91 réponses à ce sujet

[Zulu_DFA]

Skilled Seeker wrote...

Metagaming sucks. You whimpy cheats who save the council cause you know you will still win should be ashamed of yourselves.

Agreed.

I rewrote the Heretics on the 1st ME2 run, but later desided that it was subconscious "no real harm can come out of it" thing. And replayed to blast the Station. It's safer that way.

Modifié par Zulu_DFA, 15 avril 2010 - 11:12 .

[Massadonious1]

Skilled Seeker wrote...

Metagaming sucks. You whimpy cheats who save the council cause you know you will still win should be ashamed of yourselves.

Meh.

I wanted to save them when I first played ME1, but I thought something even worse would happen if I didn't press the advantage. I certainly didn't expect my tactical choice to have the same outcome as the "Let the dirty bastards die. BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA." option.

[Bebbe777]

Character Background : Spacer
The biggest reason I picked this background was because Shepard would then have a family, something that was missing in the other two backgrounds. And since his family were in navy Shep would already have some advantages in his career (Only wished Hannah Shepard would have accepted the admiral post, and where is his father!?)

Military Background : War Hero
I wanted my Shep to be from the start a hero, a symbol for what the Alliance and humanity stands for. Courage, honor, loyalty. Plus its a nice bonus that he got the "Star of Terra" (The Alliance's Medal of Honor) and renown throughout the Alliance (something I wished was shown more, especially with admirals and Udina)

class : Vanguard/Adept
Once more I wanted my Shep to be a bit special. First I picked Vanguard because it gave me the medium armor and it was a strong balance between a Soldier and an Adept. In ME2 I picked Adept because armor didnt matter anymore and he recieved a heavy weapon later on. It also puts Shepard in a position to help the biotic community that through the years has seen discrimination and abuse. 

Gender : Male
Im male so I always play male and play the characther after how I would act. Plus, I like Mark Meers performance. 

Morality : Paragon
Since I picked War Hero which transforms Shepard into a symbol I wanted to continue on that path. With my Shep I wanted to show humanity and the rest of the universe of what we are capable of. My years with Star Trek influenced this of course. But my purpose was to evolve our species above greed and self-interest. 

The Council : I Saved Them
I saved because of two reasons
1. To keep a unified front in the coming war we need the original council who already knows alot about controlling Citadel space. They have been at this for a long time. 
2. The second reason is also the strongest one. When we saved them we showed them that humanity is ready, that we are able to stand firm no matter what the cost. When we are in a crisis in our prime, we never give up, we advance ourself and fight harder than possible. 
This decision will also grant humanity a great amount of respect and the Council trust Shepard more than any other Council. In time that may probe fruitfull

Human Representative: I picked Anderson, he knows what needs to be done and doesnt think about the potential political ****storm at all times, he is also more diplomatic than the other option. Plus, I would never pick the **** that is Udina. As the Turians say "Udina is a diplomatic incident waiting to happen". 

The Collector Base : Kept It
To give nuclear weapons to cave men can only end in disaster. I felt the same thing about giving something that advanced to humanity that still struggles with greed and imperialism. Especially if it was given to Cerberus, an organisation that will stop at nothing.

Rachni Queen : Shepard is no God and in my book have no right to condemn an entire species to annhilation. Plus, there were evidence that they were indoctrinated and a species cant be condemned because of that, if that is the case then we should condemn every species in the galaxy. 
And it seemed like it payed of. The Rachni have kept for themself and will stand ready to aid the galaxy when the times come. Plus, it was also stated that the Rachni are not imperialistic, they just defend themself. 

Urdnot Wrex : Saved him, Wrex is a great Krogan and now that he is the leader of the Krogan race it will give us some great support. We can have a functional diplomatic relationship with them and Wrex also want to change the Krogan way of life into something better (by our standard of course)

Virmire : Killed Kaidan. Why? Ash was the LI so it was natural. But in the end Kaidan would have been the better option. He was a naval officer that will be needed in the future. Ash is a common soldier that may not have much to contribute but she is resilient and loyal so that counts for something. 

Casulties : Everyone except Kaidan is dead. 

Genophage Data : Kept it, it may come to use if we want to give the Krogan a bit higher birthtrate so they dont die out. Plus, scientific data is always great. 

Heretics : Spared them. By doing this I hope the geth will see that organics can care about them and that we see them as living beings. A potential ally may be come from this. And we also know that it wasnt the main faction of the Geth that attacked which means they still are neutral. 

Samara/Morinth : I chose Samara. Morinth is dangerous and having the loyalty of justicar cant go wrong (as long as you are Paragon ) Anyway, I believe she is more valuable to everyone than Morinth.

Love Interest(s) : Ash at first. I kept to my own species because that felt most right. She has experienced much of the things Shepard has. Military family and all that. But in ME2 after meeting Ash on Horizon I felt the need to break up and pick another one which became Miranda. After getting thru her cold exterior she really was a nice girl, a bit misguided but great. 

[DPSSOC]

Background: Colonist - struck me as the most interesting of the options next to Oliver Twist and Wesley Crusher.
Psyche: Ruthless - After the events on Mindoir my Shepard developed a deep seeded hate for Batarians, no way was he letting any of those bastards get out alive
class: Soldier - Always been one for straight up fights as well as weapon diversity.
Gender: Male - I am myself male and it seems to be going well so far
Morality: Renegon - Kind to my friends, brutal to my enemies, my Shepard usually relies on physical intimidation to get their way but isn't a mindless killer.
Council: Saved - Partly because my Shepard wanted to be able to say "I told you so" but mostly because he felt he had a duty to save the Council.
Councillor: Anderson - After the stunt Udina pulled he's lucky I didn't throw him off that podium, balcony thing.
Collector Base: Kept - You don't throw away a weapon because you don't like what the last guy did with it.
Cerberus: Doesn't trust them but willing to give them a chance at first, meeting with Council and later missions lead to the determination that while distasteful they are necessary.  Eventually becomes sympathetic to the cause (part of his decision to keep the Collector Base)
Feros: Saved the colonists - Ties into Renegon reasoning the colonists are victims in this killing them may be easy but just wrong.  Let Shiala live as well, she aided Shepard when she could have just as easily denied still possessing the Cipher, that allows a small measure of trust.
Noveria: Assisted Gianna, take that you Salarian ******, and released the Rachni Queen.  Aided Gianna because Shepard's big on enforcing the law, with extreme prejudice usually, and let the Rachni go because no third option was given and the decision to wipe out a species is a little over Shepard's head.
Wrex: Talked him down, I had gotten to like Wrex and respected him.  Also understood his position so had to try a peaceful solution.
K.I.A.: Kaidan Alenko, was romancing Ash at the time, allowed personal feelings to influence decision, considerable regret, liked Kaidan.
Casualties: Fist (Wrex killed him), Nobody died on Suicide Mission
Genophage Data: Destroyed it.  While potential of Krogan army to face Reapers was appealing Krogan are ground/shock troops not much help against sentient ships.  Also acknowledged that the Krogan haven't changed that much and projections of war are still accurate.  In time perhaps but they aren't ready yet.
Samara/Morinth: Sided with Samara.  Samara can be trusted, Morinth cannot, furthermore having a succubus running around my ship seems like one of the worst ideas in the long sad history of bad ideas.
Love Intersts:
ME1 - Ashley Williams.  The alien bookworm didn't appeal to me and I really liked Ash.  She's confident, outspoken, and stands by her beliefs.  I also appreciate that rather than simmering over the aliens being on board she was upfront with her concerns (entirely valid concerns by the way).
ME2 - Miranda Lawson.  Ash calling me a traitor on Horizon cut deep and while I understand her feelings and appreciate the email some things just can't be washed away with a few words.  Also really liked Miranda for a lot of the reasons I liked Ash.  Again appreciate her honesty in telling me at the beginning she neither likes nor trusts me (I'm weird that way).

[Nightwriter]

Skilled Seeker wrote...

Metagaming sucks. You whimpy cheats who save the council cause you know you will still win should be ashamed of yourselves.

Why? My first playthrough I took a chance and saved the Council. I didn't know what would happen.

Of course every time after that I did the same thing and stuck with the decision, because I knew I'd made the right call and it would work out.

Anyway, I hate these gamers who seem only to exist to tell other people that they're lesser gamers. For whatever reason they've invented that makes them more of a gamer.

Modifié par Nightwriter, 15 avril 2010 - 03:21 .

[Andrew_Waltfeld]

Nightwriter wrote...

Skilled Seeker wrote...

Metagaming sucks. You whimpy cheats who save the council cause you know you will still win should be ashamed of yourselves.

Why? My first playthrough I took a chance and saved the Council. I didn't know what would happen.

Of course every time after that I did the same thing and stuck with the decision, because I knew I'd made the right call and it would work out.

Anyway, I hate these gamers who seem only to exist to tell other people that they're lesser gamers. For whatever reason they've invented that makes them more of a gamer.

agreed. Sadly, I made the choice move and sacfrised an vauable piece in order to keep most of my pieces in play to trap Soverign.

[DPSSOC]

Nightwriter wrote...

Skilled Seeker wrote...

Metagaming sucks. You whimpy cheats who save the council cause you know you will still win should be ashamed of yourselves.

Why? My first playthrough I took a chance and saved the Council. I didn't know what would happen.

Of course every time after that I did the same thing and stuck with the decision, because I knew I'd made the right call and it would work out.

Anyway, I hate these gamers who seem only to exist to tell other people that they're lesser gamers. For whatever reason they've invented that makes them more of a gamer.

I have nothing against metagaming, we all do it subconciously to some degree or another, I generally don't because my first RPG experience was Dungeons and Dragons with a DM who would literally kill off my character to punish my metagaming.

Now to answer your question of why, many people view games as similar to books and movies in that if one of the characters acts on information you know they don't have it taints the experience.  For example how boring would Return of the Jedi been if before launching the attack on the Death Star one of the Rebel leaders said, "No we need to hold back, the Emperor new about the Bothan spies and fed us false information, the Death Star is fully operational and they're waiting in ambush for our team on the forest moon of Endor."

[Nightwriter]

DPSSOC wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...

Skilled Seeker wrote...

Metagaming sucks. You whimpy cheats who save the council cause you know you will still win should be ashamed of yourselves.

Why? My first playthrough I took a chance and saved the Council. I didn't know what would happen.

Of course every time after that I did the same thing and stuck with the decision, because I knew I'd made the right call and it would work out.

Anyway, I hate these gamers who seem only to exist to tell other people that they're lesser gamers. For whatever reason they've invented that makes them more of a gamer.

I have nothing against metagaming, we all do it subconciously to some degree or another, I generally don't because my first RPG experience was Dungeons and Dragons with a DM who would literally kill off my character to punish my metagaming.

Now to answer your question of why, many people view games as similar to books and movies in that if one of the characters acts on information you know they don't have it taints the experience.  For example how boring would Return of the Jedi been if before launching the attack on the Death Star one of the Rebel leaders said, "No we need to hold back, the Emperor new about the Bothan spies and fed us false information, the Death Star is fully operational and they're waiting in ambush for our team on the forest moon of Endor."

And that's all well and good, but just my presence here on these forums means I am exposed to a great many things I would have otherwise found out on my own, and that quite a few of my experiences were compromised.

I can't help hearing things, and once I know I can resolve a situation a certain way with minimal loss, I can't unhear it. I can't help that my decision making process is now tainted.

Does this make me a bad gamer? That my having certain foreknowledge of the outcomes of events can keep me from making a bad or unnecessary decision I would have made otherwise? Does it make people who went ahead and made these bad or unnecessary decisions anyway better gamers than me? Does it make it right when they disdain my metagaming and act like they have better gaming principles than me? I always want to save people, and when I know I can I can't not act on that knowledge, like some people.

My problem and flaw is that I have a hard time not pointing out to these people that their decisions involved pointless loss of life, pointless sacrifice, great damage. I can't as easily dismiss the knowledge that it didn't need to happen.

Modifié par Nightwriter, 15 avril 2010 - 04:27 .

[Nightwriter]

Shandepared wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...


Does this make me a bad gamer?

No, it makes you a bad roleplayer.

Ha. More judgment.

I like roleplaying, and I do it often. I just find I do it better in games whose forum community I don't belong to.

[DPSSOC]

Nightwriter wrote...

DPSSOC wrote...
I have nothing against metagaming, we all do it subconciously to some degree or another, I generally don't because my first RPG experience was Dungeons and Dragons with a DM who would literally kill off my character to punish my metagaming.

Now to answer your question of why, many people view games as similar to books and movies in that if one of the characters acts on information you know they don't have it taints the experience.  For example how boring would Return of the Jedi been if before launching the attack on the Death Star one of the Rebel leaders said, "No we need to hold back, the Emperor new about the Bothan spies and fed us false information, the Death Star is fully operational and they're waiting in ambush for our team on the forest moon of Endor."

And that's all well and good, but just my presence here on these forums means I am exposed to a great many things I would have otherwise found out on my own, and that quite a few of my experiences were compromised.

I can't help hearing things, and once I know I can resolve a situation a certain way with minimal loss, I can't unhear it. I can't help that my decision making process is now tainted.

Does this make me a bad gamer? That my having certain foreknowledge of the outcomes of events can keep me from making a bad or unnecessary decision I would have made otherwise? Does it make people who went ahead and made these bad or unnecessary decisions anyway better gamers than me? Does it make it right when they disdain my metagaming and act like they have better gaming principles than me? I always want to save people, and when I know I can I can't not act on that knowledge, like some people.

My problem and flaw is that I have a hard time not pointing out to these people that their decisions involved pointless loss of life, pointless sacrifice, great damage. I can't as easily dismiss the knowledge that it didn't need to happen.

It doesn't make you a better/worse gamer and vice versa but it's just like fans of certain types of games.  Those who don't metagame occassionally look on those who do as cheaters or poor roleplayers, similarly those who do metagame occassionally look on those who don't as stupid (why make decision x if you know it won't end well).  It's a preference thing and as with anything involving preference there are going to be people on both sides who hold tightly to their preference and criticize those who don't.

As I said I don't metagame (conciously anyway) but I don't criticize those who do, it's not easy to disconnect yourself from the character your controlling and some people can't do it or simply don't want to.  They've made their choice, it's no less valid than my choice, and we can all enjoy the game in our own way.

[Nightwriter]

DPSSOC wrote...

It doesn't make you a better/worse gamer and vice versa but it's just like fans of certain types of games.  Those who don't metagame occassionally look on those who do as cheaters or poor roleplayers, similarly those who do metagame occassionally look on those who don't as stupid (why make decision x if you know it won't end well).  It's a preference thing and as with anything involving preference there are going to be people on both sides who hold tightly to their preference and criticize those who don't.

As I said I don't metagame (conciously anyway) but I don't criticize those who do, it's not easy to disconnect yourself from the character your controlling and some people can't do it or simply don't want to.  They've made their choice, it's no less valid than my choice, and we can all enjoy the game in our own way.

You're very reasonable. I like you. Will you be my friend?

[8erserker]

Who cares about metagaming or not? It's a game. The point of a game is to provide the player with FUN. If Nightwriter has more fun with a little metagaming, it's just as good as Shandepared "role-playing." Games are for FUN, so you play it in a way that is fun.

[Nightwriter]

Jorran Khaar wrote...

Who cares about metagaming or not? It's a game. The point of a game is to provide the player with FUN. If Nightwriter has more fun with a little metagaming, it's just as good as Shandepared "role-playing." Games are for FUN, so you play it in a way that is fun.

Dude... that.... that was beautiful. *sniffles*

You are so righteous.

I nominate this for post of the year.

[Mercuriol]

Character Background: Spacer
Just seemed more interesting than Colonist and Earthborn. It doesn't really do much in the game anyways. It is kind of cool to be able to speak with your mother, and that she's an XO/captain.

Military Background: War Hero
Don't want to be the bad guy. Sole Survivor seemed a bit... tame, if you completely destroy those Thresher's ingame. I don't necesarily want to be the hero, a more 'good commander' option would have been nice too.

class: Vanguard.
Biotics and guns, just seems the coolest option. Long range is resolved by picking Sniper Rifles and even though it's not exactly the strongest class in ME2, CHAAAAAARGE is awesome.

Gender: Male
I'm male. To be fair I find Hale better than Meer, but he'll do. I think he's improved in 2 as well.

Morality: Paragon... with quite a lot of Renegade points as well.
I do what I think is right. Sometimes that means sacrificing civilians for a greater good or to stop a terrorist who would otherwise be free to kill more civs.

The Council: Saved
**** it, I'm not running. Plus saving the Destiny Ascension as the largest ship that was known until the Reapers, seemed a good idea if you would like to destroy the barriers of Reapers. Would have had to kill those Geth ships anyways, might as well have done it while there were still some allies arround.

The Collector Base: It's still there.
Why destroy it really? Destroying it without at the very least studying it first seems like a completely idiotic thing to do, especially when faced with exstinction by machines with superior technology. You know this can make the difference; blowing it up just like that is just stupid.

Rachni Queen: Saved it.
It seemed like it was speaking the truth, and it also appears to be true. Though seriously some characters said 'let the council decide'; THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN THE BEST OPTION.

Zhu's Hope: Saved it.
Why not? Those grenades worked.

Urdnot Wrex: Saved him.
Tried to reason with him; worked. Why not?

Virmire: Killed Kaidan.
He was the tech, so he set up the bomb. He armed it and Ash was with those STG guys, meaning her group was larger than just Kaiden. Sounds reasonable eh?
Also Kaidan was more boring.

Genophage Data: Kept it. Mordin did the right thing if you ask me, but like the Collector base, stuff can always come in handy. For example in the purely hypothetical situation when there's huge machine ships trying to wipe out every organic being.

Heretics: Rewrote them. Whatever Legion said, also sounded reasonable. Besides if those machines now know the truth as well about Reapers, they should logically come to the conclusion that the Reapers won't really keep them arround just like that as well right? Right?

Quarians: Push for peace.
Don't really know yet if this will make a difference, but Legion makes sense. Might as well all try to get along. Better to unite against the reapers.

Samara/Morinth: Samara. Choosing Morinth is just stupid. She's a murderer, and not one that kills bad guys either, she's just crazy.

Casulties: Well... Kaiden and Morinth eh.

Love Interest(s): Liara in ME, Miranda in ME2. I do wonder how this'll play out though. Liara now seems like someone who will use biotic violence to get what she wants. On the other side, she wasn't the one who was complaining in ME either, when you were in a love triangle. Now I just need to convince Miranda.

Modifié par Mercuriol, 15 avril 2010 - 05:07 .

[Nightwriter]

Mercuriol wrote...

Character Background: Spacer
Just seemed more interesting than Colonist and Earthborn. It doesn't really do much in the game anyways. It is kind of cool to be able to speak with your mother, and that she's an XO/captain.

Did you import your spacer character into ME2?

Do they ever address your mother in the second game? You know, and the fact that you should probably tell her you're not dead?

[DPSSOC]

Nightwriter wrote...

DPSSOC wrote...

It doesn't make you a better/worse gamer and vice versa but it's just like fans of certain types of games.  Those who don't metagame occassionally look on those who do as cheaters or poor roleplayers, similarly those who do metagame occassionally look on those who don't as stupid (why make decision x if you know it won't end well).  It's a preference thing and as with anything involving preference there are going to be people on both sides who hold tightly to their preference and criticize those who don't.

As I said I don't metagame (conciously anyway) but I don't criticize those who do, it's not easy to disconnect yourself from the character your controlling and some people can't do it or simply don't want to.  They've made their choice, it's no less valid than my choice, and we can all enjoy the game in our own way.

You're very reasonable. I like you. Will you be my friend?

Have to be reasonable, I'm Canadian.  If we stop being reasonable then we're just Americans. (I kid of course)

[Mercuriol]

Nightwriter wrote...

Did you import your spacer character into ME2?

Do they ever address your mother in the second game? You know, and the fact that you should probably tell her you're not dead?

Well... she sends you an e-mail, complaining you haven't contacted her. There's also a news message on Omega/Citadel that she was going to be promoted to admiral, but that she denied the offer.

Modifié par Mercuriol, 15 avril 2010 - 05:14 .

[Chuvvy]

ME1

Name: German Shepard
Reason: If your names not German Shepard then your doin' it wrong.
Pre-service record: Earthborn
Reason: I am also from Earth.

Pysche profile: War Hero
Reason : I don't know I think I closed my eyes and picked one
Gender: Male
Reason I also have a penis. Not in addition too a vagina. That'd be weird allthough not unheard of. Oh Agent Orange.
class: Infiltrator
Reason That is one sexy rifle.
Morality: PARAGADE
Because your a naive child if your Paragon and a douche bag if your Renegade.
Crewmember saved: Kaiden
Ashly's personality rhymes with word itch. Kaidens personalty rhymes with the name arth. Equabad
Wrex Status: Live.
Reason Wrex is a true bro. He's the only one that's happy to see you in ME2. Well Joker is but that crippled bastard better be. I died because of him
LI: Liara
Hawt.
Rachni Status: Live
Reason: Why would I kill them?
Council: saved
It's a game the bad guy's won't win because you saved the Council. I might let them die if it didn't get replaced with an all human council. That makes no sense. It seems like they'd have a few back up council members.
Human Counciler: Anderson
**** you Udina, your almost as bad as Eric Sparrow. **** I rage just thinking about that ******. FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU-

ME2

LI:NA
Didn't like any of them. Well I liked Samara, but not an LI almost one.
Attitude towards Cerberus: Indifferent.
I don't care what you do. Just don't mess with my bro's (Lee John Lii Wrex and Garrus)
Heritics- Rewrote
Reason: 3 runtimes favored it over destruction.
Specter status: Not one
Reason: "Ahh yes" He's also almost as bad as Eric Sparrow. I hate that guy so much.
Collector Base: Blew up
Rational Reason: "Your civilization is based on the technology of the Mass Relays. Our technology. By using it your society develops along the paths we desire." - Nazara.
Main Reason: Nothing bad will happen because those Paragon points popped up. If those weren't in there I might keep it because. It's kinda stupid to blow it up. It's also kinda stupid to keep it.
Crew Status:Live
Reason:???
Squad Status:All but one alive.
Reason: Not a huge fan of Tali
Cerberus status: Not so hot.

Modifié par Slidell505, 15 avril 2010 - 05:34 .

[Nightwriter]

Mercuriol wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...

Did you import your spacer character into ME2?

Do they ever address your mother in the second game? You know, and the fact that you should probably tell her you're not dead?

Well... she sends you an e-mail, complaining you haven't contacted her. There's also a news message on Omega/Citadel that she was going to be promoted to admiral, but that she denied the offer.

Oh, cool. Thanks.

Well, at least they try to address it properly. Not like with Akuze.

[The Governator]

OP, your Geth heretic answer made no sense given your responses to other questions.  Wrex was mad that his people would lose their chance at replenishing their population and you kill him for it.  The geth have been trying to kill you throughout ME1 but because of one SINGLE encounter with a geth that did not kill you, suddenly you are willing to believe that all of them are worth saving?  Sorry, it just don't wash.

[FredThePhoenix]

Shandepared wrote...

No, it makes you a bad roleplayer.

I love Mass Effect, but I don't roleplay anything really important at the end of the day. I do the missions, and I take the decisions depending on what I would do versus how it's only a game and how it will proceed the future storyline. For example, let's say I go to Chora's Den in Mass Effect 1 to know where the meeting with Tali is. I would have killed Fist myself, simply because it eliminates many problems. But the game gives you something if you let him go free (more content in Mass Effect 2 since you see him). So even with a Renegon character, I let him go.

It's mostly the same with bigger decisions. These choices aren't really what I expected them to be. During the Battle of the Citadel, I think the most logical decision was to 'let the Council die' and concentrate on Sovereign since it's the biggest threat and since a galaxy is at stake. You also don't know if that it doesn't matter since the Alliance/Shepard destroys Sovereign anyway, so it's better to save the Council. In Mass Effect 2, you don't even get to meet the new Council if you killed the first one. Better content to keep everything in Mass Effect, that's my thoughts on this.

Realistically, most of the time, I'd kill visible threats, but I know most of them wouldn't be replaced by anything else (Council, Rana, Fist, Helena, etc), so I use that knowledge on how these games works to make the best decision. The one that will keep as much content as possible in the future games.

And as for Roleplay, I myself find it a total loss of time to roleplay Shepard eating, showering and going to the toilet.