78 réponses à ce sujet

[unspoken_demise]

ElektroDragon wrote...
I asked you on the BioWare forums over a year ago to make this a Games for Windows - Live title, but I guess you don't listen to your customers.

All the while accusing some of the other posters of simply being ignorant? Throwing stones from your glass house much? You can't honesty believe that it's the case that since you (and presumably some other people) wanted DA:O to be GFW-compatible, and they didn't do it, that it automatically entails failing to listen to customers.

There's no point in complaining about this. Your points mean more to you than the full game experience (it would be different in you had financial considerations, like needing to buy a new PC for it), and that's all there is. Move along, nothing to see here.

EDIT: Additionally, how do you *know* such things as modding potential weren't considerations Bioware was throwing around? The fact that they may not have explicitly stated such a thing doesn't equate to there not being reasons *why* they wouldn't do GFW.

Modifié par unspoken_demise, 08 novembre 2009 - 10:16 .

[MrGOH]

GFWL makes patching QA for the devs a big headache - Microsoft suddenly has a say in every post-release decision the devs make about their game. It's not dev friendly, and can drive up the cost of a PC game. So no GFWL for me, thank you. I'm happy enough with the social site for all my meaningless achievement needs.

[loudenkl]

To the OP the question is why?? What does GFWL bring to the plate and how would it make DA:O better?

I for one do not play games to boost achievements or obtain some score that only has meaning to one person, so GFWL in any game is meaningless to me (IMHO).

[ElektroDragon]

DeepGray wrote...

GfWL is extra overhead that doesn't add any real feature. 

It adds tons of featues.  Automatic patching, NON-INTRUSTIVE account based DRM (not install based, or tied to a PC), achievements and gamerscore, a unified interface that allows for headset and controller use in addition to keyboard, which adds flexibility, a friends list and easy matchmaking for online games.  And its free.  It doesn't consume any more system cycles or RAM than Steam does, I tested it.

[FollowTheGourd]

ElektroDragon wrote...
 You can re-install a GFWL title as many times as you want, its like Steam, in that its ACCOUNT driven. If there really was some install # restriction that had nothing to do with GFWL, but probably a bug in the game or the publisher doing something extra not part of the GFWL mechanism.

Tell that to people like myself and people here: http://forums.gamesf...com/t/3213.aspx
(I can't be bothered to go dig up the tech support posts on the game's forum from way back).

I'll just be avoiding those sorts of games in the future.

Edit: Plus some people have similar issues with (maybe just the PC version) of GTA IV and GFWL?

Modifié par FollowTheGourd, 08 novembre 2009 - 10:26 .

[ElektroDragon]

You guys make valid points about modding ability and increased levels of testing and certification. I would love constructive, honest answers from BioWare as to why they decided to make it a non GFW - Live game. Especially since a lot of their peers have seen the light (in my opinion) and decided to adopt it.

Modifié par ElektroDragon, 08 novembre 2009 - 10:20 .

[mufuti7]

ElektroDragon wrote...
I asked you on the BioWare forums over a year ago to make this a Games for Windows - Live title, but I guess you don't listen to your customers.  You also tend to delete viewpoints your don't agree with.  Hopefully you will prove me wrong this time.

I hope they do listen to their customers - because most of them probably hate Games for Windows live and all this achievement crap and gamerscore, etc.
Completely unnecessary and stupid, if you "outleveled" your teenage years.

That being said - your own loss. If you want to put up with far inferior console versions, as is the case with Dragon Age on the Xbox, just because you are stubborn suit yourself but dont come here complaining.

[ThomasAndrew]

ElektroDragon wrote...

Outside from you, I have not seen a single complaint about DA:O not being GFW-Live. Mainly because that service suuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuucks for PC. Live belongs on only one thing and that's the 360.

Have you even tried the service on the PC, recently?  Or are you just being a sheep jumping on the hate bandwagon? I find that it works perfectly well and had plenty of benefits.

I had alot of problems working it with Batman Arkham Asylum, patches that I had to download externally and install because the GFWL downloader wouldn't work. And after I found a mirror I still couldn't play the game because it wouldnt upload my profile so I couldn't save.

In my experience most people would prefer a better version of a game, over a version which increases a useless number.

[wotann]

LOL @ ElektroDragon. So you play games for what? Gamerscore or gameplay?!? You certainly sound like you prefer the first case. I mean if you care so much about gamerscore, go get kiddy games for the 360 to earn cheap points, or just buy a private cheat for some PC game like COD4/COD5 and stat pad all you want. You're missing the BIGGEST advantage the PC version has over all others, PLAYER MODS and the mod kit!! That's why I got the PC version and not the 360 version (also the gfx on the 360 simply suck compared to PC as well as the interface).

Modifié par wotann, 08 novembre 2009 - 10:22 .

[Landozelig]

Call me old school, but I actually bought this game for THE GAME. Silly me, I should have been looking at how I could have boosted a meaningless arbitrary number instead of playing a great game. What good is another 1000 added to your gamerscore? Does it help you get a job? ... "oh yes mister johnson, I realize that I'm competing with 3 other candidates for the job, so I'd just like to mention my gamerscore in hopes of securing the job ... it's over 100K you know"



I long for the old days where anyone who had a computer knew how to use a computer, and we gamed for the fun of it.

[Default137]

GFWL is a program that still has a LONG way to go before I even consider it workable in most games, as such, I'm pretty glad its not in DA:O, as it would have done nothing for this game, except have probably given it a much worse launch then it had.



Lets take a look at its faults, shall we?



- It won't work with most mods, which is odd really, considering that this is a staple of the PC genre, what sets PC games above Xbox games? Ah, the ability to mod, to bad that you can't mod stuff easily when it has GFWL attached to it!



- If you can't connect to it, you can't play most games its attached to, I have a really buggy internet, due to being in the middle of nowhere, and it will often drop on my, when this happens, I am totally unable to play Fallout 3, or Dawn of War 2 SP, because I cannot connect to a silly Achievement Scoreboard, I'd rather like to play DA:O at all times.



- The setup system is atrocious, due to it sharing info with Xbox Live, it takes forever just coming up with an account to use, and even after you finally figure something out, it takes forever to finally recognizing your account as your own, with Dawn of War 2, I had to wait 4 days for it to recognize my account, before I could actually start playing the game I purchased, needless to say, I was not very happy.



- If a game is multiplayer based, you have to give over matchmaking to GFWLs Truescore system, which to put it in kind terms, is a buggy, useless piece of junk, that needs to be completely rewritten, in DOW2, it will often throw completely new players, on their very first game against some of the top players, it will often mix up who is who, and bug out, dropping everyone from a game, its useless, and one of the main reasons DOW2 multi is pretty much dead.



You seem to dislike Steam, why? It record Achievements as well, and while its just as intrusive, setting up and maintaining a Steam account is incredibly easy, as well as the nifty fact it supports all the games you own, and allows you to buy many games, and have them all stored on your account.

[Begarian]

Here's another thing that I just thought of:



If you're already an existing xbox live member (gold), Games for Windows Live IS easier to get up and running because you can simply enter in your account that you setup on the 360 and get things going. I don't have a 360 and I hadn't setup Live account before, so that's where most of my trouble came in with trying to get the PC version of Fallout 3 to actually sign in to the service and start collecting achievements, which failed miserably.

[WildstarGoethe]

Nassou wrote...

More people hate GFWL than like it.

I am one of those people. Seeing your stats online isn't really necessary. The only person who usually looks at them is yourself. It's a vanity tool. No one really cares about other peoples' stats.

[ElektroDragon]

mufuti7 wrote...

I hope they do listen to their customers - because most of them probably hate Games for Windows live and all this achievement crap and gamerscore, etc.
Completely unnecessary and stupid, if you "outleveled" your teenage years.

That's an interesting opinion considering I'm 32.  Perhaps I am in the minority here, but someone's gotta be on the "dark side", eh? 

[loudenkl]

ElektroDragon wrote...

DeepGray wrote...

GfWL is extra overhead that doesn't add any real feature. 

It adds tons of featues.  Automatic patching, NON-INTRUSTIVE account based DRM (not install based, or tied to a PC), achievements and gamerscore, a unified interface that allows for headset and controller use in addition to keyboard, which adds flexibility, a friends list and easy matchmaking for online games.  And its free.  It doesn't consume any more system cycles or RAM than Steam does, I tested it.

I've bolded two things that is not needed for DA:O since it is not a online game. (BTW - neither was FO3)
So again, I ask my question... what does GFWL bring to the table that would make DA:O better?

[Magern]

Last game I played that was GFWL was Dawn of War 2. I found it to be bloated nonsense, so I disabled it once I found out how.

[DeepGray]

ElektroDragon wrote...

Automatic patching,

Until you don't want to patch and you're locked out of your account until do. If I want a patch, I'll get it myself.

ElektroDragon wrote...

NON-INTRUSTIVE account based DRM

Wrong. RE5-PC requires a CDKEY for each and every computer you install the game onto even ones that have been verifed with an on-line GfWL account.

ElektroDragon wrote...

achievements and gamerscore

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

ElektroDragon wrote...
a unified interface that allows for headset and controller use in addition to keyboard, which adds flexibility

Except DA:O has neither headset nor controller support anyway.

ElektroDragon wrote...
a friends list and easy matchmaking for online games. 

Only if my friends have it too and matchmaking is garbage for PC games.

ElektroDragon wrote...
And its free.

  
Nothing's ever free. Implementing GfWL requires dev time/money that could be spent elsewhere.

ElektroDragon wrote...
It doesn't consume any more system cycles or RAM than Steam does, I tested it.

It does consume more if I already have Steam open, I don't need GfWL.

So how does GfWL benefit anyone other than yourself again?

Modifié par DeepGray, 08 novembre 2009 - 10:30 .

[ElektroDragon]

Landozelig wrote...

Call me old school, but I actually bought this game for THE GAME. Silly me, I should have been looking at how I could have boosted a meaningless arbitrary number instead of playing a great game. What good is another 1000 added to your gamerscore? Does it help you get a job? ... "oh yes mister johnson, I realize that I'm competing with 3 other candidates for the job, so I'd just like to mention my gamerscore in hopes of securing the job ... it's over 100K you know"

I long for the old days where anyone who had a computer knew how to use a computer, and we gamed for the fun of it.

Valid points, and very entertaining.  My answer would be that I bought it for the game too, but I'm just addicted to the "meaningless" icing on the cake that achievements/gamerscore offer, being both a console and PC gamer. Yes, I long for those old days too, which is why I did not touch a console until 2005.  I was a PC only gamer from 1988 to 2005.  Before that, I had a Sega Master System and Atari 2600.  After 2005, I owned every single console released.

[lawsie100]

i like the gamerscore, but that is the only reason why most people who play consoles a lot want it on there pc games as well. The only reason.

[ElektroDragon]

Default137 wrote...

You seem to dislike Steam, why? It record Achievements as well, and while its just as intrusive, setting up and maintaining a Steam account is incredibly easy, as well as the nifty fact it supports all the games you own, and allows you to buy many games, and have them all stored on your account.

You make some valid points.  I don't dislike Steam at all.  I was just pointing out to folks who might love Steam but hate GFWL that they are in many ways similar, and can definitely co-exist peacefully, as you can buy and run GFWL games via Steam just fine.

[Nassou]

Steam is bogus as well. Don't assume I like it. Anything that requires the internet to play is absolutely ridiculous. Hard copies FTW!

[ElektroDragon]

loudenkl wrote...

So again, I ask my question... what does GFWL bring to the table that would make DA:O better?

I will admit, the answer is being able to earn achievements that add to my existing large gamerscore.  And yes, I realize its a vanity thing no one else really care about.  Still, I would think this feature would be something really appreciated by folks like me who already have an Xbox Live account from their 360 gaming.  It really adds a lot if you play 360 and PC equally, or play more 360 than PC.  If you are PC only, I can understand some of the vitriol, I suppose, but its really not that bad.  You'd be able to add to your same score with other GFWL PC games.  Again, maybe you don't care, but SOME people do.

[JonOsterman]

This guy just wants his gamerscore. Leave him be. No big deal. We can go back to enjoying our GAME.

[Spirit Shrink]

I'd quite happily sacrifice achievements in favour of being able to run DAO on my PC. I have the 360 version and don't get me wrong, I love it to itty bitty pieces, more than anything else I have ever played on the 360 but I'd love to be able to use the toolset as well... Hmmm, one day I hope.

[ElektroDragon]

lawsie100 wrote...

i like the gamerscore, but that is the only reason why most people who play consoles a lot want it on there pc games as well. The only reason.

I completely agree with you.