87 réponses à ce sujet

[Dudeman315]

Gameplay without lore in an Action/RPG just makes it a Action/PG. Gameplay and lore go hand in hand in RPGs which is why AD&D doesn't have guns and spaceships (gameplay functionality) does not fit into lore (world functionality).

[FlyingWalrus]

Dudeman315 wrote...

I commended ME1 on not using ammo being a great new feature. ME2 's explanation for it's removal was weak at best. Ashley Williams and co whipped Geth ass on Eden Prime with these inferior to Geth weapons, not to mention Shepard's assaults on the Geth strongholds all throughout ME1...

Because the AI in that game is **** at best.

I'm playing through Insanity right now on ME1 and, now that I've sufficiently min-maxed everything, enemies drop like kittens shot with a Desert Eagle. What's even more hilarious is that at Rank 1 in Assault Rifles, I can use the Master Gear AR and get pin-point accuracy with it regardless of my actual investment in the skill! What a joke.

I don't like ME2's explanation about Geth technology much either, but I can see how it works from a certain point of view. It's certainly faster to dump and replace a heatsink in mid-combat than it is to wait for it to cool down, and from a game design perspective it has really helped the game in terms of pace and challenge.

Running out of charges? Use another gun.

Running out of charges on that gun? Learn to aim.

I play a lot of RPGs and F/TPS. This system feels right at home.

Also, in relation to the topic of this thread, the majority of leonid meteors are about the size of a grain. The 'visible bullet' could very well be the sight of friction acting on the fired particle. That's easy enough for anyone to understand, I hope.

[Xapctag]

Hmm. Let's see if I can take a crack at this.

We know that the guns we use in ME supposedly chip off shrapnel from a block of metal, using that as a projectile and accelerating it to speeds high enough to penetrate shields, barriers, armor, and of course skin. The acceleration occurs because of a theoretical mass effect core present in every weapon, similar to the cores used in spaceships which allow FTL travel. (Correct me if I'm wrong at this point)

Now, it's been mentioned that these bullets can be accelerated to such high velocities that the force of created upon impact is equal to the force created by an atom bomb. Even if that was possible we must take into account Newton's Third Law of Motion. Every action must have an equal and opposite reaction. So by firing that gun with a force equal to that of an atom bomb you are effectively blowing yourself up. My point here is that these bullets can be seen due to the fact that generating higher forces would prove to be lethal to the person who wields the firearm.

My second point is that the conventional FTL travel and any subsequent use mass effect cores to achieve FTL velocities usually occur in the vacuum of space. Since most of the shooting Sheapard is doing takes place in environments which contain both an atmosphere and some kind of gravitational force, that force has an effect on the velocity of the projectile. Something that should be moving at or close to the speed of light in a vacuum will be moving slower with the presence of gravity.

Hope any of that makes sense. If not the disregard it for the rambling that it is.

Modifié par Xapctag, 20 avril 2010 - 04:46 .

[BellatrixLugosi]

FlyingWalrus wrote...

Dudeman315 wrote...

I commended ME1 on not using ammo being a great new feature. ME2 's explanation for it's removal was weak at best. Ashley Williams and co whipped Geth ass on Eden Prime with these inferior to Geth weapons, not to mention Shepard's assaults on the Geth strongholds all throughout ME1...

Because the AI in that game is **** at best.

I'm playing through Insanity right now on ME1 and, now that I've sufficiently min-maxed everything, enemies drop like kittens shot with a Desert Eagle. What's even more hilarious is that at Rank 1 in Assault Rifles, I can use the Master Gear AR and get pin-point accuracy with it regardless of my actual investment in the skill! What a joke.

I don't like ME2's explanation about Geth technology much either, but I can see how it works from a certain point of view. It's certainly faster to dump and replace a heatsink in mid-combat than it is to wait for it to cool down, and from a game design perspective it has really helped the game in terms of pace and challenge.

Running out of charges? Use another gun.

Running out of charges on that gun? Learn to aim.

I play a lot of RPGs and F/TPS. This system feels right at home.

Also, in relation to the topic of this thread, the majority of leonid meteors are about the size of a grain. The 'visible bullet' could very well be the sight of friction acting on the fired particle. That's easy enough for anyone to understand, I hope.

you just made me wet.............

[Cascadus]

I'll add in my two cents here, but if lore and gameplay are separated, what's the point of creating all that information regarding weaponry if the game itself doesn't even reflect it? Lore should complement gameplay and gameplay should complement lore, as in be reflected by each other.

Modifié par Cascadus, 20 avril 2010 - 04:59 .

[Massadonious1]

Hey guys, I just learned how to shoot Magic Missles from my hand after sleeping and dreaming about kittens.

[Onyx Jaguar]

BellatrixLugosi wrote...

FlyingWalrus wrote...

Dudeman315 wrote...

I commended ME1 on not using ammo being a great new feature. ME2 's explanation for it's removal was weak at best. Ashley Williams and co whipped Geth ass on Eden Prime with these inferior to Geth weapons, not to mention Shepard's assaults on the Geth strongholds all throughout ME1...

Because the AI in that game is **** at best.

I'm playing through Insanity right now on ME1 and, now that I've sufficiently min-maxed everything, enemies drop like kittens shot with a Desert Eagle. What's even more hilarious is that at Rank 1 in Assault Rifles, I can use the Master Gear AR and get pin-point accuracy with it regardless of my actual investment in the skill! What a joke.

I don't like ME2's explanation about Geth technology much either, but I can see how it works from a certain point of view. It's certainly faster to dump and replace a heatsink in mid-combat than it is to wait for it to cool down, and from a game design perspective it has really helped the game in terms of pace and challenge.

Running out of charges? Use another gun.

Running out of charges on that gun? Learn to aim.

I play a lot of RPGs and F/TPS. This system feels right at home.

Also, in relation to the topic of this thread, the majority of leonid meteors are about the size of a grain. The 'visible bullet' could very well be the sight of friction acting on the fired particle. That's easy enough for anyone to understand, I hope.

you just made me wet.............

Well, this forum can sure be interesting sometimes.

[KenLyns]

Lance Of Longinus wrote...
I would say the Lancer was better, by virtue that I used the Avenger as little as possible for the awful weapon it was.

I think you forgot how horrible the Lancer 1 was in ME1.  Giant reticle that expands after one burst due to heat buildup, slow cooldown, etc. 

The Avenger, Collector AR and Geth pulse rifle are all very similar according to cruz1ale's tests:

http://www.youtube.c...?v=aVC2Uw31KwU 

[Cascadus]

In regards to the above theory, I don't think that works. ME1 demonstrated that gravity has no real effect on the trajectory or velocity of a round coming from a gun (or at least a substantial one), and BW obviously took Newton's Third Law into account when building this kind of weapon, as they explain that the advent of ME fields take care of it, mostly. Bullets fired in areas of gravity travel at the same velocity as one fired on say Luna travel at roughly the same speed, that it is to say, near-instantaneous. If you can understand my rambling at this point, I'll condense my point, your point is kinda negated by the fact ME1's bullet speeds are obviously very, very fast so there's obviously no restriction with this. At least this is what I understand of your point, if I'm wrong, forgive me.



And with the idea of you're simply seeing the friction reacting on the bullet, the person is still damaged when that bullet or drag hits the person, but as stated by the OP and everyone else, a grain-sized bullet would need to go a lot faster to do the damage they seem to do in ME2.



The topic starter and the other people are all in the end nit-picking though. It's kinda annoying, yes, but not glaring.

[GuardianAngel470]

Lance Of Longinus wrote...

I cannot wrap my head around this.
I've been playing ME2, and what I just cannot understand is why the bullets move so slow. This just doesn't make any sense. Bullets in the ME universe have naturally escalated from marble sized rounds propelled at sonic velocities in order to damage a target to grain sized bullets fired at ridiculously high velocities that would be unachievable without the advent of element zero and the mitigation of much of this thanks to the mass effect fields encapsuling the rounds. This would naturally mean that bullets would be required to near instantly hit a target in order to deal damage, a grain-sized bullet fired at the same velocitiy of a 9mm bullet might hope to sting someone.
I can understand why this was implemented, I suppose. To be more shooter-like and have you require to 'lead' targets, and maybe I might of accepted it if BioWare even bothered to address it, but it's not even acknowledged. Is galactic technology cyclic? Will the humans, turians and asari start firing space muskets at each other?
I really enjoyed ME2, but this blatant disregard of established lore is insulting.

If you have used the sniper rifle you would know that your bullet hits your target the second you depress the trigger.  What you see is irrelevant, your target gets hit instantaneously.  You can see his head snap back before that little light trail even gets to him. So the lore is sound, the art direction sucks.  

[Lance Of Longinus]

That just means the gameplay is inconsistent, seeing as you wait for your bullet to hit the person for every other weapon. Snipers just work differently because getting a perfect headshot but finding out that your target moves slightly to the left rendering said shot pointless is rather frustrating, as I would imagine it.

[vhatever]

I think people are confused about the "delay" in bullet speed. The actualy image of projectile is far slower than how the fast the actual projectile "hits" the area. It just looks like it's shooting sloer. Your weapon hits very quickly, maybe not hitscan level, but fast enough. Your aim/reflexes is more likely the problem, not the delay.

Modifié par vhatever, 20 avril 2010 - 01:16 .

[Destructo-Bot]

I'm fairly certain the weapons are hitscan with simple particle effects to give the player a sense of actually shooting something. The only projectiles are heavy weapons.

I'd be shocked if it were otherwise, because hitscan is much simpler to implement than projectiles.

Modifié par Destructo-Bot, 20 avril 2010 - 07:08 .