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Creating a personality and roleplaying it consistently


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#1
Discus

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Hi fellow Dragon age players.

I have played a lot of pen and paper roleplaying games even before starting to play video games. I heard of people creating characters with background story and personality for their Warden character that will influence the way they make decisions and what they prioritize. What they will answer in dialogue, what choices they will make from a moral/ethical/personal point of view, what quests they choose to persue etc.

I would like to try this because I feel one of my main troubles while playing through the game the first time was that I kept on reloading to find out what was the most beneficial dialogue options, and constantly having a hard time to make a choice that made sense for the character when for example (SPOILER)..... deciding who should be the dwarfen king etc.

So I would like some tips on how others go about roleplaying the game consistently. Would be great if you would like to share your experiences.

Cheers,
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Modifié par Discus, 08 mai 2010 - 10:21 .


#2
yummysoap

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It's not always easy. Bioware are usually great with extremely diverse personality options but they're not necessarily consistent with it. The Urn of Sacred Ashes is a good example [SPOILER OH GOD DON'T READ]- in previous conversations you can establish your character as a non-Andrastian, but come Ashes time there's really only two choices: destroy 'em or fall to your knees before 'em. Should you choose the former it's then assumed you worship a crazy dragon cult. Most of the dialogue will reflect this in some way or another.

#3
soteria

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My first couple games I roleplayed a personality... I think it's actually pretty easy in DA since you don't get the blatant light side/dark side or good/evil from KoTOR or NWN. The reason you have a hard time making the choices is because they are hard choices, and the game doesn't usually telegraph what the "right" answer is. Do you want to make a deal with a demon for a reward, figuring you won't personally face the consequences, or do you turn down the offer because you think that's wrong?



Usually I refer to either my origin or what I think my companions would think of something, assuming my character cares.



Spoilers below.



I disagree with the specific example above. There's really no reason to take the "evil" route unless you're going along with the crazy dragon cult... a normal well-adjusted "non-Andrastian" who just disagrees with the Chantry probably wouldn't defile a dead person's remains for no reason, and you do have reason to take the ashes (you need them, period).




#4
Bigdoser

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yummysoap wrote...

It's not always easy. Bioware are usually great with extremely diverse personality options but they're not necessarily consistent with it. The Urn of Sacred Ashes is a good example [SPOILER OH GOD DON'T READ]- in previous conversations you can establish your character as a non-Andrastian, but come Ashes time there's really only two choices: destroy 'em or fall to your knees before 'em. Should you choose the former it's then assumed you worship a crazy dragon cult. Most of the dialogue will reflect this in some way or another.


All I will say is take oghren with you on that quest

#5
Mlai00

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DAO helps you do this (roleplay) more than other RPGs, because every time you start a game you get a detailed origin/prologue of your character.

Other games make you improvise your blank character as you play along. The genius of DAO is that it gives you a fundation to play the chara off of.

So, all you need to do is immerse yourself in the chara's origin. You will then make the consistent choices.

#6
Icinix

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I role-play my character as if their life paralleled my own. That way I never need to think too hard about what my character would do in a decision.



I also feel guilty very easily about hurting people in games, so I can't role-play anything outside of my own mentality anyway. :( I couldn't even use Force Grip / Lightning in Jedi Knight : Dark Forces 2

#7
maxernst

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Yummysoap, I didn't find it that hard to imagine falling to my knees in that circumstance, even though my character is a bit skeptical going in (perhaps less so thereafter). Even if you don't believe in the Maker, it's been a pretty impressive display (and yes, I heard Oghren's comments, but still...).



But yeah, there are times when the exact option you want isn't there. I find it's not quite as hard to RP in DA:O as in a lot of other games.




#8
AlanC9

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I find that it's easiest to play the first time with just my own responses. In DA I thought human mage was easiest for this; since mages (magi?) are outsiders, you're not committed to any particular cultural background, etc After than, I try to play someone consistent with the backgrounds; I agree that DA 's origins are helpful for designing a character.



All of my characters tend to do the same thing in a couple of major areas -- the Circle and Nature of the Beast, for instance. I'm not sure I'll ever see the alternative resolutions.

#9
Giggles_Manically

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Its a blast to play a Dalish who always bugs people for believing in the Maker, but somehow gets to like Leliana.


#10
maxernst

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I found playing the human rogue a little tricky because it seems very odd for a noble to be a rogue...so I decided my character must be a bit of a rebel in certain ways, and he doesn't conform to a lot of "normal" noble beliefs.

#11
Discus

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Those of you who do roleplay strictly. Do you set up some kind of rules or ideas about how your character would react in certain situations or do you simply decide whether he is a good guy or not and then make decisions as you go along. I think it would be interesting to go deeper and set up a kind of system for guidance. Since the game is not really about good or evil but rather about personal choice and personal beliefs I guess roleplaying needs to be more complex than a simple choice of evil/good alignment.



Of course some decisions are harder to shape in your desire because of the fact that the dialogue options are chosen and not written by yourself.



Also, I found that I missed out on some quests like certain companion quets because I for example decided to be clear with sticking to one romance and therefore did not flatter anyone else. I guess this is consistent roleplaying but it also puts you in a position where you miss out on parts of the game which is a pity. How do you deal with these kind of things?



By the way I also just wanted to add that I think this is a fantastic game! Enjoyed it so much and I am looking forward to the continuation of the story!

#12
yasuraka.hakkyou

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Giggles_Manically wrote...

Its a blast to play a Dalish who always bugs people for believing in the Maker, but somehow gets to like Leliana.


She's my favorite romance methinks, but on my dalish, that actually really started to bug me. go figure eh?

#13
Maria Caliban

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If you want a satisfying RP experience, you need to be very broad about your character's personality.



'Nice, pious, and helpful' were keywords for my first Warden. If you put the same detail into a PC that you would a PnP character, there will inevitably be conflicts.

#14
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You are definately right about thtat Maria Caliban. Still though, did you ever get into situation where you missed out on certain things because of your PCs personality, besides being good or evil. For example the keywords you describe must have made your charcter and Morrigan quite on edge with each other since she generally is not into the nice and helpful way of treating others.

#15
Tirigon

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I always try to RP a certain character, but usually I decide as I´d do in Real life, then. Sometimes I even change my attitude depending on NPCs, like...













SPOILER!!!!!!!!!!!



















today when I wanted to kill Connor. I talked to him first and after that I thought that he is innocent and battled the demon in the Fade instead.

#16
Khayness

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Well my 1st character was basically a do-gooder without any roleplay plans, but I was experiencing the game for the first time.

Then came my mage. I already knew it's gonna be a bloodmage, and somehow a relatively good but cinical person. It's origin story had great potential, he turned out to be a templar hating lad who had no problems turning to blood magic believing he can control it and use it for the greater good (shame it sucks compared to the ingame hype).

I enjoyed my 3rd (HNM rogue) character the most RP wise, the magnificent bastard. Romanced no companions but bedded every single chick in the game, said every pun what was there to be said and ended up being a Prince-Consort.

Now I'm replaying my first character (HNM warrior) from the Lothering save, making him the hopeless tragic hero. Lost everything, found friends and love, then sacrificing his life to save them all.

#17
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Khayness, how did you bed all the girls without romancing, thought that was impossible?



Anyway, so these charactersyou talked about. Did they come out of planning beforehand or did their personalities appear while playing?

#18
yasuraka.hakkyou

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you can break up romances with ____, so that's how you hump around. that and / or proper timing.

#19
Khayness

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Discus wrote...

Khayness, how did you bed all the girls without romancing, thought that was impossible?

Anyway, so these charactersyou talked about. Did they come out of planning beforehand or did their personalities appear while playing?


Right, my bad, I bedded every NPC chick.

Yup, they were planned after the first playthrough, but I couldn't justify my feelings about bloodmagic because there weren't any options, and the "Wardens accept all kind of help" mentality doesn't do justice about how I really see things. Now that I think about it my mage's personality is similar to Anders', except I don't do jokes. After Awakenings get patched it will be fun to carry over my mage and meet with him.

Playing paper 'n pen RPGs helped me a lot with forming characters beforehead. I played everything from honorable knight through demon posessed schizofrenic wizard to loyal fanatic assasin of the state. Fun times.

#20
maxernst

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Besides, there's enough grey in a lot of places that two do-gooders might well do different things. For example, there's no reason you can't play a chantry-hating blood mage, a devout and honorable noble and a wily rogue could all be committed to doing the right thing and make different choices.

#21
yasuraka.hakkyou

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^ DA is all about shades of grey. and a little of your personality almost inevitably makes its way into each of your characters.

#22
yummysoap

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soteria wrote...

My first couple games I roleplayed a personality... I think it's actually pretty easy in DA since you don't get the blatant light side/dark side or good/evil from KoTOR or NWN. The reason you have a hard time making the choices is because they are hard choices, and the game doesn't usually telegraph what the "right" answer is. Do you want to make a deal with a demon for a reward, figuring you won't personally face the consequences, or do you turn down the offer because you think that's wrong?

Usually I refer to either my origin or what I think my companions would think of something, assuming my character cares.

Spoilers below.

I disagree with the specific example above. There's really no reason to take the "evil" route unless you're going along with the crazy dragon cult... a normal well-adjusted "non-Andrastian" who just disagrees with the Chantry probably wouldn't defile a dead person's remains for no reason, and you do have reason to take the ashes (you need them, period).


In retrospect I probably didn't offer the best example - it was the only one I could think of at the time. To make myself more clear, I wasn't suggesting there be any justification for destroying the Ashes (which is unnecessary even to the most hear-felt atheist), it was more to do with the fact that the dialogue options at that point were more or less split into two: dragon worshipper or Andrastian.

But again, now that I think about it - it would be pretty petty to have a character continue to disavow the religion when the ashes are healing Eamon before his very eyes.. It was a poor example.

I guess my point was that you can roleplay personalities but there's not always going to be the perfect dialogue option for you. Sometimes there will be, and you'll think "crikey my character's writing himself", and sometimes there are a few awkward bits where nothing you say really mixes well with the character you've created. Not that I have a problem with that - I am aware that it's impossible to accomodate everyone's desired PC.

#23
yasuraka.hakkyou

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well, (and the mods will want to smite me)



SPOILER



you can obviously side with the cultists, get the blood, and either then or after the fact, betray them because they're crazy.



END SPOILER

#24
ObserverStatus

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maxernst wrote...

Besides, there's enough grey in a lot of places that two do-gooders might well do different things. For example, there's no reason you can't play a chantry-hating blood mage, a devout and honorable noble and a wily rogue could all be committed to doing the right thing and make different choices.

So trading the soul of the child to the desire demon could be considered doing the right thing in the case of the bloodmage?

#25
searanox

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Dragon Age is actually a pretty crappy game for role-playing, I find. There's a lot of great dialogue and the like in there, and the lack of a moral compass is very nice, but there are too many broken game systems dragging it down.

For one, the moral compass is gone, but it's replaced with companion approval. This means that you are constantly gaming the system to maximise your +'s and minimise your -'s, which can lead to not bringing characters to certain places, or not asking certain hard questions of them. The consequences for maintaining approval are so dire (party members leaving you), and the benefits so great (massive and arbitrary stat bonuses) that they effectively prevent you from roleplaying. This would simply not be an issue if there were no obvious numbers available to the player, since you'd have to rely upon things like dialogue responses and behaviour, rather than numbers.

Another major problem is that BioWare have a very bad habit of giving highly differential rewards for different choices. It's one thing to give you a certain reward for one option and another reward for another; it's totally something else entirely to give you wholly different rewards in a totally unpredictable way. Although this isn't so bad playing the first time through the game, it means that on subsequent plays, you're almost guaranteed to pick the option with the best rewards, rather than the one with the best role-playing potential. The ultimate example of this is in Redcliffe: choosing to abandon the town rather than save it foreits a massive amount of the game, including quests not directly related to Redcliffe itself. Furthermore, it opens up absolutely no new options to compensate for it. This means that even as an "evil" or just "jerkass" character, the rewards for doing the "right" thing vastly outweigh any other possibilities.

The third biggest problem with roleplaying is that sometimes the quests shoehorn you into particular goals. Part of this is simply because all games have to be at least somewhat linear, but part of it is also due to bad design. Let's examine a few quests: although Dragon Age's main quests are pretty good in terms of letting you do X, Y, or Z, the side-quests are very different. Side-quests in Dragon Age tend to have only one possible outcome, and they very often only have one method for solving them. The Blackstone Irregulars in particular have quite a few of these, such as bringing in people for desertion. While it seems totally logical to expect to be able to do any number of things (accept a bribe, persuade them to return to the Irregulars, lure them into a trap, use magic to brainwash them, etc.), you only have one option, which is to kill them. The game attempts to pass this off by claiming that it was "the only way" or some such, but this sort of explanation rarely stands up under any scrutiny.

This wouldn't be such a huge deal if it wasn't for the fact that this is an RPG we're talking about, and an open-ended one at that. What is absolutely integral to RPGs, and Western RPGs especially, is that the player has freedom to explore and negotiate a very realistic, multi-faceted world, and has a large amount of choice in resolving situations. The ultimate example of this might be Fallout, but there are other games that pull it off - some of them from BioWare, in fact. I would actually argue that it's more important for side-quests to contain major decision-making and player freedom than it is for the main storyline, because a) side-quests are by nature optional, and so choices can have less bearing on the story, but still have high emotional value, and B) side-quests are where the world is most fleshed out; they tend to have more variety than the main story and allow for the world to shine through not just in terms of epic set pieces, but also in terms of day-to-day life.

I feel like one of the reasons Dragon Age has such limited opportunity with role-playing, especially when it comes to side-quests, is because of the way the game mechanics are structured. Many old-school PC RPGs have discrete skills for a wide variety of situations; to use Fallout again, you have combat skills, but also non-combat skills like Speech, Science, Repair, Outdoorsman, etc. These skills have just as much effect on your progress through the game as your core combat skills, to the point where I usually prioritise them.

By contrast, in Dragon Age, most skills are centred around killing things, with only a few exceptions for persuasion and pickpocketing. As a result, Dragon Age has to use dialogue for a large number of these role-playing elements. You can't "interact" with the world using your Nature skill, you can only at best do a skill check in dialogue, and even then this happens about once in the game, if I remember correctly. That you can't go into combat at any point in the game is also extremely limiting to how you can resolve situations. Limitations are necessary in games to keep content bloat under control, but by smartly designing game systems and scenarios, much of this work can be done for you already, and appears out of the player's own actions and choices through gameplay, rather than through a menu.

Modifié par searanox, 10 mai 2010 - 06:32 .