60083 réponses à ce sujet

[cmessaz]

Exactly. I only harden Alistair when I am going to be is lover, as a female mage. I just can't marry the poor dude off to Anora. People say that it is smart, but look at how vendictive she is! And plus it probably wouldn't improve the heir situation anyway, considering Cailen was having a hard time getting Anora knocked up, and Alistair is a grey warden! The heir is just not gonna happen people, no matter who takes the throne.

[Addai]

Thalorin1919 wrote...

I think leaving him unhardened will then never bring out the true person that he can be. Eamon had to force Alistair all of his life that he doesnt have the potential to rule, lead, make decisions and everything. In which there would be no rebellion he would want to raise.

You do him more good by hardening him anyways. He realizes that he can rule, he realizes that he can lead, and he realizes that he can be a good king. When you harden him and try to marry Anora, he expresses his disconcern very strongly for the idea, and does not like the idea of her being on the throne. At all.

Other than that, I honestly dont see any difference in his personality. I dont play females, so I only see it from a friendship point of view. And the only difference I got from hardening him was him wanting to be king, which I liked. I dont know how it is for the ladies though.

Agreed.  Not hardening him is like confirming the wrong that was done him as a child.  And I don't notice any difference in his personality, either, just his attitude towards the kingship and towards his personal happiness.

[LadyDamodred]

Talk to hardened Alistair right before you make him king. He flat out tells you to do it. *shrugs* That's good enough for me.

[cmessaz]

Addai67 wrote...

cmessaz wrote...

The problem is this: If I am queen, I am concerned about the letters that I found between Eamon and Cailen telling Cailen to sleep around on Anora.

I believe he was telling him to put her away, i.e. divorce and remarry.

So Eamon would have a heart attack if the king assisted in helping fight the darkspawn, well Alistair IS king, so screw what Eamon says.

Alistair is always complaining about Eamon pulling him aside for this and that.  I would not take this too seriously.  Besides, the problem is not Alistair fighting, it's that he's needed elsewhere.  Running the kingdom is a big job, hence he's entrusting the darkspawn problem to your PC's capable hands.

Plus, Anora says that Cailen wouldn't have minded Alistair being at court. It was Eamon who kept him locked away.

This might be so, but keep in mind that the only time Anora's lying is when her lips are moving.  She is trying to get you to trust her rather than Eamon.  it behooves her to pull you closer to her corner.

I didn't say I hate Eamon, but as I've played through and read I am very suspicious of him. Plus he can't count! I won the last landsmeet, damn it, only two people voted against me and Eamon declared war and I had a sodding fight on my hands. WTH Eamon! We won 3-2. I just don't get it.

Anora counts for 3 votes.  Eamon doesn't get a vote, I assume because he called the LM.  It's more fun that way anyway.  I roleplayed my mage as being too naive to see through Anora's deceptions, so she told her straight up that she couldn't support her.  Seeing Anora's true colors and Loghain's response to winning the vote is more satisfying than my PC pulling a fast one on Anora, IMO.

Eamon stands by you and opposes Loghain, when if you read The Stolen Throne, you know that most of Ferelden's nobility is craven and self-serving.  I don't think Eamon's a saint- he made a terrible mistake letting Isolde run Alistair into the ground- but the fact that he took Alistair in anyway should earn him some halo points.  His advice to Cailan was harsh, but so is running a kingdom.  An orderly succession is literal survival, especially for a nation as fractious and threatened as Ferelden is.

For the record: the comment about Eamon not being able to count was just for fun. But as far as everything else goes, I think we will just have to agree to disagree. I have played this game since it was released, and I always liked Eamon, until I actually started reading the codex and the toolset dialogue. I just don't agree with his actions.

Modifié par cmessaz, 11 avril 2010 - 04:34 .

[cmessaz]

Addai67 wrote...

Thalorin1919 wrote...

I think leaving him unhardened will then never bring out the true person that he can be. Eamon had to force Alistair all of his life that he doesnt have the potential to rule, lead, make decisions and everything. In which there would be no rebellion he would want to raise.

You do him more good by hardening him anyways. He realizes that he can rule, he realizes that he can lead, and he realizes that he can be a good king. When you harden him and try to marry Anora, he expresses his disconcern very strongly for the idea, and does not like the idea of her being on the throne. At all.

Other than that, I honestly dont see any difference in his personality. I dont play females, so I only see it from a friendship point of view. And the only difference I got from hardening him was him wanting to be king, which I liked. I dont know how it is for the ladies though.

Agreed.  Not hardening him is like confirming the wrong that was done him as a child.  And I don't notice any difference in his personality, either, just his attitude towards the kingship and towards his personal happiness.

Go into the toolset. There are ALOT of different dialogues for the hardened vs. unhardened Alistair.

[Thor Rand Al]

Thalorin1919 wrote...

Thor Rand Al wrote...
Now if my male pc would of done that, made him King unhardened he would of chewed my but out and i would of lost approval with Alistair lol

Oh yeah, he goes into Alistair-rage on my male PC if I made him King unhardened, which was like my first playthrough.

"I TOLD YOU I DIDNT WANT TO BE KING! BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH! MY FEELINGS?"

I know, you talk about a very pist off Alistair omg, do that 1 lol.  I know 1 thing, I will never ever play a male again and make him King without hardening him first lol


That was 1 of the things that kept me from making Alistair King unhardened with any of my female pc's.  Because of how pist he was at my male lol.  What a difference playing a female and male are.  Especially if he loves the female and she decide's to rule with him.

[sylvanaerie]

I've never been able to NOT harden him. The line is absolutely wretched but the change is profound even if its basically the same man its...still him but not so (wishy washy?) for lack of a better phrase.

[nranola]

It was out of character for my Cousland girl to call Anora a ruthless **** in front of all the nobles, but man was I tempted to! Once I go through the game again with a more abrasive character I'll definitely go for it. xD

And yes, Landsmeet battle was epic. I went for the dialogue choices to have Anora betray the group in the Landsmeet; that was the only way I could justify my girl giving the throne to Alistair instead, considering he didn't want it in the first place. At that point I think you can see how betrayal doesn't sit too well for her.

Also agree with the hardened Alistair thing. As tempting as it is to comfort him after that whole deal with Goldanna, telling him to stand up for himself does him a world of good. Getting pushed around by others all his life won't make him happy.

@cmessaz- [img*]DIRECT_LINK_OF_IMAGE_GOES_HERE[/img*] for the screenshot love of goodness. <3 Just get rid of the asterisks when you do it. x3

Modifié par nranola, 11 avril 2010 - 04:40 .

[Addai]

cmessaz wrote...
Go into the toolset. There are ALOT of different dialogues for the hardened vs. unhardened Alistair.

Can you give some examples?  Admittedly I haven't played with an unhardened Ali since my 1st character, though on my 1st runthrough after hardening I was attuned for changes in his personality and didn't notice any.

[LadyDamodred]

cmessaz wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

Thalorin1919 wrote...

I think leaving him unhardened will then never bring out the true person that he can be. Eamon had to force Alistair all of his life that he doesnt have the potential to rule, lead, make decisions and everything. In which there would be no rebellion he would want to raise.

You do him more good by hardening him anyways. He realizes that he can rule, he realizes that he can lead, and he realizes that he can be a good king. When you harden him and try to marry Anora, he expresses his disconcern very strongly for the idea, and does not like the idea of her being on the throne. At all.

Other than that, I honestly dont see any difference in his personality. I dont play females, so I only see it from a friendship point of view. And the only difference I got from hardening him was him wanting to be king, which I liked. I dont know how it is for the ladies though.

Agreed.  Not hardening him is like confirming the wrong that was done him as a child.  And I don't notice any difference in his personality, either, just his attitude towards the kingship and towards his personal happiness.

Go into the toolset. There are ALOT of different dialogues for the hardened vs. unhardened Alistair.

There are, and after seeing them all, I seriously prefer hardened Alistair even more.

[LadyDamodred]

Addai67 wrote...

cmessaz wrote...
Go into the toolset. There are ALOT of different dialogues for the hardened vs. unhardened Alistair.

Can you give some examples?  Admittedly I haven't played with an unhardened Ali since my 1st character, though on my 1st runthrough after hardening I was attuned for changes in his personality and didn't notice any.

You would think, having the toolset open this would be easier for me to remember.  But it's late, I have a cold, and am reading through hundreds of lines of dialogue.  -.-  If no one else gets to it, I'll poke around tomorrow.

I only noticed a few differences between unhardened/hardened Alistair (note, the toolset calls him changed) in my runs, b/c I didn't choose a lot of the dialogue that it revolves around.

[cmessaz]

In some ways I agree. For example, when you ask him to marry Anora when he is unhardened, if he is in love with you and you say "I know but this is important" he will say "So are you. You are more important to me than anything, I don't want anyone else. Even just for show." If you are at adore with him: "I understand, and I don't care, you are important as well, more important than the throne, by far." If he is hardened, he will say this to the same dialogue choice: "Alright, I'll accept that for now, why do you think I should do this?" There are a couple of others in that conversation, but I don't want to get back into the toolset tonight. And seriously, I really love Alistair, but being the kings girl on the side just doesn't fit the hero of Ferelden thing for me, so I don't generally do it.

Modifié par cmessaz, 11 avril 2010 - 04:46 .

[LadyDamodred]

I guess his lines about not wanting anyone else, even for pretend are sort of sweet, except I know that they come at the cost of him being unwilling to make his own decisions/stand up for himself. The relationship always seem more equal with a hardened Alistair, too. My HNF, at least, needs someone willing to stand up to and for her, and not just fall back on the 'but I love you and that's enough, right?' schtick.

[cmessaz]

[img/]
I did it!!!!! Thanks! Now if only I had a better screenshot, since I quit uploading them long ago in hopes that it would improve the crashing issue.

Modifié par cmessaz, 11 avril 2010 - 04:56 .

[cmessaz]

YAY. Anyway, it really depends on whether or not I am going to make him king. I generally harden him if I am going to be queen, but this time I am not, just to get the sweet lines. Thats the beauty of DA! Play through many times and do different things! To bad there isn't much continuity in Awakening....

Modifié par cmessaz, 11 avril 2010 - 04:58 .

[nranola]

Addai67 wrote...

cmessaz wrote...
Go into the toolset. There are ALOT of different dialogues for the hardened vs. unhardened Alistair.

Can you give some examples?  Admittedly I haven't played with an unhardened Ali since my 1st character, though on my 1st runthrough after hardening I was attuned for changes in his personality and didn't notice any.

Here's a prime example. Voiceover/script notes in parenthesis:

PC: Where do you see this going between us?
Alistair: I don't know where this is going. We have a Blight to think of first, don't we? Everything else just seems so... distant. (sincere)
PC: If we care about each other, that's all that matters.

H!Alistair: I agree. I don't intend to jeopardize that, trust me. (sincere)

UH!Alistair: Is it? What about duty? What about honor? (uncomfortable; approval -10)
UH!Alistair: Those things are important, too, aren't they? I hope they don't come between us, but... but I can't say they won't. I'm sorry. (awkward -- wishes he didn't have to say this)
UH!Alistair: This isn't really the time for this conversation. Please, let's... just talk about this another time. (grim)

He's basically resigned to fulfilling his duty completely over his own happiness when he's unhardened. He stands up for what he wants more instead of being pushed around otherwise.

Modifié par nranola, 11 avril 2010 - 05:02 .

[cmessaz]

This is why I generally harden him if I intend to make him king. BTW, I don't know if anyone else discovered this, but wait for that conversation until after the landsmeet if you make him king and harden him. Much much better.

[LadyDamodred]

Oooh, yeah, my friend discovered that a couple months ago. It makes waiting so sweet.

[nranola]

cmessaz wrote...

This is why I generally harden him if I intend to make him king. BTW, I don't know if anyone else discovered this, but wait for that conversation until after the landsmeet if you make him king and harden him. Much much better.

Yeah, I noticed that, and I agree. <3 Certain dialogues change depending on at what point in the game you're in; that one I posted above was one of them.

And congrats on getting that screenie up! xD

Modifié par nranola, 11 avril 2010 - 05:06 .

[cmessaz]

Thanks!  I actually deleted that character long ago, because I had made her...slightly overpowered to the point where I did the deep roads all by me onesie. But it was the only decent one I have of Alistair. You know what sucks? Stopping the screenshot uploading didn't do any good, I still crash all the time anyway! I would have had some good screenshots, too.

Modifié par cmessaz, 11 avril 2010 - 05:10 .

[Addai]

cmessaz wrote...

Thanks!  I actually deleted that character long ago, because I had made her...slightly overpowered to the point where I did the deep roads all by me onesie. But it was the only decent one I have of Alistair. You know what sucks? Stopping the screenshot uploading didn't do any good, I still crash all the time anyway! I would have had some good screenshots, too.

We are crashing now with 1.03, too, whereas we hardly ever did before.  Not uploading screenshots did help in uncluttering our online profile, though.  We had no character info uploading for months until I fiddled with it.

[Addai]

cmessaz wrote...

This is why I generally harden him if I intend to make him king. BTW, I don't know if anyone else discovered this, but wait for that conversation until after the landsmeet if you make him king and harden him. Much much better.

Ah, I haven't seen this before, will have to try it.

[cmessaz]

Yes it is the best way to have that conversation! It didn't help with my crashing, I also tried the affinity trick (shutting down all but one core for a processor that has more than one) that everyone is suggesting, but that didn't help, and my sound kept cutting in and out and the game just ran like crap. I NEVER crashed prior to 1.03. I am so sick of people blaming the computer! I have 8 freakin gigs of ram and a seperate GB video card! It IS NOT my computer! I can't use mana clash, throw fire bombs, or some of my other high-end spells now for fear of crashing. Guess this is a little off topic, sorry. Rant over.

[nranola]

You went through the Deep Roads all by yourself? Omg, you crazy woman! xD I don't think I would be able to manage that. On Normal and above, anyway; I haven't gone through an Easy playthrough yet so I wouldn't know.

And what's all that about 1.03 patch crashing? I... think the game may have done that to me a couple of times, but I'm not sure. How exactly does the crash occur? I did notice the lack of online updates with my characters, though. Which sucks. I want the world to know how much of a life I don't have, dammit!

A couple more screenshots to gush over, by the way. I'm in-topic, see? See? '8D Is it obvious yet how much of a screenshot **** I am? I swear, my finger hovers over the printscreen button about 80% of the time. xD I like the lighting in these, particularly, and how disgruntled Alistair in the first one.




...I also hate how Sten ruins an otherwise great picture of these two together. >3>; It almost feels like he's photobombing the thing.

[cmessaz]

Seriously, give Sten the butterfly sword. He's good for a laugh, big tough Sten with purty butterflies. If you want to take on the deep roads by yourself as a mage, download the skill book mod, and the Armageddon spells. Um, by the time my party members got to the enemy, it was already dead. So, I figured I was making them feel insignificant, so I left them at camp. Seriously I just wanted to see if I could do it. Being that overpowered is just not fun for long though. And I wouldn't dream of doing the armageddon spells since the new patch was released. Can you say, crash city?!
I guess we both lack a life! My characters just recently started uploading again, but they didn't for a while. OMG Alistair is the hottest video game character ever. But I do also like Bann Teagan, he is pretty hot too. But Alistair, oh wow. (Just trying to stay on topic, here.) Errr, what was the topic again?

Modifié par cmessaz, 11 avril 2010 - 07:46 .