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[Remy LeBeau]

I don't know if this Question have been asked here on this forum before. If it have, Im sorry. If not ,cool.

Duncan knows that Ferelden is about to face a Blight, and that the AD is behind it, and nobody believe him because there hasn't been a blight in 400 years . He desperately needs more Wardens and Troops For the battle at Ostagar. Cailan refuse  Eamons offer to to send troops to ad in the  battle , because he thinks Eamon wants in on the Glory.Duncan Knows Cailan is a d!#% head and is about to get Thousands of people killed for glory.

So my question is this. What if Duncan pulled the Wardens out, and left the battle at Ostagar? What would you think of him?

I ask because a lot of people seem to get pissed of to no end, because Loghain pulled his troops out.

Modifié par Remy LeBeau, 11 mai 2010 - 04:50 .

[Sarah1281]

There weren't enough Wardens to turn the tide and since no Archdemon appeared their presence was unnecessary. The Wardens would be branded as traitors even more for leaving which would cause problems if they tried to salvage Ferelden, which Duncan would have entually also pulled out of. With Loghain it's a bit more complicated as we don't really know why he left and he had a LOT of troops. They might not have been able to win but they could have at least gotten Cailan out.

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

David Gaider once said, that had he not died at Ostagar, Duncan more than likely would have done just that: decided Ferelden was a lost cause, Loghain and the civil war, and head towards Orlais and began preparing, along with Wardens from other lands, to attack the Blight once to spread beyond Ferelden. If Ferelden could not pull it's colelctive head out of it's ass and forget politics and vendettas long enough to unite and save it's own ass, then yes, it is likely he wopuld have written it off.



And I certainly would have respected such a descision as sound. I certainly would not waste valuable time and lives trying to save a country too stupid to save itself. ****** on em.



Andf Cailan didn't refuse Eamon's troops, he decided he was not going to wait a week for them to arrive. There are actually other reasons, other than glory, that he possibly did this. Not that Eamon's forces would have made that much of a difference.

[Remy LeBeau]

Sarah1281 wrote...

There weren't enough Wardens to turn the tide and since no Archdemon appeared their presence was unnecessary. The Wardens would be branded as traitors even more for leaving which would cause problems if they tried to salvage Ferelden, which Duncan would have entually also pulled out of. With Loghain it's a bit more complicated as we don't really know why he left and he had a LOT of troops. They might not have been able to win but they could have at least gotten Cailan out.

Oh I know if Duncan would had left, it would cause problems later. Sarah1281 don't you think he have  every right to leave? I know I would have left. like you said it was unnecessary for the Wardens to be there since the AD did not appear.

[Sarah1281]

Remy LeBeau wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...

There weren't enough Wardens to turn the tide and since no Archdemon appeared their presence was unnecessary. The Wardens would be branded as traitors even more for leaving which would cause problems if they tried to salvage Ferelden, which Duncan would have entually also pulled out of. With Loghain it's a bit more complicated as we don't really know why he left and he had a LOT of troops. They might not have been able to win but they could have at least gotten Cailan out.

Oh I know if Duncan would had left, it would cause problems later. Sarah1281 don't you think he have  every right to leave? I know I would have left. like you said it was unnecessary for the Wardens to be there since the AD did not appear.

They had more of a right to leave than Loghain did given their presence wouldn't have meant much while we don't know what would have happened if Loghain stayed and preserving the Wardens for the Archdemon would have been more sensible than them killing a few (hopefully dozen) darkspawn at Ostagar. If they intended to stay in Ferelden for a little while and not hastily writing it off but waiting until Loghain started being really stupid them actually being conirmed as leaving by all of the survivors would have made their task harder and might have actually forced them out of the country.

[Remy LeBeau]

Skadi_the_Evil_Elf wrote...

David Gaider once said, that had he not died at Ostagar, Duncan more than likely would have done just that: decided Ferelden was a lost cause, Loghain and the civil war, and head towards Orlais and began preparing, along with Wardens from other lands, to attack the Blight once to spread beyond Ferelden. If Ferelden could not pull it's colelctive head out of it's ass and forget politics and vendettas long enough to unite and save it's own ass, then yes, it is likely he wopuld have written it off.

And I certainly would have respected such a descision as sound. I certainly would not waste valuable time and lives trying to save a country too stupid to save itself. ****** on em.

Andf Cailan didn't refuse Eamon's troops, he decided he was not going to wait a week for them to arrive. There are actually other reasons, other than glory, that he possibly did this. Not that Eamon's forces would have made that much of a difference.

You are right,he didn't refuse Eamon's troops. He just didn't want to wait for them. That would have been enough for me to leave. Duncan should have stuck to the GW code of Whatever it takes, and got the hell out of there.


Now if they made a DLC about what if the the Wardens left Ostagar. I would love to buy that.

Modifié par Remy LeBeau, 10 mai 2010 - 11:33 .

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

I agree on that, certainly more potential than a darkspawn "what if"?



Personally, I have yet to play a character that really was that patriotic and really cared about Ferelden as a country. Even my human noble ended up disillusioned and disgruntled. So I think most of my characters would have jumped for joy if Duncan suggested a nice long vacation somewhere else. My Wardens, in the end, were working to end the Blight, not save Ferelden.

[Remy LeBeau]

Sarah1281 wrote...

Remy LeBeau wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...

There weren't enough Wardens to turn the tide and since no Archdemon appeared their presence was unnecessary. The Wardens would be branded as traitors even more for leaving which would cause problems if they tried to salvage Ferelden, which Duncan would have entually also pulled out of. With Loghain it's a bit more complicated as we don't really know why he left and he had a LOT of troops. They might not have been able to win but they could have at least gotten Cailan out.

Oh I know if Duncan would had left, it would cause problems later. Sarah1281 don't you think he have  every right to leave? I know I would have left. like you said it was unnecessary for the Wardens to be there since the AD did not appear.

They had more of a right to leave than Loghain did given their presence wouldn't have meant much while we don't know what would have happened if Loghain stayed and preserving the Wardens for the Archdemon would have been more sensible than them killing a few (hopefully dozen) darkspawn at Ostagar. If they intended to stay in Ferelden for a little while and not hastily writing it off but waiting until Loghain started being really stupid them actually being conirmed as leaving by all of the survivors would have made their task harder and might have actually forced them out of the country.

 Sorry it takes me so long to reply. I can't type worth a damn. But you know I would had wrote the counrty off right after that meeting you had with Loghain and Cailan when Duncan  said" You need to consider the Ad appearing" and Logain reply by saying " he didn't hear report about see any Dragons in the Wilds".Cailan reply with "isn't thats what your men is for". Duncan is supposed to make the hard decisions. That should have the last straw.

Modifié par Remy LeBeau, 10 mai 2010 - 11:37 .

[Remy LeBeau]

Skadi_the_Evil_Elf wrote...

I agree on that, certainly more potential than a darkspawn "what if"?

Personally, I have yet to play a character that really was that patriotic and really cared about Ferelden as a country. Even my human noble ended up disillusioned and disgruntled. So I think most of my characters would have jumped for joy if Duncan suggested a nice long vacation somewhere else. My Wardens, in the end, were working to end the Blight, not save Ferelden.

Yes I agree with everything you said. Forget politics. My Warden can't understand Why the GW waste time on the surface, when he knows the GW know the location of the last of Old Gods. His motto is, cut of the head off the snake. Not standing around waiting a blight to happen in  about 3 or 400 years.

Modifié par Remy LeBeau, 10 mai 2010 - 09:42 .

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

My first mage, who is pretty much less than in love with Thedas and the Chantry, let alone ferelden, actually thinks the Wardens should open up outposts in the deeproads and focus their efforts there, both to solidify loyalty and alliances with the dwarves, and to actually operate in the thick of things.



I mean, Wardens on the surface inbetween Blights seems like a waste, since darkspawn are pretty rare then. They really need to go on the offensive. Given the large timespan that generally occurs between Blights, they could really boost their knowledge and give themselves a head start.

[Sarah1281]

Remy LeBeau wrote...

Skadi_the_Evil_Elf wrote...

I agree on that, certainly more potential than a darkspawn "what if"?

Personally, I have yet to play a character that really was that patriotic and really cared about Ferelden as a country. Even my human noble ended up disillusioned and disgruntled. So I think most of my characters would have jumped for joy if Duncan suggested a nice long vacation somewhere else. My Wardens, in the end, were working to end the Blight, not save Ferelden.

Yes I agree with everything you said. Forget politics. My Warden can't understand Why the GW waste time on the surface, when he knows the GW know the location of the last of Old Gods. Hes motto is, cut of the head of fthe snake.

It's not about saving Ferelden, necessarily; it's about stopping the Blight as quickly as possible to minimize damage and casualties and prevent the darkspawn from having time to buid up their forces. Just imagine how difficult they'd be to stop if they got to tear across the entire country and have free access to plenty of potential broodmothers. Unless it were an absolute necessity (and right at about the point where I heard the words "we can't help you until you find the holy grail" would have been it) then it's better to try and stop the Blight there. Not to mention Alistair kind of won't let you leave. I tried bringing it up but he didn't want to hear it.

And I wouldn't have been able to leave without dragging a few people I wasn't about to let die off to Orlais with me.

[Remy LeBeau]

Sareh1281 like the Dwarves. Right? What does your Warden think about waiting around for blights?

[Sarah1281]

Remy LeBeau wrote...

Sarah1281 like the Dwarves. Right? What does your Warden think about waiting around for blights?

You could say that...

Do you mean the Grey Wardens doing nothing for 400 years and having time to play politics in the Anderfels? She'd rather they had their recruits look into helping her people push back the darkspawn. I mean, that is their job, right? The whole purpose of their order? She may resign from active duty to go back to Orzammar but that doesn't mean that those still with the Order should just be sitting pretty up in Amaranthine when there are darkspawn to be killed in the Deep Roads.

[Remy LeBeau]

I like the your Warden thinks. I think there should be a Grey Warden Outpost in Orzammer. After all Isn't there supposed to be Grey Warden stations all over Thedas? I woudn't mind there being a DLC for taking back the Thaigs.

Modifié par Remy LeBeau, 10 mai 2010 - 10:04 .

[Sarah1281]

Remy LeBeau wrote...

I like the your Warden thinks. I think there should be a Grey Warden Outpost in Orzammer. After all Isn't there supposed to be Grey Warden stations all over Thedas?

Supposed to be but people have gotten complacent in the 400 years since the last Blight. Not to mention the GW have been exiled from Ferelden for who even knows how long and so they had no way of getting to Orzammar (but even before then they apparently had nothing better to do then stage a coup) and after they returned Duncan was obsessively recruiting. After, however, the Hero of Ferelden - who, dwarf or not, could request aid for the dwarves if they wanted to - could make clearing the Deep Roads a priority for the GW. I mean, that's kind of more important than playing at being nobility no matter wha the first warden might say. He's thousands of milse away anyway and until his darkspawn body count matches yours, his input is not welcome.

[Remy LeBeau]

Sarah1281 wrote...

Remy LeBeau wrote...

I like the your Warden thinks. I think there should be a Grey Warden Outpost in Orzammer. After all Isn't there supposed to be Grey Warden stations all over Thedas?

Supposed to be but people have gotten complacent in the 400 years since the last Blight. Not to mention the GW have been exiled from Ferelden for who even knows how long and so they had no way of getting to Orzammar (but even before then they apparently had nothing better to do then stage a coup) and after they returned Duncan was obsessively recruiting. After, however, the Hero of Ferelden - who, dwarf or not, could request aid for the dwarves if they wanted to - could make clearing the Deep Roads a priority for the GW. I mean, that's kind of more important than playing at being nobility no matter wha the first warden might say. He's thousands of milse away anyway and until his darkspawn body count matches yours, his input is not welcome.

The first Wardens dosen't care about fighting the Dark Spawn, according to  Riorden. That's what make me  think that the First Warden and the others in the Anderfels, knows a cure for the taint, and amoung other important things.  that they don't lower class Wardens to know .It's just a theory of mine.

Modifié par Remy LeBeau, 10 mai 2010 - 10:24 .

[Sarah1281]

That's why I don't see why Ferelden Wardens should have to listen to him. You can bet that Loghain didn't move to Orlais because someone in the Anderfels told him to; he just didn't want to cause problems for Anora and knew that if he stayed he'd intefere. People always say that their Wardens didn't want to go to Amaranthine for Awakenings but they were 'ordered' to by the First Warden. I don't think he really could order you around. Alistair and/or Anora tell you that they hate asking you to do it (possibly only if you're on the throne as well) but you've agreed so the Orlesians wouldn't be in charge and it's only responsible to spend a few months trying to sort things out before going back to your real life and so the Wardens can help out with, say, Orzammar.

[Remy LeBeau]

Sarah1281 wrote...

That's why I don't see why Ferelden Wardens should have to listen to him. You can bet that Loghain didn't move to Orlais because someone in the Anderfels told him to; he just didn't want to cause problems for Anora and knew that if he stayed he'd intefere. People always say that their Wardens didn't want to go to Amaranthine for Awakenings but they were 'ordered' to by the First Warden. I don't think he really could order you around. Alistair and/or Anora tell you that they hate asking you to do it (possibly only if you're on the throne as well) but you've agreed so the Orlesians wouldn't be in charge and it's only responsible to spend a few months trying to sort things out before going back to your real life and so the Wardens can help out with, say, Orzammar.

Isn't it funny how when ask other Wardens have you been to Weisshaupt Fortress they say no, because it's to far. Is there really a first Warden? It makes me think about Keyser Soze, from the movie The Usual Suspects. Who are we Taking orders from?

We should not have to listen to him like you said. We are the Commanders of GW for Ferelden. So I think it's are choice what do for Ferelden and for the Dwarva of Orzammer.

Modifié par Remy LeBeau, 10 mai 2010 - 10:58 .

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

Remy LeBeau wrote...
Isn't it funny how when ask other Wardens have you been to Weisshaupt Fortress they say no, because it's to far. Is there really a first Warden? It makes me think about Keyser Soze, from the movie The Usual Suspects. Who are we Taking orders from?

Interesting thought.

But, no, the First Warden doesn't care, methinks. In fact, you pretty much learn that he or she are interested in your efforts in Amaranthine not because they care about the darkspawn threat so much, as seeing if they can set up a porecedent for Wardens in power, holding lands and titles and having actual direct political authority.

Me wonders what sorts of things are going to happen in future games with the Wardens, especially given Riordan's opinion and past follies. Perhaps a Blight won't be the focus anymore.

[Sarah1281]

Remy LeBeau wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...

That's why I don't see why Ferelden Wardens should have to listen to him. You can bet that Loghain didn't move to Orlais because someone in the Anderfels told him to; he just didn't want to cause problems for Anora and knew that if he stayed he'd intefere. People always say that their Wardens didn't want to go to Amaranthine for Awakenings but they were 'ordered' to by the First Warden. I don't think he really could order you around. Alistair and/or Anora tell you that they hate asking you to do it (possibly only if you're on the throne as well) but you've agreed so the Orlesians wouldn't be in charge and it's only responsible to spend a few months trying to sort things out before going back to your real life and so the Wardens can help out with, say, Orzammar.

Isn't it funny how when ask other Wardens have you been to Weisshaupt Fortress they say no, because it's to far. Is there really a first Warden? It makes me think about Keyser Soze, from the movie The Usual Suspects. Who are we Taking orders from?

...I have no idea. Maybe they're just making things up? Like Loghain knew he had to leave Ferelden but Anora didn't want to exile her own father so he 'was suddenly transferred'? And you didn't really want to go back to the Wardens but felt obligated to set up them up so you 'received orders.' It would really be pretty convenient and a great way to save face. I should write a one-shot about that...

[Remy LeBeau]

Sarah1281 wrote...

Remy LeBeau wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...

That's why I don't see why Ferelden Wardens should have to listen to him. You can bet that Loghain didn't move to Orlais because someone in the Anderfels told him to; he just didn't want to cause problems for Anora and knew that if he stayed he'd intefere. People always say that their Wardens didn't want to go to Amaranthine for Awakenings but they were 'ordered' to by the First Warden. I don't think he really could order you around. Alistair and/or Anora tell you that they hate asking you to do it (possibly only if you're on the throne as well) but you've agreed so the Orlesians wouldn't be in charge and it's only responsible to spend a few months trying to sort things out before going back to your real life and so the Wardens can help out with, say, Orzammar.

Isn't it funny how when ask other Wardens have you been to Weisshaupt Fortress they say no, because it's to far. Is there really a first Warden? It makes me think about Keyser Soze, from the movie The Usual Suspects. Who are we Taking orders from?

...I have no idea. Maybe they're just making things up? Like Loghain knew he had to leave Ferelden but Anora didn't want to exile her own father so he 'was suddenly transferred'? And you didn't really want to go back to the Wardens but felt obligated to set up them up so you 'received orders.' It would really be pretty convenient and a great way to save face. I should write a one-shot about that...

When you write the one shot, I would love to read it

Modifié par Remy LeBeau, 10 mai 2010 - 11:15 .

[Remy LeBeau]

Skadi_the_Evil_Elf wrote...

Remy LeBeau wrote...
Isn't it funny how when ask other Wardens have you been to Weisshaupt Fortress they say no, because it's to far. Is there really a first Warden? It makes me think about Keyser Soze, from the movie The Usual Suspects. Who are we Taking orders from?

Interesting thought.

But, no, the First Warden doesn't care, methinks. In fact, you pretty much learn that he or she are interested in your efforts in Amaranthine not because they care about the darkspawn threat so much, as seeing if they can set up a porecedent for Wardens in power, holding lands and titles and having actual direct political authority.

Me wonders what sorts of things are going to happen in future games with the Wardens, especially given Riordan's opinion and past follies. Perhaps a Blight won't be the focus anymore.

I've been wondering what the future is going to be about for the Wardens myself. I just hope they clear up a lot of the lose ends and secrets in the future DAO games.

[Remy LeBeau]

Skadi_the_Evil_Elf wrote...

My first mage, who is pretty much less than in love with Thedas and the Chantry, let alone ferelden, actually thinks the Wardens should open up outposts in the deeproads and focus their efforts there, both to solidify loyalty and alliances with the dwarves, and to actually operate in the thick of things.

I mean, Wardens on the surface inbetween Blights seems like a waste, since darkspawn are pretty rare then. They really need to go on the offensive. Given the large timespan that generally occurs between Blights, they could really boost their knowledge and give themselves a head start.

I agree. But I  Would take about ,maybe Three or four years to recruit GWs before I go on the offensive in the deep roads. Like I said in my other post. My PC motto is, cut of the head of the snake.

[Sarah1281]

We could be like Ireland. The only country in Thedas to have no darkspawn in it.

[Remy LeBeau]

Sarah1281 wrote...

We could be like Ireland. The only country in Thedas to have no darkspawn in it.

Ireland ?