340 réponses à ce sujet

[Aeropostle]

I think gaming companies need to be reported to the Better Business
Bureau. There is absolutely no accountability by them whatsoever. IF
they CHOOSE to fix a game they released half-****ed, then we're supposed
to be happy with that. There needs to be some organization that
watches over these companies to make sure the games are tested and
market-ready. Because, obviously, the companies don't police themselves
for the most part. So we, as gamers, have come to expect that with our
hard-earned dollars, a game could very well be a piece of sh!t, which
many of them are. At best, they are 90% complete when they are
released. Now, with the amount of hardware out there, I'm willing to
give them a little bit of a break, but bugs in this game that are so
obvious across the board that are addressed with the attitude of  "they'll get
fixed when we get around to it" is absolutely ridiculous. Especially
when we can't return them for a refund.  Which, if I could, I would
return this piece of crap game. Good companies will admit a mistake,
apologize and fix it as soon as possible.  We've seen none of that from Bioware.

Bioware, these are
MAJOR bugs that should not only have been caught before the game went
out the door, but fixed the next day or the next week at the latest.
Your customer service is absolute crap. I play an mmo and as soon as a
major bug is tagged, it is fixed. Usually the next day at the latest.
What do you think would happen if you were a hardware store and sold a
lawnmower that was known to have problems, and was only 50 - 90%
complete? The owner would take it back to get his/her money back. Now
say that store refused to do that. All hell would break loose, and
you'd be on the 6:00 news that evening.  Somehow, you get you get away
with this on an almost daily basis.

I love PC games, and
Bioware's games in particular, but this is just ridiculous and taking
waaaay to long to address. It's time we gamers hold these companies
accountable with our dollars, and let them know we aren't going to lie
down and take it.  Marketing half-arsed games as complete just to get our dollars and run with them should not be the norm.  We, as consumers, accepting on good faith that the games we bought with our hard-earned dollars should be the norm.  Getting them at less than 100% which they almost always are should not be the norm.  Not ever getting them 100% fixed in a timely manner should not be the norm.

FYI, Bioware, I am calling the national BBB, and I am also contacting national news stations to see if there is any interest in a story in which consumers are getting ripped off.  Finally, I am not buying another one of your games (and I usually don't buy any others) unless I can be assured through research it is playable without major, game-killing bugs which Awakening certainly has.   Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me.

[yasuraka.hakkyou]

I do agree that Bioware's ridiculous on the whole bug-fixing front, at least.

[Rendar666]

Is this another one of those "Making fun of the whining douche bag" threads? Or are you actually one of said whining douche bags?



Hmmm.

[Aeropostle]

Not whining, acting. I've already contacted the national BBB and filed a complaint. On Monday, it's searching for a reporter interested in this story. You can continue to sit on your arse, take it, and make smart arse comments. You obviously feel you're not worth paying attention to, so I won't pay any further attention to you either.

[TheMadCat]

Hehe, Better Business Bureau, one of the most useless organizations in the world.

Anyways, just so you're aware there is a very powerful group out there already policing developers and publishers, they're called the consumers. You see, without these consumers on your side you make no money, and as a company if you're not making money you either need to change or you go down with your dignity. And that is all the industry needs, a shoddy product is in no way physically or mentally harmful, there is no risk for any longterm damage. The consumer base is arguably the most powerful entity in the business sector, there is no reason anyone or anything needs to be holding our hand. If you choose to blindly purchase a product without waiting for input from other players and various sites than the only one who can truly be blamed is you. Educate yourself, you have the tools and resources to do so right at your finger tips. There is no reason to lay blame on BioWare or any other company because of your ignorance.

And if you want to get the media involved, you've got to come up with a better story than consumer fraud. This is 2010 man, get with the times we want "real" stories. You want to lay it into BioWare call up Fox News and tell them Dragon Age has homosexual poronography in it or something, that'll get the ball rolling.

[traversc]

TheMadCat wrote...

Anyways, just so you're aware there is a very powerful group out there already policing developers and publishers, they're called the consumers.

Wrong. 

As Mr Mencken said, "no one ever went broke underestimating the taste of the American public." 

The general human population is no more a policing force for large companies than cattle are a policing force for farmers. 

Modifié par traversc, 18 avril 2010 - 01:02 .

[BLOWare]

Dude, I can deal with the stupid little glitches in the cinimatics, no game is perfect, hell i think its kinda fun to look for them...  But the fact that the awsomest armor in the game looks like garbage unless your a midget or unless you had the foresight to NOT give this BS company your money buying the warden's keep expansion is totally unacceptable...  If you bought ALL the other DLC and are giving them as much support as possible, you should be rewarded with cooler gear, not screwing up the best, especially conscidering how uber gay most of the armor looks... 

***Edit*** Insults removed. Let's keep it civil, folks.

Modifié par Eurypterid, 18 avril 2010 - 01:20 .

[Eurypterid]

Obviously you're upset, but can you point out these problems? In your entire post, you never once mentioned a specific problem, nor did you post your system specs and whether or not you're running any mods. Some of this information could possibly end being something important and could possibly lead to someone pointing out a solution for you.

Stating that there are 'major bugs' without even bothering to list them is no help to anyone and makes your post little more than a rant and tough to take seriously.

*edit* Oh, and BLOWare: yes, you're allowed to discuss how lousy you think the game is. But you're not allowed to sling insults at other forum members. I suggest reading the rules of conduct before posting further.

Modifié par Eurypterid, 18 avril 2010 - 01:19 .

[TheMadCat]

traversc wrote...

TheMadCat wrote...

Anyways, just so you're aware there is a very powerful group out there already policing developers and publishers, they're called the consumers.

Wrong. 

As Mr Mencken said, "no one ever went broke underestimating the taste of the American public." 

The general human population is no more a policing force for large companies than cattle are a policing force for farmers. 

That's a novel notion, but as with a lot of what Henry Mencken said it isn't reflected in reality. The reality is without the consumer base there is no market, if you drive away your consumer base you lose your market. If BioWare/EA went crazy for the next 5-10 years and constantly did everything terrible and did everything they could to upset the consumer I guarantee you it would be reflected in their numbers. Consumers are idiots, I won't argue that. But every individual has their limits, in this case that limit would be expected quality. If you push more and more over the limit and fall short of what people expect it'll come back to bight you, it's happened before and will happen again.

[Icinix]

Although I don't necessarily agree with your post as a whole.

I do think you've brought up a very interesting point with the Games / Movie / Literature industry. Who does police them from a consumer standpoint?



A product purchased from a hardware store, or even a grocery store, usually has some sort of policy where "If you're not entirely happy with this product, or if this product does not do as it was said to do, we will offer you a full refund or exchange." The three areas I have listed above do not have those sorts of things. I can understand why they don't have them, but it is an interesting area from a consumer rights point of view. If an intellectual property is being sold to consumers to enjoy, and they're not enjoying them, where does the rights for consumer refunds start / end.



Like I said, I don't agree with your post, mainly because I haven't had any of the major issues people have mentioned, but also because I do completely enjoy the games and get hundred of hours of play out of them. But I would like to see some companies answer more to consumers in the area of DRM and poor quality, I have a couple of games here that are unplayable because of bugs and DRM, so a refund or exchange would be fantastic. A patch that fixes these issues would be even better. Refunds / exchanges I don't think should be an issue because the P word is mostly digital downloads these days, not direct copies.

[Khimber]

Eurypterid wrote...

Obviously you're upset, but can you point out these problems? In your entire post, you never once mentioned a specific problem, nor did you post your system specs and whether or not you're running any mods. Some of this information could possibly end being something important and could possibly lead to someone pointing out a solution for you.

Stating that there are 'major bugs' without even bothering to list them is no help to anyone and makes your post little more than a rant and tough to take seriously.

*edit* Oh, and BLOWare: yes, you're allowed to discuss how lousy you think the game is. But you're not allowed to sling insults at other forum members. I suggest reading the rules of conduct before posting further.

Yes more info.  I haven't played Dragon Age in months and just d/l the patch and add-ons to start playing again. Was planning on heading out in about an hour to buy Awakenings.  Is there something I need to know??? 

[Caldarin V]

Eurypterid wrote...

Obviously you're upset, but can you point out these problems? In your entire post, you never once mentioned a specific problem, nor did you post your system specs and whether or not you're running any mods. Some of this information could possibly end being something important and could possibly lead to someone pointing out a solution for you.

Stating that there are 'major bugs' without even bothering to list them is no help to anyone and makes your post little more than a rant and tough to take seriously.

*edit* Oh, and BLOWare: yes, you're allowed to discuss how lousy you think the game is. But you're not allowed to sling insults at other forum members. I suggest reading the rules of conduct before posting further.

A few specific bugs that I've run into-
Sometimes, the ghoul with your character's gear fails to spawn in the Silverite Mines

apparently Sigrun's personal quest is bugged so it won't trigger if you raise her influence at all

Velanna's personal quest doesn't always trigger

If you import a character wearing armor from Warden's keep DLC, you don't have it, but the game freezes your stats (happened to me; my naked character had 30 something armor because he was wearing warden commander plate at the end of awakening... which admittedly is kinda cool, but still a glitch)

this will also happen some times with the manual of focus; you'll have all your gear removed, but your stats will stay the same (essentially allowing for doulbe armor).

I personally enjoyed awakening greatly, was a good story, just had some wrinkles in that made playing difficult at times

Modifié par Caldarin V, 18 avril 2010 - 01:34 .

[Icinix]

Caldarin V - The issue with the Ghoul not spawning with your gear is because Awakening doesn't support gear from the premium add on's (RTO the exception). Before going into the mines, remove things like the Helm of Honnleath (leave it in the keep chest) as that's the most common issue. Once you get out you can get it back from the chest and wear it and shouldn't have any issues.
Importing any character wearing items from Wardens Keep seems to have unusual / different issues for people, best bet is to jump in the prologue and remove any premium content gear before importing.(Awakenings doesn't support them anyway)

Edit : The gear carrying over issue could be causing the issues with the other parts as well.  You might find random encounters don't always trigger properly as well.  Best bet is to only take over Vanilla Dragon Age characters.

Modifié par Icinix, 18 avril 2010 - 01:42 .

[Caldarin V]

okay... can I counter this with something?

I paid 12$ for that DLC, even if I can't use it, I don't think it should mess up the game;

that kind of thing is a glitch

while I understand that there is an ingame way to deal with it, it's avoiding the problem, not fixing it

[Caldarin V]

sorry, those DLCs

[Icinix]

You're probably right, but...

If I could counter your counter with a counter...

There is already numerous threads that contain posts about the issue with DLC not being carried over to the Expansion, so nothing will be gained from posting them all again here. But rest assured, you are not alone in your frustration.

[Caldarin V]

let me counter your counter to my counter with another counter (mauhhhaha)

touche... I've got nothing to say to that actually

[CybAnt1]

Before going into the mines, remove things like the Helm of Honnleath (leave it in the keep chest) as that's the most common issue. Once you get out you can get it back from the chest and wear it and shouldn't have any issues.
Importing any character wearing items from Wardens Keep seems to have unusual / different issues for people, best bet is to jump in the prologue and remove any premium content gear before importing.(Awakenings doesn't support them anyway)

This is misinformation, and has to be corrected.

I can verify for a fact it is NOT just DlC items that trigger the Silverite mines bug. 

Several non-DlC items from Origins can also trigger the bug (IF Equipped; not if in your backpack). 

Essentially, for whatever odd reason, the only way to be sure not to trigger the bug is not to bring any Origins items with you into the mines. Not all Origin items trigger it, but some that are non-DlC do. 

Secondly, sorry, it is not equipment that is affecting the failure of other quests to trigger properly. It is bad scripting. 

Modifié par CybAnt1, 18 avril 2010 - 03:58 .

[Shadowwot]

When I compare the number of bugs in this game compared to most other companies games (I'm looking at you Bethesda) I'd say that Bioware is still better than the industry standard.

[Frank the Running Bugzepel]

Awakening bugs seem more minute when compared with other expansions for example MoTB where you have constant blocks on the original campaign and the expansion is riddled with broken plots and lost meshes. So really I don't have nothing bad to complain plus there are gaming companies that are worse than BioWare so be grateful that BioWare actually has high standards for their products.

[Anyroad2]

I have to agree with the original poster here to some extent. I'm not as disgruntled about the whole deal but it does irritate me.



I think that a product should be released in the best shape that it possibly can be. Completed, polished, checked for malfunctions/bugs whatever then rechecked. If things happen to fall through the cracks, I would think that it would be corrected very quickly as things like this typically lessen the quality of the product.

Seems to me that the ability to patch games is both a blessing and a curse. Sooner a curse than a blessing from my experiences. Patching rarely makes a fine game better, mostly its used to fix screw-ups. I think it allows companies to be sloppy - I mean they can always go back and fix the things they would have if they weren't pushed to meet a deadline or whatever. Patching should be the safety net if things fail, not the support.

[traversc]

TheMadCat wrote...

traversc wrote...

TheMadCat wrote...

Anyways, just so you're aware there is a very powerful group out there already policing developers and publishers, they're called the consumers.

Wrong. 

As Mr Mencken said, "no one ever went broke underestimating the taste of the American public." 

The general human population is no more a policing force for large companies than cattle are a policing force for farmers. 

That's a novel notion, but as with a lot of what Henry Mencken said it isn't reflected in reality. The reality is without the consumer base there is no market, if you drive away your consumer base you lose your market. If BioWare/EA went crazy for the next 5-10 years and constantly did everything terrible and did everything they could to upset the consumer I guarantee you it would be reflected in their numbers. Consumers are idiots, I won't argue that. But every individual has their limits, in this case that limit would be expected quality. If you push more and more over the limit and fall short of what people expect it'll come back to bight you, it's happened before and will happen again.

You're missing the point.  The point is consumers will often willingly accept being screwed.  And not only that, rationalize being screwed to high heaven.  This directly contradicts the ridiculous "pure capitalism is good" model you, and so many others on this board have purported.  When we consumers accept being screwed, we are not a "policing force" as you say, we are not even consumers and this is no longer capitalism.  We are cattle and this is a farmstead.  We, consumers, are being farmed. 

[Astranagant]

Aeropostle wrote...

I think gaming companies need to be reported to the Better Business
Bureau. There is absolutely no accountability by them whatsoever. IF
they CHOOSE to fix a game they released half-****ed, then we're supposed
to be happy with that. There needs to be some organization that
watches over these companies to make sure the games are tested and
market-ready. Because, obviously, the companies don't police themselves
for the most part. So we, as gamers, have come to expect that with our
hard-earned dollars, a game could very well be a piece of sh!t, which
many of them are. At best, they are 90% complete when they are
released. Now, with the amount of hardware out there, I'm willing to
give them a little bit of a break, but bugs in this game that are so
obvious across the board that are addressed with the attitude of  "they'll get
fixed when we get around to it" is absolutely ridiculous. Especially
when we can't return them for a refund.  Which, if I could, I would
return this piece of crap game. Good companies will admit a mistake,
apologize and fix it as soon as possible.  We've seen none of that from Bioware.

Bioware, these are
MAJOR bugs that should not only have been caught before the game went
out the door, but fixed the next day or the next week at the latest.
Your customer service is absolute crap. I play an mmo and as soon as a
major bug is tagged, it is fixed. Usually the next day at the latest.
What do you think would happen if you were a hardware store and sold a
lawnmower that was known to have problems, and was only 50 - 90%
complete? The owner would take it back to get his/her money back. Now
say that store refused to do that. All hell would break loose, and
you'd be on the 6:00 news that evening.  Somehow, you get you get away
with this on an almost daily basis.

I love PC games, and
Bioware's games in particular, but this is just ridiculous and taking
waaaay to long to address. It's time we gamers hold these companies
accountable with our dollars, and let them know we aren't going to lie
down and take it.  Marketing half-arsed games as complete just to get our dollars and run with them should not be the norm.  We, as consumers, accepting on good faith that the games we bought with our hard-earned dollars should be the norm.  Getting them at less than 100% which they almost always are should not be the norm.  Not ever getting them 100% fixed in a timely manner should not be the norm.

FYI, Bioware, I am calling the national BBB, and I am also contacting national news stations to see if there is any interest in a story in which consumers are getting ripped off.  Finally, I am not buying another one of your games (and I usually don't buy any others) unless I can be assured through research it is playable without major, game-killing bugs which Awakening certainly has.   Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me.

DAO works fine and the few significant bugs are missing or improperly working items, and there are mods to fix most of those.

Also implying that any MMOs are anywhere near the quality of a Bioware game.... lmao.

Modifié par Astranagant, 18 avril 2010 - 04:53 .

[traversc]

Astranagant wrote...
DAO works fine and the few significant bugs are missing or improperly working items, and there are mods to fix most of those.

Also implying that any MMOs are anywhere near the quality of a Bioware game.... lmao.

Um yes..  BW has one thing going for them, and that is story and writing.  Everything else: graphics optimization... gameplay.. (lack of) bugs... most MMOs are light years ahead of ahead of BW. 

[hexaligned]

It makes me worry for the success of their mmo, well that and they have no expierience balancing pvp games, and mods aren't going to be around to do their job for them. Tolerating bugs in a game you can't return is one thing, paying money every month to continue playing one is another. I can see it flopping after initial sales very easily.