164 réponses à ce sujet

[beancounter501]

One of the things that has been bugging me this whole playthrough is why the main character is blowing everyone else away. I am in a party with four warriors and he has 48% of the total dmg. It has been baffling. However, I did have a "duh" moment. I have been writing everyone's hit percent down, but not really paying attention to it. Glancing over it I can see the main has a hit percent of 93%. The rest of the party is sitting between 87 and 85. A huge advantage.

I decided to open up the character screen and see what everyone's attack rating is. The main has an attack score of 114, Alistar has 101, Sten is at 90 and Ogren is at 94. Looks like the huge attack bonus from Starfang and the Harvest Festival Ring are having a big impact! Maybe I should give those two items to another character and see if they pull ahead.

Modifié par beancounter501, 23 mai 2010 - 12:05 .

[Phaelducan]

Just a thought, but if you prioritized enemies that could stun/knockdown first and could in theory kill them before any effect incapacitated your DW or S/S warriors, wouldn't that mitigate the DPS loss for your DW?



I only ask because (purely from memory here) I don't recall my DW warrior spending much time out of the fight (on normal). I ended up that playthrough with near 50% of the damage contribution, and that was with a rogue and a mage in the party almost all of the time.

[Elhanan]

I saw this thread, and could not help thinking of the party banter between fights:



"TRAP! Thanks! TRAP! Thanks again! ANOTHER TRAP! Thanks! HEAL!!! Time to rotate...."

[beancounter501]

@Phaelducan - Good suggestion. However, not having a big mass crowd control yet really limits how well you can knock someone out of the fight. And unfortunately just about anyone can stun poor ole Alistar. In the forest he was knockdowned in every single fight with the big walking trees.



@Hanz - Not really. I have been trying to spread the gear around and I have not bought a single tome. He did get the Fade bonus which is not that big of a difference. +4 Str and + 4 dex. It was the Starfang and Harvest festival ring that was jacking his attack rating though the roof. Those two items were giving almost +16 to attack. I have since given the Harvest Ring to Sten. That makes Alistar and Sten almost matched with attack and the main is only 7 points over those two due to Starfang.



However, this whole little exercise makes me really wonder what the effective defense rating is for most critters. I will have to mod by game to post out some defense and attack rating of their targets going forward. Is there any other data someone would be interested in seeing as well?



Also, does anyone use Percise Striking with a Dual Weld? Seems like a +10 attack and the crit boost would be nice.



BTW, next stop is the Deep Roads!

[Random70]

beancounter501 wrote...
@Hanz - Not really. I have been trying to spread the gear around and I have not bought a single tome. He did get the Fade bonus which is not that big of a difference. +4 Str and + 4 dex. It was the Starfang and Harvest festival ring that was jacking his attack rating though the roof. Those two items were giving almost +16 to attack. I have since given the Harvest Ring to Sten. That makes Alistar and Sten almost matched with attack and the main is only 7 points over those two due to Starfang.

Been saying it for a long time: In most instances the best way to increase your 'DPS' is to actually hit things with your attacks. From a practical standpoint + / - 10 Attack is a *Big* deal.

beancounter501 wrote...
However, this whole little exercise makes me really wonder what the effective defense rating is for most critters. I will have to mod by game to post out some defense and attack rating of their targets going forward. Is there any other data someone would be interested in seeing as well?

Any and all! I know that you posted some AC data in that other thread, but more would be better. At the high end, ATT rating can be inferred as ~160 DEF makes you unhittable by auto attacks, suggesting that the toughest bosses have an ATT of ~100. But beyond that it's all guesstimates. DEF, HP, & Phys Res. info would all be useful as well. Compiling all of that in to a 'Monster Data' chart would be nice. I would also be interesting to see how these values change with level scaling.
If you're willing to post detailed directions on how to extract this data, I'll take a crack at it myself. But please be concise as the last programming I did was on my Apple //C in 1985.

beancounter501 wrote...Also, does anyone use Percise Striking with a Dual Weld? Seems like a +10 attack and the crit boost would be nice.

Depends. If your PC is DW you could go with Veshaile / Rose + WC armor, Cailan's gloves, Wicked Oath, Momentum, Precise Striking, Bloodthirst for some really nasty crits with Bloodthirst offsetting the speed loss from Precise Striking. With a different party setup you could also add SoC for more crit chance. Or for a non-PC can offset Precise Striking with Haste or Swift salves. But outside of this 'Ultra-Crit' build, I usually don't bother unless facing a difficult to hit enemy i.e. Revenant w/ Aura of weakness & Shield Defense.

You mentioned in a previous post that you weren't very impressed with the DW in general. I'll have to 2nd that opinion. Depending on how you build them they may provide more 'DPS' but give most of that advantage back with the stun / knockdown thing and weaker CC, though, of course they are very good at tearing up trash mobs.  If you want a frontline DW character, build a STR Rogue. The Warrior gets more HP and a bit better Stamina control (and Taunt!!!) in exchange for Stealth and Auto-Crit mode (backstab) that can be activated at will with Dirty Fighting, Riposte, and Party-based AoE stuns in addition to random activation from Poisons and Paralyze runes. A *very* strong build.

Modifié par Random70, 23 mai 2010 - 09:40 .

[beancounter501]

Random70 wrote...
If you're willing to post detailed directions on how to extract this data, I'll take a crack at it myself. But please be concise as the last programming I did was on my Apple //C in 1985.

Random - you have always been helpful, so sure here is how to do it.  In just a couple of easy steps. 
(I am assuming you have the console enabled for this.  If not, I can walk you through that)

1.  Download this mod to save yourself from pulling out your hair!  This mod simply makes the console commands visible.
http://www.dragonage...ile.php?id=1110
2.  Turn on the Script Logging.  From the builder Wiki:

To enable script logging, edit or create \\bin_ship\\ECLog.ini and set Script=1 in the [LogTypes] section.
You may have to create the file.  Make sure Script=1 is continuous with no spaces.  The path is in your Dragon Age install directory in the Program Files

This will now allow scripts to post to the debug log.  The debug log normally shows up under:
My Documents\\BioWare\\Dragon Age\\Logs

3.  Open the toolset and do File - New - Script.  Call the script whatever you want.  Something short is recommended cause you will have to type it.

4.  Copy and paste the following into the script window.  Save and compile 


#include "attributes_h"

void dumpstats(object oCreature)
{
//        Attribute_DumpCharacterSheetToLog( OBJECT_SELF );

    string sTag = GetTag(oCreature);
    int TABLE_PROPERTIES = 98;
    int i;
    PrintToLog("--- Dumping Stats for "+ sTag + " ---");
    string sName;
    int nType;
    string sValue;
    for (i = 1; i <= 40; i++)
{
        sName = GetM2DAString(TABLE_PROPERTIES,"Stat",i);
        nType = GetCreaturePropertyType(oCreature,i);

        switch (nType)
        {
            case PROPERTY_TYPE_ATTRIBUTE:
                sValue = "  Total: " + FloatToString(GetCreatureProperty(oCreature,i, PROPERTY_VALUE_TOTAL));
                sValue += " Base: " + FloatToString(GetCreatureProperty(oCreature,i, PROPERTY_VALUE_BASE));
                sValue += " Mod: " + FloatToString(GetCreatureProperty(oCreature,i, PROPERTY_VALUE_MODIFIER));
                sValue += " (Attribute)";
                break;
            case PROPERTY_TYPE_SIMPLE:
                sValue = "  Total: " + FloatToString(GetCreatureProperty(oCreature,i, PROPERTY_VALUE_TOTAL));
                sValue += " Base: " + FloatToString(GetCreatureProperty(oCreature,i, PROPERTY_VALUE_BASE));
                sValue += " Mod: " + FloatToString(GetCreatureProperty(oCreature,i, PROPERTY_VALUE_MODIFIER));
                sValue += " (Simple)";
                break;
            case PROPERTY_TYPE_DERIVED:
                sValue = " Total: " + FloatToString(GetCreatureProperty(oCreature,i, PROPERTY_VALUE_TOTAL));
                sValue += " Base: " + FloatToString(GetCreatureProperty(oCreature,i, PROPERTY_VALUE_BASE));
                sValue += " Mod: " + FloatToString(GetCreatureProperty(oCreature,i, PROPERTY_VALUE_MODIFIER));
                sValue += " (Derived)";
                break;
            case PROPERTY_TYPE_DEPLETABLE:
                sValue = "  Max: " + FloatToString(GetCreatureProperty(oCreature,i, PROPERTY_VALUE_TOTAL));
                sValue += " Base: " + FloatToString(GetCreatureProperty(oCreature,i, PROPERTY_VALUE_BASE));
                sValue += " Current: " + FloatToString(GetCreatureProperty(oCreature,i, PROPERTY_VALUE_CURRENT));
                sValue += " Mod: " + FloatToString(GetCreatureProperty(oCreature,i, PROPERTY_VALUE_MODIFIER));
                sValue += " (Depletable)";
                break;
        }

        PrintToLog(ToString(i) + " " + sName + sValue);

    }
    Log_Msg(LOG_CHANNEL_TEMP, "CanDiePermanently:" + ToString(GetCanDiePermanently(oCreature)));
    Log_Msg(LOG_CHANNEL_TEMP, "Rank:"+ ToString(GetCreatureRank(oCreature)));
    Log_Msg(LOG_CHANNEL_TEMP, " ---- ");

}
void main()
{
    object[] objects = GetNearestObject(OBJECT_SELF,OBJECT_TYPE_CREATURE,20,TRUE);
    int nCount = GetArraySize(objects);
    int i;
    for (i = 0; i < nCount; i++)
    {
       
        dumpstats(objects[i]);
       
    }
 
5.  Now when you play the game and want to record the stats of a monster.  Just open the console and type: runscript randoms_script

This will now post all of the details for every character that is nearby.  Including the party.  I think there are about 40 attributes show for each character - so it can get long.  But it includes just about everything you could ever want to know.  Send me a PM if you have any trouble.  Easy right? 

Modifié par beancounter501, 24 mai 2010 - 03:00 .

[Random70]

That console mod is slick. Thx for the heads up.

Ok, I created ECLog and pasted the above into a new script but when used in game I get 'Script does not exist'. I don't think I'm locating it in the proper directory. What values go into the drop down box that pops up when creating a new script?

[beancounter501]

You should be able to just type in the name of your script. Make sure you have no spaces in the name and make sure you hit the compile script button.



How about trying to do a search for the script name in your My Documents/Bioware file? And then move the file over to the directory modules/single player/override. There should be two scripts with that name. One with a nss extension and one with a ncs extension. Make sure you have both.



I will probaly package the script up and release it on the Nexus this weekend. So if it is giving you a problem just wait until the weekend.

[DWSmiley]

beancounter501 wrote...

One of the things that has been bugging me this whole playthrough is why the main character is blowing everyone else away. I am in a party with four warriors and he has 48% of the total dmg. It has been baffling. However, I did have a "duh" moment. I have been writing everyone's hit percent down, but not really paying attention to it. Glancing over it I can see the main has a hit percent of 93%. The rest of the party is sitting between 87 and 85. A huge advantage.

I decided to open up the character screen and see what everyone's attack rating is. The main has an attack score of 114, Alistar has 101, Sten is at 90 and Ogren is at 94. Looks like the huge attack bonus from Starfang and the Harvest Festival Ring are having a big impact! Maybe I should give those two items to another character and see if they pull ahead.

Another possiblility is that rally stacks except that a warrior who rallies does not get the benefit of any already active. So if you tend to leave your pc's rally active and do the others after leaving camp, then only your pc is getting full stacking.

[beancounter501]

Weird, I was just coming on to post about Rally Stacking. Up until his point only one character had Rally going, so that is not an issue. We did just wrap up the Ortan Thaig and crushed the spider queen with 2 Rally's running. I think we used 2 or 3 potions in the entire zone. I attacked each spider with 2 warriors and they blitzed them pretty quick. The main thing I hate is having the lone templar getting hit with Crushing Prision. That sucks. Or use Cleanse area on getting rid of the mages Glyph before realizing poor Alistar was hit by a Crushing Prision. Man, I hate being on the receiving end of that spell. I need another Templar in the group and I think I need to get Holy Smite.



However, I did find that you can easily have multiple characters using Rally and have the entire party get the full bonus. Have the first character Rally, put the whole party on hold and then move the other character out of the radius of the first Rally. Then have him rally and join the rest of the party. Viola - everyone now gets the full bonus of +20 attack and defense. I imagine you could have all four characters using Rally and get a big massive +40 attack & defense. Brutal.



Hmm, I wonder if War Cry stacks from different characters? That would basically render almost the entire party unhittable since 4 Rally and 4 War Cry would give everyone a whopping +80 defense. I dunno, seems a little chessy. Even Rally stacking seems a little cheesy. What do you all think? Cheesy or just overpowered?



Also, I did find out that you can cancel the animation of Berserk pretty quickly. Press the Berzerk button and the instant the icon appears on your talent bar move your character. Don't attack cause he will still stand there doing the Berserk dance. Makes Berzerker much better.

[Random70]

beancounter501 wrote...

Weird, I was just coming on to post about Rally Stacking. Up until his point only one character had Rally going, so that is not an issue. We did just wrap up the Ortan Thaig and crushed the spider queen with 2 Rally's running. I think we used 2 or 3 potions in the entire zone. I attacked each spider with 2 warriors and they blitzed them pretty quick. The main thing I hate is having the lone templar getting hit with Crushing Prision. That sucks. Or use Cleanse area on getting rid of the mages Glyph before realizing poor Alistar was hit by a Crushing Prision. Man, I hate being on the receiving end of that spell. I need another Templar in the group and I think I need to get Holy Smite.

Why would you need two Templars? Just have one with the Spellward / KC armor / Dweomer rune setup lead the charge when facing mage types. Or better yet, Smite at range which will stun mages until you can close to melee distance and bash them into oblivion. Once you have Smite you don't have to screw around with spell resist gear any longer.  Even lacking the these two options, Crushing Prison isn't that big of a deal. A mid-level warrior shouldn't have any problem surviving one. If you're concerned about it, just use a spirit balm on your 'lead-the-charge' guy prior to engaging emissaries / arcane horrors / Uldred / Fade beast

beancounter501 wrote...
However, I did find that you can easily have multiple characters using Rally and have the entire party get the full bonus. Have the first character Rally, put the whole party on hold and then move the other character out of the radius of the first Rally. Then have him rally and join the rest of the party. Viola - everyone now gets the full bonus of +20 attack and defense. I imagine you could have all four characters using Rally and get a big massive +40 attack & defense. Brutal.

That does indeed work, though Rally is still a little wonky on area transition. On my last party run, with Alistair being the only one with Rally, I would often get something like this after area transition:  Leliana & Morrigan - no bonus, Alistair - 1x bonus, PC - 2x bonus. Weird. Speaking of weird area transition stuff, keep on eye on the fatigue of the guy wearing Blood Dragon. I think that it's 10% fatigue bonus may start to multiply after a time.

beancounter501 wrote...
Hmm, I wonder if War Cry stacks from different characters? That would basically render almost the entire party unhittable since 4 Rally and 4 War Cry would give everyone a whopping +80 defense. I dunno, seems a little chessy. Even Rally stacking seems a little cheesy. What do you all think? Cheesy or just overpowered?

I think Warcry is simply a 'refresh the timer' ability. You check this for yourself next time you do the Suits of Armor @ Redcliff. They all light up Warcry but you only take a -10 penalty to attack. As to Rally stacking, why would it be cheese? The aforementioned Suits of Armor do it you. The shades in the 'Lord of the Rings' encounter stack aura of weakness on you, and Gaxxkang will hit you with both Aura of Weakness and Miasma. Screw 'Em.

beancounter501 wrote...
Also, I did find out that you can cancel the animation of Berserk pretty quickly. Press the Berzerk button and the instant the icon appears on your talent bar move your character. Don't attack cause he will still stand there doing the Berserk dance. Makes Berzerker much better.

Good Tip.

[beancounter501]

Well, just cleared the Deep Roads from Aeduican Thaig to the Broodmother.  The Broodmother was not nearly as hard as I thought it would be.  We pretty much just ignored everything but her.  Only stoping occasionally to kill the tentacles.  I think we only fought one wave of Darkspawn.  No one ever got grabbed, and we only used one potion the entire fight.  No Nature Salves or anything.

So here is everyones dmg output through most of the Deep Roads

Main: Level 15 Champion/Templar - 37,654
Alistar: Level 15 Berserker - 30,089
Sten: Level 15 Champion - 27,366
Oghren: Level 16 Champion - 20,908

The hardest fight by far was the two mages before the Broodmother.  Crushing Prision and Curse of Mortality is a pain.

In case some people are wondering here are some stats from the monster in this area:

Broodmother
Health: 2,032
Armor: 32
Attack: 103
Defense: 73

Broodmother Tentacle
Health: 698
Armor: 12
Attack: 94
Defense: 66

Corrupted Spider
Health: 268
Armor: 8
Attack: 93
Defense: 89

Stone Golem
Health: 618
Armor: 29
Attack: 91
Defense:  57

Fade Beast
Health: 1,157
Armor: 28
Attack: 94
Defense:  77

Most of the weaker mobs seem to have an defense between 60 to 80 and most have an attack in 80 range.

Modifié par beancounter501, 29 mai 2010 - 08:01 .

[Random70]

beancounter501 wrote...
In case some people are wondering here are some stats from the monster in this area:

Broodmother
Health: 2,032
Armor: 32
Attack: 103
Defense: 73

Broodmother Tentacle
Health: 698
Armor: 12
Attack: 94
Defense: 66

Corrupted Spider
Health: 268
Armor: 8
Attack: 93
Defense: 89

Stone Golem
Health: 618
Armor: 29
Attack: 91
Defense:  57

Fade Beast
Health: 1,157
Armor: 28
Attack: 94
Defense:  77

Most of the weaker mobs seem to have an defense between 60 to 80 and most have an attack in 80 range.

Nice info! So according to this, a DEF of 157 gives perfect defense vs. Broodmother and an ATT of 143 gives perfect to-hit vs. corrupted spiders, excluding stuns & autohits in both cases, of course.

Still can't get that script to compile. If I try to create it in Single player module I get 'Compile failed - file not found' and if I try to create in Core module I get 'Compile failed - 'Unexpected somethingorother at line 66' (sorry, didn't write it down). In either case I get a .nss file in the toolsetexport folder but no .ncs

[soteria]

Maybe I haven't been paying enough attention, but how many of the Broodmother's attacks *aren't* autohit? Seems like she's mostly doing massive attacks and sweeps for me. But, I don't engage her in melee so much.

Well, just cleared the Deep Roads from Aeduican Thaig to the Broodmother. The Broodmother was not nearly as hard as I thought it would be. We pretty much just ignored everything but her. Only stoping occasionally to kill the tentacles. I think we only fought one wave of Darkspawn. No one ever got grabbed, and we only used one potion the entire fight. No Nature Salves or anything.

I should update my broodmother video with this strategy. "Or, you could just man up and whack her with a sword until she's dead. You'll probably survive."  Thanks for the numbers...  the attack values match up with what I would expect:  at 110-120 defense you'll get hit 1/3 of the time by normal enemies, and around half the time by bosses.  Any chance you could post the numbers for some of the generic genlock/hurlocks as well as an alpha or two?  I can never get the console to work right.

Modifié par soteria, 30 mai 2010 - 07:06 .

[beancounter501]

@ Random - The best defense I have seen so far was from a Reverant. That was 99. Combined with Aura of Weakness he has an effective defense of 109. Also, keep in mind this is all at level 15 = not sure how much higher they scale up.



@Soteria - Another brillant tactic from the Beancounter - hit em with a sword. Actually, the biggest key is start with a Sunder Armor, since Broodmother has some serious armor. Make sure you hit her with that every 10 seconds. Helps if you have two 2 Hand Warriors.



And ignoring the tentacles is actually pretty good - those things have a ton of health. If you have killed three or four you could have basically killed Broodmother.



Now for the other stats:

All of this is from Cadrins Cross:



Hurlock Alpha - Sword & Shield

Health: 496

Armor: 16

Attack: 108

Defense: 88



Genlock - Shortbow

Health: 210

Armor: 8

Attack: 101 (LOL - not sure what is going on there, but there were 4 or 5 of em with that high attack value)

Defense: 78



Shriek - Just a White Mob

Health: 260

Armor: 8

Attack: 88

Defense: 74



Genlock Emissary

Health: 334

Armor: 9

Spellpower: 45

Mana: 398

Attack: 66

Defense: 81



Not sure why the frigging Genlocks with a bow have such a high attack rating. And every mage in the game has a massive mana pool. No point in trying to drain their mana or use the Templars special Righteous Strike.

[Random70]

beancounter501 wrote...

@ Random - The best defense I have seen so far was from a Reverant. That was 99. Combined with Aura of Weakness he has an effective defense of 109. Also, keep in mind this is all at level 15 = not sure how much higher they scale up.

@Soteria - Another brillant tactic from the Beancounter - hit em with a sword. Actually, the biggest key is start with a Sunder Armor, since Broodmother has some serious armor. Make sure you hit her with that every 10 seconds. Helps if you have two 2 Hand Warriors.

And ignoring the tentacles is actually pretty good - those things have a ton of health. If you have killed three or four you could have basically killed Broodmother.

Now for the other stats:
All of this is from Cadrins Cross:

Hurlock Alpha - Sword & Shield
Health: 496
Armor: 16
Attack: 108
Defense: 88

Genlock - Shortbow
Health: 210
Armor: 8
Attack: 101 (LOL - not sure what is going on there, but there were 4 or 5 of em with that high attack value)
Defense: 78

Shriek - Just a White Mob
Health: 260
Armor: 8
Attack: 88
Defense: 74

Genlock Emissary
Health: 334
Armor: 9
Spellpower: 45
Mana: 398
Attack: 66
Defense: 81

Not sure why the frigging Genlocks with a bow have such a high attack rating. And every mage in the game has a massive mana pool. No point in trying to drain their mana or use the Templars special Righteous Strike.

Again, two thumbs up on data. Always knew that Righteous Strike / Magebane was a waste of mouseclicks and this confirms it.

It was my understanding that the efficacy of your defense is:
If (your DEF) > (enemy ATT) + 54 then *unhittable*
From many playthroughs,160 DEF seems to be 'magic number' that *nobody* can hit through - Cauthrien, Branka, Revenants, etc. But according to your numbers here, you would need 163 to remain unhittable vs. a lowly Alpha. Hmm.

Did you happen to grab numbers for the Ogre Alpha? Wondering how he compares to the Cadash Thaig version. The Cadash guy always seems to put up a better fight.

Modifié par Random70, 31 mai 2010 - 12:39 .

[soteria]

I think they give the archers higher attack because it's needed--almost everyone is going to have a higher defense vs ranged. Oh, and I still recommend killing the tentacles because they're worth something like 130 exp each. That's a hefty chunk altogether. Also, this confirms the way I've always felt about relative armor values: archers' is really low, emissaries' is high (relatively. Random, 160 defense is probably still enough, because if you have that much defense you probably have an item or two that grants 10% dodge. Now, that bonus is multiplied, not added, so you're not hitting 100% evasion, but you're still probably at like 99%. Chances are no Hurlock Alpha is going to get 100 swings off to have a statistically relevant chance to hit you.

[beancounter501]

Not much time for gaming here lately. But we cleared out Redcliff and started the Urn going all the way through the first level of the temple. Saved the town with not losing a single villager the first try. I thought for sure Murdock was going to die. I got a crappy helmet for all my trouble. Looking forward to killing Kolgrim and the High Dragon next! Combat is well, easy. I actually double checked a number of times to make sure I had not put the difficulty on easy.



Three little suprise - First, I simply do not need any crowd control other then 2 Hand Sweep and Holy Smite for the mages. War Cry/Freightning Appearance goes unused the majority of battle. Things are just dying to fast. Second, a high str Dual Weld Warrior can go total talent usage without momentum and kill things faster. Thanks to Random70 on that tip. Finally, Holy Smite is much better then I thought it was. Works great on Mages/Archers. I have not had a mage resisit it yet. A great strat is to Holy Smite the Mage, run one character right at him and then do an AOE attack next to him. Your character charging the mage will almost always have a ton of mobs swarming him. Works best for a Two Hand Warrior.



Not much has changed in the comparision between the different character.



Main Two Hand(Champ/Templar): 25,200

Alistar Dual Weld (Berserker/Templar): 17,300

Sten - Two Hand (Champ/Reaver): 15,100

Oghren - S&S (Champ/Berserker): 11,100



Pretty much how the entire game has been running. The lead character taking a run away lead, with Alistar second and Sten a close third. Oghren is almost always last.



I experimented with a double Reaver and using Aura of Pain. But it was a complete waste. The little 6 point per tick of dmg did not mean anything when I could easily kill most white with one or two talents. Very apparent the talent stinks when you see your health take a hit right before you kill some monster with a Punisher or Sunder Arms. Fights don't last long enough to justify the stamina and health drain.



Here are a few stats from the monsters along the way:



Cultist 2 Hand Reaver

Attk: 77

Def: 60

Health: 217

AR: 10

(Man those guys are weak!)



Boss Bear in a Chantry Board Quest to find some Wolves

attk: 79

Def: 45

Health: 1,369

AR: 0

(Basically a Punching Bag)



Genlock Boss Mage in a Caravan Attack

Attk: 68

Def: 55

Health: 850

AR: 11

Mana: 440



Suit of Armor in Castle Redcliff

Attk: 85

Def: 80

Health: 284

AR: 24



On the next updage I should have the little Wyrms, High Dragon and Kolgrim.

[soteria]

Things are just dying to fast. Second, a high str Dual Weld Warrior can go total talent usage without momentum and kill things faster. Thanks to Random70 on that tip. Finally, Holy Smite is much better then I thought it was. Works great on Mages/Archers. I have not had a mage resisit it yet. A great strat is to Holy Smite the Mage, run one character right at him and then do an AOE attack next to him. Your character charging the mage will almost always have a ton of mobs swarming him. Works best for a Two Hand Warrior.

One more reason not to start the fight with all those sustains running, eh?  Glad to hear you're finding Holy Smite useful.  I'm a fan, myself (as you know

Modifié par soteria, 08 juin 2010 - 01:46 .

[beancounter501]

Yes, the less sustains the better. Even though with some good stamina gear you should be able to keep momentum and berserk up and still have enough stamina for talents. Deathblow is the key for any warrior. I am starting to get a lot more impressed with the Dual weld active talents. I am finding that Punisher/Flurry/Ripstoe/Dual Sweep pump out dmg a lot quicker then auto attack. Cripple leaves a lot to be desired though. I think that was half the problem earlier in my play through - I was throwing out Cripple and Zerker, did not pick up deathblow and had all kinds of Stamina problems.



I was very skeptical of Holy Smite. But I like it now. It is no Mana Clash, but it gets the job done. The hardest part of every battle with a mage is the time it takes you to get into melee range. Holy Smite solves that problem nicely. Smite + plus your favorite melee talent will ususally equal a dead mage.

[beancounter501]

Ok, just went through the lower Ruins, killed Kolgrim and the High Dragon. Straight melee. The whole party was about level 17. The lower ruins were fairly easy, the hardest battle was the one were a couple of Drakes come up from behind when you charge the Ruins Overseer Mage who drops Spell Weave. Everything was cruising along until Sten got caught in a leg trap and Alistar became a chew toy for a Drake. Fortunately, Alistar surived with a bare sliver of health. The mistake there was sending two warriors to kill a single Yellow Mage. After a holy smite any warrior can pretty drop any non-boss mage.

Kolgrim was straight forward. Having two Templars really helped. Even though only 1 character has Holy Smite, it was still useful to have two Cleanse Auras. I never realized just how short the AOE is on Cleanse Aura. I actually used the talent, but did not have Sten in range to clear the Misdirection Hex! But overall, no one was ever really in danger of dying.

For the High Dragon. I would love to say we used nothing but melee, no potions, kicked her butt with no casualities. I was trying to do that when Sten got a little under 50% health and promptly got chewed on by the Dragon. Despite saving a number of special attacks for just this occasion, Sten was promptly killed. The High Dragon was at 50% health and everyone was out of Stamina and under half health. I decided it was better to win the battle and went on a potion binge. I think I drank more health potions in that one fight then I have since leaving Lothering. So we did kick her butt with nothing but straight melee, but it took a lot of potions. And Sten died.

It was tough, you run out of Stamina because of no Deathblow and you have zero way to heal someone who gets stunned or grabbed. Plus Massive Attack was hitting the whole party.

Dmg wise, Alistar actually came really close to take the lead. He was within 500 points of dmg. Probably because of the High Dragon. He burned all his Stamina, turned on Momentum and Auto Attacked. I really did not think he would do that well because he was stunned. A lot! Actually, in this whole area he has been stunned alot. So has Oghren because of all the darn Rogues and Dirty Fighting.

Sten, came in last - probably because he was chomped to bits by the dragon and spent a couple of battles tied up in a pesky leg hold trap. Ogren was a decent third. Good ole Oghren did surive a grab attack from the dragon. I have given him lots of + con gear which makes him pretty durable.

But anyways, here are the stats for all the monsters:

High Dragon
Attk: 71
Def: 64
Health: 4,085
AR: 36.875
Mental Resist: 28
Physical Resistance: 98.5

Kolgrim
Attk: 99.5
Def: 84
Health: 1,240
AR: 18

Revear with Kolgrim
Attk: 90.5
Def: 73
Health: 310
AR: 12.6

Yellow Drake
Attk: 90
Def: 80
Health: 515
AR: 18

Modifié par beancounter501, 10 juin 2010 - 03:56 .

[DWSmiley]

How many deep mushrooms would you have to chow down to get enough stamina for an emergency bash or pommel strike? The couple of times I ate them they seemed to have almost no effect.



So, a more varied warrior group would help vs. the HD, eh? Namely, the grumpy golem type. In my current playthrough I am for the first time using Shale outside of Orzammar/Deep Roads and using other than the Stoneheart tree. Disappointing at first, as I've found nothing but useless chipped and flawed crystals and the pulverizing tree is pretty sucky. But then I discovered the wonderfulness of rock mastery. And of course Shale is ideal for dragons.



BTW, according to the wiki Flemeth will be easier, as she will be level 15 vs. level 19-20 for the High Dragon. But if you leave Flemeth until after the Landsmeet her area resets and she will be level 22 - as high as it gets.

[beancounter501]

Not sure how many Deep Mushrooms you would need. I think it restores 15 stamina, so probably one or two for an emergency Pommel Strike. But I was finding that I could not get her to release the grab even when hitting it with a Pommel Strike and a Shield Bash. Best strategy was to simply keep every ones health on the high end and just tough it out relying on health and armor.

Looking at the HD mental resistance it should be really susceptible to Freightning Appearance, but it resisted it all three times I used the talent.

Shale and switching everyone to bows would probably be the best tactics for all warriors, but I wanted to melee it out! I just redid the battle and it went much smoother, since I kept using health potions to keep everyones health up. Killed it in just under 40 seconds. I started the battle off with Freighting Appearance, hit her again as soon as the cooldown was up and it had just about recharged when Alistar got the deathblow animation.

The fight was still a lot harder then the Broodmother. After burning up a lot of the stamina the group seems to do about 2500 to 3000 points of dmg to a single target before running out of steam.   Enough to kill Broodmother, but not enough for the HD. That last quarter chunk of health is the hardest to get.  I almost wish there were a couple of lower level minions to kill in the fight to restore Stamina.

The Rock Master line is really good for Shale. So is pulzering blows once you get some high end crystals.

Edit: I do not see how people solo the HD on Nightmare without resorting to using a Warm Balm and staying out of melee range.  Or even taking the HD with a full party and no mage or potions.  Again unless you stay out of melee range.  In melee the HD is nasty.  Good luck Smiley on your Solo nightmare playthrough!

Modifié par beancounter501, 10 juin 2010 - 02:31 .

[DWSmiley]

Yeah, the Broodmother is really not hard at all.  I don't bother staying back on the rocks anymore; my warriors and DW rogues just wade in.  She almost never grabs for some reason.  And the DW kill animation is such fun - I'll even shut down the ranged attackers when it's close to the end.