536 réponses à ce sujet

[screwoffreg]

Ray Joel Oh wrote...

JohnnyDollar wrote...

Ray Joel Oh wrote...
The gaming community is composed of many different vocal minorities.  Female gamers, racial minorities, gamers with poor eyesight or who are hard of hearing, foreign markets--being considerate of different demographics is what makes better games.  The gay demographic is a significant one.  Although Bioware holds no obligation to provide consessions to anyone, it would not only make their games more entertaining to more people, it would be profitable.

How do know it would be more profitable?  How do know it will not turn away other demographics?

Because looking at the sales of other popular games with gay options in them has shown that the number of people willing to refuse to play a good game from a beloved franchise is negligable.  Plus if you have a significant-to-the-point-of-willing-to-boycott moral objection to non-traditional relationships, you would already be refusing to buy both ME1 and ME2.

Gamers buy good games, regardless of content.  Super violent games like GTA and others sell and I am sure sexier games would sell if the US market wasn't so skittish about the human body and slap them all with AO ratings for showing flesh.

You may get some comments, but even the biggest homophobe wants a good story and action, so they would just ignore the gay parts.

[Collider]

The riddle to whether gay content is profitable is not as easy as gay content = more money. You also need to factor in the cost of making the gay content, as well as the possible PR problems.

[GuardianAngel470]

justinnstuff wrote...

screwoffreg wrote...
The hilarious thing in the Sims was that EVERYONE was bisexual.  If you were nice and flirty enough, you could get married housewives to leave and become your girlfriend.  I didn't hear any real complaints about homewrecking there from Fox...

Meh, everyone with half a brain knows Fox News is a joke. I guess that means there's a lot of idiots out there...

Yes quite a few million idiots.

[screwoffreg]

Nightwriter wrote...

Well, there you go. Plus, in the Sims it doesn't really feel like actual people in actual scenes. Not like in Mass Effect. Mass Effect scenes and romances play out like movies almost.

Which, ironically, is what makes them good.

That's true, but like I said, the ME 1 scenes were so tame as not be that different from "cartoonish bed moving".  It showed two seconds of a butt and then kissing.  You see more action in a PG 13 movie these days!

[screwoffreg]

GuardianAngel470 wrote...

justinnstuff wrote...

screwoffreg wrote...
The hilarious thing in the Sims was that EVERYONE was bisexual.  If you were nice and flirty enough, you could get married housewives to leave and become your girlfriend.  I didn't hear any real complaints about homewrecking there from Fox...

Meh, everyone with half a brain knows Fox News is a joke. I guess that means there's a lot of idiots out there...

Yes quite a few million idiots.

The human race has no shortage of such

[Ray Joel Oh]

Xaijin wrote...

without mods, no.

Rated T.

They can still make out and grind against each other.  Enough to drop some monocles.

[screwoffreg]

Ray Joel Oh wrote...

Xaijin wrote...

without mods, no.

Rated T.

They can still make out and grind against each other.  Enough to drop some monocles.

Yeah, and a very, very SIMPLE patch removes the nudity filter, so you are basically seeing an anatomically correct human form, making it that much more risque than ME.

[Xaijin]

HARRUMPH.



Do they still have the grinding?

[screwoffreg]

Xaijin wrote...

HARRUMPH.

Do they still have the grinding?

Yeah.  Wild making out has been part of the Sims since forever...

[GuardianAngel470]

I'm seeing a lot of conspiracy theories in this thread. Why don't you just take the devs at their word and accept that Shepard can't romance someone of the same sex because they didn't want him to? They wrote the character and they get to dictate how he behaves. You wouldn't be complaining this much if it were a book or a movie, why complain about it because it is a video game? They already told you that they perceive this series as a third person narative (like a movie or book) and yet a lot of you seem to ignore this in favor of seeing some darker message.



They have already proved that they aren't afraid of making homosexual romances in a big budget game.

[Ray Joel Oh]

Collider wrote...

The riddle to whether gay content is profitable is not as easy as gay content = more money. You also need to factor in the cost of making the gay content, as well as the possible PR problems.

I'll always doubt the legitimacy of the PR problems.  No such thing as bad publicity and all that.  And without pre-rendered scenes, it's as simple as changing some plot flags to make a heterosexual romance homosexual.  All the animations fit, some of them even have most of the lines already there.

[jlb524]

I am retiring from this discussion for the evening.



To emphasize my point, I'm aware that there is lesbian content in ME2, but I think it is crap compared to the straight content and often it is offensive. Instead of a lot of crap content, I would like a little bit of good content. That is all.

[Collider]

JohnnyDollar wrote...

Collider wrote...

The riddle to whether gay content is profitable is not as easy as gay content = more money. You also need to factor in the cost of making the gay content, as well as the possible PR problems.

And PR problems for a business is ultimately money right?

If you're saying that PR problems = equal more money, you are false. It can, but it does not have to.

[Onyx Jaguar]

jlb524 wrote...

I am retiring from this discussion for the evening.

To emphasize my point, I'm aware that there is lesbian content in ME2, but I think it is crap compared to the straight content and often it is offensive. Instead of a lot of crap content, I would like a little bit of good content. That is all.

Indeed, although I'd also like to emphasize that it is disapointing that there is no M/M content

[screwoffreg]

GuardianAngel470 wrote...

I'm seeing a lot of conspiracy theories in this thread. Why don't you just take the devs at their word and accept that Shepard can't romance someone of the same sex because they didn't want him to? They wrote the character and they get to dictate how he behaves. You wouldn't be complaining this much if it were a book or a movie, why complain about it because it is a video game? They already told you that they perceive this series as a third person narative (like a movie or book) and yet a lot of you seem to ignore this in favor of seeing some darker message.

They have already proved that they aren't afraid of making homosexual romances in a big budget game.

We've covered this ground already.  The whole Liara not being gay thing (she's female, surprise!!!!), cut dialogue (maybe explainable) etc etc.  Yeah, its just guesses and we will likely NEVER know.  

It is surprising because basically ever Bioware game has given you that choice in recent memory though.  Its just a jarring change.

[Collider]

Ray Joel Oh wrote...

Collider wrote...

The riddle to whether gay content is profitable is not as easy as gay content = more money. You also need to factor in the cost of making the gay content, as well as the possible PR problems.

I'll always doubt the legitimacy of the PR problems.  No such thing as bad publicity and all that.  And without pre-rendered scenes, it's as simple as changing some plot flags to make a heterosexual romance homosexual.  All the animations fit, some of them even have most of the lines already there.

That's an assumption. Since we are talking about homosexual content in general, Bioware could very well make the homosexual content more varied than the heterosexual content than just plot flags and changing pronouns. Also, thinking that the animations for the sex scene with Kaidan if you're male would be the same makes me laugh hard.

[GuardianAngel470]

JohnnyDollar wrote...

Collider wrote...

The riddle to whether gay content is profitable is not as easy as gay content = more money. You also need to factor in the cost of making the gay content, as well as the possible PR problems.

And PR problems for a business is ultimately money right?

Any publicity is good publicity.  Just think about how much it would cost bioware and by extension EA to advertize their game on every major news channel at prime time.  Now consider that that exact thing can be achieved by letting it slip that there is homosexual content, ie creating a scandal.  You all think that the ME1 thing with Fox News was bad for bioware when in reality it was just free advertizing. 

Carls Jr (A west coast US burger chain) does that all the time, and the news stations still fall for it, even when their newscasters say that all they are doing is giving them free advertizing.

[screwoffreg]

The Liara thing grated on me most. Sure, their species is ONE sex, female, so among their people there is no such concept as "gay". Let's be honest here folks, if you are a human female you have to have lesbian tendencies to be attracted to an OBVIOUSLY female alien. The whole "Naw, they are just different is all!!!" was really lame.

Modifié par screwoffreg, 06 avril 2010 - 04:15 .

[GuardianAngel470]

Collider wrote...

Ray Joel Oh wrote...

Collider wrote...

The riddle to whether gay content is profitable is not as easy as gay content = more money. You also need to factor in the cost of making the gay content, as well as the possible PR problems.

I'll always doubt the legitimacy of the PR problems.  No such thing as bad publicity and all that.  And without pre-rendered scenes, it's as simple as changing some plot flags to make a heterosexual romance homosexual.  All the animations fit, some of them even have most of the lines already there.

That's an assumption. Since we are talking about homosexual content in general, Bioware could very well make the homosexual content more varied than the heterosexual content than just plot flags and changing pronouns. Also, thinking that the animations for the sex scene with Kaidan if you're male would be the same makes me laugh hard.

If you read the devs response in the OP Ray then you should know that Bioware wouldn't do what you are suggesting.  He addresses that very method of making a homosexual romance scene in the OP.

[Collider]

Bad publicity can yield more money, but it does not have to. Literally. If you are being sponsored or assisted by other companies, they will withdraw giving you money or doing business if your publicity is negative enough.

[screwoffreg]

Collider wrote...

Bad publicity can yield more money, but it does not have to. Literally. If you are being sponsored or assisted by other companies, they will withdraw giving you money or doing business if your publicity is negative enough.

The publicity about ME 1 was just Fox News though, and it obviously did nothing to deter sales.  It's not like the President came out and said "DAMN ME FOR ITS EVIL WAYS!!!"

[GuardianAngel470]

screwoffreg wrote...

GuardianAngel470 wrote...

I'm seeing a lot of conspiracy theories in this thread. Why don't you just take the devs at their word and accept that Shepard can't romance someone of the same sex because they didn't want him to? They wrote the character and they get to dictate how he behaves. You wouldn't be complaining this much if it were a book or a movie, why complain about it because it is a video game? They already told you that they perceive this series as a third person narative (like a movie or book) and yet a lot of you seem to ignore this in favor of seeing some darker message.

They have already proved that they aren't afraid of making homosexual romances in a big budget game.

We've covered this ground already.  The whole Liara not being gay thing (she's female, surprise!!!!), cut dialogue (maybe explainable) etc etc.  Yeah, its just guesses and we will likely NEVER know.  

It is surprising because basically ever Bioware game has given you that choice in recent memory though.  Its just a jarring change.

Oh, my apologies for posting a redundant statement.

[jlb524]

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

jlb524 wrote...

I am retiring from this discussion for the evening.

To emphasize my point, I'm aware that there is lesbian content in ME2, but I think it is crap compared to the straight content and often it is offensive. Instead of a lot of crap content, I would like a little bit of good content. That is all.

Indeed, although I'd also like to emphasize that it is disapointing that there is no M/M content

Yes, there is absolutely NO M/M content, not even bad stufff.