125 réponses à ce sujet

[ejoslin]

 If you're a dwarf, Harrowmont is clearly the better choice.



Edited to put screenshot back in!

Modifié par ejoslin, 13 avril 2011 - 07:57 .

[Giggles_Manically]

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

ejoslin wrote...

 If you're a dwarf, Harrowmont is clearly the better choice.

You need to make a mod and put this epilogue slide in. That would be just.....epic...lol!

[KingNothing125]

My first playthrough was with an Aeducan Warden, so I naturally felt compelled to side with Harrowmont, but since then I've gone with Bhelen.

Take a step back and look at it through a wider lense. Orzammar as it stands before the Warden comes along is clearly broken. An entire class of people are relegated to lives of poverty and crime for what reason? Unthinking, rigid tradition. That's it. A Duster might have a real knack for smithing, but they'll never know because he's got the brand, which automagically means he's worthless.

The Aeducan family may be the current rulers, and Harrowmont obviously has legitimate claim to the throne, but they're all (save Bhelen) supporters of the status-quo... a status-quo where swaths of dwarves are simply waiting around to die, and relations with the surface world are frosty at best.

Bhelen may be a ruthless and conniving little bastard who gets his entire family killed, but it's for the good of all dwarves. The rigid caste system gets softened up, and relations with the surface improve. Bhelen drags Orzammar towards the modern age, kicking and screaming, and a strong Orzammar is essential if Thedas is to ever be rid of the darkspawn once and for all.

Bhelen is the logical choice.

[ejoslin]

Hmmmm, wow, the picture not being in my post changes it entirely! /kicks photobucket...

[Costin_Razvan]

I don't need to link THIS now do I?!

[Fallstar]

Bhelen. He just makes for a far stronger king. Unless you're a dwarven noble. In which case its Harrowmont, and screw the Dwarven Kingdoms as a whole.

[thesuperdarkone]

Everyone knows the logical choice is Bhelen. Bhelen=Epic Win
Harrowmont= Epic FAIL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[ejoslin]

*sigh* And I don't even have a copy of that screenie on my computer... [edit: oh yes I do... Editing my original post]

I prefer Bhelen, for real and true. A weak man does not equal a good ruler, and an **** does not equal a poor ruler. Bhelen is good for Orzammar. It's a country in rapid decline, and it needs change, not the status quo. Even if Bhelen sets up a government that cant' be sustained for more than a few generations, that at least puts Orzammar into a position of strength for the next uprising. Harrowmont would most likely lead to this not being an issue at all as Orzammar would most likely be gone.

Modifié par ejoslin, 13 avril 2011 - 07:56 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

thesuperdarkone wrote...

Everyone knows the logical choice is Bhelen. Bhelen=Epic Win
Harrowmont= Epic FAIL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Allow me to illustrate your point

[Xavier St. Cloud]

Neither politician is a unifying force in Orzammar, usually leaving one dead and the other still on guard for his life.

Harrowmont is honorable but of the ineffectual conservatives.

Bhelen is more progressive but a lying, cheating son of a _____ who allies with sociopaths like the Carta and falsifies records.

As smart as he is, you would think Bhelen could have made some progressive steps without making a play for the throne. But that's just it, everything Bhelen does is for the good of Bhelen. Just look at his ____-eating grin in the Dwarf Noble's frame-up (if you're playing innocent). That's the Bhelen I would never trust the uncertain future to and whom I kill off each and every time.

Without some moral compass and prioritizing short-term gains, it's little wonder _____ bags like Hitler and Stalin rose to power.

Modifié par Xavier St. Cloud, 14 avril 2011 - 03:44 .

[Giggles_Manically]

I will just give a recap of my line of thinking in Orzamar:

Huh well there are castes thanks Helmi and Mr. Shaperate.
Ah it seems that the casteless dont get much love around here.

Oh I am sorry ma'am about your kid... wait... wut?
So your kid has to be killed because of who its parent was?
Also all these people are either going to end up as criminals or hookers because they dont exist....

Your entire culture oppresses and degrades all these people because of who they were born too...
Then Harrowmont supports that entire idea....

Well okay then.
Bhelen for President my friends!

[DreamSever]

bhelen although if you preserve the anvil harrowmont lives and does well, always felt bad when bhelen executes harrowmont when you pick him though, shouldve had a persuade option where you can convince bhelen not to kill him, i mean even harrowmont was ready to serve him too.


other then that bhelen is the best choice

[Rexiselic]

Bhelen may have been willing to abloish the caste system, but he would just as quickly create the same exact system if it benefited him.

I put Harrowmont on the throne because he does not seek the mantle of leadership for his own power, but as a duty to his people.

Moreover, in the end, I was made Paragon so I will be ruling Orzammar in truth regardless of who sits on the throne. Thusly, I will be able to achieve more than anything Bhelen could have and I will do so without losing my honor.

And on a personal level, my brother Trian had to be avenged.


In the words of King Alistair, "We're doing what's right, no matter what."

Modifié par Rexiselic, 15 avril 2011 - 05:50 .

[Giggles_Manically]

Rexiselic wrote...

Bhelen may have been willing to abloish the caste system, but he would just as quickly create the same exact system if it benefited him.

I put Harrowmont on the throne because he does not seek the mantle of leadership for his own power, but as a duty to his people.
Moreover, in the end, I was made Paragon so I will be ruling Orzammar in truth regardless of who sits on the throne. Thusly, I will be able to achieve more than anything Bhelen could have and I will do so without losing my honor.

And on a personal level, my brother Trian had to be avenged.


In the words of King Alistair, "We're doing what's right, no matter what."

So in other words:

[Rexiselic]

Historians do have a certain flare to their writings.

[happy_daiz]

DreamSever wrote...

bhelen although if you preserve the anvil harrowmont lives and does well, always felt bad when bhelen executes harrowmont when you pick him though, shouldve had a persuade option where you can convince bhelen not to kill him, i mean even harrowmont was ready to serve him too.


other then that bhelen is the best choice

That is a relief. I'm in the midst of double-crossing Bhelen right now, which I sort of stumbled upon.

Through any of my (many) playthroughs, it never occurred to me to play for both sides until this go-around. Right before I went to talk to Bhelen about receiving the Jarvia quest, I saw Dulin in Tapster's Tavern and offered to be an inside man for him/Harrowmont. Crazy that I never did this before! I was feeling a little guilty about siding with Bhelen, because I know Harrowmont's fate from my last pt, so the option you mention sounds like a good one. Thank you for saving me some guilt!

In the end, I'll most likely give the crown to Harrowmont. I've always destroyed the anvil (and Branka), so I'm looking forward to having some golem buddies helping a girl out, in the final battle. I just have to remember not to bring Shale on this little road trip. 

Modifié par happy_daiz, 15 avril 2011 - 06:04 .

[Giggles_Manically]

Uhm.

If you give Harrowmont the Anvil... things go badly.

[DreamSever]

happy_daiz wrote...

DreamSever wrote...

bhelen although if you preserve the anvil harrowmont lives and does well, always felt bad when bhelen executes harrowmont when you pick him though, shouldve had a persuade option where you can convince bhelen not to kill him, i mean even harrowmont was ready to serve him too.


other then that bhelen is the best choice

That is a relief. I'm in the midst of double-crossing Bhelen right now, which I sort of stumbled upon.

Through any of my (many) playthroughs, it never occurred to me to play for both sides until this go-around. Right before I went to talk to Bhelen about receiving the Jarvia quest, I saw Dulin in Tapster's Tavern and offered to be an inside man for him/Harrowmont. Crazy that I never did this before! I was feeling a little guilty about siding with Bhelen, because I know Harrowmont's fate from my last pt, so the option you mention sounds like a good one. Thank you for saving me some guilt!

In the end, I'll most likely give the crown to Harrowmont. I've always destroyed the anvil (and Branka), so I'm looking forward to having some golem buddies helping a girl out, in the final battle. I just have to remember not to bring Shale on this little road trip. 

i would still choose bhelen, you need shale in the deep roads with you anyway, to get the personal quest, i dont know if you can get it if you dont bring her along, havent tried, as i said there shouldve been a persaude check to keep harrowmont alive, thats my the only downside to bhelen.

[Verly]

yeah, Harowmont + Anvil = big failure

I have almost always chosen Bhelen. even when I play an Auducan. harromont..uh, I don't even! no, I'll just do whatever the Assembly tells me to do. after all they know best. oh your troops? I'll ask them for help. one of the last times I was actually going to side with harromont until this came up and she just couldn't do it. She had to do what was right for orzammar, not for her own pride. after all she was an Auducan. so she went through the deep roads on harromonts quest, but in the end chose her brother. she found out she liked being a warden so it worked out well for her anyway.

[DreamSever]

if your an auducan you can become king once harrowmont dies, thats the best ending for the dwarf noble


my mistake you become heir and have your name restored, still better then the bhelen choice for the dwarf noble

Modifié par DreamSever, 15 avril 2011 - 07:10 .

[Verly]

My Auducans are female. The heir thing is a male only ending I believe. it has to do with the child that your male auducan can have with the noble hunter from the origin.

my female Auducan's names are restored anyway, and they becomes paragons. They way I see it let Bhelen be king. my wardens becomes paragons and gets to have a house in their own names.

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

thesuperdarkone wrote...

Everyone knows the logical choice is Bhelen. Bhelen=Epic Win
Harrowmont= Epic FAIL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Allow me to illustrate your point

This is a fact as concrete and irrefutable as the Laws of Physics.

[ejoslin]

Verly wrote...

My Auducans are female. The heir thing is a male only ending I believe. it has to do with the child that your male auducan can have with the noble hunter from the origin.

my female Auducan's names are restored anyway, and they becomes paragons. They way I see it let Bhelen be king. my wardens becomes paragons and gets to have a house in their own names.

Nah, the thing about an Auducan becoming king is just in fanfics.  Harrowmont restores you to house Aeducan.  I don't think he declares an Aeducan heir -- he has his own house and family that he would give this to first.  But ultimately, it would be up to the assembly.

Modifié par ejoslin, 15 avril 2011 - 10:03 .

[Verly]

ejoslin wrote...

Verly wrote...

My Auducans are female. The heir thing is a male only ending I believe. it has to do with the child that your male auducan can have with the noble hunter from the origin.

my female Auducan's names are restored anyway, and they becomes paragons. They way I see it let Bhelen be king. my wardens becomes paragons and gets to have a house in their own names.

Nah, the thing about an Auducan becoming king is just in fanfics.  Harrowmont restores you to house Aeducan.  I don't think he declares an Aeducan heir -- he has his own house and family that he would give this to first.  But ultimately, it would be up to the assembly.

After thinking about it I realized that myself, but I didn't feel like correcting it.  I still prefer keeping her brother as king and being an Auducan again, as well as a living paragon.