391 réponses à ce sujet

[chiliztri]

Tirigon wrote...

Sorry about the noob question, but what exactly IS a JRPG?

Japanese Role-playing Game.

Modifié par chiliztri, 13 mai 2010 - 10:27 .

[Busomjack]

Tirigon wrote...

Sorry about the noob question, but what exactly IS a JRPG?

A barely interactive anime.

[Tirigon]

Busomjack wrote...

Tirigon wrote...

Sorry about the noob question, but what exactly IS a JRPG?

A barely interactive anime.

Hentai?

[Onyx Jaguar]

Basically derived from Ultima when Dragon Quest took some of the designs. After that they followed the DQ mold more so than Western RPGS and they began to Diverge wildly.



Oddly enough the Western Concepts of Wizardry and Rogue are also heavily tied into Japan at this point. In the 90s Western Companies tried to emulate DnD more while Japanese continued to progress in their way. Big split.

[MerinTB]

You can agree or disagree, but here are my thoughts on FF XIII -

http://ingenre.com/2...–-in-two-parts/

http://ingenre.com/2...sy-xiii-part-2/

[Busomjack]

MerinTB wrote...

You can agree or disagree, but here are my thoughts on FF XIII -

http://ingenre.com/2...–-in-two-parts/

http://ingenre.com/2...sy-xiii-part-2/

TLDR.

[chiliztri]

Busomjack wrote...

Tirigon wrote...

Sorry about the noob question, but what exactly IS a JRPG?

A barely interactive anime.

Please stop lumping every single JRPG with FFXIII.

Modifié par chiliztri, 13 mai 2010 - 10:35 .

[Onyx Jaguar]

Modern JRPGs really do not have much trouble. THe main problem they have is that they are sticking more so to handhelds. The SRPG subgenre is expanding though.



Japenese developers in general have had problems keeping up with Western developers on this generation of consoles. You see them trying different things with Gameplay or you see them only innovate graphically. This isn't 100% true however, Capcom has done decently but as of now they are having problems in outsourcing.

[MaaZeus]

enormousmoonboots wrote...
. It's an illusion of choice, not true freedom. If you really believe that a 'huge tree of pathways' comes down to option A or option B, with no third/fourth choice or option to make your own decision, you've never played a real role-playing game with a good DM.

It doesnt matter if its just an illusion, you still get impression that you ARE making choices. A game with incredible range of choices is borderline impossible to make anyway, but Mass Effect and Dragon Age did quite good job  so far. Even old Final Fantasies had some sense of freedom and choice as you can stop and explore, do miniquests, find new areas etc...

Perhaps its only illusion, but it works. Games like FFXIII dont even have that. I'm with Busomjack in that I find classifying FFXIII as RPG bit difficult. It looks like RPG, it SHOULD be RPG, but yet it doesnt feel like it.

I tried to like it. I love character driven stories with a lot of character developement and FFXIII is just like that. Characters, while not that impressive and some even annoying, kept my interest up to certain point and I wanted to know what happens to them, but the game around that story and characters is a repetive POS on rails. I cant finish it even if I want to.

Modifié par MaaZeus, 13 mai 2010 - 10:50 .

[MerinTB]

Busomjack wrote...

MerinTB wrote...

You can agree or disagree, but here are my thoughts on FF XIII -

http://ingenre.com/2...–-in-two-parts/

http://ingenre.com/2...sy-xiii-part-2/

TLDR.

GRMN

TUFQ

WTF?

You're not using a cell phone, son.

[Onyx Jaguar]

The only RPGS where you have a broad range of choice is I S IS IS IS



ZOMG



































































































































Sports games



Think about it, everything anyone uses to classify as an "RPG" is in a sports game.

[MaaZeus]

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

The only RPGS where you have a broad range of choice is I S IS IS IS

ZOMG




Sports games

Think about it, everything anyone uses to classify as an "RPG" is in a sports game.

Everything except epic story. Except a one NES game, sort of soccer RPG. Forgot its name though...

[Onyx Jaguar]

MaaZeus wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

The only RPGS where you have a broad range of choice is I S IS IS IS

ZOMG




Sports games

Think about it, everything anyone uses to classify as an "RPG" is in a sports game.

Everything except epic story. Except a one NES game, sort of soccer RPG. Forgot its name though...

Yes but you can technically make your own story.

I'll use Baseball as an anology.  You can take a team from 20 games back in the standings with a minor league lineup then surge and claim first place.  For a sports fan that is pretty epic.

[MaaZeus]

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

MaaZeus wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

The only RPGS where you have a broad range of choice is I S IS IS IS

ZOMG




Sports games

Think about it, everything anyone uses to classify as an "RPG" is in a sports game.

Everything except epic story. Except a one NES game, sort of soccer RPG. Forgot its name though...

Yes but you can technically make your own story.

I'll use Baseball as an anology.  You can take a team from 20 games back in the standings with a minor league lineup then surge and claim first place.  For a sports fan that is pretty epic.

I... see. I have no idea what I can say to that kind of logic.

Modifié par MaaZeus, 13 mai 2010 - 11:02 .

[Fexelea]

Being currently addicted to White Knight Chronicles, I have to say that people are missing out on how jrpgs are subtly changing. I don't understand why anyone wouldn't get that not "liking" the style of something does not mean it is wrong or that they can simply move it to another category from what you like.



Whilst I love the customization and such of main characters on Wrpgs, Jrpgs offer you a different focus, concentrating in combat but remaining strong in the ability/stat development, which is ultimately what brings rpgs together imo; therefore Daniel is off base to me.



It is irrelevant wether you think that their swords are oversized and explosions unrealistic, I think that summoning fire out of thin air and transforming into a spider is equally ludicrous. It's a game.

[Talonfire]

You can put a 'J' in front of it, but it's not an RPG. You don't make
any choices, you don't create a character, you don't live your
character... I don't know what those are - adventure games maybe? But
they're not RPG's.

So JRPGs aren't RPGs... nor is any western RPG prior to Black Isle's Fallout in 1997 for that matter. The only feature on that list present in early cRPGs is character creation; you didn't "make choices" (beyond character generation and leveling), nor did you "live your character"... unless you consider dungeon crawling with a paper thin plot consisting of going through a string of dungeons and killing the big bad living the life of your character.

I wasn't aware that the RPG genre had such a definite interpretation.

Modifié par Talonfire, 13 mai 2010 - 11:16 .

[MaaZeus]

Fexelea wrote...


It is irrelevant wether you think that their swords are oversized and explosions unrealistic, I think that summoning fire out of thin air and transforming into a spider is equally ludicrous. It's a game.

Well, you cant really compare magic to physics. Magic is magic and can do incredible things, because ITS MAGIC. But man wielding a sword of same size as himself and balance-point somewhere far away in the tip just looks wierd and impractical. Obviously real-life physics have no place in fantasy full of insane jumps and whatever but basics should still be there just because of added believability.

Modifié par MaaZeus, 13 mai 2010 - 11:19 .

[MaaZeus]

Talonfire wrote...

You can put a 'J' in front of it, but it's not an RPG. You don't make
any choices, you don't create a character, you don't live your
character... I don't know what those are - adventure games maybe? But
they're not RPG's.

So JRPGs aren't RPGs... nor is any western RPG prior to Black Isle's Fallout in 1997 for that matter. The only feature on that list present in early cRPGs is character creation; you didn't "make choices" (beyond character generation and leveling), nor did you "live your character"... unless you consider dungeon crawling with a paper thin plot consisting of going through a string of dungeons and killing the big bad living the life of your character.

I wasn't aware that the RPG genre had such a definite interpretation.

But they were still free worlds that you could explore and lose yourself into, like ages old Ultima serie. (I think they had a story too?) This has been quite constant thing in RPGs through the genres history. New FF games do not have that. Cant say for other modern JRPGs though.

Modifié par MaaZeus, 13 mai 2010 - 11:25 .

[Talonfire]

MaaZeus wrote...

Talonfire wrote...

You can put a 'J' in front of it, but it's not an RPG. You don't make
any choices, you don't create a character, you don't live your
character... I don't know what those are - adventure games maybe? But
they're not RPG's.

So JRPGs aren't RPGs... nor is any western RPG prior to Black Isle's Fallout in 1997 for that matter. The only feature on that list present in early cRPGs is character creation; you didn't "make choices" (beyond character generation and leveling), nor did you "live your character"... unless you consider dungeon crawling with a paper thin plot consisting of going through a string of dungeons and killing the big bad living the life of your character.

I wasn't aware that the RPG genre had such a definite interpretation.

But they were still free worlds that you could explore, like ages old Ultima serie. This has been quite constant thing in RPGs through the genres history. New FF games do not have that. Cant say for other modern JRPGs though.

True, but it's not like all JRPGs have forsaken the world map system like Final Fantasy has. I haven't personally touched a JRPG since the PS1 days, but last I checked some still do have world maps that allow you to freely explore.

Modifié par Talonfire, 13 mai 2010 - 11:26 .

[MaaZeus]

Talonfire wrote...

MaaZeus wrote...

Talonfire wrote...

You can put a 'J' in front of it, but it's not an RPG. You don't make
any choices, you don't create a character, you don't live your
character... I don't know what those are - adventure games maybe? But
they're not RPG's.

So JRPGs aren't RPGs... nor is any western RPG prior to Black Isle's Fallout in 1997 for that matter. The only feature on that list present in early cRPGs is character creation; you didn't "make choices" (beyond character generation and leveling), nor did you "live your character"... unless you consider dungeon crawling with a paper thin plot consisting of going through a string of dungeons and killing the big bad living the life of your character.

I wasn't aware that the RPG genre had such a definite interpretation.

But they were still free worlds that you could explore, like ages old Ultima serie. This has been quite constant thing in RPGs through the genres history. New FF games do not have that. Cant say for other modern JRPGs though.

True, but it's not like all JRPGs have forsaken the world map system like Final Fantasy has.

Indeed. I am now waiting for Lost Odyssey and see what that game has to offer after dissapointment FFXIII gave me.

[CRISIS1717]

MaaZeus wrote...

Talonfire wrote...

You can put a 'J' in front of it, but it's not an RPG. You don't make
any choices, you don't create a character, you don't live your
character... I don't know what those are - adventure games maybe? But
they're not RPG's.

So JRPGs aren't RPGs... nor is any western RPG prior to Black Isle's Fallout in 1997 for that matter. The only feature on that list present in early cRPGs is character creation; you didn't "make choices" (beyond character generation and leveling), nor did you "live your character"... unless you consider dungeon crawling with a paper thin plot consisting of going through a string of dungeons and killing the big bad living the life of your character.

I wasn't aware that the RPG genre had such a definite interpretation.

But they were still free worlds that you could explore and lose yourself into, like ages old Ultima serie. (I think they had a story too?) This has been quite constant thing in RPGs through the genres history. New FF games do not have that. Cant say for other modern JRPGs though.

What are you talking about? an rpg is a role playing game, in FFXIII you play the role of the chraracters therefore it is definitely an rpg. 

If you are talking about what sticks closer to the normal rpg formula then it'd probably be FFXIII as in most role playing games you have levels and maps that you advance through.

[MaaZeus]

CRISIS1717 wrote...

What are you talking about? an rpg is a role playing game, in FFXIII you play the role of the chraracters therefore it is definitely an rpg. 

If you are talking about what sticks closer to the normal rpg formula then it'd probably be FFXIII as in most role playing games you have levels and maps that you advance through.

I think this has been discussed to death before and in other threads. RPG may mean "Role Playing Game" but those letters do not define exactly what the genre is about, nowadays anyway. Just defining games with the words "Role Playing Game" can make almost any game RPG, like Doom. You are in the role of marine fighting his way out of demon infested spacestation and perhaps even figuring out what is going on.

So my current impression of FFXIII still stands. It looks like RPG, it should be RPG, but it certainly doesnt feel like RPG. Hell, it doesnt even feel like classic JRPG which I have played since I was a teen.

Modifié par MaaZeus, 13 mai 2010 - 11:38 .

[Wicked 702]

MaaZeus wrote...

Fexelea wrote...


It is irrelevant wether you think that their swords are oversized and explosions unrealistic, I think that summoning fire out of thin air and transforming into a spider is equally ludicrous. It's a game.

Well, you cant really compare magic to physics. Magic is magic and can do incredible things, because ITS MAGIC. But man wielding a sword of same size as himself and balance-point somewhere far away in the tip just looks wierd and impractical. Obviously real-life physics have no place in fantasy full of insane jumps and whatever but basics should still be there just because of added believability.

This is so wrong! Watch Sci-Fi much? See ships traveling fast than the speed of light like in Star Trek? Hear all the different kinds of forces, particles, and substances they make up to fit their stories? What the hell is realisitic in any of that?

There is NO prerequisite for realism in a fantasy setting.

Repeat after me:

It's
a
Fantasy!

[NeroSparda]

Captain Cornhole wrote...

I love how Bioware tells Jrpgs to go to hell! Bosumjack is right I have played a few jrpgs and they are hardly interactive.

Same with Bioware, though with some of the JRPGs games I played, I believe they are MORE interactive compared to Bioware. Shin Megami Tensei, anyone?