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Differences between the ME1 and ME2 companions


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#101
smudboy

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brain_damage wrote...

Is it me, or are the characters in ME2 too over the top? The ones in Mass Effect were more...normal, more realistic, more down to earth and IMO they were deeper. The ones in ME2 are a ragtag bunch of misfits - they're more like a traveling circus. For example - once, a developer from Obsidian Ent. said that in Alpha Protocol they used a Kill Bill test - If a character fits in Kill Bill, that's probably too over-the-top. Ashley can pass, Jack and Mordin certainly can't.
What I'm trying to say is that I liked the characters and character interaction in ME1 better - communicating with the characters was certainly easier and they were more believeable. Why is everything so different in ME2?


They are only over the top when you look at CutscenePowerToTheMax

Other than that, they're some of the most "real" and "human" characters in video gaming.

#102
Collider

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jtav wrote...

kraidy, you might want to tone it down a little.

As I said, I found the ME2 team generally superior, probably because of the increased insight via the loyalty missions and better animations.

I felt the same. I felt much more connected to the characters because I, like you said, got an insight into them with the loyalty missions as well as the recruitment missions. The romances then feel more emotional to me, as their is that element of trust and mutual cooperation, you feel like you've invested something into the character you are romancing.

But really, ME is a more "realistic" game and ME2 is closer to a comic book. You might as well compare Saving Private Ryan to The Dark Knight.

??? I didn't see like this at all.

By the way, this entire thread can be summed up as follows:
People whose favorite romance is in ME1 = ME1 squad is better
People whose favorite romance is in ME2 = ME2 squad is better
Basically.

#103
Onyx Jaguar

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Smudboy wins the thread

#104
ratzerman

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Skilled Seeker wrote...

How did this thread get trolled so fast by the Liara fanatics?

We're not fanatics.  We're trolls.
:kissing:

#105
kraidy1117

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TeenZombie wrote...

For me, the difference appeared to be that ME1 squad mates were written for interaction on board the ship, with the romances interspersed through conversations, while the ME2 squad mates were developed mainly to be interacted with during their recruitment mission and loyalty missions, and once they're on the ship, if you are not romancing the characters, their conversation options are extremely limited and boring.

For the people who enjoy ME2 more than ME1, can you honestly tell me that the characters you like in ME2 are just as developed if you are not romancing them, as when you are? I have not romanced any of the ME2 characters, and ME2 feels pretty empty and lonely because of it. Each character's recruitment or loyalty mission may be fun, but they are woefully short, and don't really mesh together into a full story for me. I feel like I'm playing a bunch of DLC packs in ME2, with the story mashed into the beginning and end, while ME1 flowed as a whole more cohesively.

It may be a matter of opinion, but it's a fact that you are shut out of a lot of dialogue with squad mates in ME2, if you are the wrong sex or not romancing them. It's sad when hanging out with Joker in the cockpit was more stimulating than entire dialogue trees with my squad.


Legion and Mordin where all better then the characters in ME. Miranda, Jack and Garrus had the best romance in the ME universe. Also what I find funny is that people always bring up the less dialog. If you don't romance Liara you only get three conversations. Kaidan and Ashley while had alot of dialog was not realy intresting IMO. The non LI where alot more intresting. In ME2 we have Mordin and Legion, two fantastic characters. We have Miranda, Jack and Samara who have fantastic character dev. We have two old favs from ME and even tho they have less dialog then normal, both there missions kinda make up for it. We then have Grunt which might find funny to some but I loved the character because he was not complex. We have alot of complex characters in ME2, but Grunt was refreshing and I loved it. Thane was ok in my books, I just wished they would have gave him more dev. The only characters that I hated was Jacob and Zaeed.

Also just to bring this up, it was the same as DAO. You get more dialog if you are romancing characters. Bioware always does that. I just found the characters alot more intresting then ME and the funny thing is I did not even like the lI from the first ME.

#106
GodWood

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Collider wrote...
By the way, this entire thread can be summed up as follows:
People whose favorite romance is in ME1 = ME1 squad is better
People whose favorite romance is in ME2 = ME2 squad is better
Basically.



#107
JeanLuc761

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Onyx Jaguar wrote...

Smudboy wins the thread

This, bigtime.  

#108
Onyx Jaguar

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GodWood wrote...

Collider wrote...
By the way, this entire thread can be summed up as follows:
People whose favorite romance is in ME1 = ME1 squad is better
People whose favorite romance is in ME2 = ME2 squad is better
Basically.



#109
kraidy1117

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smudboy wrote...

brain_damage wrote...

Is it me, or are the characters in ME2 too over the top? The ones in Mass Effect were more...normal, more realistic, more down to earth and IMO they were deeper. The ones in ME2 are a ragtag bunch of misfits - they're more like a traveling circus. For example - once, a developer from Obsidian Ent. said that in Alpha Protocol they used a Kill Bill test - If a character fits in Kill Bill, that's probably too over-the-top. Ashley can pass, Jack and Mordin certainly can't.
What I'm trying to say is that I liked the characters and character interaction in ME1 better - communicating with the characters was certainly easier and they were more believeable. Why is everything so different in ME2?


They are only over the top when you look at CutscenePowerToTheMax

Other than that, they're some of the most "real" and "human" characters in video gaming.


Smudboy, I thought I would never say this, but you are completey right.

#110
syllogi

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Collider wrote...
By the way, this entire thread can be summed up as follows:
People whose favorite romance is in ME1 = ME1 squad is better
People whose favorite romance is in ME2 = ME2 squad is better
Basically.


Yup, but as I said in my post, if you're doing a faithful or no-romance run of ME2, you miss out on a huge chunk of character interaction.  People somehow got to know and love Tali, Garrus and Wrex well in the first game without having sex with them, but that's impossible now.  It's really not the fault of ME1 fans that they are punished, basically, for wanting to continue the relationship with their original LI, by missing out on dialogue in ME2.  Can anyone tell me what incentive there is to care about characters who only talk to you once or twice the entire game, outside of their recruitment and loyalty quests?

#111
Guest_Shavon_*

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GodWood wrote...

Collider wrote...
By the way, this entire thread can be summed up as follows:
People whose favorite romance is in ME1 = ME1 squad is better
People whose favorite romance is in ME2 = ME2 squad is better
Basically.


And those of us who like some of both get completely ignored :wizard:

#112
kraidy1117

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TeenZombie wrote...

Collider wrote...
By the way, this entire thread can be summed up as follows:
People whose favorite romance is in ME1 = ME1 squad is better
People whose favorite romance is in ME2 = ME2 squad is better
Basically.


Yup, but as I said in my post, if you're doing a faithful or no-romance run of ME2, you miss out on a huge chunk of character interaction.  People somehow got to know and love Tali, Garrus and Wrex well in the first game without having sex with them, but that's impossible now.  It's really not the fault of ME1 fans that they are punished, basically, for wanting to continue the relationship with their original LI, by missing out on dialogue in ME2.  Can anyone tell me what incentive there is to care about characters who only talk to you once or twice the entire game, outside of their recruitment and loyalty quests?


Well they where not LI in that game and Garrus dialog for female Shepard would be kinda creepy. Same as Tali if saying she wants him. LI should have more dialog and look at Liara, if you don't romance her you miss out on alot of stuff about her. DAO did it with more dialog and so did ME2, but I do still wished they would have gave Garrus and Tali more dialog, but there missions made up for it.

#113
SithLordExarKun

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Dinkamus_Littlelog wrote...

kraidy1117 wrote...
*sad and pathetic and majorly off topic troll post*


Stop trolling kraidy. This is about the OPs opinion that ME1 executed the squad better than ME2, not about your quote mining and trolling skills.

LOL you're asking him to stop trolling when you started trolling in the first place? You are probably the worst hypocrite i have seen on these forums and probably the most obsessive and mentally disturbed one that thinks his opnions are universal.

#114
Mahlerian

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Shavon wrote...

Seriously why can't you guys avoid personal attacks? is it too hard? I fyou don't like a post, or the way someone responds to you, then ignore it! Gawd . . .

Anyway, I think there were ME squadmates from both games that were 'developed' better than other ones, but much of this is preference, too. Garrus and Tali in ME1 were very well written, and I think the same holds for Tali in ME2, but Garrus, not so much. That's sad, really, because unless you romance him, he's too busy calibrating. :( That's why I don;t think heor a few others were developed well. There was so much more they could have done with his character. Same with Liara in her cameo. Another favorite, beloved character turned so many off because she was poorly developed in ME2. Just because her character gets a role in a comic book doesn't mean that they get to skimp her cameo like that.

On the flipside, some characters were done very well. Thane, Samara, Mordin, and Miranda come to mind.


That is logical. Someone may legitimately disagree about Garrus or something (I personally think you're right), but it makes sense that people like more characters from one game or the other better, and that doesn't mean one game's characters are awesome or the other's suck. (And I certainly agree that personal attacks are unnecessary, and I'm sure I'm not the only one.)

#115
JeanLuc761

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kraidy1117 wrote...

TeenZombie wrote...

Collider wrote...
By the way, this entire thread can be summed up as follows:
People whose favorite romance is in ME1 = ME1 squad is better
People whose favorite romance is in ME2 = ME2 squad is better
Basically.


Yup, but as I said in my post, if you're doing a faithful or no-romance run of ME2, you miss out on a huge chunk of character interaction.  People somehow got to know and love Tali, Garrus and Wrex well in the first game without having sex with them, but that's impossible now.  It's really not the fault of ME1 fans that they are punished, basically, for wanting to continue the relationship with their original LI, by missing out on dialogue in ME2.  Can anyone tell me what incentive there is to care about characters who only talk to you once or twice the entire game, outside of their recruitment and loyalty quests?


Well they where not LI in that game and Garrus dialog for female Shepard would be kinda creepy. Same as Tali if saying she wants him. LI should have more dialog and look at Liara, if you don't romance her you miss out on alot of stuff about her. DAO did it with more dialog and so did ME2, but I do still wished they would have gave Garrus and Tali more dialog, but there missions made up for it.

They do have a point; A few simple rewordings and an extra recording session would have ensured you got roughly the same amount of dialogue whether you romanced them or not.  

Example, Garrus says "You're the only friend I've got in this galaxy."  Why should he only say that to his romance?  

#116
jlb524

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TeenZombie wrote...

Collider wrote...
By the way, this entire thread can be summed up as follows:
People whose favorite romance is in ME1 = ME1 squad is better
People whose favorite romance is in ME2 = ME2 squad is better
Basically.


Yup, but as I said in my post, if you're doing a faithful or no-romance run of ME2, you miss out on a huge chunk of character interaction.  People somehow got to know and love Tali, Garrus and Wrex well in the first game without having sex with them, but that's impossible now.  It's really not the fault of ME1 fans that they are punished, basically, for wanting to continue the relationship with their original LI, by missing out on dialogue in ME2.  Can anyone tell me what incentive there is to care about characters who only talk to you once or twice the entire game, outside of their recruitment and loyalty quests?


+1

But, people don't get that.    As I said, the individual characters in ME2 are interesting, but they don't talk to you much outside of romance.  The whole thing feels 'meh' b/c of this.  It's just poor execution.

#117
Collider

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TeenZombie wrote...
Yup, but as I said in my post, if you're doing a faithful or no-romance run of ME2, you miss out on a huge chunk of character interaction.  People somehow got to know and love Tali, Garrus and Wrex well in the first game without having sex with them, but that's impossible now.  It's really not the fault of ME1 fans that they are punished, basically, for wanting to continue the relationship with their original LI, by missing out on dialogue in ME2.  Can anyone tell me what incentive there is to care about characters who only talk to you once or twice the entire game, outside of their recruitment and loyalty quests?

Why does it have to be outside of their recruitment and loyalty quests? Those missions are precisely why we are so invested in them, because we are getting a direct insight into their character and history. It's not once or twice the entire game, either. I do think that ME1 was better paced but I don't think ME2 fans are unjustified in caring about the ME2 characters.

#118
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kraidy1117 wrote...

TeenZombie wrote...

Collider wrote...
By the way, this entire thread can be summed up as follows:
People whose favorite romance is in ME1 = ME1 squad is better
People whose favorite romance is in ME2 = ME2 squad is better
Basically.


Yup, but as I said in my post, if you're doing a faithful or no-romance run of ME2, you miss out on a huge chunk of character interaction.  People somehow got to know and love Tali, Garrus and Wrex well in the first game without having sex with them, but that's impossible now.  It's really not the fault of ME1 fans that they are punished, basically, for wanting to continue the relationship with their original LI, by missing out on dialogue in ME2.  Can anyone tell me what incentive there is to care about characters who only talk to you once or twice the entire game, outside of their recruitment and loyalty quests?


Well they where not LI in that game and Garrus dialog for female Shepard would be kinda creepy. Same as Tali if saying she wants him. LI should have more dialog and look at Liara, if you don't romance her you miss out on alot of stuff about her. DAO did it with more dialog and so did ME2, but I do still wished they would have gave Garrus and Tali more dialog, but there missions made up for it.

You still got a bit of dialog though from LI's in ME1 even if you didnt romance them. Ashley for instance will still talk to you about her grandfather, and Kaidan tells you about his time in BAAT. Squadmates in ME2 like Garrus and Miranda had very little dialog if they werent your LI's.

#119
Halmiriliath

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brain_damage wrote...

Is it me, or are the characters in ME2 too over the top? The ones in Mass Effect were more...normal, more realistic, more down to earth and IMO they were deeper. The ones in ME2 are a ragtag bunch of misfits - they're more like a traveling circus. For example - once, a developer from Obsidian Ent. said that in Alpha Protocol they used a Kill Bill test - If a character fits in Kill Bill, that's probably too over-the-top. Ashley can pass, Jack and Mordin certainly can't.
What I'm trying to say is that I liked the characters and character interaction in ME1 better - communicating with the characters was certainly easier and they were more believeable. Why is everything so different in ME2?


*Peeks head into the thread of no return(!) and hopes the thread hasn't been locked by the time he posts this*

An interesting point of view. Something I would like to reiterate, however, from things other posters have said previously on these forums is that things have changed drastically for ol' Shepard in Mass Effect 2. In Mass Effect he/she is part of the mainstream, as it were.  He/she is part of the Alliance and a Council Spectre who has been given full backing in their quest to hunt down Saren, and we thus have a tangible enemy who it seems is within our reach. It also doesn't seem that said mission will likely cost the lives of everyone on the squad in order to achieve their goal. Knowledge of the Reapers is thin on the ground to say the least until our first encounter with Sovereign, but he is the vanguard of your destruction, not the entire Reaper fleet. Knowledge of an entire fleet of them only comes at the end of the first game. 

Contrasting this to Mass Effect 2, we have an enemy almost beyond our comprehension that we are aware from the beginning intend to wipe out all galactic life. We're working for Cerberus - a shady organisation that is actively condemned by the Council, because the leading politicians of the galaxy are trying very hard to forget about the nightmare Shepard probably has every night. We are recruiting a team to go into the Omega-4 relay - where no sapient being hath set foot and returned to tell of their exploits. Who would want to go on such a mission? Not many, given the probability of death. You are thus likely to gather a squad with either nothing left to lose, a death-wish or are one of the very few aware of the severity of the Reaper/Collector threat. Thus, your team is much more likely to be composed of misfits - those not part of the political mainstream, eccentrics, mercenaries etc. And this is what the team is.

That aside, I pretty much like all the characters from Mass Effect 1 and 2. My favourites, some of whom are my favourites from any game, are from both - Tali, Garrus, Legion, Mordin, Wrex, Jack and Thane - and I personally think the accusations of discontinuity between the two games are over-exaggerated. The existential debates I had with Legion, Mordin and Thane were brilliant for me, but may not have been to other's tastes. Ultimately, it all boils down to what you think, and I thought the characters of Mass Effect 2 were great, just as I enjoyed the characters of the first Mass Effect.   

Edit: I started typing this about an hour ago, so this post will have not taken into account more recent posts. Time to catch-up, methinks...

Modifié par Halmiriliath, 12 avril 2010 - 11:41 .


#120
jlb524

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JeanLuc761 wrote...

They do have a point; A few simple rewordings and an extra recording session would have ensured you got roughly the same amount of dialogue whether you romanced them or not.  

Example, Garrus says "You're the only friend I've got in this galaxy."  Why should he only say that to his romance?  


That would have been a nice addition to the non-existent friendship path with Garrus.  I'd feel a deeper connection to the character and probably like him more if there was an option to become friends with him.

#121
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Guys, this is not about Me1 vs. ME2, it's about the characters, development, how well-written they are, etc.

#122
DarthCaine

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Collider wrote...
By the way, this entire thread can be summed up as follows:
People whose favorite romance is in ME1 = ME1 squad is better
People whose favorite romance is in ME2 = ME2 squad is better
Basically.

Not really

I don't really like Tali but she's much better written in ME2 than in ME1 and her romance is far better than any ME1 romance

Wrex and Kaidan were just a bland boring versions of Canderous Ordo and Carth

Mordin and Legion are very memorable characters

Though I prefered Garrus' personality more in ME1

#123
ratzerman

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Shavon wrote...
And those of us who like some of both get completely ignored :wizard:

Hey, that's no fair Shavon.  You're playing both sides. You're like a... a.... a double agent of love!
:lol:

#124
JeanLuc761

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jlb524 wrote...

JeanLuc761 wrote...

They do have a point; A few simple rewordings and an extra recording session would have ensured you got roughly the same amount of dialogue whether you romanced them or not.  

Example, Garrus says "You're the only friend I've got in this galaxy."  Why should he only say that to his romance?  


That would have been a nice addition to the non-existent friendship path with Garrus.  I'd feel a deeper connection to the character and probably like him more if there was an option to become friends with him.

I can agree with you on that.  Bioware should take a page from Dragon Age and enable that level of character interaction in Mass Effect 3 (though I wouldn't say no to DLC that adds more dialogue to ME1 and ME2)

#125
kraidy1117

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Somebody1003 wrote...

kraidy1117 wrote...

TeenZombie wrote...

Collider wrote...
By the way, this entire thread can be summed up as follows:
People whose favorite romance is in ME1 = ME1 squad is better
People whose favorite romance is in ME2 = ME2 squad is better
Basically.


Yup, but as I said in my post, if you're doing a faithful or no-romance run of ME2, you miss out on a huge chunk of character interaction.  People somehow got to know and love Tali, Garrus and Wrex well in the first game without having sex with them, but that's impossible now.  It's really not the fault of ME1 fans that they are punished, basically, for wanting to continue the relationship with their original LI, by missing out on dialogue in ME2.  Can anyone tell me what incentive there is to care about characters who only talk to you once or twice the entire game, outside of their recruitment and loyalty quests?


Well they where not LI in that game and Garrus dialog for female Shepard would be kinda creepy. Same as Tali if saying she wants him. LI should have more dialog and look at Liara, if you don't romance her you miss out on alot of stuff about her. DAO did it with more dialog and so did ME2, but I do still wished they would have gave Garrus and Tali more dialog, but there missions made up for it.

You still got a bit of dialog though from LI's in ME1 even if you didnt romance them. Ashley for instance will still talk to you about her grandfather, and Kaidan tells you about his time in BAAT. Squadmates in ME2 like Garrus and Miranda had very little dialog if they werent your LI's.


Miranda only had  four if you don't romance her, also things like Ashley talking about her grandfather is extended if you are romancing her, same as Kaidan. Liara however brush's you off.

It's the same with ME2 with Miranda her last dialog is extended if you romance her and you get an extra dialog if you are romancing her. Your LI should have more dialog and extanded. It happend in DAO and it happend in ME2.  Also just to point this out Miranda talks about her familly too, no matter what, Garrus still talks about his adventures in Omega ect. The last bit of dialog for a character is romantic and would be realy awakward if Shepard was female and Miranda said maybe I want you to admire me.

It was the same thing with Ashley and Kaidan, tho they had 6, 7 if you romanced them. I am just pointing out that while ME2 did have less dialog, it was not that much and I found there was more dialog in each conversation then in ME, but that's just me.

Modifié par kraidy1117, 12 avril 2010 - 11:31 .