258292 réponses à ce sujet

[Alphyn]

CptSkull wrote...

It's strange how we talk about if Tali is old enough to do it, but we never ask if she's old enough to kill.

If the comic of Kick-Ass has taught me anything, it's that you can never be too young to kill; especially if you're an 8 year old girl with the mind of Clint Eastwood and akimbo katanas.

[CptSkull]

Can we please stop talking about if Tali is a minor, before Fox News sees it.

Modifié par CptSkull, 03 juillet 2010 - 02:12 .

[Someone With Mass]

Lividity Jones wrote...

Azint wrote...

You know, Romeo and Juliet were sixteen and fourteen years old, respectively, when they did it. Yet no one is throwing fits about that.
Does it really matter how old either character is? Do these speculative connotations really bother you so, or the accusations?

It matters when people accuse us of being rapists for romancing Tali.

'kay...

Now tell me how that makes sense.

[Kira Shepard]

So...is AoD done?

[RiptideX1090]

Lividity Jones wrote...

Azint wrote...

You know, Romeo and Juliet were sixteen and fourteen years old, respectively, when they did it. Yet no one is throwing fits about that.
Does it really matter how old either character is? Do these speculative connotations really bother you so, or the accusations?

It matters when people accuse us of being rapists for romancing Tali.

Yeah.

If anyone is raping anyone, it's Tali raping Shepard.

I saw that pounce.

[Azint]

Pacifien wrote...

Phil725 wrote...
I never understood the whole little sister thing that gets thrown a lot either.*snip*

I do. I like her, but I don't romance her. If I figure her and my Shepard to be particularly close, it would be as a little sister just as much as Garrus is a brother. I can see people not wanting to do the romance because that's how they view the character: family rather than romance.

It's called platonic affection. Understandable, but people will hold varying veiws on such. I never actually thought of Tali as a little sister, so it never bothered me. I could consider Garrus to be a brother, and I still felt that his romance path is one of the only ones that was actually well done.

[RiptideX1090]

Kira Shepard wrote...

So...is AoD done?

Not the last time I checked...

Huh. You raise an interesting point.

Azint? Isn't tonight an AOD night?

[Collider]

Allow me to faciliate discussion of another topic (although the one that kglaser brought up interests me - I am not completely familiar with the Quarian economy)



Anyway, here is what I wrote to a pm with someone who raised concern about Shepard's ability to "influence her." I disagree strongly with the notion that Shepard can influence her so easily as if she is malleable and a puppy to Shepard's every whim. In fact, Tali's loyalty is literally the most variable in the entire game. Here's what I wrote:

So, we have the greatest obligation Tali has in her life - the Migrant Fleet, yet she was openly defiant to their command as she saw behind their facade. Tali is unique in ME2 as she is the only one who has so many ways of losing her loyalty. Even during her romance -you can lose Tali's loyalty if you side with Legion. She does not let her principles be compromised for Shepard.



After which - the romance is completely over. You can get her loyalty back with charm and intimidate, but the romance is terminated.



This is incongruous with the notion that Tali is an impressionable person who would let Shepard decide her morals for her. In fact, all of these things indicate that Tali is one of the most stalwart of the squad mates.

[Pacifien]

Phil725 wrote...
It does take place during college years, the very end of college years when you're ready to go into the real world and succeed.  That's my whole point.  Tali on her pilgrimage is like a college student about to graduate, not an incoming freshman.  Accelerated upbrining or not, she would not have been ready for her pilgrimage at 18, but she clearly was at 22.

I've known 18 year olds far more prepared for the trials of life than a 22 year old. Or a 25 year old. A lot of that probably has to do with what they had to do as they grew up.

I have no problem with people thinking Tali is 22 and they certainly have the website to back them up. I personally think she was younger and I have the inconsistencies of the website to allow for that leeway.

[Phil725]

Pacifien wrote...

Phil725 wrote...
I never understood the whole little sister thing that gets thrown a lot either.*snip*

I do. I like her, but I don't romance her. If I figure her and my Shepard to be particularly close, it would be as a little sister just as much as Garrus is a brother. I can see people not wanting to do the romance because that's how they view the character: family rather than romance.

I see it differently because I have a little sister, and romantic feelings for Tali aside, the friendship between Tali and Shep hardly goes into the little sister territory for me.  They are much more like very close friends, or even just brother/sister in general.  Little sister to me implies that Shep is protecting her and teaching her about the world, and that the little sister will go along with what the big brother says, that she looks up to him to some extent.  I could see this case being made in ME1, but its definitely not true in ME2.  Tali is perfectly fine being an independent person, and she is more than ok standing up for herself, while she respects Shep, she is hardly worshipping him and following him around.

Maybe that's more along the lines of semantics though.

[Azint]

Lividity Jones wrote...

Azint wrote...

You know, Romeo and Juliet were sixteen and fourteen years old, respectively, when they did it. Yet no one is throwing fits about that.
Does it really matter how old either character is? Do these speculative connotations really bother you so, or the accusations?

It matters when people accuse us of being rapists for romancing Tali.

And you let what other people think bother you?

[Battalion]

RiptideX1090 wrote...

Kira Shepard wrote...

So...is AoD done?

Not the last time I checked...

Huh. You raise an interesting point.

Azint? Isn't tonight an AOD night?

Whats AoD?

[Kira Shepard]

RiptideX1090 wrote...

Lividity Jones wrote...

Azint wrote...

You know, Romeo and Juliet were sixteen and fourteen years old, respectively, when they did it. Yet no one is throwing fits about that.
Does it really matter how old either character is? Do these speculative connotations really bother you so, or the accusations?

It matters when people accuse us of being rapists for romancing Tali.

Yeah.

If anyone is raping anyone, it's Tali raping Shepard.

I saw that pounce.

Can't rape the willing.

[Lividity Jones]

Azint wrote...

Lividity Jones wrote...

Azint wrote...

You know, Romeo and Juliet were sixteen and fourteen years old, respectively, when they did it. Yet no one is throwing fits about that.
Does it really matter how old either character is? Do these speculative connotations really bother you so, or the accusations?

It matters when people accuse us of being rapists for romancing Tali.

And you let what other people think bother you?

Do I really need to go into this like I did before?

[CptSkull]

Modifié par CptSkull, 03 juillet 2010 - 02:16 .

[Pacifien]

Azint wrote...
You know, Romeo and Juliet were sixteen and fourteen years old, respectively, when they did it. Yet no one is throwing fits about that.
Does it really matter how old either character is? Do these speculative connotations really bother you so, or the accusations?

I wrote a paper once about how Romeo and Juliet was a cautionary tale of the foolishness in young, inexperienced love rather than a tale of tragic romance.

I don't care what age the characters are for their romance, I've already said that. I do think it's ridiculous to think Shepard is 29. I do like to think Tali is younger than 24. The reasons for this are separate from whatever opinion I have on their romance, though.

[Tairis Deamhan]

A wild fic appears!

social.bioware.com/511958/blog/6421/

Go read and give feedback instead of arguing over Tali's age! (Yes said fic is heavily Tali related )

[Azint]

RiptideX1090 wrote...

Not the last time I checked...

Huh. You raise an interesting point.

Azint? Isn't tonight an AOD night?

If you're willing to wait. I have some plans tonight.

[Someone With Mass]

Kira Shepard wrote...
Can't rape the willing.

It's not rape if the "victim" is embracing it.

Modifié par Someone With Mass, 03 juillet 2010 - 02:22 .

[Phil725]

Pacifien wrote...

Collider wrote...
Frankly, Pacifien, we don't know the specifics so it's largely speculative.

That's what I'm doing: speculating. That's what people do for the most part on forums.

But I still maintain that Shepard is 31 no matter when he regained some semblance of life. I never understood this desire to cling to the age of 29 other than some inherent belief that 30 has pushed you over the hill by society's standards.

That's hardly the reasoning for me.  The man's body was completely destroyed when he was 29.  You don't age when you're dead, someone who was born in 1900 and died in 1950 (and who's body was preserved as it was at that time for the last 60 years,) would not be 110 if you reanimated them right now.  Shep's case is just taking it to the opposite of the extreme.

It basically all comes down to whether Cerberus rebuilt him to his 29 year old self, or whether they simulated the aging process.  You can throw in other speculation about the aging process being restarted earlier as well.  Since its all speculation, it obviously can't be proven one way or the other, but 29 looks a whole lot more accurate to me than 31.

[Someone With Mass]

CptSkull wrote...

So?

[uhdnrt]

hmmmm....my music no longer pleases the muse (unable to find inspiration to write. Any suggestions for types of music?

[mikethor007]

Tairis Deamhan wrote...

A wild fic appears!

social.bioware.com/511958/blog/6421/

Go read and give feedback instead of arguing over Tali's age! (Yes said fic is heavily Tali related )

Done and Done.

[Azint]

Pacifien wrote...

I wrote a paper once about how Romeo and Juliet was a cautionary tale of the foolishness in young, inexperienced love rather than a tale of tragic romance.

I don't care what age the characters are for their romance, I've already said that. I do think it's ridiculous to think Shepard is 29. I do like to think Tali is younger than 24. The reasons for this are separate from whatever opinion I have on their romance, though.

Shepard is 31, without a doubt. Two years dead does not mean the character is exempt from time. Shepard may only be 29 physically, but the two years still do count. People like to argue the ages on the website, but only when it comes to Mordin, Grunt, and Zaeed. Is it really that hard to accept that she is 24 years old? What about all the other characters listed? Their listed ages are void, too.

As I said; I don't think it's an issue worth fussing over, on either side.