137 réponses à ce sujet

[Aradace]

Valcutio wrote...

Major Spoilers. Duh.

So, Kelly and the rest of the crew got melted because I didn't race to the suicide mission after the Joker mission. Talk about pissed off.

Gamers should be rewarded for doing everything a game has to offer before finishing it - not punished. It would have been SO much easier to skip all the optional side quests and just finish the game but I invested the time to build up my team and obtain everything I could on Insanity before going for the last mission.

Instead of being rewarded, I lose my crew. What kind of stupid logic is this? I loved this game but this situation really killed a lot of the experience for me. My Team was perfectly fine but a lot of good that does me when my engineers get melted and screw over my save for mass effect 3.

The first time I played the game, I didn't do everything and the crew was fine (all my team survived and everything) - but for my second playthrough I wanted it to be a perfect Insanity game to port to Mass Effect 3. I did everything and because I didn't do it in a special order or whatever - I got screwed over.

Now I have to restart my game and make the same decisions I made the last time because I only used 5 save spots not including quick save. I just don't understand the thinking behind this mechanic at all. I guess you could give some lame excuse like, "You have to make the choice to either build up or go with what you have and that means consequences" - but the game mechanics should have been EXPLAINED in that case. Especially considering there's room to do 1 or 2 other missions before you have to go. These are details that shouldn't need to be guessed at - YOU SHOULD TELL US.

Anyways. Great game but talk about a stupid, supid, stupid game mechanic. 

- V

Real simple...Dont get the IFF until you have done all of the side missions etc ad nausium that you want to complete.  That way, the crew DOESNT get melted.

[Lord Nicholai]

jmood88 wrote...

I didn't know what would happen the first time and none of the crew members died.

Same here, and I did all assignments. I figured that the IFF mission was going to lead to the end of the game since it was heavily hinted

[Sir Ulrich Von Lichenstien]

Valcutio wrote...

Sir Ulrich Von Lichenstien wrote...

Lemonwizard wrote...

I still don't get why you can't just load a save right before the IFF.

This is what I was about to say, particular when I read the OPs comment about having to start from the very beginning again.

Unless the OP is one of those dimwitted people that doesn't save much in an rpg based game then you must surely have a save pre-IFF that isn't too far back.

In virtually all my playthroughs I tend to make a save just after doing the collector mission that I keep just so I can tinker with things.

And this is the kind of stupid post that I don't appreciate. To make a comparison.

First of all, if you read my original post instead of rushing to pipe in, you would have seen that I said I only used 5 save slots and quick save. Didn't see the purpose of using more. In hindsight, yes - it would have been really nice, but hardly dimwitted. Ironic you should use that term.

Sorry but your response is laughable. If this was after your first playthrough, I could understand it, but it wasn't, it was your second and thus you would have known that shortly after the IFF mission the Abduction sequence kicks in. Also if you had taken the time to read the forums rather than making a pathetic rant, you would've seen why/how you messed up. It ain't as if the game has only been out a week.

Valcutio wrote...

Did you even read my post? Are you a small child? I won't want to insult you if you're a kid. Nobody is debating that you should do the loyalty quests - just the timing.

Says the fool whining like a baby because he didn't have the intelligence to read the forums before making a rant.

Valcutio wrote...

Sir Ulrich Von Lichenstien wrote...

One thing to point out, after the crew gets taken. If you haven't done everything Miranda and Jacob talk about what things still need fixing. It is mentioned that by delaying you could be risking the lives of the crew. Shepard gets the chance to state going after the crew or mission comes first. Miranda does also comment on the fact that the crew knew this could be a one way trip and that their lives could be in jeopardy. It's actually also mentioned when you do Grunt's recruitment mission in one of the dialogues how the crew is expendable.

Yeah. Every mission is vital. Every loyalty quest is important. Everybody wants everything done right away. One mission in the entire game is actually time based and will result in screwing you over if not completed right away. One.

Now feel free to read the rest of the thread and maybe in the future you'll hesitate before jumping into a thread you don't understand.

Funny you should talk about reading seeing as your OP and your response to my post proves you didn't do any reading at all before making your rants.

To make it more clear to you I bolded the parts which obviously in my quote you didn't bother reading. Other than the mention of the crew being expendable when bringing Grunt onto the Ship. The only real times when Miranda and Jacob talk about urgency is after the collector ship mission and after crew is taken. During both instances you are given hints that firstly going after the IFF right away could be trouble. and secondly not going through the relay after the abduction could cause trouble for the crew. Is that really so hard to understand?

Also one thing to point out, it isn't just one mission that has a timer.

Horizon - Occurs once Shepard has done the initial set of Dossiers
Collector Ship mission - Occurs once Shepard has 8 squadmates and has done 5 missions post-Horizon
Abduction sequence - Occurs 1-2 missions after obtaining the IFF
Death of crew members - half crew dead if Shepard does 1 mission after Abduction sequence, all the crew apart from Chakwas if  Shepard does 2 main missions (recruitment or loyalty) or 4 N7 missions (or 1 main mission and 2 N7 missions)

So there is several missions on timers. Its just that the abduction sequence to death of crew members has more of an impact and for obvious reasons too seeing as it is the only one where lives of your team are at stake. As I have said and others have also stated to you, the importance of going through the relay at that point is stated in obvious terms by Jacob after they are taken.

As for doing everything, again as pointed out by others, as long as you got a good set of loyal people, unless you hadn't done the 3 main upgrades for the ship you could have left all the other stuff to do post-suicide mission.

[Sina84]

Okay, compair this to ME1. Once you get the option to go to Ilos, it's an obvious notification that you need to knock off the rest of the sidequests before continuing on if you want to have a perfect game. A cushy safe point provided by Bioware. Logically, the Omega 4 relay would be the safepoint in ME2. Like Ilos, it's the logical endgame and something you should avoid until everything else is done.

The fact that an invisible timer starts when you pick up the Reaper IFF is really a d*ckmove since you don't even know you're on a timer until you see Kelly liquified. Now, if this were a real life situation, then yes, ofcourse you're in a hurry to save your crew. But since this is a game, and the general rule of thumb in games is that all urgency is false so you're never really forced or rushed into doing something you're not ready for, that IFF timer is really a suprise.

I think you're too hard on the OP, nomather how whiny he is, since you shouldn't have to read forums and walkthroughs to make sense of a game. If your crew survives the first time you play since you rushed through it, you really have no way of knowing that they even can die.

Now, again, I thought the timer was a refreshing game mechanic and I liked the idea, but point of all this and why it didn't work is that it's ultimately impossible to have a perfect game in ME2. You WANT to go to the IFF early because it's obvious you'll get your last partymember there, and in RPG's you really want your party full as early as possible so you won't miss character content. But the game punishes you for recruiting Legion before the very last second. Plus, the whole game is about being as prepared as possible for the suicide mission, which means doing every single sidemission before you pick up Legion, meaning you'll miss most of his content anyway.

You could save sidemissions for the sole purpose of unlocking his dialogue after the suicide mission, but that feels kind of counterproductive to the whole "preparing" thing, and is as anticlimactic an endgame as it gets.

Again, I love ME2. But it annoys me when people blindly defend its faults to the death. That's not helping Bioware in any way. If they had added a short little filler mission after the IFF mission that acted as the real timer starter/abduction, that would've been so much less awkward and given room for Legion.

Modifié par Sina84, 07 mai 2010 - 07:39 .

[Sharn01]

It was obviously hinted that the IFF mission would force the main story forward but gave you all the time you wanted before that. While you had no way of knowing the game would not give you an additional time to get things done, its pretty much an old school rpg rule that when the game tells you this is the time to build up your character you do so, because you do not know when the next chance will be.

[Al-the-Catman]

The reaper IFF is a double edged sword: on 1 side it pressures players & gives them a greater sense of urgency to add to the drama, on the other side, it pisses people off who aren't prepared & want to experiment with Legion, as the potentially last character, in different missions to see what they would be like. I would like to use Legion in other character recruitment missions before my crew dies, is that too much to ask? If I had already finished all the story missions up to the pt where the Collectors take every1 minus Joker, I'd be fine w/ it, but the 1st time I thought, "What the $*@%!!!" 2nd time I made sure I saved every1, though. PC users are lucky enough to hack the game & have any1 they want in their party at any time, why couldn't Bioware have given Xbox/console people a choice as to which way we would want to play, like asking us at the beginning of the game or on a repeat playthrough? The way BW implemented the Collector kidnapping was atrocious in my opinion, especially if I'm nowhere near a mission area or I finished all other missions! (Every squad member can now magically fit into the tiny shuttle but I could still only choose 2 of them anyway? [listen to EDI or Joker's dialogue carefully before leaving to "hear" what I mean]) I know its "just a game" but this still seems as lousy writing on BW's part, at least let it happen after finishing an actual mission, not just some random joyride! (rant =-S)

[MrNose]

Sina84 wrote...

Again, I love ME2. But it annoys me when people blindly defend its faults to the death. That's not helping Bioware in any way. If they had added a short little filler mission after the IFF mission that acted as the real timer starter/abduction, that would've been so much less awkward and given room for Legion.

It annoys me when people refer to to anyone who disagrees with them as 'blindly defending faults.'  I hated the lack of urgency in ME1.  I did pretty much none of the sidequests because the mission was called "Race Against Time" and I was RPing it.  In my first playthrough of ME2 I did the IFF and still had a lot more to do afterwards.  The game gave me a clear choice: "Go now, or prepare and deal with the consequences." I prepared.   I loved that there were consequences to me doing this.  

You may not like the game mechanic, but to me talking about this mechanic isn't about defending a fault, it's about applauding what I consider to be an excellent design choice.  

[Sina84]

MrNose wrote...

Sina84 wrote...

Again, I love ME2. But it annoys me when people blindly defend its faults to the death. That's not helping Bioware in any way. If they had added a short little filler mission after the IFF mission that acted as the real timer starter/abduction, that would've been so much less awkward and given room for Legion.

It annoys me when people refer to to anyone who disagrees with them as 'blindly defending faults.'  I hated the lack of urgency in ME1.  I did pretty much none of the sidequests because the mission was called "Race Against Time" and I was RPing it.  In my first playthrough of ME2 I did the IFF and still had a lot more to do afterwards.  The game gave me a clear choice: "Go now, or prepare and deal with the consequences." I prepared.   I loved that there were consequences to me doing this.  

You may not like the game mechanic, but to me talking about this mechanic isn't about defending a fault, it's about applauding what I consider to be an excellent design choice.  

The fault I'm talking about is that in order to get the "good" ending you're forced to basically skip Legion til the very end of the game and miss most of his content. You concider that a good design choice? Concidering all the extra potential dialogue Legion has throughout the game? Again, I liked the idea, but it was executed poorly.

[EmperorSahlertz]

You can jsut save Legion for the continued play after you've been to the collector base. I only completed Main assignments during my first playthrogh (might have been one or two odd side quests) and had plenty of assignments to complete afterwards with Legion, no biggie really.

[jwalker]

What I hate about this mechanic, is the whole thing with Legion.



If you build up your team and buy every upgrade posible, leaving the IFF for last, that means you will have Legion available for only 2 more missions. And he's a great character and great squadmate.



Or, you can get the IFF right away and someone will die. Your crew because you didn't rescue them after they were kidnapped, or some other squadmate because they weren't loyal.



I mean, if you do things right, Legion will available for 2 missions.

That's major suckiness to me.

[Substance-E]

jwalker wrote...

What I hate about this mechanic, is the whole thing with Legion.

If you build up your team and buy every upgrade posible, leaving the IFF for last, that means you will have Legion available for only 2 more missions. And he's a great character and great squadmate.

Or, you can get the IFF right away and someone will die. Your crew because you didn't rescue them after they were kidnapped, or some other squadmate because they weren't loyal.

I mean, if you do things right, Legion will available for 2 missions.
That's major suckiness to me.

Use a mod to get in in your group early on, they programed and recorded audio for him on the recruitment missions, Tali even tries to shoot him on Haestrom...

But ya, he gets the shaft and it does indeed blow...

[jwalker]

Substance-E wrote...

Use a mod to get in in your group early on, they programed and recorded audio for him on the recruitment missions, Tali even tries to shoot him on Haestrom...

But ya, he gets the shaft and it does indeed blow...

What mod ? Gibbed's save editor ?

[Privateerkev]

Substance-E wrote...

jwalker wrote...

What I hate about this mechanic, is the whole thing with Legion.

If you build up your team and buy every upgrade posible, leaving the IFF for last, that means you will have Legion available for only 2 more missions. And he's a great character and great squadmate.

Or, you can get the IFF right away and someone will die. Your crew because you didn't rescue them after they were kidnapped, or some other squadmate because they weren't loyal.

I mean, if you do things right, Legion will available for 2 missions.
That's major suckiness to me.

Use a mod to get in in your group early on, they programed and recorded audio for him on the recruitment missions, Tali even tries to shoot him on Haestrom...

But ya, he gets the shaft and it does indeed blow...

Don't need a mod to get Legion into Tali's recruitment mission. Just don't recruit her until after you get Legion...