53 réponses à ce sujet

[Lowenhart]

I am just wondering will there be anychance that the mage origin storyline between Jowan and Lily might be continued possible Aonar being a DLC or something.

I thought the story was rather tragic and felt powerless at the mage origin to do anything of what i thought was right for them, and i must admit i had my moments in Redcliffe where i was a bit furious of the poor level of game design, that dident allow me to save Jowan when he redeemed himself by conscripting him into being a grey warden, i mean come on Loghain who done far worse crimes were allowed to be conscipted why couldnt we be allowed to recruit Jowan and for instance have Wynne leave if she disagreed.

I was bit disappointed that if you started mage origin you werent allowed much to retrofy what happened at the beginning in the tower, and story between Jowan and lily been much more interesting than having Wynne along, especially if it was possible for Jowan to follow over to awakening, and Aonar the mage prison was added to it, and followed up on the lily as a side line quest for him, also would make for interesting content if having Anders the ex apothage along. Possible even Justice might give for some interesting themes.

Modifié par Lowenhart, 25 avril 2010 - 12:35 .

[CalJones]

Well Jowan was originally intended to be recruitable, but it got cut from the game for reasons I'm not sure of. I'd have loved to have him in my party.

[Aisynia]

Seriously!!



Every time I play through the game, I get pissed off I can't recruit Jowan and run off to Aeonar to save Lily.



I understand the chances are slim, but I really, really hope they release him as a full companion one day.



Barring that, I wish someone would make a mod to add him.

[sylvanaerie]

Aisynia wrote...

Seriously!!

Every time I play through the game, I get pissed off I can't recruit Jowan and run off to Aeonar to save Lily.

I understand the chances are slim, but I really, really hope they release him as a full companion one day.

Barring that, I wish someone would make a mod to add him.

Me too. I used to really hate him but after 5 mage playthroughs I understand him better.  I wish there had been something I could have done to help them.  A DLC adventure in Aeonar would have been fantastic, but its rather origin specific unless they can supply a reason other wardens might want to rescue the maleficar's girlfriend.  Recruitment would be good, as it would be his "Companion" quest maybe.  Its a shame he got cut.  I would have enjoyed kicking some templar behinds.

[Majspuffen]

I beileve that at first, they were going to have Jowan as a party member, a male mage, someone you can learn blood magic from. Would be a solid idea for a dlc, in my opinion. Jowan really wants to help, destroy the evil bla bla bla, he says, but when you tell him to follow you, he says "errr.. I don't want to follow you into danger." then how does he intend to help?



Also, there's the persuade option to have him freed, but it has never worked for me. Right of conscription? He's a pretty complete character with a companion quest already

[CalJones]

Yes, the only way you can free him is to tell him to run and you never want to see him again, the first time you encounter him in Eamon's dungeon. You can't have him do the ritual or enter the Fade and then free him. It's a shame. Since you get an option to execute him in the dungeon yourself, it would have been nice if you'd been able to just let him out instead.

[Sarah1281]

They could end up going through with making with a companion via a DLC à la Shale.

[Aisynia]

Majspuffen wrote...

I beileve that at first, they were going to have Jowan as a party member, a male mage, someone you can learn blood magic from. Would be a solid idea for a dlc, in my opinion. Jowan really wants to help, destroy the evil bla bla bla, he says, but when you tell him to follow you, he says "errr.. I don't want to follow you into danger." then how does he intend to help?

Also, there's the persuade option to have him freed, but it has never worked for me. Right of conscription? He's a pretty complete character with a companion quest already

Basically, yes. He was intended to be a companion, and from what I have learned, they mnay have even started on his lines and companion quest.. but he got cut. I think thge idea was that you could conscript him out of Eamon's custody.

*sigh*

Jowan is a good person who made a lot of stupid mistakes. He is not an evil guy by any stretch. He would have amde a fun companion and I think he would make a decent Grey Warden too.

[Aisynia]

Sarah1281 wrote...

They could end up going through with making with a companion via a DLC à la Shale.

I am not counting on it, but I sure hope so.

BioWare has a habit of not really talking about anything it's actually doing though, so who knows.

[Aisynia]

Well we're simplifying. We don't know WHAT rescuing her would actually entail. She might change some of her views after getting stuck in Aeonar too. Unlikely, but it's impossible to tell.

[BHRamsay]

No offence intended but ...Jowan is a tool. He's like Woody Allen with way too much power. I would have liked to save Lilly or helped her in some way but I hand Jowan over to the circle each and every single time I play

Jowan: Ive made so many mistakes if only there was something I could do to make things right
PC: Come with me and fight the horrors that your poorly trained apprentice unleashed
Jowan: Sorry that sounds dangerous

My only regret is that I can't be there when they make him tranquil --- perhaps as an emotional blank slate he will cause less headaches for the world at large.

Modifié par BHRamsay, 25 avril 2010 - 04:41 .

[sylvanaerie]

BHRamsay wrote...

No offence intended but ...Jowan is a tool. He's like Woody Allen with way too much power. I would have liked to save Lilly or helped her in some way but I hand Jowan over to the circle each and every single time I play

Jowan: Ive made so many mistakes if only there was something I could do to make things right
PC: come with me and fight the horrors that your barely trained apprentice unleashed
Jowan: Sorry that sounds dangerous

My only regret is that I can't be there when they make him tranquil --- perhaps as an emotional blank slate he will cause less headaches for for the world at large.

He won't be Tranquiled. Gregoir pronounced execution for Jowan at the end of the Mage Origin so even if you send him back to the Circle he still gets Queen of Hearts'ed.

[Aisynia]

BHRamsay wrote...

No offence intended but ...Jowan is a tool. He's like Woody Allen with way too much power. I would have liked to save Lilly or helped her in some way but I hand Jowan over to the circle each and every single time I play

Jowan: Ive made so many mistakes if only there was something I could do to make things right
PC: Come with me and fight the horrors that your poorly trained apprentice unleashed
Jowan: Sorry that sounds dangerous

My only regret is that I can't be there when they make him tranquil --- perhaps as an emotional blank slate he will cause less headaches for the world at large.

That is ONLY because he isn't recruitable. He he was recruitable, you could take him with you there, and then when given the opportunity, conscript him out of custody.

We learn from the Mage Origin that in a fight, he is actually fairly competant, and not afraid of danger.

Likewise, in the quest you get after freeing him (Jowan's Intention, which can be done only on the PC), he is leading around and protecting several people from blighted animals.

The entire fact that he says that is really, very out of character for him, and is there simply because you CAN'T recruit him.

[BHRamsay]

That never dawned on me I just assumed that if he went back to the tower he'd be made a tranquil since that was what they intended to do in the first place.



OK you make a good point, He is annoying but I don't want to see him dead but I rather he wasn't running around free.



He may hate the idea of becoming a Tranquil but all the ones we encounter are ...well not happy obviously, but Owian seems content with his lot and he mentions having some of the same fears and misgivings as Jowan did

[sylvanaerie]

I think the intent was originally to tranquil him because they either had no irrefuteable proof or because he at that point hadn't harmed anyone. Once he uses his blood magics to attack the templars and Irving the kid gloves (so to speak) are off.

Really death, when it comes to him, I think he's accepted it. As a mage I ask Teagan if I could execute him and I always go down and talk to him first. His last thoughts were for Lily. (I always lie to him and tell him Lily is fine when I find him in the dungeon on my first run through it). And he accepts his fate, almost seems to welcome it and is kind of glad its you (the mage PC) who is giving it to him. Sometimes I let him live a bit longer so he can at least say his apologies to Eamon for all the mess of things.

In the end I think the writing for Jowan is to be appreciated. His character grows perhaps more than any other (esp for being a minor plot one) and he accepts his fate with dignity.

[Aisynia]

BHRamsay wrote...

That never dawned on me I just assumed that if he went back to the tower he'd be made a tranquil since that was what they intended to do in the first place.

OK you make a good point, He is annoying but I don't want to see him dead but I rather he wasn't running around free.

He may hate the idea of becoming a Tranquil but all the ones we encounter are ...well not happy obviously, but Owian seems content with his lot and he mentions having some of the same fears and misgivings as Jowan did

Making someone Tranquil is a crime against humanity as far as I'm concerned.

[sylvanaerie]

It would depend on the circumstances for me. For Jowan who is obviously so averse to it I think killing him is more of a kindness. Owain chose to be Tranquiled. He would beg to differ if you think he is less of a human being because he lacks emotions. (And considering some of what he says in the Circle Treaty quest I tend to think they ARE aware of their existance and threats to that existance cause them distress) I don't think its as cut and dried a fate as Jowan says it is.

[CalJones]

Yes, in Jowan's shoes I'd rather be dead. The tragedy of his situation is that he's in love, and to lose that emotion is horrifying to him. Execution is more of a mercy (though I'd rather he lived. I think under the Warden's guidance he could do quite well. Provided the Warden was a complete ass or power hungry lunatic, of course).

[Lowenhart]

Massamies wrote...

Considering that Lily didn't want to leave with Jowan after him using blood magic to knock down few people, she probably wouldn't be too happy about killing your way through Aeonar.

Well is it unlikely that Aeonar couldnt be a target for demons or darkspawns considering the prospect for aquirring malificarums? And create abominations for their ranks.

Modifié par Lowenhart, 25 avril 2010 - 08:20 .

[BHRamsay]

Perhaps I am biased because i'm just doing my mage run and during the Gauntlet ..its Jowan you see... I'm standing on a frozen mountaintop, having barely survived an encounter with a real live and pissed off dragon and a bunch of psycho cultists because of Jowan...my hat goes off to the boy since whatever he did was so powerful it needed Andraste's ashes to fix it, but seeing him there in the temple, I just wanted to smack him so hard.

[Lowenhart]

Its part of the gauntlets trials its not the real Jowan, if you refuse to answer the gaurdians question he wont appear, and you wont recieve the reflection amulet, its part of the gauntlets test about facing your past, and later yourself, when facing your own reflections.

[Aisynia]

Jowan is a super cool guy. I always miss him and it makes me mad I can't recruit him.



I was just discussing on the phone with a friend whether or not I should learn the toolset well enough to add him to the party or not.

[thegreateski]

Well . . . Jowan is dead or worse in my playthrough . . . so I don't think it will happen.

[Sarah1281]

Its part of the gauntlets trials its not the real Jowan, if you refuse to answer the gaurdians question he wont appear, and you wont recieve the reflection amulet, its part of the gauntlets test about facing your past, and later yourself, when facing your own reflections.

If you don't answer the question the spirit will appear (at least it does for the DN) but no, you don't get the amulet.