34 réponses à ce sujet

[Doriath]

I just want to place this build here for people looking for advice on Engineer builds on Insanity. There are some bad ones online that I swept through before I started and all they did was get me killed.

Anyway, here it is:

Overload (take Heavy Overload)
Incinerate (take Incineration Blast)
Combat Drone (take Explosive Drone)
Tech Mastery (take Demolisher)

Bonus Talent: There are a few ways to go here, all good options.
1) Geth Shield Boost (take Improved version)
2) Warp Ammo (take Heavy version; yes, you're allies will need a Squad version from someone else)
3) Armor Piercing Ammo (take Squad version)

Basically, I got combat drone and tech mastery up to three asap and then starting working on overload/incinerate. You can survive with garrus/miranda until you start getting those 2 powers stronger. In combat, I lock down an elite enemy with the drone, and start stripping defenses thereafter. Cleanup with appropriate weapon, rinse and repeat. Once you get all your powers up to three you start seeing that combining a lvl 3 incinerate/heavy warp is enough to start wiping out minions. As long as you move cautiously, it's pretty easy. The engineer's ability to strip defenses is invauable, and enemies will die faster simply because you don't have to grind down anyone's defenses, they're gone real quick.

I know some people think it's a big deal even though its not, but I chose sniper rifle training on the collector ship. Honestly you could go any one of them and be fine (assuming you have the eviscerator). I found it was nice to have the vyper in some instances. Still, I really didn't see any point in the game where I would've greatly benefited from assault rifle training. Fact is, the carnifex is you're best bet against armor and the tempest/locust handle enerything else. In fact, the locust probably makes assault rifle training redundant. All in all, sniper rifles atleast gives you a safer option against heavy weapon users.

Just to ellaborate a bit on the bonus talent thing. If your going to take a defensive power, always take the geth shield. it receives duration, and (I think) damage bonuses from tech upgrades just like you're offensive powers.

With ammo powers, the reason I suggest heavy warp ammo over squad version is because the damage bonus isn't large enough without heavy. Even though warp ammo covers more bases than armor piercing, barriers can be easily handled by one or two allies sporting warp and the fact is, armor will be more prevalent than barriers.

Having the higher damage bonus from armor piercing is more valuable in my opinion and the squad version of armor piercing is enough of a damage bonus for you and you're squad, so you don't need an ally to upgrade an ammo power just for them to use. This will allow greater tactical flexibilty when choosing you're squad for specific missions, because you won't have to drag around someone else just for squad ammo.

I chose armor piercing. Geth shield could also work. Keep in mind that once you get stripped of it during combat a recast will cost you a long global cooldown. I thought I got more use out of an ammo power, but you may find different, especially if you don't like mircomanaging you're squad's movements.

A few tips I can give:
1) Never import a ME2 Engineer for Insanity. It's easier to start from a ME1 import or simply a new character.
2) Put you're drone on an elite enemy. It's always better to lock down the guy with 2 levels of defense than attempt to get maximum explosion damage on a group of minions.
3) Don't take a Tech character as an ally. You don't need further help against shields, or two or three combat drones running around. Allies should fill needs you're character can't. Miranda is the exception here. For example, you need help against barriers? Take character with Warp (evole to heavy Warp early).
4) You do NOT need a tank (ie Grunt). Anyone who tells you that you do is stupid. Fact is, no ally on insanity can tank for you, not even Grunt unless you micromanage every move he makes and upgrade his health to the maximum and bring Miranda. Even then it's not a good idea.
5) Don't worry about ally weapons. There are only two allies capable of outputting damage from weapons alone that can rival Shepard, and that's Legion (Widow+sniper upgrades+Miranda) and Zaeed (Vindicator+Warlord evo+Miranda), and you still probably need lvl 4 warp or armor piercing ammo on top of that. Even then, they're still allies. Micromanaging ally powers will always be better than allies who's greatest asset is their gun... just the facts.

Anyway that's about all I can say without making it any more confusing that it probably already is. Engineer is a good class to make an insanity run, you just need to micromanage power use and squad movement if you chose it. If you won't do that, than you're better off with the soldier.

[swk3000]

1. Fortification, Geth Shield Boost, and Fortification are some of the worst bonus powers you can take. I'd put them on par with Shredder Ammo for sheer uselessness.



2. Why is importing a bad idea? As far as I can tell, it actually makes things easier. More money, more resources, and you start of at a higher level at the beginning of the game, so you get stronger sooner. How is that bad?



3. Thane also has the +50% Weapon Damage skill that Zaeed has, so he's a solid person to take with you for just weapon damage.



4. Two Tech members can actually be a good thing. Miranda + Garrus + Shepard could all but rape Haestrom with their three Overloads.



I can't speak for most of your advice, as I've not played an Engineer, but those are the points I can comment on.

[cruc1al]

swk3000 wrote...

2. Why is importing a bad idea? As far as I can tell, it actually makes things easier. More money, more resources, and you start of at a higher level at the beginning of the game, so you get stronger sooner. How is that bad?

Because your enemies are ahead of you. In a normal playthrough at level 20 for example, you'd have almost all upgrades and your enemies would be level 20. In an imported playthrough, your enemies are still level 20 but you won't have any upgrades.

[swk3000]

Ah. I fail at reading comprehension after waking up. I missed the 'ME2' bit.



Anyway, the problem he mentions is a problem with any class, not just Engineers. Frankly, I figure it's common sense.

[Doriath]

swk3000 wrote...
1. Fortification, Geth Shield Boost, and Fortification are some of the worst bonus powers you can take. I'd put them on par with Shredder Ammo for sheer uselessness.

Well I didn't take geth shield boost, but I've seen Engineer Insanity runs with it and for a character that has naturally lacking defense and weapon damage, it can help alleviate that. However, I did say that I wouldn't take it because of the long global cooldown. (even with tech mastery)

swk3000 wrote...
2. Why is importing a bad idea? As far as I can tell, it actually makes things easier. More money, more resources, and you start of at a higher level at the beginning of the game, so you get stronger sooner. How is that bad?

Edit: Cruc1al already beat me to the punch on that.

swk3000 wrote...
3. Thane also has the +50% Weapon Damage skill that Zaeed has, so he's a solid person to take with you for just weapon damage.

Yes, however he doesn't have an assault rifle. The only sniper I would take with me expecting significant weapon damage is Legion with the Widow. Even though the bonuses are the same the weapon statistics and effectiveness against defenses means that Zaeed's Vindicator will output more damage than the vyper or the mantis in Thane's hands. Granted I think Thane is the better party member due to Warp & Pull, but that's beside the point.

swk3000 wrote...
4. Two Tech members can actually be a good thing. Miranda + Garrus + Shepard could all but rape Haestrom with their three Overloads.

True enough. I was speaking more along the lines of generalized play than party selection for specific missions when I said that about tech characters in an engineer's squad.

I can't speak for most of your advice, as I've not played an Engineer, but those are the points I can comment on.

Modifié par chrisnabal, 08 mai 2010 - 09:54 .

[swk3000]

chrisnabal wrote...

swk3000 wrote...
1. Fortification, Geth Shield Boost, and Fortification are some of the worst bonus powers you can take. I'd put them on par with Shredder Ammo for sheer uselessness.

Well I didn't take geth shield boost, but I've seen Engineer Insanity runs with it and for a character that has naturally lacking defense and weapon damage, it can help alleviate that. However, I did say that I wouldn't take it because of the long global cooldown. (even with tech mastery)

There are two reasons why those three powers are so bad, and the cooldown is one of them. The other is that their bonus only lasts until your shields are gone once; after that, you recieve no bonus to your shields, and have a global cooldown keeping you from doing anything else for 12 seconds. On Insanity, you get maybe an extra half-a-second out of them before your shields go down, then get killed in the time it takes for your powers to recharge. As I said, I rank those three powers next to Shredder Ammo in terms of sheer uselessness.

swk3000 wrote...
2. Why is importing a bad idea? As far as I can tell, it actually makes things easier. More money, more resources, and you start of at a higher level at the beginning of the game, so you get stronger sooner. How is that bad?

Edit: Cruc1al already beat me to the punch on that.

Keep in mind that enemies are always scaled to your level, not just on Insanity. The difference simply becomes more apparent on a New Game+ when you don't have your upgrades. And importing an ME2 character is how you get New Game+. When I originally made that post, I missed the ME2 bit, and assumed you were talking about importing an ME1 character, and from that perspective, your advice made no sense.

swk3000 wrote...
3. Thane also has the +50% Weapon Damage skill that Zaeed has, so he's a solid person to take with you for just weapon damage.

Yes, however he doesn't have an assault rifle. The only sniper I would take with me expecting significant weapon damage is Legion with the Widow. Even though the bonuses are the same the weapon statistics and effectiveness against defenses means that Zaeed's Vindicator will output more damage than the vyper or the mantis in Thane's hands. Granted I think Thane is the better party member due to Warp & Pull, but that's beside the point.

Fair enough, I suppose. For me, though, the big deal is that they can get close to the damage that Shepard would do with the same weapon.

[Doriath]

swk3000 wrote...
Fair enough, I suppose. For me, though, the big deal is that they can get close to the damage that Shepard would do with the same weapon.

Oh you are absolutely right, I just don't trust the vyper or the mantis to output the damage you need from a weapon specialist on insanity in order for them to be a productive party member. I assume that is why Thane does have an effective damage power like Warp.

Sorry for causing some confusion there on the import topic, I'm not the best guy when it comes to conveying my meaning in writing, lol.

Modifié par chrisnabal, 08 mai 2010 - 10:12 .

[jwalker]

cruc1al wrote...

swk3000 wrote...

2. Why is importing a bad idea? As far as I can tell, it actually makes things easier. More money, more resources, and you start of at a higher level at the beginning of the game, so you get stronger sooner. How is that bad?

Because your enemies are ahead of you. In a normal playthrough at level 20 for example, you'd have almost all upgrades and your enemies would be level 20. In an imported playthrough, your enemies are still level 20 but you won't have any upgrades.

That's true for all classes.

But if you do start a NG+ and have Kasumi DLC, probably the engineer will have much better time catching up. There's one tech upgrade in the Citadel, another recruiting Garrus and another in Kasumis's mission. With those
3, you unlock tech duration and, more importantly, tech cooldowns
Before Kasumi, you had to "wait" until the disabled collector ship to get there. Way too long.

[FoFoZem]

I agree with swk3000. The armor bonus powers are simply not worth using

[Aradace]

Personally, my build was as follows:



Overload --> Heavy Overload

Incinerate --> Heavy Incinerate

Drone --> Explosive Drone

Cryo Blast --> Nothing really just one point in it lol

class Skill --> Demolisher

Bonus Skill --> Energy Drain (Believe it or not, I find it very useful on Insanity mode)



As far as Armor goes I use my Blood Dragon Armor for the extra power damage boost. With that set up, I can practically walk through Insanity like it's a joke. That's just me though. Other builds work, this is just what works for me

[FoFoZem]

No offense, Aradace, but don't you find Overload and Energy Drain to be redundant?

[OniGanon]

Being able to recharge your shields on demand instead of needing to wait can be very valuable. After all, it works very well for the Sentinel. That being said, I wouldn't use it on an Engineer. They need their cooldowns too much.


And yeah, taking Overload to max when you have Energy Drain seems very odd.

Modifié par OniGanon, 09 mai 2010 - 12:03 .

[Aradace]

FoFoZem wrote...

No offense, Aradace, but don't you find Overload and Energy Drain to be redundant?

Not really....E-Drain boosts my shields back up quickly when I need that quick little "pick me up"  

I should also mention that my particular style of play has me in full control of my squad's powers because I do not trust the AI at all.  If I have to use E-Drain, I usually have Miranda follow up with Overload if it's needed...Otherwise, it's business as usual. 

My team usually consists of Miranda and Kasumi or Kasumi and Zaeed.  Mostly the latter than the former that way I can use Zaeed's abilities more reliably in those situations and having Rapid Shadow Strike for Kasumi more than makes up for any other shortcomings lol.

Modifié par Aradace, 09 mai 2010 - 12:09 .

[mosor]

I like energy drain too, especially on missions with shielded enemies. 2 overload is enough to detonate a flamethrower, but I'd rather have the shield restoring effect that energy drain brings. As for ammo, did all the non geth missions with jacobs squad incindiary. Reave is a pretty good skill for an engineer on collector missions if you don't mind mixing biotics because they get a great cooldown and demolisher gives a damage bonus.



As for the OP, you're right. You don't need a tank. You honestly don't need a tank for any class. The only time I ever used grunt was his loyalty and the reaper IFF. Jacob/Zaeed and miranda were the usual team for me on insanity and it was a cakewalk

[Tlazolteotl]

My engineer has shredder ammo.

'cos really bonus powers are unnecessary, and shredder ammo may be totally crap, but it's funny. Jagged bullets, yo.

[Aradace]

Tlazolteotl wrote...

My engineer has shredder ammo.
'cos really bonus powers are unnecessary, and shredder ammo may be totally crap, but it's funny. Jagged bullets, yo.

I always pictured Shredder Ammo as being a form of "Hallow Points"

[swk3000]

Aradace wrote...

FoFoZem wrote...

No offense, Aradace, but don't you find Overload and Energy Drain to be redundant?

Not really....E-Drain boosts my shields back up quickly when I need that quick little "pick me up"  

I should also mention that my particular style of play has me in full control of my squad's powers because I do not trust the AI at all.  If I have to use E-Drain, I usually have Miranda follow up with Overload if it's needed...Otherwise, it's business as usual. 

My team usually consists of Miranda and Kasumi or Kasumi and Zaeed.  Mostly the latter than the former that way I can use Zaeed's abilities more reliably in those situations and having Rapid Shadow Strike for Kasumi more than makes up for any other shortcomings lol.

Kasumi/Zaeed is an interesting party. Especially if you get their Loyalty Powers at the start. Inferno Grenade for Armor and health, Overload for Shields, Shadow Strike for everything, and lots of weapon damage on top of it. Those two make an interesting, and pretty well-rounded, party combination.

[swk3000]

Aradace wrote...

Tlazolteotl wrote...

My engineer has shredder ammo.
'cos really bonus powers are unnecessary, and shredder ammo may be totally crap, but it's funny. Jagged bullets, yo.

I always pictured Shredder Ammo as being a form of "Hallow Points"

I believe you mean 'Hollow Points'.

[Aradace]

swk3000 wrote...

Aradace wrote...

Tlazolteotl wrote...

My engineer has shredder ammo.
'cos really bonus powers are unnecessary, and shredder ammo may be totally crap, but it's funny. Jagged bullets, yo.

I always pictured Shredder Ammo as being a form of "Hallow Points"

I believe you mean 'Hollow Points'.

Yea, you're right....Oops, and or my bad lol.

[Tlazolteotl]

Well, mass effect bullets are meant to be shaved off a metal block, and propelled by field tech ... so err ... hollow points aren't practical for the weapons to manufacture?

Besides, hollow points deal their damage by shattering on impact, and are therefore more easily stopped by vests and helmets ... so it doesn't quite work with how shredder ammo doesn't actually deal less damage to armour.

[Aradace]

Tlazolteotl wrote...

Well, mass effect bullets are meant to be shaved off a metal block, and propelled by field tech ... so err ... hollow points aren't practical for the weapons to manufacture?
Besides, hollow points deal their damage by shattering on impact, and are therefore more easily stopped by vests and helmets ... so it doesn't quite work with how shredder ammo doesn't actually deal less damage to armour.

True. Yea, suppose I could see it that way lol...Was just always the first thing that popped into mind whenever I thought of Shredder Ammo heh.

[cruc1al]

Tlazolteotl wrote...

Well, mass effect bullets are meant to be shaved off a metal block, and propelled by field tech ... so err ... hollow points aren't practical for the weapons to manufacture?
Besides, hollow points deal their damage by shattering on impact, and are therefore more easily stopped by vests and helmets ... so it doesn't quite work with how shredder ammo doesn't actually deal less damage to armour.

It also doesn't make sense that shooting someone in the face doesn't negate their armor completely, or that cryo ammo instantly deep-freezes anything without armor on (how's that even possible), or that barriers and shields protect from melee damage, flamethrowers, grenades, missiles, etc... the list goes on.

Modifié par cruc1al, 09 mai 2010 - 12:53 .

[Tlazolteotl]

I'm less concerned about the instant deep freezing than the frozen statues being more susceptible to physics.

Wtf is with throw suddenly being able to bounce an iceblock off 3 walls?

[FoFoZem]

Armor protects some enemies without them even having to use it. (Scion, husk, feneris miechs, vorcha)