70 réponses à ce sujet

[LumpOfCole]

Admit it, you didn't kill Loghain. You let him redeem himself at the very end by slaying the archdemon and completing the dimensional story that the first novel started.

Teary eyed, I am, from seeing the story be shaped this way by my own hands. 

[LumpOfCole]

I can't have been the only Stolen Throne reader on this new forum..

[Novasurge]

No, you aren't. I let him live, but I didn't sacrifice him at the end because I did that deal with morrigan.

I also married the queen so he's my father-in-law, haha.

[Naurhir]

I haven't beaten the game (have 2 armies at my camp, almost have my 3rd), but read both books. I will probably let him live, I enjoyed his character far more than Maric. I hate the whiney ones.

[LumpOfCole]

The way I played my character (romance Leliana to boot!), I couldn't possibly imagine doing the deal with Morrigan. So many things wrong with it! I wish I had her for those final battles though, but the "Summon 12 Mages" button was a nice substitute

[Lightbringer500]

i read the book though disappointed when he betrayed me i did let him redeem himself

[WizardD52986]

i didn't let him redeem himself and sacrificed myself instead.

[DalishRanger]

I read the Stolen Throne and while I think Loghain's a very interesting character whose motivations make a lot more sense if you've read the book, I let Alistair slay him. Just because I know Loghain's background, doesn't mean my Dalish elf does. From his perspective, Loghain was a dangerous enemy who needed to be removed, and Duncan deserved avenging.

[LumpOfCole]

Maric killed Katriel in very similar fashion: full of emotion and passion. I didn't want Alistair living with himself like that. The way he stomped off forever in protest wa not the kind of guy I want at my side slaying the archdemon.

[Xover]

I read both books and I was pissed that Loghain turned on the Grey Wardens. Then throughout the game I wanted to find out why he did it until I realized that I should of seen his paranoia coming from a mile away.



At the End I saved him, and let him sacrifice himself, even though I was mad Alistair acted like such a crybaby at the end, I was mad to let him go. I was wondering what happened to Cailan's half brother and was happy to find out it was Alistair. I wonder if Alistair knows he he half elven.

[LumpOfCole]

Alistair acted like such a crybaby at the end

That's king of the Theirin family trait, I thought. A pushover when it comes to 99.9% of things but when it comes to any sort of betrayal, it's death to the betrayer or become a crybaby for life. I couldn't stand Alistair in that moment, and even decked out in the Juggernaut armor I just let him go.

Now granted Loghain pulled some bad crap leaving us to die but it wasn't a powergrab (Loghain could've had power like that a long, long time ago), it was out of excessive fear for handing the country back to foreigners and the Orlesian occupation all over again.

[Malkavianqueen]

I loved having Loghain in my party...So much. It filled me with joy. I couldn't even be angry with him the whole game...Which really wasn't in character. But oh well. ;P



He was my favorite character in the books...So I let him live. I made the deal with Morrigan and he lived through the final battle too!

[Xover]

I was wondering why anyone would want to impregnate the wench Morrigan so she gives birth to a friggin demon spawn.

[skiwolf7]

Loghain can be saved? dang. Alistair wanted to kill him so bad I let him...

[LumpOfCole]

skiwolf7 wrote...

Loghain can be saved? dang. Alistair wanted to kill him so bad I let him...

Just like Maric killed Katriel? You were such a Loghain about it, jeez.

[jeckaldied]

Before reading the stolen throne, what little we had seen of Loghain in the tower of ishal game play demo made me think he was just a stereo typical jerk. After reading it however, I became a huge Loghain fan boy, he was abrasive, and was not good with people, but he had such a deep love for lord and country, he was even willing to hurt that lord to try to make him a more effective ruler. Even back then, it was clear he had issues with paranoia, and when I first met him outside his tent in game at Ostagar, the dark rings around his eyes and the tiredness in his voice really got me feeling that he was struggling with a lot of things mentally.



Every time he would tell people to 'focus on reality' and 'attend to reality' and to stop being obsessed with tales and legends, I really got the feeling that maybe his choice of words was influenced by a bit of sanity left in him, like maybe at the same time, he was pleading with himself to try to get past his delusions, even if he did not quite realize it himself. The way he got mad whenever someone would question him, his facial expressions when Howe would give him more bad news on the civil war, he looked like he was so burdened with guild and doubt he was a bout to breakdown then and there. I couldn't not spare him at the Landsmeet, he realized what he was doing was wrong in the end, all of it, he was just a soul too loyal to his country to see that delusions and paranoia were replacing his rational thoughts, no doubt aided by Howe, in fact, I blame Howe more so than Loghain for the war, it is implied I think that Howe has been usig Loghain's paranoia for his own gain.

[RazorrX]

I killed him and enjoyed it. I read both Stolen Throne and The Calling.



Loghain only does what suits his agenda. He betrayed Maric and his son. He betrayed Ferelden. The ONLY thing Loghain wants to do is keep the Orlesians out. He is forever scarred from the death/rape of his mother and later the death of his father and friends. He allows that bias to cause him to manipulate his 'freind' Maric and twist him into the leader that He (Loghain) feels is what Ferelden needs. For someone who is supposed to be a great military mind, he cant see the forest for the trees. The blight is not some small thing to take care of later. The plan at Ostigar was His plan. Calian even says so. He planned all along to sacrifce the king and wardens, so that he could make sure Orlais did not get a foothold into Ferelden. What he did would have destroyed Ferelden if it were not for the PC.



He sacrificed Maric's Son because he was willing to have Grey Wardens from Orlais some and help. He outlawed the Grey Wardens because they were not Ferelden loyalists. He was willing to have his own daughter killed because she got along with Orlais.



And he had Maric Kill Katriel.



So he had to die.

[David Gaider]

It's interesting. "He will betray you, each time worse than the last." In my mind, the bigger crime for Loghain is that he kill *Rowan's* son -- but Loghain is definitely capable of that kind of blindness when it comes to doing what he thinks is best.



You're only going to ever get a better understanding of the why's involved in what Loghain did if you get him in the party and speak to him, but ultimately his decision was based on the fact that he didn't believe this was actually a Blight -- *couldn't* believe it, in fact, because if it was it made the witch's prophecy true and thus everything else she said true as well. Including the betrayals. About half-way through the game he realizes he is wrong, but at that point the die is already cast.



Whether this makes what he did villainous (he had obviously already begun to act against Cailan prior to Ostagar) or misguided and too easily susceptible to Arl Rendon's poisonous words is ultimately up to the player's perception.

[LumpOfCole]

I wouldn't describe it as outright villainous - I see what he did as fiercely and maybe almost blindly protect Ferelden from Orlais. As soon as I heard "We're sending in Grey Wardens from Orlais" from Duncan's mouth in the game, I knew Loghain was going to have a pretty sizable problem with that. The way in which Loghain reacted to the situation was extreme, but it came from a place of duty and protection I would like to think. Maybe it makes me the naive one.



Either way, the ending I chose and how it was written was incredible. Thank you.

[Celevra]

Compiling the Stolen Throne and The Calling. Loghain most likely dispised the Grey Warden's, and blamed them for Marics strange departure to the deep roads in The Calling.



I was bummed when Loghain betrayed, like any other reader. But I find it intresting because theirs so many little events that seemed to have influenced the betrayal.

[veryalien]

I almost let Loghain live but not because of all these *good* reasons. It was Allister. I mean the guy really pushed me to just running him through with a sword. Do we have that option btw? If not we should.



I picked letting Allister kill him since that was the only way he'd he even remotely agree to become King.

[LumpOfCole]

Funny side note: I originally planned to have Alistair duel Loghain 1v1 but I never played with him and he got his ass kicked to hell. So I had to battle him as myself. Even then I had to chug some pots, Loghain hits hard.

[MrWakka]

I read the stolen throne, not read the calling yet though.



When i started my play through i went and spoke with him at the start, figuring he would be a big player in the story as a NPC, little did i realize he would turn out to more or less be the main villain. However once his betrayal was set, i was all to happy to kill him at the end. It always amazed me that maric let him get away with the stuff he pulled in the novel to begin with, in the end he got no redemption, he deserved no redemption.



Still, i am intrigued, i'll try and get get him in my party next time and see what he says about it all.

[RazorrX]

David Gaider wrote...

It's interesting. "He will betray you, each time worse than the last." In my mind, the bigger crime for Loghain is that he kill *Rowan's* son -- but Loghain is definitely capable of that kind of blindness when it comes to doing what he thinks is best.

You're only going to ever get a better understanding of the why's involved in what Loghain did if you get him in the party and speak to him, but ultimately his decision was based on the fact that he didn't believe this was actually a Blight -- *couldn't* believe it, in fact, because if it was it made the witch's prophecy true and thus everything else she said true as well. Including the betrayals. About half-way through the game he realizes he is wrong, but at that point the die is already cast.

Whether this makes what he did villainous (he had obviously already begun to act against Cailan prior to Ostagar) or misguided and too easily susceptible to Arl Rendon's poisonous words is ultimately up to the player's perception.

Yep yep.  I really caught that in The Calling.  You could see it at the end.  It made me wonder if perhaps Loghain had Maric removed from this coil as well.  (Last we hear of Maric he is meeting with Orlais).

When he walked away from the planning table I actually thought of that quote from the witch.

I really like how deep the writing is on this.  Everyone gets a different perspective based on playthrough, etc.  I had already gotten my impression of him from the books, so my impression has been colored by that.

I could almost have forgiven him -

but he sold my people into slavery.

So I did the humane thing, I cut his head off and had his daughter put in a tower.  Wish I could have killed her THEN him so that he could see his seed died with him.

But Kudos!  Best written and most fun game I have ever played!

[LumpOfCole]

I would say Loghain had a bigger hand than Maric in shaping Ferelden's fate during the Orlesian War and is a proper hero to Ferelden. To be fair, Maric is a catalyst for some important events in his own right. Plus if there was no Maric, who would be there to love all those elf girls?