334 réponses à ce sujet

[Zeleen]

Wow! I think it would be BORING if every game played the same. DA:O Has its good points and bad points but, so does every game I've played.. I'm realatively new but I've played a number of games that all play differently and they all have good points & bad points - BUT they are all fun!!

[TJSolo]

Zeleen wrote...

Wow! I think it would be BORING if every game played the same. DA:O Has its good points and bad points but, so does every game I've played.. I'm realatively new but I've played a number of games that all play differently and they all have good points & bad points - BUT they are all fun!!

In each and every case, the bad points would be points that can be improved upon. At the least points people discuss about improving to differing degrees of effectivness.
Not just settling with games have flaws, and offering nothing in the way of feedback.

[Zeleen]

TJSolo wrote...

Zeleen wrote...

Wow! I think it would be BORING if every game played the same. DA:O Has its good points and bad points but, so does every game I've played.. I'm realatively new but I've played a number of games that all play differently and they all have good points & bad points - BUT they are all fun!!

In each and every case, the bad points would be points that can be improved upon. At the least points people discuss about improving to differing degrees of effectivness.
Not just settling with games have flaws, and offering nothing in the way of feedback.

I agree on fixing bugs, etc.  What I disagree on is having the same kind of combat, leveling, quests systems, Having DA:O play likd LO. for example

[TJSolo]

Zeleen wrote...

TJSolo wrote...

Zeleen wrote...

Wow! I think it would be BORING if every game played the same. DA:O Has its good points and bad points but, so does every game I've played.. I'm realatively new but I've played a number of games that all play differently and they all have good points & bad points - BUT they are all fun!!

In each and every case, the bad points would be points that can be improved upon. At the least points people discuss about improving to differing degrees of effectivness.
Not just settling with games have flaws, and offering nothing in the way of feedback.

I agree on fixing bugs, etc.  What I disagree on is having the same kind of combat, leveling, quests systems, Having DA:O play likd LO. for example

None of that was meant to be cloned from LO. Combat/Enemies, have more enemy classes with different appearances unique to the DAO world. That is not cloning LO and would not lead the two games to play the same.
Leveling and questing are not even topics the OP has suggested.

[Upper_Krust]

Zeleen wrote...

I agree on fixing bugs, etc.  What I disagree on is having the same kind of combat, leveling, quests systems, Having DA:O play likd LO. for example

As TJSolo already noted (and thanks for that), no one is suggesting that Dragon Age have the same kind of combat, leveling or quest systems as Lost Odyssey. What I (and others) ARE suggesting is twofold.

Firstly that the variety of enemies in DAO is fairly lacklustre, but more importantly that diversity amongst existing enemies is very poor. Added to which encounter variety is also badly done. This means that you spend too many encounters battling either the same (or similar) enemies in roughly the same numbers.

Secondly, that the choices you make in combat don't have a massive impact upon the outcome. This has a knock on effect (in my opinion) that means you cannot have a large difference between difficulty levels - which is why (for example) everyone says Awakening is far too easy even on Nightmare difficulty.

[Upper_Krust]

I was mucking about with some dungeon design brainstorming and outlined a strong basis for how to plan encounters.

Lets assume each 'Dungeon' has 17 encounters (on average).
Dungeon Act #1: Encounters 1-4
Dungeon Act #2: Encounters 5-12
Dungeon Act #3: Encounters 13-16
Dungeon Boss: Encounter 17

Now lets assume:
Normal Rank monster = 1
Lieutenant Rank Monster = 3
Boss Rank Monster = 10
Elite Boss Rank Monster = 30

Encounter #1 = Rating of 5
#2 = 10
#3 = 15
#4 = 20

Encounter #5 = Rating of 10
#6 = 15
#7 = 20
#8 = 25

#9 = 15
#10 = 20
#11 = 25
#12 = 30

Encounter #13 = Rating of 20
#14 = 25
#15 = 30
#16 = 35

Encounter #17 = Special

#1__#5__#9__#13
#2__#6__#10_#14
#3__#7__#11_#15
#4__#8__#12_#16

Highest Rank per Encounter...

Normal____Normal_____Lieutenant__2 Bosses
Normal____Normal_____Lieutenant__2 Bosses
Lieutenant__Lieutenant__Lieutenant__2 Bosses
Boss______Boss______Boss______3 Bosses

Genlock 'Dungeon' (Using my earlier Genlock Ideas)

Encounter #1: 5 Sneaks
Encounter #2: 5 Sneaks + 5 Grenadiers
Encounter #3: Master Sneak + 7 Sneaks + 5 Grenadiers
Encounter #4: Emissary + 2 Master Sneaks + 2 Sneaks + 2 Grenadiers

Encounter #5: 5 Sneaks + 3 Grenadiers + 2 Trappers
Encounter #6: 10 Wolves + 5 Sneaks
Encounter #7: Bombardier + 5 Sneaks + 5 Grenadiers + 2 Trappers
Encounter #8: Forgeborn + 2 Bombardiers + 4 Grenadiers

Encounter #9: Wolfmaster + 7 Wolves (or 4 + Alpha Wolf) + 5 Sneaks
Encounter #10: Enfield (new Lieutenant Rank Wolf type monster) + 7 Grenadiers + 5 Sneaks + 5 Trappers (Dunno about this one - looks a bit flimsy)
Encounter #11: 4 Bombardiers + 4 Master Sneaks + Trapper
Encounter #12: Forgemaster + 2 Wolfmasters + 14 Wolves (or 10 + 2 Alpha Wolves)

Encounter #13: 2 Emissaries
Encounter #14: Forgemaster + Forgeborn + Bombardier + 2 Grenadiers 
Encounter #15: Bombardier + Master Sneak + Wolfmaster + 7 Wolves + 5 Sneaks + 4 Grenadiers + 3 Trappers
Encounter #16: Emissary + Forgeborn + Forgemaster + Master Sneak + 2 Trappers

Encounter #17a: Genlock Paragon (Elite Boss)...who escapes
Encounter #17b: Orthrus (Monster Wolf Boss) + 7 Wolfmasters 

[Zeleen]

though i responded already..

We battle Darkspawn in DA:O  so you want more diverse Darkspawn creatures, with different skills, spells, powers, resistances, etc?

[Upper_Krust]

Zeleen wrote...

though i responded already..

We battle Darkspawn in DA:O  so you want more diverse Darkspawn creatures, with different skills, spells, powers, resistances, etc?

The answer is more complicated than a mere 'yes' (or no).

I want greater diversity between existing enemies. Thats more important than simply creating more Darkspawn.

Its a wasted opportunity making genlocks so similar to hurlocks (or humans or skeletons or werewolves etc. etc.)

You could argue that many genlock or hurlock variants do have different skills, spells and powers. But my impression of the game is that these differences are next to irrelevant because they don't have any noticeable impact upon the game.

So my suggestion is that differences should matter more (variable by difficulty level).

[Vegielamb]

xCobalt wrote...
As for my opinion on this matter. I do feel there are certain aspects that make LO better than DA, despite how different these two games are. LO's crafting system provided a more rewarding and enjoyable experience compared to DA where you could only make potions/traps/bombs that weren't all that useful or engaging.

DAO
lacks depth in some areas where depth would be greatly appreciated. Crafting is
one of these areas. Rogues and fighter mechanics are another. Fighters are just
BORING! Steal should have had something to make it worth picking up. Stealth wasn't terribly useful, not because the skill was bad, but because the opportunities to use it were lame. Basically, Bioware fell into the trap of making one right way to do things in combat and not allowing players multiple ways to solve dungeon problems (based on class). [ Ironically, the story did allow multiple ways to solve problems.]

Modifié par Vegielamb, 23 mai 2010 - 11:39 .

[Vegielamb]

relhart wrote...

I enjoyed Lost Odyssey, though I never actually finished it. I agree with you in variety of enemies if nothing else. One thing great about the BG series and the DnD universe in general is the amount of different creepies to both kill and learn about, DAO seems really limited, and like a step backwards, in that regard.

While DAO could have been more creative here, a limited selection of enemies makes more sense. Typcially you see a huge selection of enemies in globe trotting RPGs because their globe trotting. That means you'll be in a wide range of ecosystems and environments. DAO takes place in one tiny kingdom, so the same "monster" types makes sense.

Now, tactically speaking, they could have done a LOT more with the enemies they had.

Modifié par Vegielamb, 24 mai 2010 - 08:08 .