111 réponses à ce sujet

[jtav]

OT: but I agree on the engine room scene. My favorite romance and I still hated it. I do very liberal mental editing (okay, a complete rewrite) of that. Come on, Bioware. I'm an amateur, and I could do better.

[Jackal904]

Nightwriter wrote...

"I can't fix it all just like that, but that doesn't mean I'm going anywhere."

I find this sentiment quite realistic.

Exactly. It's not like doing the paragon romance with Jack completely relieves her of all her trauma, it's just a giant step forward in helping her get over everything she's been through. Finally someone who isn't dense and can actually think logically... And it helps that he actually went through Jack's romance dialogue unlike some people who have only spoken to her during her recruitment mission, and then pass all these judgements about her like they know everything.

[MassAffected]

jlb524 wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...

I wish there had been two separate paths in Miranda's romance, like with Jack's.

Her's always felt a bit more like a fling to me than the others - simply because of the way the romance scene plays out. A more serious path that triggered a more meaningful conversation leading up to that scene would've been cool for me.

I thought the Miranda romance was fine until the love scene.  Miranda's love scene is almost as bad as Jacob's.  Yeah, I said it. 

I would have preferred something sweet and mushy with hers, similar to Garrus'.

Agreed.

[MassAffected]

Jackal904 wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...

"I can't fix it all just like that, but that doesn't mean I'm going anywhere."

I find this sentiment quite realistic.

Exactly. It's not like doing the paragon romance with Jack completely relieves her of all her trauma, it's just a giant step forward in helping her get over everything she's been through. Finally someone who isn't dense and can actually think logically... And it helps that he actually went through Jack's romance dialogue unlike some people who have only spoken to her during her recruitment mission, and then pass all these judgements about her like they know everything.

I was giving a first impression...I'm open to being shown otherwise...no need to get all belligerent over it.

[Nightwriter]

jtav wrote...

OT: but I agree on the engine room scene. My favorite romance and I still hated it. I do very liberal mental editing (okay, a complete rewrite) of that. Come on, Bioware. I'm an amateur, and I could do better.

I share this sentiment.

And jlb, you're right, it was worse than Jacob's. And that's saying something.

There - saying something. They should've done that. They should've said something before that romance scene. I mean, really? No dialogue? No meaningful interaction at all? I love that. It enhances the scene and draws out the moment.

But instead, just a wink and a, "I cleared out the engine deck! Let's bang!"

[Jackal904]

MassAffected wrote...

I was giving a first impression...I'm open to being shown otherwise...no need to get all belligerent over it.

I'm not refering to you. I'm refering to a people in general who act that way, and some specific people in this thread.  I haven't even read any of your posts in this thread.

[Nightwriter]

Jackal904 wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...

"I can't fix it all just like that, but that doesn't mean I'm going anywhere."

I find this sentiment quite realistic.

Exactly. It's not like doing the paragon romance with Jack completely relieves her of all her trauma, it's just a giant step forward in helping her get over everything she's been through. Finally someone who isn't dense and can actually think logically... And it helps that he actually went through Jack's romance dialogue unlike some people who have only spoken to her during her recruitment mission, and then pass all these judgements about her like they know everything.

I was really impressed with Bioware for that line. And quite pleased.

I was like, "You're right, Bioware, a magic wand can't be waved to make all that go away, but you can prove to someone that you're different."

People tend, too, to get fed up with abuse victims' behavior and the so-called "excuses" for it. They're like, "We get it, your past was awful, and now you're acting like a complete stuck up b*tch about it."

It's difficult for them to understand, I think. To them, "abuse" is just a word. A reference to a past event, an intangible. They didn't see it, they didn't feel it - to them it is a creature of the past tense, which is always safe, a simple topic to be discussed like a piece of history. A reference. A word.

And when you compare someone's behavior, bad as it can be, to that word, how can it not seem as though that behavior is over-dramatized and out of proportion? They're responding to a reality that is nothing but a concept to you. And a concept makes a poor excuse for anything.

Modifié par Nightwriter, 12 avril 2010 - 02:48 .

[Collider]

That's a great point nightwriter. We can speculate on how another person's experiences felt to them and affected them, but we would not truly know. Even if they went through the same as we did, everyone reacts to trauma differently. I do feel sorry for Jack.

[kraidy1117]

Nightwriter wrote...

jtav wrote...

OT: but I agree on the engine room scene. My favorite romance and I still hated it. I do very liberal mental editing (okay, a complete rewrite) of that. Come on, Bioware. I'm an amateur, and I could do better.

I share this sentiment.

And jlb, you're right, it was worse than Jacob's. And that's saying something.

There - saying something. They should've done that. They should've said something before that romance scene. I mean, really? No dialogue? No meaningful interaction at all? I love that. It enhances the scene and draws out the moment.

But instead, just a wink and a, "I cleared out the engine deck! Let's bang!"

But the priiiiiize. No it was not as bad as Jacobs, Jacobs whole romance was baaaad. Miris sex scene was ok, it could have been better, but hers is not even close to Jacob, move Miris scene to Shepards room and it would have been fine. Jacob, no matter what was baaaaad.

(Yes I hate Jacob)

Modifié par kraidy1117, 12 avril 2010 - 02:58 .

[Nightwriter]

Collider wrote...

That's a great point nightwriter. We can speculate on how another person's experiences felt to them and affected them, but we would not truly know. Even if they went through the same as we did, everyone reacts to trauma differently. I do feel sorry for Jack.

Me too. I have respect for what happened and all that I don't know.

I feel like sometimes, when I hear people really hating on Jack, what would happen if they were suddenly and vividly shown an intense and intrusive moment of her torture as a child - saw every aspect of that moment, heard the sounds, the smells, the whimpers or screams of help, saw the blood in the cell and the violent spasms - how it would change their perspective if that were abruptly flashed right in front of their eyes and then yanked back, to reveal Jack sitting there fully grown again, tattooed up, looking at you all annoyed and going,

"What the f*ck are you staring at?"

But then, I wonder this about a lot of really messed up people society thinks they have a good beat on.

Modifié par Nightwriter, 12 avril 2010 - 03:08 .

[WarlordFil]

I actually think Jack is a fairly realistic character.



Yes, it's frustrating that MaleShep can't walk a moderate path with being her friend but not her lover. On the other hand, if Jack equates sex with closeness--since she doesn't understand real closeness--and you reject sex, it seems natural that she wouldn't understand the difference between rejecting sex and rejecting friendship.



I don't believe that romance = automatic healing either, but if she feels affection for Shepard than at least she has some kind of motivation to TRY to change. It would not be easy on poor Shep though.



I do like that playing FemShep I seem to manage to be friends with her, since she tells me right out she won't date me and then continues to talk to me.

[Collider]

I do think that every able adult should be held accountable for there actions however. One measure of a person is how they have reacted to the struggles they've had. I would say that people hating Jack for her appearance (the ridiculous straps aside) are already shallow though.