I think harbinger was a good replacement for saren in ME2. He obviously has some thing for shepard, and him taking control of collectors always makes collector fights more intense, especially on hardcore and insanity when he seems to pop out more often.
Harbinger would actually fit the bill for the face to face antagonist in ME3 as well. Perhaps a more permanent vessel this time would be more interesting, maybe a character we already know or some type of machine like the Saren-husk fellow at the end of ME1.
ME3 Needs a "New" Saren
Débuté par
InStereoWhereAvailable
, avril 18 2010 12:53
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#27
Posté 18 avril 2010 - 01:23
kraidy1117
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Splinter Cell 108 wrote...
Collider wrote...
You can say the fact that he rarely gets angry is part of the reason why he's such a great antagonist or villain. He always has his composure, he always has everything planned out, he's always one step ahead of you. Nearly nothing you can say upsets him.Splinter Cell 108 wrote...
kraidy1117 wrote...
Splinter Cell 108 wrote...
ME2 didn't have a cool villain. Sure there's Harbinger but it's not the same especially when he's not present. That's one of the things I miss about ME1, Saren. However I think Saren is probably irreplaceable and in ME2 it seemed to me like the villain was TIM (at least for paragons) with all his ideas. TIM feels different but just as great as Saren.
I found TIm alot better because through out the whole game you talk to him and you know he knows more then letting on and you are always battling your insitincs (should I trust this man?) Thats why I loved TIM, and why he is one of my fav characters ever in a video game.
I prefer Saren though probably just because he's an alien and we know more about him. TIM is a shady character like the Shadow Broker, Miranda's Father and Mr. Thax. That's what makes him really interesting plus the fact that the only time he gets really angry is at the end if you destroy the Collector Base.
Yes the only thing he didn't plan was that Shepard would double cross him (if you're paragon). Saren was cool because he wasn't really bad he was just a little nuts. Most of the bad things that happened to him happened because he couldn't get over his brother's death. TIM on the other hand, is completely unknown. I want to find out about his past, nobody even remembers his real name.
Both TIm and Saren where fantastic, Bioware took two villien concepts (the tragic villien and the smart, shady person who is always a step ahead) and made two fantastic characters. Saren made me sad after Virmire, we at last find out that he is not acting out of free will, and TIm alkways kept me thinking.
Now while the Genral was lame, i still felt sorry for the poor guy.
The Collectors where so tragic.
#28
Posté 18 avril 2010 - 01:24
Nu-Nu
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Collider wrote...
@Nu-Nu The Reapers are insanely boring though.
Saren wasn't that interesting either, he was hardly in it. I would like the reapers to have more presence but I don't know if I want to be chasing one guy across the universe again when we're suppose to be concerntrating on the reapers.
If we saw a better reactions from victims in me3 it would help. All we got in me2 was a mumbling quarian and an annoyed colonist, their reactions of what happened doesn't really instill fear/anger into you.
I think this time someone should be chasing us, instead of us chasing them, shows up when we don't expect them to. Mix it up a little.
#29
Posté 18 avril 2010 - 01:25
Halmiriliath
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InStereoWhereAvailable wrote...
Not as in resurrection, but in terms of a human scale Big-Bad. While we all know that ME3 will likely culminate in a huge space battle consisting of the Reapers against the collected forces of the galaxy, there has to be a foe that Shepard can fight personally. To use a (sloppy) Star Wars analogy, the Reapers are like giant, sentient Death Stars. Shepard needs a Darth Vader to fight while his allies have the big-space-battle-for-the-fate-of-the-galaxy outside. Saren fit this mold well, giving a face to evil that the Reapers simply cannot provide. He was someone to direct our hatred towards. The Reapers are faceless, giant, metal Space-Cthulhu, and it is more difficult to properly think of them as "The Bad Guys". The Collectors had more of a face than the Reapers. They were a face to hate. An enemy to fight. You can't fight a Reaper on foot. We need a "Vader", or a "Saren" that we can fight, face-to-face. An Embodiment Of Evil.
An interesting idea, but I think a lack of a personal enemy might add an interesting dimension to the concluding chapter of the trilogy. As you said, we can't give a face to a fleet of almost unfathomable beings, but perhaps that could be the point. Perhaps in this instance a quest for a 'bad guy' eludes us, and it boils down to internal squabbles in the formation of a force to resist the Reapers (how it is organised, who organises it etc.) or trying to break through layers of apathy in trying to gather said force. By being unable to anthropomorphise our enemy, we could be fighting the unknown, unsure of whether we are the 'good guys' or they are the 'bad guys', or if these dichotomies are even applicable.
Of course, I could just be talking rubbish (which is nothing new), but otherwise I would like some interaction with the Reapers themselves. They tell us their goals are beyond our comprehension? Try us...
Modifié par Halmiriliath, 18 avril 2010 - 01:32 .
#30
Posté 18 avril 2010 - 01:25
Andrew_Waltfeld
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Sure, the new saren can be yourself.
#31
Posté 18 avril 2010 - 01:26
GothamLord
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Paul freakin Grayson infused with reaper tech with Harbinger piggybacking in his head.
#32
Posté 18 avril 2010 - 01:27
kraidy1117
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GothamLord wrote...
Paul freakin Grayson infused with reaper tech with Harbinger piggybacking in his head.
I would not be surprised if Paul Grayson is a villien in ME3. Look at Acension. They introduce TIm and he had a huge part in ME2.
#33
Posté 18 avril 2010 - 01:30
Xaijin
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NoUserNameHere wrote...
A human face to the Reaper threat would be nice. Plus, it'd give us a cool new villain to put on the box art.
#34
Posté 18 avril 2010 - 01:33
thatguy212
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I know its a stupid idea but why not have the person left on virmire come back all cyborgy and stuff, kinda like picard in star trek becoming locutus
#35
Posté 18 avril 2010 - 01:34
kraidy1117
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thatguy212 wrote...
I know its a stupid idea but why not have the person left on virmire come back all cyborgy and stuff, kinda like picard in star trek becoming locutus
#37
Posté 18 avril 2010 - 01:38
kraidy1117
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GothamLord wrote...
Kraidy beat me to it
If Bioware even pulls that I will be very disapointed.
#38
Posté 18 avril 2010 - 01:40
Splinter Cell 108
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The dead should stay dead. I don't understand why some people want dead characters like Saren and the Virmired person to come back.
#39
Posté 18 avril 2010 - 01:42
kraidy1117
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Splinter Cell 108 wrote...
The dead should stay dead. I don't understand why some people want dead characters like Saren and the Virmired person to come back.
The only person I can see coming back from the dead is Narraza because Bioware can pull a "he uploaded his memories into Harbinger and Harbinger is two reapers" Lame but Bioware could pull that, but Saren is in ash's and Kaidan got blowen up with the nuke.
#40
Posté 18 avril 2010 - 01:46
Andrew_Waltfeld
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Splinter Cell 108 wrote...
The dead should stay dead. I don't understand why some people want dead characters like Saren and the Virmired person to come back.
can't understand it either, but we really do an saren like character in the story. *cough* have it be sheppard *cough*
#41
Posté 18 avril 2010 - 01:47
Gamer Xtreme
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Paul Graysom would be too drugged up to do anything, 90% sure he will die at the end of retribution.
#42
Posté 18 avril 2010 - 01:50
GothamLord
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Did you read the end of the book? He was clean when he threated TIM.
#43
Posté 18 avril 2010 - 01:56
Gamer Xtreme
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I honestly forgot a fair bit, but he is hardly the reliable type. There might be Reaper humans but Graysom will stay in the books.
#44
Posté 18 avril 2010 - 02:05
_Saren Arterius
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Shift the main villainy to the other characters, just like The Illusive Man.InStereoWhereAvailable wrote...
My suggestion? The Illusive Man. Why? Because in my view, it makes sense. TIM is obsessed with power, willing to do whatever it takes to further humanity, which, of course, means Cerberus. Allying with the Reapers seems like something he would do, if only to further his own goals. Perhaps he, as Saren before him, believed himself useful, or strong enough to resist indoctrination.
But what can you expect... from a human?
Modifié par Saren Arterius, 18 avril 2010 - 02:18 .
#45
Posté 18 avril 2010 - 02:13
InStereoWhereAvailable
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Saren Arterius wrote...
Shift the main villainy to the other characters, just like The Illusive Man.InStereoWhereAvailable wrote...
My suggestion? The Illusive Man. Why? Because in my view, it makes sense. TIM is obsessed with power, willing to do whatever it takes to further humanity, which, of course, means Cerberus. Allying with the Reapers seems like something he would do, if only to further his own goals. Perhaps he, as Saren before him, believed himself useful, or strong enough to resist indoctrination.
But what can you expect... from a human?
You can't see it, but I am quivering in fear right now.
#46
Posté 18 avril 2010 - 02:19
GothamLord
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well half the point of the final scene was to show he was turning his life back around. there was nothing to show he wasnt reliable , he was just a red sand addict before. caring about gillian turned him around. hes obviously was a decent cerberus op still, otherwise tim would have gotten rid of him earlier. the next book will determine what happens with him. i still have hope for him to show up in the games.
Gamer Xtreme wrote...
I honestly forgot a fair bit, but he is hardly the reliable type. There might be Reaper humans but Graysom will stay in the books.
#47
Posté 18 avril 2010 - 02:22
_Saren Arterius
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Maybe you're right... maybe there is still a chance for ME3 to -- arrrggghhh ungggggh!InStereoWhereAvailable wrote...
You can't see it, but I am quivering in fear right now.
I'm sorry. Sovereign is too strong.
#48
Posté 18 avril 2010 - 02:33
Ultai
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Saren Arterius wrote...
Maybe you're right... maybe there is still a chance for ME3 to -- arrrggghhh ungggggh!InStereoWhereAvailable wrote...
You can't see it, but I am quivering in fear right now.
I'm sorry. Sovereign is too strong.
You let Sovereign implant you? Are you insane?
#49
Posté 18 avril 2010 - 02:34
InStereoWhereAvailable
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Saren Arterius wrote...
Maybe you're right... maybe there is still a chance for ME3 to -- arrrggghhh ungggggh!InStereoWhereAvailable wrote...
You can't see it, but I am quivering in fear right now.
I'm sorry. Sovereign is too strong.
Fight, Saren! Fight! Don't let Sovereign win! You can end this!
Modifié par InStereoWhereAvailable, 18 avril 2010 - 02:35 .
#50
Posté 18 avril 2010 - 02:43
TheLostGenius
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No, just bring him back to life. I'm sure the Reaper's have his genetic code on file. Just resurrect him.
