1527 réponses à ce sujet

[Lady of the Waters]

He is just downright bland. No wonder Miranda dumped him.

[Bucky_McLachlan]

Arcian wrote...
Just because he's the least popular doesn't mean he's a bad character. Quite the contrary, I think he's one of the best characters of ME2 because he doesn't carry around a ton of emotional baggage like say... i dunno, Tali.

WTF are you talking about? Jacob has issues with Miranda, issues with the Alliance and daddy issues up the Yin Yang. That's why barrier is such a  fitting power. Jacob is a living breathing barrier to personality. Tali is a total virgin that just loves her father wants to help her people and hates the Geth. She tends to complain a lot...but the only baggage she's carrying around is dat ass.

Modifié par Bucky_McLachlan, 12 avril 2010 - 09:12 .

[uzivatel]

tanarri23 wrote...

I like Jacob, he's a bit like Ashley of ME2 and he's my Shepard's bud.

But I admit, getting to that cool "spilling some drinks on the Citadel if we survive" friendship part was not easy. It's not because he's black. It's because I usually play femShep and her interaction with Jacob feels like borderline sexual harassment. Her predatory behaviour starts the moment they're on the Normandy, way too early for her to get to know Jacob as anything more than a Cerberus agent and/or an obviously hot piece of ass, she does it regardless of what the player actually wants or doesn't want to do with Jacob, and for the bigger part of the game Jacob seems quite uncomfortable with it.

Pretty much this.

He is somewhat better if the main character is male and he actually seems like a good character once he runs out of dialogue.

That said, BioWare seems to have problems writing lead male NCPs. Carth, Sky or Kaiden are far from the best characters in their respective games. I did not play Dragon Age: Origins, but Alistair does not seem to be much better either.

Modifié par uzivatel, 12 avril 2010 - 09:19 .

[Marta Rio]

Madi wrote...
Can you honestly tell me that if Jacob was a suave white guy he’d be this unpopular? Just look at Kaden who Jacob is commonly compared to.  Most people seem to agree that he isn’t much more if at all more interesting a character than Jacob yet he’s still infinitely more popular than Jacob.

I'd say a lot of Kaiden's popularity has to do with how his romance was handled.  The Kaiden romance is extended over several conversations, and he doesn't ever say anything too weird/creepy.  Nor does femshep act like some sort of sexual predator around him.  And thus was spawned a 1000+ page support thread with lots of posts regarding shirtless Kaiden (not to just pick on the Kaiden fans; all of the LI threads are pretty much like this...)
If the Jacob romance had been handled well, then he'd probably have an equally large legion of fangirls/boys, going on about how awesome his abs are, psychoanalyzing his backstory, etc.  As it is, he's the character that people love to make fun of.

[Onyx Jaguar]

Alistair was pretty interesting actually. They didn't use the same blank slate approach that they normally use.

[this isnt my name]

Madi wrote...

The big elephant in the room here that no one wants to talk about is the fact that Jacob is black. Now before you start getting ultra defensive and start accusing me of reverse racism I’d like to point out that I’m biracial and have no racial biases of any kind.  Secondly I’m not saying the reason that Jacob  is such a  massively unpopular is because the people who don’t like Jacob are inherently racist. However that doesn’t mean that the fact that Jacob is black isn’t a factor. In fact I would say it’s a significant factor.

I think it’s probably largely subconscious. Jacob is a relatively basic character with nothing incredibly interesting about him although still a much more solid, well rounded character than you’ll find in most games. The issue is I think that most white gamers just find it difficult to relate to black characters. I think that’s one of the main reasons why black characters are so rare in video games and actual black protagonists are nearly nonexistent in video games.Especially non- stereotypical characters (i.e. C.J. from GTA)  Can you honestly tell me that if Jacob was a suave white guy he’d be this unpopular? Just look at Kaden who Jacob is commonly compared to.  Most people seem to agree that he isn’t much more if at all more interesting a character than Jacob yet he’s still infinitely more popular than Jacob. Once again that doesn’t mean that you’re a racist but I just think it clearly shows that race plays a factor in a lot of things, whether subconscious or otherwise. Although I think the fact that he bears a strong resemblance to Kanye West didn’t really help either. I don’t really get why his look was changed so dramatically from Mass Effect Galaxy. It’s like he’s a completely different person.

http://masseffect.bi.../market/galaxy/

Nothing to do with race, you showed that in the bold part, the second bolded part I will answer, Kaiden was more popular because he didnt have the forced flirting dialouge, so people who play fem sheps will prefer kaiden. I play neither and to me Jacob is better, he didnt whine about every damn thing, I still dont like him, but he is better than kaiden, the fact he is alive and kaiden is not shows that, if I wanted Jacob could easily be killed off.

[Nightwriter]

My total disinterest in Jacob has nothing to do with him being black, and I resents the im-ple-cay-shyon, thanks you very much.

In all seriousness though, I think black people are interesting and cool to be around and that Jacob didn't really live up to that image.

[STG]

Funny you should mention CJ. I found CJ, his brother, Big Smoke or hell, even Ryder more interesting characters than Jacob. And Ryder was a total b*tch so that tells you a lot.



I don't care what color their skin is, if a character is bad, he's bad.

[this isnt my name]

Lady of the Waters wrote...

He is just downright bland. No wonder Miranda dumped him.

That reminds me, how the hell dose that guy ever get a relationship. "Im not good enough for her, she deserves better... So do you wannna go out sometime ?"

[Nightwriter]

I felt like Jacob was two different people before and after the Lazarus Station portion of the game.

While you were on the Cerberus base he was decent, forthcoming, he showed you respect and leveled with you when really no one else did. He was friendly, treated you like a person. I started to like him immediately.

But when I got him on the Normandy it was like he became this different person. He became withdrawn, taciturn, standoffish, curt and stiff. Difficult to talk to.

I began to suspect split personality or Reaper indoctrination. Or that perhaps he was becoming a werewolf and the
hormones were kicking in.

Eventually I lost interest.

Modifié par Nightwriter, 12 avril 2010 - 09:39 .

[Onyx Jaguar]

Nightwriter wrote...

I felt like Jacob was two different people before and after the Lazarus
Station portion of the game.



While you were on the Cerberus base he was decent, forthcoming, he
showed you respect and leveled with you when really no one else did. He
was friendly, treated you like a person. I started to like him
immediately.



But when I got him on the Normandy it was like he became this different
person. He became withdrawn, taciturn, standoffish, curt and stiff.
Difficult to talk to.

I began to suspect split personality or Reaper
indoctrination. Or that perhaps he was becoming a werewolf and the
hormones were kicking in.



Eventually I lost interest.

This does seem to be the case.  At first he seems to be on your side and Miranda the hostile one but then as the game progresses it seems like Jacob questions all of your moves and who you bring on the ship.  Like I said one of hte annoying things was when you get Legion he wants to space it.  After all you go through to get that Geth he wants to space it.  Funny thing is was that wasn't even an option.  Having him act that way was pointless.

Its also especially frustrating when playing as a Paragon because Jacob seems to be more of a Paragon character.  I don't know why they wrote him so hard core as to not trust you or your decisions but it is off putting.  I don't mind characters speaking their mind.  Wrex in the first game was testament to this, and to an extent Miranda fills this role just fine.  But when they introduce him in the beginning of the game to what he becomes once you get recruiting it doesn't seem to fit and the character suffers greatly for it.

[this isnt my name]

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...

I felt like Jacob was two different people before and after the Lazarus
Station portion of the game.



While you were on the Cerberus base he was decent, forthcoming, he
showed you respect and leveled with you when really no one else did. He
was friendly, treated you like a person. I started to like him
immediately.



But when I got him on the Normandy it was like he became this different
person. He became withdrawn, taciturn, standoffish, curt and stiff.
Difficult to talk to.

I began to suspect split personality or Reaper
indoctrination. Or that perhaps he was becoming a werewolf and the
hormones were kicking in.



Eventually I lost interest.

This does seem to be the case.  At first he seems to be on your side and Miranda the hostile one but then as the game progresses it seems like Jacob questions all of your moves and who you bring on the ship.  Like I said one of hte annoying things was when you get Legion he wants to space it.  After all you go through to get that Geth he wants to space it.  Funny thing is was that wasn't even an option.  Having him act that way was pointless.

Its also especially frustrating when playing as a Paragon because Jacob seems to be more of a Paragon character.  I don't know why they wrote him so hard core as to not trust you or your decisions but it is off putting.  I don't mind characters speaking their mind.  Wrex in the first game was testament to this, and to an extent Miranda fills this role just fine.  But when they introduce him in the beginning of the game to what he becomes once you get recruiting it doesn't seem to fit and the character suffers greatly for it.

What annoyed me was the way he tried telling Tali about EDI, yeah great work, dont try to tell her in a way that sounds insulting.
But as for questioning and complaining I dont remember him doing it as much as kaiden, but it was still annoying.

[Nightwriter]

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

This does seem to be the case.  At first he seems to be on your side and Miranda the hostile one but then as the game progresses it seems like Jacob questions all of your moves and who you bring on the ship.  Like I said one of hte annoying things was when you get Legion he wants to space it.  After all you go through to get that Geth he wants to space it.  Funny thing is was that wasn't even an option.  Having him act that way was pointless.

Don't even get me started on the so called "choices" that the characters in this game persecute you for which you really have no choice at all in.

Like the Council persecuting you for working with Cerberus. LIKE YOU HAD A CHOICE.

Its also especially frustrating when playing as a Paragon because Jacob seems to be more of a Paragon character.  I don't know why they wrote him so hard core as to not trust you or your decisions but it is off putting.  I don't mind characters speaking their mind.  Wrex in the first game was testament to this, and to an extent Miranda fills this role just fine.  But when they introduce him in the beginning of the game to what he becomes once you get recruiting it doesn't seem to fit and the character suffers greatly for it.

True dat. Jacob could be pretty judgmental, and he never really let you talk about anything. If I had a nickel for every time he said, "Drop it" or something like that...

[Mondo47]

I know choosing to fight Jacob's corner is going to be tough, but bear with me a moment here. I'm not afraid of heavy risks...

Can I ask all the female forumites in here for a show of hands - how many of you have had a guy use a terrible pick-up line on you? I'm guessing if you're all honest, most of you will have heard at least one that was so dire you had to tell all your friends what the guy had said and then sat about at the bar/club/party/whatever trying to retain bladder control whilre you repeated it to one another all night in a comedy version of the guy's voice.

Ok, another one - how many of you have been willing to forgive a guy for being tactless, rude, crass or just not the sharpest tool in the shed because he was good looking? I'll bet some of you have... hell, I'm not afraid to admit to doing it more than once. If we're honest once again, I'm sure those of us that have can knowingly look at one another and compare horror stories that end with the line "... but he was just so cute I couldn't stay angry with him."

Alright, maybe the last line is more like "I saw sense eventually and kicked him to the curb, but damn, he was hot.";)

Last one - how many of us have dated a 100% nice guy; a guy who's sensible, level-headed, practical, dependable, and a lot of other words that end with "ible." They're good for us; they give us support when we need it, give us space when we demand it, sometimes we even marry them. We do like though talking about the ones that were walking disaster zones, the romeos that made us feel like princesses and wh*res at the same time, and the bad boys that made us cry but we somehow just kept going back. Nice guys certainly don't finish last in the grand scheme of relationships, but until we find one and keep him... they're not the ones we remember.

And if our nice guy has a few faults, like he sometimes puts his foot in his mouth, eh, we forgive it.

I think at least (hey, feel free to disagree here) that this is why we're all so hard on Jacob (speaking from a female-gamer's perspective) - he plays through like a regular joe; he's usually the first person to back Shepard's plays in conversations, he isn't too pushy, and he at least can act like he knows something about the things he claims to. He doesn't have the emotional resonance of Thane or Kaidan, or the friendly familiarity of Garrus, or the sweet nature of Liara. Jacob is a Joe Average in almost every way - save his body. I'll be honest here again... wow. That guy could use me like a Rubiks Cube and I don't think I'd be alone in not complaining - speaking from a purely visual perspective, I stress.

And then he opens his mouth... ohboy.

Adding it up, he has a few positive elements as a character, but his game when it comes to talking his way into your bed is... yeesh, lamer than a donkey with no legs. We can all agree that "the priiiize" is not going to pull a rotten tooth out of a dead horse's head. It's the one thing everyone in the forums in mocking, and ok, maybe rightly so, but it's like complaining that this delicious slice of chocolate cake I'm eating for breakfast (yes, I'm being bad this morning!) is actually crappy simply because this slice has no chocolate-coated cherry on it and the piece is a little squishy around the edges. That's how I find myself increasingly seeing Jacob; a nice enough guy that unfortunately doesn't stand out from the crowd of suitors a female Shepard has because he's so level-on-the-level, so the only thing that screams out at us is this crappy line he throws us. Everything else about him, just isn't so bad. He lack's Thane's need, Garrus's respect, Kelly's lapdancing outfit, soooo... poor guy finishes last.

It is all a matter of horses for courses - we all have our own likes and dislikes, turn ons and turn offs, and that's perfectly fine. I just think because this one guy wants us to be "the priiiize" we're treating him a little unfairly if we all think about it; the guy's chatup is lousy - it just makes him a little more real if you ask me. Hell, when Garrus shows up with his booze and sexy-time mix-tape, we think it's cute! Jacob needs a little slack cutting in my opinion... because in real-life, ladies, we've probably accepted worse lines than that before now.

And no... I ain't sharin' mah cake!

[this isnt my name]

Nightwriter wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

This does seem to be the case.  At first he seems to be on your side and Miranda the hostile one but then as the game progresses it seems like Jacob questions all of your moves and who you bring on the ship.  Like I said one of hte annoying things was when you get Legion he wants to space it.  After all you go through to get that Geth he wants to space it.  Funny thing is was that wasn't even an option.  Having him act that way was pointless.

Don't even get me started on the so called "choices" that the characters in this game persecute you for which you really have no choice at all in.

Like the Council persecuting you for working with Cerberus. LIKE YOU HAD A CHOICE.

Its also especially frustrating when playing as a Paragon because Jacob seems to be more of a Paragon character.  I don't know why they wrote him so hard core as to not trust you or your decisions but it is off putting.  I don't mind characters speaking their mind.  Wrex in the first game was testament to this, and to an extent Miranda fills this role just fine.  But when they introduce him in the beginning of the game to what he becomes once you get recruiting it doesn't seem to fit and the character suffers greatly for it.

True dat. Jacob could be pretty judgmental, and he never really let you talk about anything. If I had a nickel for every time he said, "Drop it" or something like that...

Then again he did say he was always honest about how he felt.
Atleast the council werent as bad as the ME1 character, that needed a renegade option, she just saw the ****ing collectors and me killing them, obviously its not cerberus you stupid *****. ME1 Charaters in this game seem to be there for the entire purpose of pissing me off.

[Nightwriter]

Those are some interesting points, Mondo.

I think maybe if Jacob had been more portrayed as a guy who kind of stumbles over himself with these cheesy pickup lines, like you said, I might've seen it differently. But those lines weren't meant to present an endearing flaw, a tendency to say cheesy things to women out of clumsiness or insecurity or something. It wasn't setup as the poorly executed come on. It was meant to be serious.

And, maybe people disagree, but I don't really see Jacob as the nice guy. I would see Kaidan as being way more suitable for that role than Jacob. Way more "on the level". Jacob was kind of standoffish and sometimes stern. Nice guys are open, friendly. Communicative, usually. I don't see Jacob as possessing any of those traits, really. Do you know what I mean?

Sure, I've heard all kinds of lousy pickup lines! But if I let them slide it's because I see something cute or endearing or worth sticking around for behind that line, sort of hiding out of sight. And I... really didn't see that with Jacob. There was just this crappy line and nothing behind it.

And chocolate cake sounds so good right now stop talking about it! It's killing me.

[VettoRyouzou]

I don't dislike Jacob case he black I dislike jacob case he has the personality of mud, even his loyalty mission doesn't feel that deep his father did acts of evil and he never really emotes on it and after it all done there no mental issue there or anything? Just a "well... that over with let go!" he bland that his issue.

Also it feel like times there trying to make him a new Garrus a Maleshep best friend and command at arms.. Sadly he just comes off as that one guy who trying really to hard to fit in.

Modifié par VettoRyouzou, 12 avril 2010 - 10:11 .

[Nightwriter]

this isnt my name wrote...

ME1 Charaters in this game seem to be there for the entire purpose of pissing me off.

It's true. It's so, so true.

[darkshadow136]

Because he is boring, a whiner, and has the personality of a Walrus.

[Steel Dancer]

As others have mentioned, he's actually a decent person, just..bland. Nothing about him really makes him stand out in the game except for his utterly priiiized dire romance dialogue.

[this isnt my name]

darkshadow136 wrote...

Because he is boring, a whiner, and has the personality of a Walrus.

It almost makes me wish I saved Kaiden just to see the dialouge between the 2 most boring individuals.

[Speakeasy13]

this isnt my name wrote...

Then again he did say he was always honest about how he felt.
Atleast the council werent as bad as the ME1 character, that needed a renegade option, she just saw the ****ing collectors and me killing them, obviously its not cerberus you stupid *****. ME1 Charaters in this game seem to be there for the entire purpose of pissing me off.

I think there's a difference between being honest and being a jerk. Like you I respect his right to speak his mind, but that doesn't make his opinions any less hyprocrytical and downright annoying sometimes, if not most of the times.

I'd appreciate if he speaks his mind on issues that warrants a debate, not in the most inapporiate of situitions, saying the most insensitive things. I'm not saying I'd stop him for saying it, but the fact that he said those things just made him come across as a jerk.

Modifié par Speakeasy13, 12 avril 2010 - 10:16 .

[Nightwriter]

darkshadow136 wrote...

Because he is boring, a whiner, and has the personality of a Walrus.

Oh, I don't think he's a whiner. I think he's pretty tightlipped, actually.

I agree with the other two.

[Speakeasy13]

Nightwriter wrote...

darkshadow136 wrote...

Because he is boring, a whiner, and has the personality of a Walrus.

Oh, I don't think he's a whiner. I think he's pretty tightlipped, actually.

I agree with the other two.

I think walruses will be offended.