79 réponses à ce sujet

[Gumbeaux Jr]

I find Mass Effect 2 to be the most fun when playing as a Paragon while doing all of the Renegade & Paragon interrupts.

[Privateerkev]

I usually go "pure" paragon but I admit the renegade path makes me crack up laughing. So, I'll do 4 or 5 play throughs as paragon and then 1 renegade just to see other conversation paths and blow off steam.

It seems BW uses the whole para/rena choice to just get you to the same place using different routes. The only penalized choice seems to be going pure neutral. (go the whole game only picking middle conversations.) In ME1, going neutral (the true pragmatist route) nets you no bonuses and makes some quests harder. (Batia's, for example, is impossible as a true neutral.)

I haven't gone pure neutral in ME2 yet but I think some stuff will be harder. Like during the Jack/Miranda or Legion/Tali fights.

As for whether things have consequences in the 3rd game, like the Rachni Queen decision, we'll just have to wait for the 3rd game. My guess is that some renegade decisions will make the Reaper-vs-universe-war easier, like keeping the base. And some paragon decisions will make the war easier, like keeping the Rachni queen. Should balance out. But this is just speculation on my part.

[SonvarTheMighty]

I haven't done a full renegade in ME. In ME2 I did a full paragon and renegade game. Both have their positives and typically I've found in other playthroughs I'm typically paragon with using renegade interrupts here and there

[Wedrall3]

Personally, I hated being Evil In KOTOR. I couldn't even get off Taris as a dark side character, it just felt... wrong. In Mass Effect, though, I often switch sides, or at least stay more neutral. I tend to do all the conversation interrupters regardless of my general attitude, they tend to made sense without being extreme. In short, I basically say whatever I would do in real life... which is what you're supposed to do, I guess.

[blasto lives]

I recommend using an ugly Shepard.



I don't associate myself with the character, and that makes the jerk lines (which are pretty funny) not as painful. There is also some bonus humor because some dialogue takes on a different meaning when said to a grotesque Shep.

[EvilIguana966]

Bluebruiser wrote...

So I play plenty of RPG's and normally to get the full experience I'll play both as an "evil" and "good" player on different playthroughs. That said, I just can't bring myself to play as renegade in the Mass Effect games.

In the KOTOR games, being Sith was all about being evil. The dichotomy between your actions and real actions is so extreme that its a lot easier to dissasociate between the game and real life. It just becomes a fun way to play the game.

IN dragon age, I find it interesting in some cases to choose the "evil" option (with the exception of Branka who I can't stand).

In the Mass Effect games I just can't do it. I think the main reason is that being a renegade is so frequently associated with being a xenophobic rascist in this game. That and I identify much more with Shepard in the Mass Effect games than I do with protagonists in other RPG's. Part of this is because Shepard is a stronger character. He/she is persistant and can't be completely molded to the player's wishes.

Does anyone else feel this way about Mass Effect?

I find this a very interesting example of the rather unusual social mores we have in the modern western world.  You're fine with murder, intimidation, and grand larceny, but draw the line at racism.  I'm no fan of racism, or any bigotry really, but our priorities as a society really are pretty messed up. 

[Blackveldt]

Initially, I had a really difficult time playing Renegade. Or rather, just forcing myself to do it. But, in fairness, I generally hate being a jerk in any RPG I've played. I do agree, OP, that it seems more difficult in the Mass Effect series because the games are that much more immersible (imo). However, once I got rolling (really rolling), disassociating myself from the character and whatnot, playing Renegade not only became easier, but hilarious to boot. It far outstrips the Paragon in terms of entertainment value. And then, the oddest thing occurred: I began to respect the badass that is Commander Shepard--even as Renegade. Granted, many Renegade options are over the top, but s/he gets the job done and in style. I must admit that the female Shepard was highly entertaining in this respect. And because femShep is the more serious Renegade (imo) as opposed to the more blase, sarcastic maleShep, it may be easier to 'disassociate,' so to speak. (She is more the evil Sith, in other words.)

[Cra5y Pineapple]

Being Regenade in ME1 was annoying since Shepard was mean to Garrus =O



Though ME2 Regenade was brilliant. *Shoots pipe* WTFBOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM

Along with "Chaaaaarge", "I'll cut your balls off and sell them to a Krogan", Kicking a guy off a building (I thought "THIS IS SPARTAAAA" XD), the shortest interregation in history, shouting at the Quarian Concil, and many many more...

[Alraiis]

Somebody1003 wrote...

Alraiis wrote...

I think what makes it hard is the big decisions never backfire on Paragons.

Throwing ships away to save the Council doesn't cause Sovereign to win. The Rachni Queen wasn't a maniuplative liar. Sending one of your hand-picked best-in-the-galaxy away from your all-or-nothing suicide mission with all of humanity at stake just so Chakwas and Chambers can make it back to the ship doesn't result in the Collectors winning. Sidonis probably really is a nice guy at heart. Curing the genophage probably won't cause the krogan to dominate the galaxy and all that Geth heretic stuff is probably 100% legit. Oh, and you'll easily beat the Reapers after you throw away the technology in the Collector base.

Renegades are making choices for the kind of cynical universe that doesn't exist in Mass Effect. Why wouldn't you be a Paragon? There's no downside.

Maybe the rachni will turn centuries later on the galaxy again, long after Shepard is gone.

Thats what I think, so I killed them.

That would be a great surprise ending for Paragons in ME3. "Congratulations, you saved the galaxy! You're a hero! Oh, but about those rachni you saved...."

[enormousmoonboots]

Alraiis wrote...

I think what makes it hard is the big decisions never backfire on Paragons.

Throwing ships away to save the Council doesn't cause Sovereign to win. The Rachni Queen wasn't a maniuplative liar. Sending one of your hand-picked best-in-the-galaxy away from your all-or-nothing suicide mission with all of humanity at stake just so Chakwas and Chambers can make it back to the ship doesn't result in the Collectors winning. Sidonis probably really is a nice guy at heart. Curing the genophage probably won't cause the krogan to dominate the galaxy and all that Geth heretic stuff is probably 100% legit. Oh, and you'll easily beat the Reapers after you throw away the technology in the Collector base.

Renegades are making choices for the kind of cynical universe that doesn't exist in Mass Effect. Why wouldn't you be a Paragon? There's no downside.

Someone else phrased it a lot better than me, but when you play straight Paragon or Renegade, you shape the galaxy to your ideals. Idealism works in a Paragon world, because you're changing the world to make it work. Similarly, cynicism works in a Renegade world, because that's the way the world is there. Like, Garrus and Sidonis. If you let Garrus shoot Sidonis, he's satisfied that it was the right thing. If you stop him, he's also satisfied that it was the right thing. Both options are true, and valid. They simply exist in difference universes.

There's no real backfire from Renegade decisions, either. Only the second chapter of a trilogy, after all. Well, some people on the Citadel are rude to you. That's about it. Paragon and Renegade are equal alignments, and both valid ways to play the game. Neither should be 'punished'.

The only edge is metagame, and it's in favor of Paragons--simply that more Paragon decisions carry over from ME1 with a tangible effect. You get more dialog and more story with Paragon resolutions...mostly because Renegade Shep kills most people that dare put him on a sidequest, and so there's not a person to meet up with in the next game.

[InStereoWhereAvailable]

I can't play as a Renegade, at least not fully. I do the interrupts, like when I know a confrontation is unavoidable (Krogan on Mordin's Loyalty mission, Mercs on Miranda's), and the ones during Thane's Loyalty mission (The Interrogation) are just too damn funny ("Give me a name, or else I'll cut your balls off and sell them to a Krogan!", *Slap*, Headsmack). But as my friend once called me, I am pretty much "the stupidest bleeding heart moron in the world". Exept when you get me angry. Then I shall break you. 

[Sesshomaru47]

It's not about being "evil" in ME. It's about being a total prat in order to get things done your way. I liked being a prat more in the first game, mostly because your face didn't fall off. My brother was playing renegade before he quit, god was he ugly. I know you can fix it, but that fact that it does it is stupid to begin with. Shepard does not have the Force, you should not have evil Sith face.

[Alraiis]

enormousmoonboots wrote...

Someone else phrased it a lot better than me, but when you play straight Paragon or Renegade, you shape the galaxy to your ideals. Idealism works in a Paragon world, because you're changing the world to make it work. Similarly, cynicism works in a Renegade world, because that's the way the world is there. Like, Garrus and Sidonis. If you let Garrus shoot Sidonis, he's satisfied that it was the right thing. If you stop him, he's also satisfied that it was the right thing. Both options are true, and valid. They simply exist in difference universes.

There's no real backfire from Renegade decisions, either. Only the second chapter of a trilogy, after all. Well, some people on the Citadel are rude to you. That's about it. Paragon and Renegade are equal alignments, and both valid ways to play the game. Neither should be 'punished'.

The only edge is metagame, and it's in favor of Paragons--simply that more Paragon decisions carry over from ME1 with a tangible effect. You get more dialog and more story with Paragon resolutions...mostly because Renegade Shep kills most people that dare put him on a sidequest, and so there's not a person to meet up with in the next game.

I wasn't (seriously) trying to suggest that Paragons should be punished. What you're saying is exactly right: your decisions work if you're looking at your playthrough as its own universe. What I was trying to explain is why so many people might find playing Renegade difficult---I think a lot of it has to do with that "metagame" aspect you mention. They play Paragon first, and they see that sparing the rachni or Sidonis is a good idea in their playthrough, so it becomes a good idea in all playthroughs. I think it would be neat if Bioware really changed the reality of that universe based on your decision---so, for example, Paragons who saved the rachni get their encounter in Illium and Renegades who killed the rachni encounter, in the asari's place, someone from Noveria who uncovered the rachni's evil plans for galactic domination and gives the player a pat on the back for their preemptive strike. Also, it would be nice if saving the Collector base wasn't frowned upon by almost every single member of your team.

But such is not the case. That's why I like to do Renegade first---the decisions feel right for that playthrough, but once you see the "happier" Paragon results, it can be a bit deflating to go from that to Renegade.

[enormousmoonboots]

Not coming down on you, sorry if it came off like that :] I just see a lot of people making the 'but Renegade is better because ______' or 'well Paragon is better because ______', which kind of frustrates me, because it's 100% opinion. Opinions can't be right or wrong, and it drives me nuts when people try to say that one is DEFINITIVELY better than another. 'I enjoyed (alignment) more' or 'I prefer (alignment)' is totally cool, but I wish people would stop acting like their opinion is a fact.



But yeah, it would be nice if there were alternate encounters for Renegade Shep, not just totally removed ones. I think Shiala is the only one where you get it regardless of alignment, except it's a generic NPC rather than Shiala. Other than that, no Gianna, no queen, no email from random Omega kid or salarian janitors...the galaxy is pretty empty on my Renegade run.

[FredThePhoenix]

I actually prefer the Renegade side of Mass Effect a little more than the Paragon one. It's more entertaining and I identify myself and my character more on the Renegade side. Plus my character is an Earthborn Ruthless, so it fits him quite well. I usually go for th Paragon options when it's time to save people to keep them around for maximum content in Mass Effect 2 and 3.



I'm for keeping things, no matter what. I kept the Council alive. I kept the Collector Base.

[SF117]

I've always played as a Paragon (since I'm a nice guy and all, or try to be anyway). Playing Renegade just feels strange to me; while some options are entertaining, others just make you feel like an ass.

[Mixon]

same me cant play renegade, tryed but i cant and thats all

[shinobi602]

blasto lives wrote...

I recommend using an ugly Shepard.

I don't associate myself with the character, and that makes the jerk lines (which are pretty funny) not as painful. There is also some bonus humor because some dialogue takes on a different meaning when said to a grotesque Shep.

What...............the................f****

[8erserker]

What stops me from choosing renegade options sometimes is that I don't want to miss out on something in ME3. It made sense at first that, if you kill someone in the previous game, they and any attached sidequests won't show up in the next game, but it also gives paragon players a richer gameplay experience that renegade players will miss out on. I'm sure BioWare can work out quests where, if you killed someone in ME1, someone close to that person will look for revenge in the next game. Or maybe someone will be glad you got rid of that person and offer you another task.

[Virginian]

I have no trouble playing a Xenophobic Shep. Many of the alien races are Xenophobic towards humans so screw them.

They want to humans to treat them nicely they have to treat humans nicely but they don't. Reminds me of the golden rule/karma/good for the goose good for the gander.

[Nu-Nu]

I didn't have problem playing a renegon in me1 but it's really hard to play that in me 2 and I've become more of a paragade.  In ME2 most of the renegade was just about being a ****.
In me1, as renegon, I sacrificed the people in the "bring down the sky" to make sure the bad guy didn't get away and hurt other people. Then handed him over to alliance so they can interrogate him and find out who he works for. There's not that many renegade moments in ME2 that allows you to think for the greater good.
But I still can't play as a full renegade though.

Modifié par Nu-Nu, 22 avril 2010 - 09:54 .

[Bookman230]

inversevideo wrote...

I've found quite a few examples where the 'renegade' option seems better than the paragon alternative.

Defending Tali - if you go all renegade, in your responses to the Admiralty board, both the admirals and the Conclave members make comments about your speaking well in Tali's defence, and about being wrong in thinking a human would be too weak to do a good job at defending Tali.

Conrad Verner - renegade the merchant (undercover cop) and Lie to Conrad, telling him it was a dangerous mission, he did a good job, but could have been killed, and he will make the decision to go home, and he will do so with pride, thanking you for letting him help. You will hear later, over the news broadcast that he is starting a charity in your name to help orphans.

Tell the Asari on Illium to leave her Krogan lover. If you don't, and you convince her to marry him instead, you will run into them on the Krogan homeworld, and she will be miserable. It is a radioactive hellhole that even Grunt can't stand, and she comments on how everyone hates her.

Convince the SI rep, on Illium, to purchase the Quarian's contract. Beware, this little quest is a trap, for those of us who were used to being more paragon than renegade!
The paragon option is to convince the SI rep to buy out the Quarian's contract, free her from indentured servitude, and then garnish back her wages. Think about that! You essentially are making the Quarian a true indentured servent, and have stripped her of the strict protections she is afforded under Illium law! The renegade option is to have SI employ her under her Illium service contract, which strictly guarantees that SI cannot take the Quarian offworld, and SI must look after the Quarians needs, which includes suits, medical, a clean room, and food. No ifs ands or buts.

I'm not saying all of the Renegade options are good.
Some are just plain mean.
But not all of the Paragon options are for the best either.

It's almost like BIOWARE impelmented a system that would make you consider whether a response should be Paragon, or Renegade, then later, down the line, decided that it would be better if all of your responses were consistently either paragon or renegade, and punish you, if they were not, by not giving you enough influence to get either option, later in the game, if you were not more one or the other.

So I play Renegon, and you know what? After doing that for a few playthroughs it is hard to see ever going back to full paragon or even paragade.

The only sacrifice, to my conscience, that I have to make, is for Zaeed's mission; as I may use that mission to give my renegade points a boost. I do have a metagame rationalization for it, but I am not always able to buy it.

Actually, if you go all Paragon Charm on Tali's mission, everyone makes the same remarks(Shep's a good speaker, etc.). Lieing to Conrad with Charm gets the same result. Asari and the krogan, I give you that, but true love conquers all! The indetured Quarian, they still hire her and give her the job. She works as an employee, not a servant. So, that's one or two(arguably) options where Renegade is better than Paragon.

[Tlazolteotl]

I played exactly half paragon and half renegade in ME1, and I'm doing so again in ME2.

Could just get full bars of both in ME1, but can't quite manage it in ME2.

I just go with options that are the coolest, renegade or paragon.

[Erinlana]

Most renegade options do make you seem like a dick but some are badass and people dersevre that in game heh