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[funkymonkey2]

Part of the game that really bugged me was when the Normandy got locked down and the Council disregarded the Reapers and the Conduit.

Reason being, initially, they were fully willing to take Tali's recording as gospel. To the extent of essentially court-martialling Saren. That's a pretty big deal, a move like that is like they're saying the evidence is 100% reliable. Enough to wholly discredit one of their super elite special agents beyond any doubt.

But towards the end, for no apparent reason, they throw out their first judgment and say yeah, the recording's BS. For that to be true, Tali would have to either be Saren's agent or the recording would otherwise be a setup. But it's pretty clear by that time that the Council's invested a lot in Tali's evidence. They turn Saren, and turn Shepard into a Spectre.

Plus someone else pointed out the Council could use biotics to link and verify Shepard's vision. Presumably with those kinds of abilities, they would have some sort of lie detection process anyway, and maybe Asari would be considered the most reliable race.

So I don't get it. Why go to all the trouble, and invest so much, and just suddenly backpedal at the end for no given reason? I realize the game has to continue but in contrast to the whole investment in the rest of the story, that bit seems like a big oversight.

It would have been a lot more interesting if, towards the end, they found out Tali was an agent or a dupe, or some other reason the evidence may have been fabricated...that would have made any further drama much more interesting and less "wtf?" All Bioware would have had to do was add a little dialogue or a cutscene.

(Also, how can billions and billions of individuals, and so many races, be represented by only three individuals? You'd think it would be more like the U.N., with a lot of people, and different political factions or governments even within the same race. Why wouldn't some systems or clusters have their own, seperate governments represented? Really they could have just put more characters in the cutscenes, and still only had the main three talk...)

[Jsmith0730]

Well, Tali's recording only incriminated Saren in the attack on Eden Prime. They were still skeptical about the Reapers, believing Saren was only using the Reapers myth to control the Geth.



They were also unwilling to risk war with the Terminus systems, which is why they would only guard all the Mass Relays but not pursue him to Ilos.



Personally, I think the council might very well be under the control of an evolved type of indoctrination which is why they play down the Reaper threat. Far-fetched theory, maybe, but seriously... there just comes a point where they would have to at least CONSIDER the possibility. They don't have to make it public knowledge, but at the very least have Shepard or another Spectre look into any available leads like any files Saren may have kept for clues.



Just feels like they're somehow being manipulated without being under total control... the ultimate goal of the Indoctrination IMO.

[Arawn-Loki]

The Council never believed in the reality of the Reapers; the Salarian Councilor was interested for a few seconds but he himself judged the Reapers were a myth Saren was exploiting to manipulate the Geth.

However, you are generally right. Their disbelief seems to have been exaggerated for the purposes of the story.

Modifié par Arawn-Loki, 07 mai 2010 - 03:18 .

[funkymonkey2]

Jsmith0730 wrote...

Well, Tali's recording only incriminated Saren in the attack on Eden Prime. They were still skeptical about the Reapers, believing Saren was only using the Reapers myth to control the Geth.

They were also unwilling to risk war with the Terminus systems, which is why they would only guard all the Mass Relays but not pursue him to Ilos.

Personally, I think the council might very well be under the control of an evolved type of indoctrination which is why they play down the Reaper threat. Far-fetched theory, maybe, but seriously... there just comes a point where they would have to at least CONSIDER the possibility. They don't have to make it public knowledge, but at the very least have Shepard or another Spectre look into any available leads like any files Saren may have kept for clues.

Just feels like they're somehow being manipulated without being under total control... the ultimate goal of the Indoctrination IMO.

Those are some really good points. The Terminus systems seem to be loosely affilliated at best, and far behind the Council in numbers and technology. But that's just monday-morning quarterbacking.

I really like your theory of indoctrination being part of the Citadel. After all, whether the Reapers developed the Citadel or not, they had ample opportunity to build in such a thing. Mind control takes several forms in the game. If the Reapers had the chance to subjugate the Citadel inhabitants, even a subtle way, I can't see how they wouldn't do it. Maybe just make them a little more docile, or doubtful of themselves. It could be in the air, or water, or something like that signal Sovereign uses. There could even be an extended process of full indoctrination, something hidden in the depths of the Citadel, that draws and traps those who are fully susceptible. The Reapers could have sleeper agents even before returning to the Milky Way.

That's a very interesting thought. It makes you wonder how far you could trust anyone who's been to the Citadel at all. For that matter, the same technology could be embedded in any alien (or Prothean) technology. The beacons would have been the perfect vehicle for Reaper indoctrination. Even Shepard could be affected.

[Kid_SixXx]

funkymonkey2 wrote...

(Also, how can billions and billions of individuals, and so many races, be represented by only three individuals? You'd think it would be more like the U.N., with a lot of people, and different political factions or governments even within the same race. Why wouldn't some systems or clusters have their own, seperate governments represented? Really they could have just put more characters in the cutscenes, and still only had the main three talk...)

While the Council does make decisions for any overarching issues that concern Council space, they really don't have the jurisdiction to dictate terms to the various governments of the various races. 

The Council is there to serve as a place to help foster cooperation between the Council races and associate races like the Hanar, Volus, Elcor, and the Drell.

[CompositeGNFNR]

Um no, the keepers are not reapers.

[Stinkface27]

Jsmith0730 wrote...

Well, Tali's recording only incriminated Saren in the attack on Eden Prime. They were still skeptical about the Reapers, believing Saren was only using the Reapers myth to control the Geth.

They were also unwilling to risk war with the Terminus systems, which is why they would only guard all the Mass Relays but not pursue him to Ilos.

Personally, I think the council might very well be under the control of an evolved type of indoctrination which is why they play down the Reaper threat. Far-fetched theory, maybe, but seriously... there just comes a point where they would have to at least CONSIDER the possibility. They don't have to make it public knowledge, but at the very least have Shepard or another Spectre look into any available leads like any files Saren may have kept for clues.

Just feels like they're somehow being manipulated without being under total control... the ultimate goal of the Indoctrination IMO.

This exactly.

[Cinnamon Lightning]

The message you get from Chorban is just telling you what you already know from the end of ME1