535 réponses à ce sujet

[Liso66]

Sad Dragon wrote...

Liso66 wrote...
"sighs"

My point was, it is a mockery of a romance. All some huge joke. I fear you are inclined to argue no matter what I say. So I'll just agree to disagree with you.. 

Im not going to disagree with you if your reasoning is solid. My problem is i just dont get it atm and i am trying to do so. To better understand your reasoning i have asked you twice to explain it - or simply elaborate that is all. I do appologise if my last post came of as hostile - while i can understand that being so, my intent was never to sound hostile.

/TSD

Okay.. I will try to elaborate then.

I have played both male and female Shepards. I do this in any RPG offering both options to get the feel for both sides. The male Shepard romances seemed more real (as real as a game romance is anyway). Where as, the female options seemed a huge joke. It all seemed laid our for the humor factor, rather than a romance plot.. 

that better? 

[Masticetobbacco]

Liso66 wrote...

This is mostly to Bioware.
.
I do not wish to stir anything up. Nor do I wish for it to ignite any flaming.

One of my very few complaints with Mass Effect 2, was the uneven romance options for male and female characters. While the male character gets a choice between three females, and two of them human. They also get better romance scenes.

Having said that. I came to a final conclusion. I am sad that it seems that the Bioware writers created the female romance options, not for female players. It is geared for the male players, playing female characters. All for kicks and giggles. Between the comments that Solis makes, and the scenes themselves. This could not have possibly been intended for the female player.

The male Shepard not only gets much better options, the romance itself is much more deep. "not that any of them are really all that deep" but the comparable is very unbalanced. The scenes are more steamy and sexy for the male character.

The female Shepard? Garrus, Thane, and Jacob.

First let me say, Garrus is a cool buddy. but a romance option? Maybe if my character was addicted to red sand and Garrus had her next fix. The romance scenes are sooo incredibly lame as well. Some cheesy dialog from Garrus with heads touching, then a fade screen?

Thane. A cool persona, but c'mon.. looks like the creature from the black lagoon and dieing.. All to get some drama about dieing, kiss, then fade screen.

I have no clue about Jacob as he is so boring, I would never bother.

Bioware. You have more female players than I think you realize. We are typically less vocal in the community.. Well. aside from players like me. We keep hearing about game companies wanting to tap into the female demographic?  We are already here. But joke romances like this, that clearly display an unfair balance, are not the way to go..

I still loved the game none the less. Though. I think all my runs will be with Kaidian and or Ashley (faithful), as they did not seem to be a total mockery for the female player choices.

Regards

Female gamer...  

Bioware moderators have a terrible tl;dr policy, if you want to get a point out, make it short 

but I do kinda agree with you. Not as if they will listen to this though. Bioware is too busy developping shooter combat, rather than making content for a rommance subplot that takes up 10-15 minutes of actual gameplay

also I think you are overestimating the amount of female players. Your numbers may be rising, but gaming communities will always be a sausege fest. Most of the "girls" you associate with that are also gamers may be men or FBI agents in disguise

Modifié par Masticetobbacco, 05 avril 2010 - 12:07 .

[Sad Dragon]

Atleast we have somewhere to start now

If i may?
What about Garrus and Thanes romances felt like a big joke to you? From where i was sitting neither of them felt very jokish. Not even going to tuch the Jacob one, i felt unclean after seeing that one -shudders-

/TSD

Modifié par Sad Dragon, 05 avril 2010 - 12:17 .

[Steel Dancer]

Shinian2 wrote...

Maybe you should check out the jacob love scene. I've seen it on youtube and I don't really think it was designed with men playing women in mind.

Overall though I agree with you.

Truth be told, I'm not sure that was designed with anyone human in mind... Soooo badly done.

[Liso66]

Sad Dragon wrote...

Atleast we have somewhere to start now

If i may?
What about Garrus and Thanes romances felt like a big joke to you? From where i was sitting neither of them felt very jokish. Not even going to tuch the Jacob one, i felt unclean after seeing that one -shudders-

/TSD

Yeah. Jacob..  I was waiting for the porn music to kick in..  yikes!

Realitstically. Well.. from a human point of view. A turian? A frog man? that is dieing no less! I love both of these companions, don't get me wrong on that. As a romance option. A far less stretch from a Quarian even.  then all the major jokes from the Mordin. This gave me the impression these were set primarly for the humor.

[Collider]

LeoInterVir wrote...

Technically ME1 did not have any lesbian sex. It only had straight, straight, or blue unisex alien.
Yes, Asari do look like blue women but they are not, they aren't human and they aren't a woman.

But they're female. It's lesbian sex. Two women can look like the society's typical view of masculine, they can dress in masculine clothing and speak in deep voices, but if they have sex, it's lesbian sex. An asari is not unisex, and Asari is female. You would think the breasts, hips, face, voice, EVERYTHING would give it away. It's true that Asari aren't women, but they are female.

[Collider]

MarginalBeast wrote...

[Collider]

Liso66 wrote...
then all the major jokes from the Mordin.

Mordin jokes about all the romance interests, even the humans. If you don't have a romance interest and you keep talking to him, he jokes that you're hitting on him, whether Shepard is male or female. Mordin's just a funny guy.

[Sad Dragon]

Liso66 wrote...

Yeah. Jacob..  I was waiting for the porn music to kick in..  yikes!

I wouldnt have been surpriced if that happened ;;

Liso66 wrote...
Realitstically. Well.. from a human point of view. A turian? A frog man? that is dieing no less! I love both of these companions, don't get me wrong on that. As a romance option. A far less stretch from a Quarian even.  then all the major jokes from the Mordin. This gave me the impression these were set primarly for the humor.

I think i might be misunderstanding you but it sounds like your problem with the Garrus and Thanes romances are that they are not human?

Also: Mordin is comic releaf he always makes major jokes so i dont think that has anything to do with the romances at all - in effect i missed his dialogue all together my first romance ^^;

Stole this from my edit of my previous post - figured it would fit better into the post i was typing as edits are so easaly missed:

To clearify, i am simply asking this as i want to get to the core of the problem. A feeling is all well and good but it hard to convey to any potential bioware dev who might lurk on the forums where they when wrong. And i assume that your intent is to try and give the devs feedback so that they can improve the romances for ME3.

/TSD

Modifié par Sad Dragon, 05 avril 2010 - 12:22 .

[Liso66]

Masticetobbacco wrote...


also I think you are overestimating the amount of female players. Your numbers may be rising, but gaming communities will always be a sausege fest. Most of the "girls" you associate with that are also gamers may be men or FBI agents in disguise

A game convention touched on this fairly seriously. 44% of the casual gamer are female. As they are starting to migrate into the more hard core games, They are trying to figure out how to tap into the female demographic.

This is not with out it's challenges. However, I do not believe it impossible. We are not as complicated as Oprah may want you to think. Or all those stupid women's magazines.  If you have both options. Male and Female. then address it as such. Get some women writers! If that is what it takes. Or at least one that thinks like a woman. It is really not that difficult to make us happy... 

[Lucky Thirteen]

I think Bioware tried, they just need to hire more women on the team. I remember reading the article about how they designed Thane, and it sounds like any women working at Bioware are doing paper work in cubicles while all the guys are writing the story and doing the game design.



There were things I loved about the romances, and there were things that were just utterly pathetic that I think if a woman was there she would of said "No....that's stupid." Besides the Jacob relationship sounding like they were both in heat 24/7, I was pretty satisfied with Garrus and Thane.

[Remmak]

Well, I'm a 'female gamer' too and I couldn't disagree with you more.



Oh, and Thane's scene wasn't about dying at all. Yes, he was talking about dying, but that wasn't the take-away point. You may want to watch it again.

[Collider]

There were some female writers for Dragon Age at least. Not sure if any worked on Alistair though.

[Liso66]

Sad Dragon wrote...



To clearify, i am simply asking this as i want to get to the core of the problem. A feeling is all well and good but it hard to convey to any potential bioware dev who might lurk on the forums where they when wrong. And i assume that your intent is to try and give the devs feedback so that they can improve the romances for ME3.

/TSD

the core issue is.... it all seemed like a huge joke..  Compared to the male Shepard..  I realize this is my opinion and others may not agree with me. We all see things through different view points.  This one just happens to be mine.. 

Did i mention i love the game regardless?     lol

[Liso66]

Collider wrote...

There were some female writers for Dragon Age at least. Not sure if any worked on Alistair though.

I actually think Gaider wrote for Alistair..  If memory serves. 

[clyde]

Eh. I loved the Thane and Garrus romances, but I can see what you mean. That said, I disagree: I don't think Bioware's overlooking / slighting the female players (for one, I found Thane's romance to be the deepest), I think they're just not so good at love interests. :innocent:

I mean, fem!Sheps have their two xeno options and then the priiiize, the issues of which you've already listed, but male!Sheps get the equally problematic:

Tali: Thane's going to die 8-10 months after ME2, yeah, but there's a very good chance loveinterest!Tali will die too. She states that dying after intimacy, due to her compromised immune system, is a possibility - and, even after taking herbal supplements, she still has a pretty bad reaction to it. That's not even counting in fun stuff like the possibility of DNA allergies cropping up. I mean, if they swear a life of celibacy, they're set - otherwise, there's a risk of Tali dying each time she steps out of her envirosuit.

Jack:  A lot of people found her, courtesy of the shaved head, A-cup and tattoos, to be as unattractive as Thane or Garrus. Her romance is problematic in waaay too many ways to count, but for a quick list: she's got trust issues up the wazoo, is a little mentally unbalanced, and oh yeah, the talk with Mordin consists of him telling you that she might kill you.

Miranda: Okay, I can't actually pick on Miranda too much, mostly since I've never played through her romance. She does spend the first half of the game being very vocal about the fact she wanted to implant a control-chip in your head, though! That has to count for something.

I do agree on the sexscenes, though I prefer the emotional ones over more of the priiiize. 

Modifié par clyde, 05 avril 2010 - 12:32 .

[Sad Dragon]

Liso66 wrote...

the core issue is.... it all seemed like a huge joke..  Compared to the male Shepard..  I realize this is my opinion and others may not agree with me. We all see things through different view points.  This one just happens to be mine.. 

Did i mention i love the game regardless?     lol

Well then, i think i shall head of and get some sleep
I wish you a good romance option in ME3 /bow

NN all

/The Tired Sad Dragon

Modifié par Sad Dragon, 05 avril 2010 - 12:36 .

[Collider]

[quote]clyde wrote...
Jack:  A lot of people found her, courtesy of the
shaved head,[/quote]
Couldn't care less about the baldness my self. It's not particularly attractive or unattractive, although I'm sure a different face shape would be less complimentary to the bald head.

[quote]A-cup [/quote]
Not the A-cup. Having large breasts with that outfit would be even worse. It's the outfit itself that turns me off, it looks like some kind of weird fetish gear, not something I'd want someone I could potentially be interested in casually wearing. That's just my opinion though, not a knock on the Jack fans.

and tattoos,[/quote]
I like the tattoos, they give her character (so it seems) and you can wonder why she got each tattoo. It's unique.

[quote]Her romance is problematic in waaay too many ways to count, [/quote]
She also appears to be suffering from neural degeneration, which might eventually kill her.

[Collider]

aynxalot wrote...
 And the wonderful thing is it doesn't need the fanservice-y sex appeal that the MShep romances do.

wat

[Masticetobbacco]

aynxalot wrote...

 And the wonderful thing is it doesn't need the fanservice-y sex appeal that the MShep romances do. I'm happy with the emotional appeal, kthx.

pffttttt... emotional appeal. We're fine with our guns, booze, and sex thanks

[Tlazolteotl]

Collider wrote...

aynxalot wrote...
 And the wonderful thing is it doesn't need the fanservice-y sex appeal that the MShep romances do.

wat

Apparently some people think Miranda is popular ...

[jlb524]

I found the Jack romance to have plenty of emotional appeal...more than most of the male options.

[Internet Kraken]

clyde wrote...



Jack: A lot of people found her, courtesy of the shaved head, A-cup and tattoos, to be as unattractive as Thane or Garrus. Her romance is problematic in waaay too many ways to count, but for a quick list: she's got trust issues up the wazoo, is a little mentally unbalanced, and oh yeah, the talk with Mordin consists of him telling you that she might kill you.

I actually didn't find jack to be unattractive for any of those reasons. What really drove me away from her was her clothes, which are horribly ugly.Also Tali won't die due to the magic of plot.