buying the Dragon Age RPG book...

I remember the thread that asked who branded the casteless. I still like the theory that there is someone swooping around on the roofs of Dusttown, brands them in their sleep and then disappears into the permanight/day/whatever.

[Sarah1281]

Hmmm I may side with Harrowmont... but I really don't like the idea of the rest of house aeducan attacking me....



but we fight in the proving if we side with harrowmont? Even as a DN... I still want the best for Rica and Endrin Jr....

You could or could not fight in the Proving no matter who you support. If you convince Harrowmont's fighters to enter you don't have to and if you do Bhelen's quest I heard you can fight for him after that. And tt's not the rest of House Aeducan that attacks you, just - if I remember correctly - more Bhelen fanatics, Vartag and two palace guards (who let him in there?), and any Bhelen-supporting Proving fighter, although that requires going back to the Proving arena.



And it's quite easy to make sure Rica and Endrin are okay as a DN and without metagaming that you care about Rica: return to Orzammar after the Blight and see that your brand-new heir (if you're a girl at least) and his mother are taken care of.

[thegreateski]

I hope they include more gladiatorial combat in the next game.



It was fun.

[Radahldo]

Yeah, I enjoyed provings.

I would've liked a longer Conversation with Piotin, also.

[Sarah1281]

I would've liked a longer Conversation with Piotin, also.

Yeah, give he was the DN's cousin I would have liked to have gotten to know him a little better than just 'guards remove this intruder from my room' and 'You shoud not have returned, Exile, you disgrace us all.' Maybe he could have been in the Origin story for a quick conversation or something.

[Gilsa]

Just wanted to say to y'all that I have appreciated reading 35 pages of pure dwarf conversations and speculations. It was very nice to dissect everything and learn something new on every page.



Salud!

[Sarah1281]

That sounds strangely ominous...

[Costin_Razvan]

Gila, out of curiosity, could you check the dialog with Harrowmont? Namely when the DN is about to be exiled, and when the DN meets him again.

[Cypher0020]

uhhhh Piotin?? I heard he's the Dn's cousin.... how come we never saw him in the origin part??

[Sarah1281]

I don't know but it certainly meant I didn't care whenever I side with Harrowmont and have to kill him.

[Gilsa]

Costin_Razvan wrote...

Gila, out of curiosity, could you check the dialog with Harrowmont? Namely when the DN is about to be exiled, and when the DN meets him again.

Sure.

Prison guard: "Here is the prisoner, Lord Harrowmont."  (VO: Respectful.)
Harrowmont: "Having been found guilty of fratricide by the Assembly of Orzammar, you are hereby sentenced to exile and death." (VO: Formal, emotionless.)
Harrowmont: "Your name is, from this point forward, stripped from the records. You are no longer a person, nor a memory." (VO: Formal, emotionless.)
Harrowmont: "You are to be cast into the Deep Roads with only sword and shield, there to redeem your life by fighting the enemies of Orzammar until your death." (VO: Formal, emotionless.)
Harrowmont: "Do you have anything to say before the sentence is carried out?" (VO: Hopeful, the first emotion he's showing.)

1. I'm innocent.
Harrowmont: "I want to believe that." (VO: Sincere, with a hint of sadness.) *Go to tree 1*

2. You call this justice?
Harrowmont: "I would have prevented it if I could. Everyone should have the right to face his accuser and defend himself." (VO: Sincere, with a hint of sadness.) *Go to tree 1*

3. Bhelen will destroy you, just as he did me.
Harrowmont: "I understand your anger. You should have been allowed to defend yourself. Had I the power to stop this, I would have." (VO: Sincere, with a hint of sadness.) *Go to tree 1*

4. I will have my revenge.
Harrowmont: "I understand your anger. You should have been allowed to defend yourself. Had I the power to stop this, I would have." (VO: Sincere, with a hint of sadness.) *Go to tree 1*

5. *Stay silent.* (SET FLAG: Left_On_Bad_Note_With_Harrowmont) *Go to tree 3*


TREE #1
Harrowmont: "Look me in the eye and tell me you didn't do this. For your father's sake." (VO: Sincere, pleading, almost desperately)

(IF: Not_Bhelen_MurderPlot) 1. I didn't kill Trian. (SET FLAG: Left_On_Good_Note_With_Harrowmont)
Harrowmont: "I believe you." (VO: relief)
Harrowmont: "That means Bhelen planned this from the start." (VO: Sad, a little angry)
Harrowmont: "Believe me, I will spend the rest of my days making sure Bhelen does not profit by his deeds." (VO: Angry, resolute) *Go to tree 2*

2. I had to defend myself. He attacked first!
Harrowmont: "I believe you." (VO: relief)
Harrowmont: "That means Bhelen planned this from the start." (VO: Sad, a little angry)
Harrowmont: "Believe me, I will spend the rest of my days making sure Bhelen does not profit by his deeds." (VO:
Angry, resolute) *Go to tree 2*

(IF: Bhelen_MurderPlot) 3. Bhelen convinced me I had to do it. (SET FLAG: Left_On_Bad_Note_With_Harrowmont)
Harrowmont: "Trian's blood is on Bhelen's hands as well as yours. I will do everything I can to make sure he does not profit by it." (VO: Angry, sad, resolute) *Go to tree 3*

(IF: Bhelen_MurderPlot) 4. *Lie* I didn't kill Trian.
Harrowmont: "I'm glad. It makes what we do here a thousand times worse, but at least I can tell your father the truth about you." (VO: Relief, sadness) (SET FLAG: Left_On_Good_Note_With_Harrowmont) *Go to tree 2*
Note: The above line has no persuade check so the player will get that by default. If there was a check and the player had failed, the line they would then get is as follows:
Harrowmont: "You're a terrible liar." (VO: Scornful, almost spitting.) (SET FLAG: Left_On_Bad_Note_With_Harrowmont) *Go to tree 3*

5. I did it and I enjoyed it. (SET FLAG: Left_On_Bad_Note_With_Harrowmont)
Harrowmont: "Then your father was wrong about you. You're a villain and I suspect your younger brother is just as bad." (VO: Scornful, almost spitting) *Go to tree 3*

6. Drop dead, old man. (SET FLAG: Left_On_Bad_Note_With_Harrowmont)
Harrowmont: "Very well, if that's the way you want it." (VO: Scornful, almost spitting) *Go to tree 3*

TREE #2
Harrowmont: "Your father asked me to give these to you. This sword and shield are of fine dwarven make. Strike a blow at our enemies."

1. How is my father?
Harrowmont: "He is old and this tragedy has hit him hard. He will rest better now, though, knowing the truth." (VO: Sad)
1a. Tell my father I went to a warrior's death. *Go to tree 2, line 3*
1b. It's time for me to go. *Go to tree 2, line 4*

2. Tell my father I'm innocent.
Harrowmont: "I will." (VO: Sad, but resolute)
Harrowmont: "Open the doors and let the condemned walk through." (VO: Formal, resolved)
Harrowmont: "May the Stone accept you when you fall." (VO: May the Stone accept you = may God forgive you)
*End dialogue*

3. Tell my father I went to a warrior's death.
Harrowmont: "I will." (VO: Sad, but resolute)
Harrowmont: "Open the doors and let the condemned walk through." (VO: Formal, resolved)
Harrowmont: "May the Stone accept you when you fall." (VO: May the Stone accept you = may God forgive you)
*End dialogue*

4. It's time for me to go.
Harrowmont: "As you will, Lady of Aeducan/Lord of Aeducan." (VO: Deep sadness. He should sound very respectful when saying the title for the last time.)
Harrowmont: "Open the doors and let the condemned walk through." (VO: Formal, resolved)
Harrowmont: "May the Stone accept you when you fall." (VO: May the Stone accept you = may God forgive you)
*End dialogue*

TREE #3
Harrowmont: "Soldier, hand the accused your sword and shield." (VO: Commanding, proud, almost smug)
Harrowmont: "Open the doors and let the condemned walk through." (VO: Formal, resolved)
Harrowmont: "May the Stone accept you when you fall." (VO: May the Stone accept you = may God forgive you)
*End dialogue*

Modifié par Gilsa, 12 avril 2010 - 04:33 .