Aller au contenu

Photo

Gameplay and Story Discussion


  • Veuillez vous connecter pour répondre
73 réponses à ce sujet

#1
Rendar666

Rendar666
  • Members
  • 229 messages
So… after reading quite a few posts regarding Gameplay vs. Story, I decided to discuss this intriguing and controversial topic; write my initial thoughts, and then see what you, the forumites, have to say about it.
 
The main points a lot of gamers are trying to get across is that Gameplay is the most important factor of a game. Gameplay includes the combat, any sort of inventory management, puzzles etc. A lot of games have, lately, put an intense focus on the gameplay alone while allowing the story side to fall behind a little. This isn’t necessarily a bad thing, to most people. The gameplay is what holds up the game while you aren’t experiencing story elements of dialogue with other characters, as most would say. However-- I’ll talk about this a bit later-- I feel that story and gameplay are so closely intertwined that one cannot survive without the other.
..
In Mass Effect, 1 and 2, you will start missions with some story, dialogue and a chance to find out more about where you really are. This is construed as being just story elements to most. However, I find that this is as much apart of gameplay as it is filling in the background - story -. In games, for the most part RPGs, you will be given a mission/quest and will tasked with finishing it. You get bits and pieces of story here and there and eventually you’ll figure out everything that is going on with the world -- story -- through gameplay. The story adds to the importance of combat. Why are you fighting? Why are even where you are tackling this giant ogre thing that has eaten fifty people? Because there is a story behind it. Sure, you might get some XP and items sprinkled in the deal but you go there because you HEARD about it from somebody and thought… hmmm… this is a big bad ogre and he’s bound to have some treasure, blah, blah, blah.
..
One of my favorite games that I always seem to compare other games to is Morrowind. It’s an open world RPG/adventure with a massive amount of story and side quests. The gameplay, fighting, finding new items, new spells and gaining levels, is all deeply related to the amount of story you unfold and uncover. The gameplay, by itself, is rather repetitive actually and is kind of boring. You press the Right Trigger and get a vertical chop, or a horizontal slash or a stab mixed with some magic and swordplay. After awhile, everyone gets bored of running around slaying beasts in random caverns and collecting loot if that’s all there is to it. However, almost everything in that game has relation to the world around it through story. The background of a magical item. The Daedric and Dweomer artifacts that you uncover are all related to the story. Uncovering the background of the ancient beings is what might compel you go search for answers. It’s terribly exciting to find a new artifact and bring it to some collector and then get a bit of info about what it might have been used for. You always want to go back and look for more.
..
Mass Effect 1 had you taking on a mission, getting a quick brief on what’s going on, and then you go and solve the problem through, for the most part, gameplay -- combat --. Without the story behind that quest you would not only not even know the place existed, you’d just be walking around shooting random hoodlums who decided to take over a planet for no reason at all. The story pushes you forward and makes you want to learn more, through which you deal with the combat section of the game.
..
Story is very important… very important. But without gameplay, without anything other than just dialogue or cut scenes you’re watching a movie, not playing a game. Yes, I know that it’s very entertaining to talk to your companions and glean every last bit of their lives out of them. Eventually, you’ve had enough talking and you just want to get on with the killing of the beasties. The ENTIRE time you are fighting in games, mostly, you are furthering the story. By killing these guys you angered this group and now they want to take you down. You fight them and this happens. You make these guys here of you through your actions. It’s all related. Saying any one aspect of a game is the MOST important is ridiculous and untrue.
..
Without a story you are simply just doing things with no reason or purpose. That gets boring real fast. No amount of intense situations can hold your attention forever if it’s just one intense situation after. You’re pinned down by snipers. Seen it once you’ve seen it a thousand times. If all you ever did was get pinned down by snipers with no advancement in plot you’d hate the game. It’d boring as hell, quite frankly. All you would do is move from encounter to encounter with no reprisal or relief or explanation for why there is so many god ---- snipers in the first place.
..
However, without that sniper, without that enemy army, you’ve got no reason to even be where you are and thus you don’t have a solid gaming experience. You could walk through the forest forever and talk to your pals about the war, as soldiers IN the war, but then never take part of it. That’s boring too.
..
There is also another part of both of these. Character development. This part of story and gameplay is never really mentioned. It’s what ties the two together in most story driven games. It’s why people do what they do. Characters drive the story forward and affect both the story and the gameplay. In Grand Theft Auto 4 you’re killing people… a lot. Pretty much all of the time. But the insane cast of characters and personality put into the game is what makes it stand out. Brucie, the crazy shark testosterone freak. Packie, the ridiculous drunken Irishman and his hot sister. Michelle, who is actually Karen, and her betrayal. If you’re just running around jacking people’s cars you’re going to get bored really fast. But if you’re running around on a mission with your pals, who have their own unique personalities and conversations with you AS you are assaulting that gang territory you’ve got a good gaming experience.
..
In Final Fantasy, most recently 13, characters drive the game forward. They make the game standout more than if the characters just ran through the place for no reason getting into random battles all the time. They develop and feel real. They are their own person, but they are melded by the gameplay and thus change the story. Hope wants to become stronger to face his anger and desperation through constant fights. Lightning, AKA Claire, is running away from her feelings and thoughts by clouding herself in anger and by fighting constantly. These characters are changed drastically through the course of the story. Lightning becomes a stronger person, not just physically, but as a human being, not a weapon. She learns to care for others and gains new friends. She’s never been the type to make friends. She had no purpose after she lost her sister. All her dreams revolved around her. Hope, wanting vengeance, realizes through Lightning that fighting won’t solve everything. But then there’s about 64 REDICULOUSLY hard missions, mainly towards the end, that make for juicy gameplay. There’s even a bit of story behind of them too.
..
Are you understanding now? These elements of gaming are not at all completely stand alone. They may have different purposes, emotions and feelings and thoughts, but when you put them together they are what make the game whole. As I said before, no one element can survive long without the other. Gears of War, while it does have a rather shallow story with bland characters, the gameplay is great. I got bored REALLY fast. There will be blood… almost all story driven with nothing ever really happening. Fell asleep. Avatar the Movie, Action, good characters, good story and visuals. Good movie. Mass Effect 1, good story (fairly straight forward but beautifully told), fun gameplay that felt unique, and characters that felt real.
..
That’s my two cents on this issue. What do you guys think? And don’t be afraid discuss this thoroughly with myself and others. I know this is a heated debate so try not to go to insulting.
.
Example: You only play online shooters = You’re dumb. No. None of that. It isn’t true.
.
Example: You only like story and characters and not gameplay? = You think you’re better than everyone through your elitist tendencies. You’re actually dumb. No. None of that. It isn’t true.
...
Discuss.

Image IPB

Edit: The stupid paragraphs morphed into Paragraph Prime. One big wall of text.Image IPB


Edit 2: Someone mentioned multiplayer games. That reminded me that, yes, a game can exist without a story. But it ties into: games without a story might be fun for awhile, but the fun wont last forever and wont be remembered as fondly as the game that had that shocking ending or that emotional talk between the two main characters. The lack of story also puts off a lot of people. I know gamers who hate FPS games because they were made for multiplayer/ gameplay only. I like shooters on occasion (Battlefield being the best imo. good tactical gameplay with great online) These games might have a story but they are rarely as developed or sophisticated as games that were made with a story in mind.

**My post isn't so much about one being better than the other, just that the two should be intertwined to make each other part matter. Reasons for why you're doing what you're doing.

Modifié par Rendar666, 02 mai 2010 - 01:30 .


#2
Collider

Collider
  • Members
  • 17 165 messages
Story > gameplay. Thanks.

#3
TJSolo

TJSolo
  • Members
  • 2 256 messages
Story is part of gameplay. Once a game maker decides what kind of story they want to be told, it then sets a path as to what kind of gameplay can be used.

People are losing sight that story is woven through out games that have stories to tell after the intial design. Tetris and Pong had no notable stories after the intial design phase.

Story, the other white meat.

#4
Mister Mida

Mister Mida
  • Members
  • 3 239 messages
I would say that my preferred story/gameplay ratio would be 60% story and 40% gameplay.

#5
Onyx Jaguar

Onyx Jaguar
  • Members
  • 13 003 messages
Good story cannot save a game with bad gameplay, but a bad story can hurt a game with good gameplay.

A proper balance should be struck between the two.

EDIT:  Plus as for Mass Effect 1, it is (was) my favorite game but it was purely based on story presentation.  Otherwise I am firmly in the gameplay camp.  Lumines, Tetris, Roguelikes.  All gameplay based.  Story does not help them and they do not need it.  

My actual fantasy for a future ME game is one where you play as a mercenary and you just recruit a squad and do quests.  No real story structure.  Think of it as Fallout/Elder Scrolls combined with I dunno, freelancer and Mass Effect.

Modifié par Onyx Jaguar, 01 mai 2010 - 06:19 .


#6
Rendar666

Rendar666
  • Members
  • 229 messages

TJSolo wrote...

Story is part of gameplay. Once a game maker decides what kind of story they want to be told, it then sets a path as to what kind of gameplay can be used.
People are losing sight that story is woven through out games that have stories to tell after the intial design. Tetris and Pong had no notable stories after the intial design phase.
Story, the other white meat.



Exactly. That's what I'm saying. People seem to be losing sight of this though. That's why I thought I'd post this.

#7
DarthCaine

DarthCaine
  • Members
  • 7 175 messages
I'm more interested in the presentation than the story or its gameplay

I loved Avatar 'cos of its presentation not the story

Presentation>Story>Gameplay

Modifié par DarthCaine, 01 mai 2010 - 06:50 .


#8
Rendar666

Rendar666
  • Members
  • 229 messages

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

Good story cannot save a game with bad gameplay, but a bad story can hurt a game with good gameplay.

A proper balance should be struck between the two.

EDIT:  Plus as for Mass Effect 1, it is (was) my favorite game but it was purely based on story presentation.  Otherwise I am firmly in the gameplay camp.  Lumines, Tetris, Roguelikes.  All gameplay based.  Story does not help them and they do not need it.  

My actual fantasy for a future ME game is one where you play as a mercenary and you just recruit a squad and do quests.  No real story structure.  Think of it as Fallout/Elder Scrolls combined with I dunno, freelancer and Mass Effect.



Yes, but how long can you play Tetris, Lumines and Roguelikes without getting so bored you want to cry like a baby? The thrills of fun gameplay only last so long.
 
Funny Example: Doctor Roboniks Mean Bean Machine (Terrible game... but still) It puts story together with connect the color, tetris like, gameplay. It's a terrible game through and through, but at least it was an attempt at combining traditional arcade style gaming with a story.

Some games have your standard Tetris, arcade gameplay, mixed with a story. Kind of wierd, but they can actually be entertaining. I personally don't like Tetris or those kind of games very much. I need a game with both story and good gameplay to keep me playing for more than a week.

I won Mass Effect 1 fifteen times but I only won Modern Warfare 2 once. I played it on insain so I wouldn't have to suffer through the terrible story more than once. I felt it was terrible anyway.

#9
Guest_Aotearas_*

Guest_Aotearas_*
  • Guests
Well, ... pretty much everything you said was right. Nothing really to discuss there on my part. Actually, ... I just don't want to leave this topic without typing something after I read the whole post.



But there is one crucial thing I might add: Expectations!



Especially encountered with gaming series, expectations not only determines what you "expect" of a game, but also how you feel and play it. A great deal of games got dismissed into the realm of fail, because they didn't stand up to the players expectations, who frequently stop playing such games.



For Example Splinter Cell Conviction:

Fact is, the old Sam Fisher died (no spiolers here, just a metaphor) and lots of people say the game is BS.

Well, ... for my part, I just bought it yesterday and have to admit that it plays completely different from my personal favourite SC Chaos Theory. More focus on action instead of careful planned sneaking. The hilarious interrogations of grapped foes got replaced by more ... "physical" ones that are less frequent too.

And foremost, ... you are no longer a guy that is part in the story, the guy IS the story.



What I expected was a, ... well Splinter Cell like in the old times, sneaking, hiding, interrogating and rescueing whatever needs to be rescued, with some more action and an angry Sam.

What I got was a 180° turn, not a stealth game that has more action, but an action game that allows you to stealth.



Given my expectations and the fact that I am an Oldschool Splinter Cell, I consquently try to avoid skirmishes and try to get the job done silently, which actually is just the one wrong thing to do!



You are Sam Fisher, ... and you are angry. Really angry. I mean "strangle-the-cookie-monster"-angry. "Shoot-Kermit-the-Frog"-angry. ANGRY!



These kind of expectations let people bash a game that is great in any other aspect.

#10
Onyx Jaguar

Onyx Jaguar
  • Members
  • 13 003 messages

Rendar666 wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

Good story cannot save a game with bad gameplay, but a bad story can hurt a game with good gameplay.

A proper balance should be struck between the two.

EDIT:  Plus as for Mass Effect 1, it is (was) my favorite game but it was purely based on story presentation.  Otherwise I am firmly in the gameplay camp.  Lumines, Tetris, Roguelikes.  All gameplay based.  Story does not help them and they do not need it.  

My actual fantasy for a future ME game is one where you play as a mercenary and you just recruit a squad and do quests.  No real story structure.  Think of it as Fallout/Elder Scrolls combined with I dunno, freelancer and Mass Effect.



Yes, but how long can you play Tetris, Lumines and Roguelikes without getting so bored you want to cry like a baby? The thrills of fun gameplay only last so long.
 


Roguelikes can take a long time to complete, and I think you underestimate how long I can play tetris and Lumines.

Look at the Half-Life games, they are successful more from a presentation standpoint.  Is it the story that is driving people forward or is it the gameplay/presentation? 

How about multiplayer games?  I have put over a thousand hours into Natural Selection, hundreds into Counter Strike and that is all purely gameplay based.

Story helps, but it doesn't make the game.

#11
Rendar666

Rendar666
  • Members
  • 229 messages

Neofelis Nebulosa wrote...

Well, ... pretty much everything you said was right. Nothing really to discuss there on my part. Actually, ... I just don't want to leave this topic without typing something after I read the whole post.

But there is one crucial thing I might add: Expectations!

Especially encountered with gaming series, expectations not only determines what you "expect" of a game, but also how you feel and play it. A great deal of games got dismissed into the realm of fail, because they didn't stand up to the players expectations, who frequently stop playing such games.

For Example Splinter Cell Conviction:
Fact is, the old Sam Fisher died (no spiolers here, just a metaphor) and lots of people say the game is BS.
Well, ... for my part, I just bought it yesterday and have to admit that it plays completely different from my personal favourite SC Chaos Theory. More focus on action instead of careful planned sneaking. The hilarious interrogations of grapped foes got replaced by more ... "physical" ones that are less frequent too.
And foremost, ... you are no longer a guy that is part in the story, the guy IS the story.

What I expected was a, ... well Splinter Cell like in the old times, sneaking, hiding, interrogating and rescueing whatever needs to be rescued, with some more action and an angry Sam.
What I got was a 180° turn, not a stealth game that has more action, but an action game that allows you to stealth.

Given my expectations and the fact that I am an Oldschool Splinter Cell, I consquently try to avoid skirmishes and try to get the job done silently, which actually is just the one wrong thing to do!

You are Sam Fisher, ... and you are angry. Really angry. I mean "strangle-the-cookie-monster"-angry. "Shoot-Kermit-the-Frog"-angry. ANGRY!

These kind of expectations let people bash a game that is great in any other aspect.


Yeah, I'm probably going to reply to half the people here so maybe the topic will be bumpbed up and read more.


I've not played the new Splinter Cell other than a demo. I expected it to be like the old ones. I didn't read anything about it before playing because I wanted a surprise. Well, I was surprised. I didn't even give it a chance because of my expectation.

You're totally right. Expectation is something can make almost any game or movie better or worse.

#12
TJSolo

TJSolo
  • Members
  • 2 256 messages

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

Rendar666 wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

Good story cannot save a game with bad gameplay, but a bad story can hurt a game with good gameplay.

A proper balance should be struck between the two.

EDIT:  Plus as for Mass Effect 1, it is (was) my favorite game but it was purely based on story presentation.  Otherwise I am firmly in the gameplay camp.  Lumines, Tetris, Roguelikes.  All gameplay based.  Story does not help them and they do not need it.  

My actual fantasy for a future ME game is one where you play as a mercenary and you just recruit a squad and do quests.  No real story structure.  Think of it as Fallout/Elder Scrolls combined with I dunno, freelancer and Mass Effect.



Yes, but how long can you play Tetris, Lumines and Roguelikes without getting so bored you want to cry like a baby? The thrills of fun gameplay only last so long.
 

Roguelikes can take a long time to complete, and I think you underestimate how long I can play tetris and Lumines.
Look at the Half-Life games, they are successful more from a presentation standpoint.  Is it the story that is driving people forward or is it the gameplay/presentation? 
How about multiplayer games?  I have put over a thousand hours into Natural Selection, hundreds into Counter Strike and that is all purely gameplay based.
Story helps, but it doesn't make the game.


Multiplayer games are another concept more along the lines of a feature. Which leads to the questions on if it is co-op, competitive, or a mix.

#13
Rendar666

Rendar666
  • Members
  • 229 messages

Onyx Jaguar wrote...



Roguelikes can take a long time to complete, and I think you underestimate how long I can play tetris and Lumines.


lol. Okay. I just can't stand Tetris for too long.

Look at the Half-Life games, they are successful more from a presentation standpoint.  Is it the story that is driving people forward or is it the gameplay/presentation? 

How about multiplayer games?  I have put over a thousand hours into Natural Selection, hundreds into Counter Strike and that is all purely gameplay based.

Story helps, but it doesn't make the game.



I know. I play multiplayer games a lot actually. They are pretty fun, but eventually they all, eventually, start to feel the same. Call of Duty for example. The last three games had multiplayer that felt so similiar. I didn't even prestige once in MW 2. I did twice in the first one. Maybe that's because they need a new online formula? Yeah...

Do you play Counter Strike Source or?

Modifié par Rendar666, 01 mai 2010 - 06:47 .


#14
SuperMedbh

SuperMedbh
  • Members
  • 918 messages
I honestly don't see this as an either/or. Think about it-- what is a book or movie but story without gameplay? To take a computer example, interactive fiction falls at this extreme as well.



At the other extreme, a game can exist without story. I think someone earlier mentioned Tetris as being ultimately limited. While true, I suspect that's simply because pure gameplay videogames tend to fall into the "casual" market these days. After all, people spend their entire lives playing some games like tennis or golf. Sooner or later, videogame gameplay will be able to reach the subtle level necessary to inspire that sort of obsession (for better or worse!).



Taken by themselves, both aspects of a game can be completely rewarding. A game that combines the two (as the Mass Effect series does) therefore obligates itself to try to make both story and gameplay good enough to stand on their own. To do otherwise is to get one of those games that gets tagged with "Fun game, you'll want to skip the dialogues, though" or conversely "Click and kill combats, but man, great story!".

#15
Onyx Jaguar

Onyx Jaguar
  • Members
  • 13 003 messages
I probably played Counter Strike 1.6 a bit more than Source. I play CS:S occasionally but I mostly stick to single player games as of now.



For the record there is one thing that contradicts my overall views on videogames and that is that I played Mass Effect 1 over 12 times. It wasn't because of the gameplay it was because of how the story was presented. However the gameplay was not a hindrance to me being able to play the game if that makes any sense.

#16
KitsuneRommel

KitsuneRommel
  • Members
  • 753 messages

Onyx Jaguar wrote...
My actual fantasy for a future ME game is one where you play as a mercenary and you just recruit a squad and do quests.  No real story structure.  Think of it as Fallout/Elder Scrolls combined with I dunno, freelancer and Mass Effect.


ME meets Jagged Alliance? I'm sold.


Rendar666 wrote...

I won Mass Effect 1 fifteen times but I only won Modern Warfare 2 once. I played it on insain so I wouldn't have to suffer through the terrible story more than once. I felt it was terrible anyway.


I can't imagine playing ANY (storybased) game 15 times. Just like I don't watch the same movie 15 times either.

#17
hexaligned

hexaligned
  • Members
  • 3 166 messages
It's not like any of these stories are great literature, I find it odd people look at video game stories and see anything other than simplistic and cliched themes that they have been exposed to 1000000 times before. Without good game play, you might as well be watching saturday morning cartoons.

#18
Onyx Jaguar

Onyx Jaguar
  • Members
  • 13 003 messages

KitsuneRommel wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...
My actual fantasy for a future ME game is one where you play as a mercenary and you just recruit a squad and do quests.  No real story structure.  Think of it as Fallout/Elder Scrolls combined with I dunno, freelancer and Mass Effect.


ME meets Jagged Alliance? I'm sold.



YES
EXACTLY!


#19
cruc1al

cruc1al
  • Members
  • 2 570 messages

KitsuneRommel wrote...

Rendar666 wrote...

I won Mass Effect 1 fifteen times but I only won Modern Warfare 2 once. I played it on insain so I wouldn't have to suffer through the terrible story more than once. I felt it was terrible anyway.


I can't imagine playing ANY (storybased) game 15 times. Just like I don't watch the same movie 15 times either.


The same movie is the same movie every time you watch it, though the way you view the movie can change. The same game isn't actually the same game every time you play it, meaning that 15 playthroughs of mass effect are actually 15 variations of mass effect.

#20
TJSolo

TJSolo
  • Members
  • 2 256 messages

relhart wrote...

It's not like any of these stories are great literature, I find it odd people look at video game stories and see anything other than simplistic and cliched themes that they have been exposed to 1000000 times before. Without good game play, you might as well be watching saturday morning cartoons.

Welcome to the world where all unique stories and twists have been used. There is no new literature out that doesn't reminisce and borrow cliches from other works.
The very writers writing for games are the ones writing books. So why not have some kind of appreciation for a video game story.
Stories are stories no matter the media.

#21
cruc1al

cruc1al
  • Members
  • 2 570 messages

TJSolo wrote...

relhart wrote...

It's not like any of these stories are great literature, I find it odd people look at video game stories and see anything other than simplistic and cliched themes that they have been exposed to 1000000 times before. Without good game play, you might as well be watching saturday morning cartoons.

Welcome to the world where all unique stories and twists have been used. There is no new literature out that doesn't reminisce and borrow cliches from other works.
The very writers writing for games are the ones writing books. So why not have some kind of appreciation for a video game story.
Stories are stories no matter the media.


True. Especially considering that a game doesn't need an excellent story from a literature point of view to be a great game. But think about it - if a game did have a great story even for a book, how good a game would it be if it had great gameplay to combine with that story?

#22
Rendar666

Rendar666
  • Members
  • 229 messages

relhart wrote...

It's not like any of these stories are great literature, I find it odd people look at video game stories and see anything other than simplistic and cliched themes that they have been exposed to 1000000 times before. Without good game play, you might as well be watching saturday morning cartoons.




That’s actually something that would make a great discussion.
For one thing, it isn’t the fact that, for the most part, most of the ideas explored in video games may have been used before, it is how they are shown and develop. Sure, Dragon Age has a big host of mindless monsters, like Lord of the Rings. It isn’t that that makes the game good, it is how the story develops and changes through character and NPC interaction. If you look at video games like that, none of them are good. You don’t compare them to other things, you play the game enjoy the story for what it is. It can be similar to another thing, it’s hard to not to these days as there’s so many different ideas that have been used, but that doesn’t mean the story can’t be good. I find it odd that you look at video game stories the way you do. Image IPB

#23
Rendar666

Rendar666
  • Members
  • 229 messages

TJSolo wrote...

relhart wrote...

It's not like any of these stories are great literature, I find it odd people look at video game stories and see anything other than simplistic and cliched themes that they have been exposed to 1000000 times before. Without good game play, you might as well be watching saturday morning cartoons.

Welcome to the world where all unique stories and twists have been used. There is no new literature out that doesn't reminisce and borrow cliches from other works.
The very writers writing for games are the ones writing books. So why not have some kind of appreciation for a video game story.
Stories are stories no matter the media.



Agreed and you beat me to it.

#24
Rendar666

Rendar666
  • Members
  • 229 messages

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

KitsuneRommel wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...
My actual fantasy for a future ME game is one where you play as a mercenary and you just recruit a squad and do quests.  No real story structure.  Think of it as Fallout/Elder Scrolls combined with I dunno, freelancer and Mass Effect.


ME meets Jagged Alliance? I'm sold.



YES
EXACTLY!



Wait... What's Jagged Alliance?

Anything that could compare to the majesty of the Elder Scrolls games would have me sold pronto....


Edit: Thank you, KitsuneRommel.

Modifié par Rendar666, 01 mai 2010 - 07:28 .


#25
KitsuneRommel

KitsuneRommel
  • Members
  • 753 messages

cruc1al wrote...

The same movie is the same movie every time you watch it, though the way you view the movie can change. The same game isn't actually the same game every time you play it, meaning that 15 playthroughs of mass effect are actually 15 variations of mass effect.


Elder Scrolls: Daggerfall had random dungeons but that doesn't mean I'd play it 15 times.


Edit: http://en.wikipedia....Jagged_Alliance

Modifié par KitsuneRommel, 01 mai 2010 - 07:26 .