391 réponses à ce sujet

[TheMufflon]

Eshaye wrote...

edit: Okay so back, last thing I wanted to say is that the term RPG itself has evolved to mean more then what I quoted above, now it also involves progressing your way through a pre written story and unlocking each chapter, usually in a linear fashion (so you get to the end boss..) or through a horizontal way where you can experience multiple flavors of the same story

While CRPGs are not mutualy exclusive with linear stories, neither are they mutually inclusive. Linearity is not implied by a CRPG.

The main and only difference with a JRPG and a western RPG are that in the former your character or set of characters are chosen for you, while in the western game you often can make your own. Although your own character is really just an aesthetic choice and little more.

The distinction between western and Japanese CRPGs is not in the character creation. There are several western CRPGs that give you a set character (The Witcher and Planescape: Torment, to name two), thus there is no such distinction.

As for the MMO world, to me there is no better true RPG then a sandbox game where you have to carve out your own story, but I've often heard that such games and most older MMOs are not 'RPG'.... So who's right? What makes a better RPG game, where the story tellers are entirely the players, or entirely the game masters? (devs..)

Whether MMORPGs really are CRPGs or not is debatable. While it certainly is possible to role-play within an MMORPG to a much larger extent than in a single player CRPG, most players do not play them as CRPGS. Thus I argue that MMORPGs are a category of games apart from both western and Japanese CRPG, and thus irrelevant to this discussion.

Modifié par TheMufflon, 14 mai 2010 - 10:57 .

[FutureBoy81]

Them's is fighting word's, RPG Beef , i think Square let the first shot's go, good come back from bioware ...

[Sleepicub09]

it looks like a secret fight that's not so much of a secret to me.


 Square Enix says Wrpg's give too much freedom
http://kotaku.com/54...western-reviews
Bioware says Jrpg's don't give enough freedom
http://www.destructo...n--155782.phtml

Modifié par Sleepicub09, 14 mai 2010 - 11:18 .

[MaaZeus]

Sleepicub09 wrote...

it looks like a secret fight that's not so much of a secret to me.


 Square Enix says Wrpg's give too much freedom

Bioware says Jrpg's don't give enough freedom

When Square Enix said that WRPGs give too much freedom the first time, I think that was when they were discussing about Fallout 3 and wondering why its so popular? (I might remember wrong) In that case its quite true. Completely free game like Fallout3, even though it kicked arse, it did take quite a hit in story and character department. But I think Squenix should take a look at Biowares products too, both new and old. They are relatively free, and yet have strong plots and characters. Perfect balance between two extremes I say.

Modifié par MaaZeus, 14 mai 2010 - 11:22 .

[Sleepicub09]

MaaZeus wrote...

Sleepicub09 wrote...

it looks like a secret fight that's not so much of a secret to me.


 Square Enix says Wrpg's give too much freedom

Bioware says Jrpg's don't give enough freedom

When Square Enix said that WRPGs give too much freedom the first time, I think that was when they were discussing about Fallout 3 and wondering why its so popular? (I might remember wrong) In that case its quite true. Completely free game like Fallout3, even though it kicked arse, it did take quite a hit in story and character department. But I think Squenix should take a look at Biowares products too, both new and old. They are relatively free, and yet have strong plots and characters. Perfect balance between two extremes I say.

why would be talking about FO3. FO3 came out it 2008 this article is from the beginning of the year.they were talking about mass effect 2.

[MaaZeus]

Sleepicub09 wrote...

MaaZeus wrote...

Sleepicub09 wrote...

it looks like a secret fight that's not so much of a secret to me.


 Square Enix says Wrpg's give too much freedom

Bioware says Jrpg's don't give enough freedom

When Square Enix said that WRPGs give too much freedom the first time, I think that was when they were discussing about Fallout 3 and wondering why its so popular? (I might remember wrong) In that case its quite true. Completely free game like Fallout3, even though it kicked arse, it did take quite a hit in story and character department. But I think Squenix should take a look at Biowares products too, both new and old. They are relatively free, and yet have strong plots and characters. Perfect balance between two extremes I say.

why would be talking about FO3. FO3 came out it 2008 this article is from the beginning of the year.they were talking about mass effect 2.

I wasnt referring to THAT article. But unless my memory totally fails (not too uncommon), when Fallout 3 was relatively new I remember Japanese developers wondering why its so popular too.

Modifié par MaaZeus, 14 mai 2010 - 11:54 .

[the_one_54321]

I'm getting rather sick of western gamers and developers being so condescending.



Final Fantasy as a franchise is more successful than BioWare as a whole company. And I love BioWare. But honestly, BioWare needs to do a lot of polish on their work before they are up to the standards of Square.



This assessment has nothing to do with liking any of the games. I enjoy BioWare games and Square games. But what I've noticed is that Square games have bugs in their games a fraction of the time that BioWare has bugs. Square's animation puts BioWare animation to shame. Flat out to shame. FF13 (even if you think it's a horrible game) has visuals that make Dragon Age look like a weekend web comic. And the character development (I'm talking about writers, not game play) is at least on par with what BioWare offers up, just of a very different style.



This article is purely sour grapes. The guy is pissed that they just can't catch up to Square and he's being a baby about it.

[Ryzaki]

Interactive story = heavy rain

Do you consider Heavy Rain an RPG?

Interactive story = visual novels

If you've ever played visual novels. Do you consider those RPGs?

An interactive story and a rpg are not the same things. An RPG may be a interactive story but an interactive story is not an RPG.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 15 mai 2010 - 12:14 .

[TheMufflon]

Ryzaki wrote...

Interactive story = heavy rain

Do you consider Heavy Rain an RPG?

Interactive story = visual novels

If you've ever played visual novels. Do you consider those RPGs?

I haven't played Heavy Rain, so I make no judgements as to it's nature.

A visual novel isn't an interactive story. A comic is a visual novel, and comics are decidedly uninteractive.

[TheMufflon]

Ryzaki wrote...

An interactive story and a rpg are not the same things. An RPG may be a interactive story but an interactive story is not an RPG.

Having an interactive story is what sets CRPGs apart from other games. Thus for something to be a CRPG it must A) Be a video game and Allow the player to interact with the story.

[the_one_54321]

gmartin40 wrote...
HAHAHA (screen shot)

First off, how old are you? Your response was remarkably immature, but that's not a surprise in these forums. I want to make sure that I verify I'm dealing with adults before I treat people like adults. There are way too many teens and pre-teens around here.

Anyway, Mass Effect 2 was better on visuals than Dragon Age, but even that doesn't measure up to FF13.





These are actual game play shots, not cutscenes.

Modifié par the_one_54321, 15 mai 2010 - 12:26 .

[Onyx Jaguar]

Ain't nothin' but a thing

[Ryzaki]

TheMufflon wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Interactive story = heavy rain

Do you consider Heavy Rain an RPG?

Interactive story = visual novels

If you've ever played visual novels. Do you consider those RPGs?

I haven't played Heavy Rain, so I make no judgements as to it's nature.

A visual novel isn't an interactive story. A comic is a visual novel, and comics are decidedly uninteractive.

And you've never played a japanese visual novel. Those *are* interactive stories. They're pratically choose your own adventure books. Which while interactive (to an extent) or sure in heck not RPGs.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 15 mai 2010 - 12:29 .

[Ryzaki]

TheMufflon wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

An interactive story and a rpg are not the same things. An RPG may be a interactive story but an interactive story is not an RPG.

Having an interactive story is what sets CRPGs apart from other games. Thus for something to be a CRPG it must A) Be a video game and Allow the player to interact with the story.

Great. But once again the two are not interchangeable. And frankly I think it needs more than just those two things to be an RPG or once again. Heavy rain would apply. Heavy Rain is not an RPG.

[TheMufflon]

Ryzaki wrote...

TheMufflon wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Interactive story = heavy rain

Do you consider Heavy Rain an RPG?

Interactive story = visual novels

If you've ever played visual novels. Do you consider those RPGs?

I haven't played Heavy Rain, so I make no judgements as to it's nature.

A visual novel isn't an interactive story. A comic is a visual novel, and comics are decidedly uninteractive.

And you've never played a japanese visual novel. Those *are* interactive stories. They're pratically choose your own adventure books. Which while interactive (to an extent) or sure in heck not RPGs.

You equated visual novels with interactive stories. I pointed out that not all visual novels are interactive, thus proving you wrong.

Choose Your Own Adventure books cannot be role-playing games because they are not games.

[TheMufflon]

Ryzaki wrote...
Heavy Rain is not an RPG.

Like I said, I haven't played Heavy Rain. What is it that makes it not be a CRPG?

[Busomjack]

the_one_54321 wrote...

gmartin40 wrote...
HAHAHA (screen shot)

First off, how old are you? Your response was remarkably immature, but that's not a surprise in these forums. I want to make sure that I verify I'm dealing with adults before I treat people like adults. There are way too many teens and pre-teens around here.

Anyway, Mass Effect 2 was better on visuals than Dragon Age, but even that doesn't measure up to FF13.





These are actual game play shots, not cutscenes.

The graphics in Final Fantasy XIII are too gaudy.  They use way too much color to the point where everything looks like it's in Disneyland.  Also, everything is way too sleek and there is almost no variety.

In Mass Effect 2 you had the gritty bars of Afterlife to the city utopia of Illium.   Much better visual style.

[Ryzaki]

TheMufflon wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...
Heavy Rain is not an RPG.

Like I said, I haven't played Heavy Rain. What is it that makes it not be a CRPG?

The fact that the creators don't call it such. Nor is it ever really catagorized as an RPG.

Frankly I believe all games with very few exceptions are RPGs because you're playing a role. Influencing the storyline is just extra.

[TheMufflon]

Ryzaki wrote...

Frankly I believe all games with very few exceptions are RPGs because you're playing a role. Influencing the storyline is just extra.

If you can't interact with the story you can't play a role.