1527 réponses à ce sujet

[Gundar3]

I actually liked Jacob, I thought he was supposed to be more of the common man/ average guy. Thats a fine role and is certainly appreciated over the "everyone has a dark mysterious/jaded past with their own unique problems that are so far out there its crazy, but your attention is DEMANDED".



However, while he is a great character, that was the same position that Kaiden was in, in the first game. While the average guy can be pulled off well, in the face of a more "outthere" personality or character, its more difficult to latch on to and be compelled by.

[Darkhour]

Masticetobbacco wrote...

not white

Figured. A white person would never make the folly of trying to describe a white person to a non-white person. They already know better.

and yes the pigment would make me assume he is white, caucasian

I see you backed down and decided not to answer the questions. Figured out that is is pure idiocy of trying to point out what makes a person a white person based on physical attributes. You learn quick. It is painfully obvious that there are no physical traits that white people have that a non-white person can't have. Trying to classify people by looks will only lead to failure. Race, as we use the term, is purely a social construct, not a physical one.

The truth is, you suspect he is a white person. You don't know. It takes a white person to point out another white person because they are the ones deciding how an individual is going to be treated on the basis of color.

lol this guy does have a carefree lifestyle, but that is because how the southern economy works, that he does not really have to work for much and can pretty much live on his own. Still I'd say he could do better. He certainly is not "well-off". I could imagine his diet, his hygiene, and his "house" are doing quite poorly. I would not really call him priviliged or lucky. He is doing fine with what he has.

He has no money to change his lifestyle, and certainly not the education at all.

"Better" is a matter of opinion. You might not think he is living well, but he could be content with his life. What exactly is stopping him from changing his lifestyle? Why can't he get an education? The opportunities are out there. What is restricting him other than himself?

There is a saying that non-white kids hear growing up. I'm sure you were probably told this as well. "You will have to work twice as hard as a white person to get the same thing". Non-whites accept this as a fact of life. The thing about non-white people is that they can work twice as hard and bust their butts, but if a white person decides to practice racism against them their work means nothing. Look at the civil right's movement. People can march and protest all they want, but ultimately nothing changes unless some white men get together and decide to allow it.  

[Polka14]

So by your logic Darkhour, a "white" person can be anyone. Does that not mean that "white" people do not actually exist at all?

[Siansonea]

I am seeing lots of generalizations, and few facts. It's easy to proclaim something, but without actual information to back up the claims, there's not very much substance to the argument. Such discussions become increasingly irrelevant.

I am dismayed by the contentious tone of the discussion, I wish the matter could be discussed in a civil way, but perhaps that is a vain hope. I believe the topic is important to discuss, but such topics are best discussed dispassionately. Name calling does not further a discussion in any way, it only reinforces entrenched positions and blocks any opportunity to influence another's viewpoint.

The question remains: What does ANY of this have to do with Jacob?

[Masticetobbacco]

Siansonea II wrote...


The question remains: What does ANY of this have to do with Jacob?

nothin. Jacob is boring, we gave up on that discussion days ago. Discussing race and biology is much more interesting than Jacob

[Polka14]

Siansonea II wrote...

I am seeing lots of generalizations, and few facts. It's easy to proclaim something, but without actual information to back up the claims, there's not very much substance to the argument. Such discussions become increasingly irrelevant.

I am dismayed by the contentious tone of the discussion, I wish the matter could be discussed in a civil way, but perhaps that is a vain hope. I believe the topic is important to discuss, but such topics are best discussed dispassionately. Name calling does not further a discussion in any way, it only reinforces entrenched positions and blocks any opportunity to influence another's viewpoint.

The question remains: What does ANY of this have to do with Jacob?

It has nothing to do with jacob or mass effect. Racists have taken over this thread.

[Siansonea]

Masticetobbacco wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...


The question remains: What does ANY of this have to do with Jacob?

nothin. Jacob is boring, we gave up on that discussion days ago. Discussing race and biology is much more interesting than Jacob

That I agree with. I only wish the discussion could be more productive and less sensationalized.

[Polka14]

Masticetobbacco wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...


The question remains: What does ANY of this have to do with Jacob?

nothin. Jacob is boring, we gave up on that discussion days ago. Discussing race and biology is much more interesting than Jacob

but started by some fool that knows nothing about race or biology and considers the term "race" to be some kind of social superiority. He needs to be locked in an insane asylum.

[Onyx Jaguar]

I like how characters like Samara, a one note character is considered "INteresting"

[Masticetobbacco]

Darkhour wrote...


I see you backed down and decided not to answer the questions. Figured out that is is pure idiocy of trying to point out what makes a person a white person based on physical attributes. You learn quick. It is painfully obvious that there are no physical traits that white people have that a non-white person can't have. Trying to classify people by looks will only lead to failure. Race, as we use the term, is purely a social construct, not a physical one.
  

I called him white because I judged by his physical attributes for him to be white. Yes then, I do believe that light pigment as in this man's case = white man

he is physically different, and so I would categorize him as such

[Siansonea]

Polka14 wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

I am seeing lots of generalizations, and few facts. It's easy to proclaim something, but without actual information to back up the claims, there's not very much substance to the argument. Such discussions become increasingly irrelevant.

I am dismayed by the contentious tone of the discussion, I wish the matter could be discussed in a civil way, but perhaps that is a vain hope. I believe the topic is important to discuss, but such topics are best discussed dispassionately. Name calling does not further a discussion in any way, it only reinforces entrenched positions and blocks any opportunity to influence another's viewpoint.

The question remains: What does ANY of this have to do with Jacob?

It has nothing to do with jacob or mass effect. Racists have taken over this thread.

I sympathize with your position, but statements such as this do not help the situation. You should not let others make you so upset. Generally such a reaction is exactly what the instigator desires.

[Siansonea]

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

I like how characters like Samara, a one note character is considered "INteresting"

One-note is fine if it is a compelling note. Jacob just doesn't have a compelling note.

[Onyx Jaguar]

Siansonea II wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

I like how characters like Samara, a one note character is considered "INteresting"

One-note is fine if it is a compelling note. Jacob just doesn't have a compelling note.

Samara is entirely predicatable.  Completely lawful stupid.  With how she is presented you can pretty much predict everything she says and how she reacts.

[Masticetobbacco]

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

I like how characters like Samara, a one note character is considered "INteresting"

One-note is fine if it is a compelling note. Jacob just doesn't have a compelling note.

Samara is entirely predicatable.  Completely lawful stupid.  With how she is presented you can pretty much predict everything she says and how she reacts.

ouch

[2papercuts]

Polka14 wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

I am seeing lots of generalizations, and few facts. It's easy to proclaim something, but without actual information to back up the claims, there's not very much substance to the argument. Such discussions become increasingly irrelevant.

I am dismayed by the contentious tone of the discussion, I wish the matter could be discussed in a civil way, but perhaps that is a vain hope. I believe the topic is important to discuss, but such topics are best discussed dispassionately. Name calling does not further a discussion in any way, it only reinforces entrenched positions and blocks any opportunity to influence another's viewpoint.

The question remains: What does ANY of this have to do with Jacob?

It has nothing to do with jacob or mass effect. Racists have taken over this thread.

Modifié par 2papercuts, 30 avril 2010 - 02:40 .

[Polka14]

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

I like how characters like Samara, a one note character is considered "INteresting"

One-note is fine if it is a compelling note. Jacob just doesn't have a compelling note.

Samara is entirely predicatable.  Completely lawful stupid.  With how she is presented you can pretty much predict everything she says and how she reacts.

Samara and jacob both have interesting backstories but they are hesitant to reveal them.  I think both characters are interesting. Jacob is a man that saved the council, a captain of his own ship and a powerful soldier/biotic. Samara is a powerful biotic and is a justicar. She kills her enemies by snapping their necks. Great. Now this thread is going to be about Samara.

[Onyx Jaguar]

Polka14 wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

I like how characters like Samara, a one note character is considered "INteresting"

One-note is fine if it is a compelling note. Jacob just doesn't have a compelling note.

Samara is entirely predicatable.  Completely lawful stupid.  With how she is presented you can pretty much predict everything she says and how she reacts.

Samara and jacob both have interesting backstories but they are hesitant to reveal them.  I think both characters are interesting. Jacob is a man that saved the council, a captain of his own ship and a powerful soldier/biotic. Samara is a powerful biotic and is a justicar. She kills her enemies by snapping their necks. Great. Now this thread is going to be about Samara.

Or I could bring up how Thane while he is interesting is 100% pointless.  Firstly he is an assassin, this is a team mission of Commando's why the **** would you pick up an assassin, bloody silly fantasy archetype.  Plus the content of his missions is a detriment to the overall game.  And he has no real use.  And he is just another biotic, and he is just another sniper.  

After one playthrough I was like, ok he's kind of cool.  After 5 more my opinion of Thane is that he is the most pointless character in the game, with absolutely no use.  They should have axed him and just made Joker an LI.

[katjajett]

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

I like how characters like Samara, a one note character is considered "INteresting"

One-note is fine if it is a compelling note. Jacob just doesn't have a compelling note.

Samara is entirely predicatable.  Completely lawful stupid.  With how she is presented you can pretty much predict everything she says and how she reacts.

New person jumping in. Yes, she is predictable,  but she has an appeal that Jacob doesn't, she's a justicar. Someone wrote that Jacob is the average guy on the Normandy, its true and why no one really cares about him. I liked his loyalty mission better then half the squad, but that's as far as my interest went because he was so normal. People don't want to hang out with the average joe in a game unless he's doing something interesting.

[Darkhour]

Polka14 wrote...

Okay smart man. What is a "white person" and why are all of them without exception racist. If they are all hopelessly racist, maybe they should all be gunned down. If they wrote a social contract, who wrote it? and when?
Morphology/geneology are biological but do not equal race? What is race then?

A white person is a person who considers themselves white and who is considered white by a substantial number of other persons who classify themselves as white and who general function as white in all areas of people activities.

Race is Race-ism. There can be no racism without race. Race being a system of thought, speech and action operated by people who classifiy themselves as white who use deceit, violence and/or the threat of violence, to subjegate, use and/or abuse people classified as non-white in one or more areas of people activity (education, labor, sex, etc.) in order to maintain, expand and/or refine the practice of white supremacy. White supremacy being the direct or indirect subjugation of all non-white people by white people, for the basic purpose of pleasing and/or serving any and all white persons at all times, in all places, in all areas of activity including economics, education, entertainment, labor, law, politics, religion, sex and war.

The "white race" is the only race in the known universe. The white supremacists are the race. White supremacy is the only form of functional racism in the known universe.



Who "wrote a social contract"? I have no idea what you are talking about.

[Masticetobbacco]

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

Polka14 wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

I like how characters like Samara, a one note character is considered "INteresting"

One-note is fine if it is a compelling note. Jacob just doesn't have a compelling note.

Samara is entirely predicatable.  Completely lawful stupid.  With how she is presented you can pretty much predict everything she says and how she reacts.

Samara and jacob both have interesting backstories but they are hesitant to reveal them.  I think both characters are interesting. Jacob is a man that saved the council, a captain of his own ship and a powerful soldier/biotic. Samara is a powerful biotic and is a justicar. She kills her enemies by snapping their necks. Great. Now this thread is going to be about Samara.

Or I could bring up how Thane while he is interesting is 100% pointless.  Firstly he is an assassin, this is a team mission of Commando's why the **** would you pick up an assassin, bloody silly fantasy archetype.  Plus the content of his missions is a detriment to the overall game.  And he has no real use.  And he is just another biotic, and he is just another sniper.  

After one playthrough I was like, ok he's kind of cool.  After 5 more my opinion of Thane is that he is the most pointless character in the game, with absolutely no use.  They should have axed him and just made Joker an LI.

thane and samara should have been combined into one character

[Onyx Jaguar]

Masticetobbacco wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

Polka14 wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

I like how characters like Samara, a one note character is considered "INteresting"

One-note is fine if it is a compelling note. Jacob just doesn't have a compelling note.

Samara is entirely predicatable.  Completely lawful stupid.  With how she is presented you can pretty much predict everything she says and how she reacts.

Samara and jacob both have interesting backstories but they are hesitant to reveal them.  I think both characters are interesting. Jacob is a man that saved the council, a captain of his own ship and a powerful soldier/biotic. Samara is a powerful biotic and is a justicar. She kills her enemies by snapping their necks. Great. Now this thread is going to be about Samara.

Or I could bring up how Thane while he is interesting is 100% pointless.  Firstly he is an assassin, this is a team mission of Commando's why the **** would you pick up an assassin, bloody silly fantasy archetype.  Plus the content of his missions is a detriment to the overall game.  And he has no real use.  And he is just another biotic, and he is just another sniper.  

After one playthrough I was like, ok he's kind of cool.  After 5 more my opinion of Thane is that he is the most pointless character in the game, with absolutely no use.  They should have axed him and just made Joker an LI.

thane and samara should have been combined into one character

I agree

[Onyx Jaguar]

katjajett wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

I like how characters like Samara, a one note character is considered "INteresting"

One-note is fine if it is a compelling note. Jacob just doesn't have a compelling note.

Samara is entirely predicatable.  Completely lawful stupid.  With how she is presented you can pretty much predict everything she says and how she reacts.

New person jumping in. Yes, she is predictable,  but she has an appeal that Jacob doesn't, she's a justicar. Someone wrote that Jacob is the average guy on the Normandy, its true and why no one really cares about him. I liked his loyalty mission better then half the squad, but that's as far as my interest went because he was so normal. People don't want to hang out with the average joe in a game unless he's doing something interesting.

I don't see why someone would hang out with Samara.  The only reason I talked to her was because I was interested in her backstory which is probably true of most people playing the game.  Other than that there is nothing in her personality that makes her more intersting than Jacob or Miranda.

[Darkhour]

Polka14 wrote...

So by your logic Darkhour, a "white" person can be anyone. Does that not mean that "white" people do not actually exist at all?

Racism definitely exists so it is not possible that white people, and by extension White supremacy, don't exist.

[katjajett]

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

katjajett wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

I like how characters like Samara, a one note character is considered "INteresting"

One-note is fine if it is a compelling note. Jacob just doesn't have a compelling note.

Samara is entirely predicatable.  Completely lawful stupid.  With how she is presented you can pretty much predict everything she says and how she reacts.

New person jumping in. Yes, she is predictable,  but she has an appeal that Jacob doesn't, she's a justicar. Someone wrote that Jacob is the average guy on the Normandy, its true and why no one really cares about him. I liked his loyalty mission better then half the squad, but that's as far as my interest went because he was so normal. People don't want to hang out with the average joe in a game unless he's doing something interesting.

I don't see why someone would hang out with Samara.  The only reason I talked to her was because I was interested in her backstory which is probably true of most people playing the game.  Other than that there is nothing in her personality that makes her more intersting than Jacob or Miranda.

Non of the interactions with the characters went that deep in ME2.

[Onyx Jaguar]

katjajett wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

katjajett wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

I like how characters like Samara, a one note character is considered "INteresting"

One-note is fine if it is a compelling note. Jacob just doesn't have a compelling note.

Samara is entirely predicatable.  Completely lawful stupid.  With how she is presented you can pretty much predict everything she says and how she reacts.

New person jumping in. Yes, she is predictable,  but she has an appeal that Jacob doesn't, she's a justicar. Someone wrote that Jacob is the average guy on the Normandy, its true and why no one really cares about him. I liked his loyalty mission better then half the squad, but that's as far as my interest went because he was so normal. People don't want to hang out with the average joe in a game unless he's doing something interesting.

I don't see why someone would hang out with Samara.  The only reason I talked to her was because I was interested in her backstory which is probably true of most people playing the game.  Other than that there is nothing in her personality that makes her more intersting than Jacob or Miranda.

Non of the interactions with the characters went that deep in ME2.

Yes, and I would not put Samara above Miranda or Jacob just because the Justicar are interesting in what they do.  I thought this was a debate on character.