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[Sarah1281]

Sabariel wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...

I do have to wonder WTH Soris was thinking when he had all those human kids, though. OTOH, it was a huge scandal and they had to move so I'm guessing it's not all that common.

I always wondered how Soris ended up with a human woman. What happened to Valora?

I think Shianni said she was shipped to the Tevinter.

[Sabariel]

Sarah1281 wrote...

Sabariel wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...

I do have to wonder WTH Soris was thinking when he had all those human kids, though. OTOH, it was a huge scandal and they had to move so I'm guessing it's not all that common.

I always wondered how Soris ended up with a human woman. What happened to Valora?

I think Shianni said she was shipped to the Tevinter.

Ooohhh. Sucky. Well... go save her, Soris!!

[mousestalker]

Sabariel wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...

Sabariel wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...

I do have to wonder WTH Soris was thinking when he had all those human kids, though. OTOH, it was a huge scandal and they had to move so I'm guessing it's not all that common.

I always wondered how Soris ended up with a human woman. What happened to Valora?

I think Shianni said she was shipped to the Tevinter.

Ooohhh. Sucky. Well... go save her, Soris!!

I'm guessing he's rather wary of doing that given how his last rescue attempt turned out. Soris is a decent man. He deserves a little joy in his life given how the alienage treated him.

[Sabariel]

mousestalker wrote...

Sabariel wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...

Sabariel wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...

I do have to wonder WTH Soris was thinking when he had all those human kids, though. OTOH, it was a huge scandal and they had to move so I'm guessing it's not all that common.

I always wondered how Soris ended up with a human woman. What happened to Valora?

I think Shianni said she was shipped to the Tevinter.

Ooohhh. Sucky. Well... go save her, Soris!!

I'm guessing he's rather wary of doing that given how his last rescue attempt turned out. Soris is a decent man. He deserves a little joy in his life given how the alienage treated him.

I still feel bad for Valora. She did seem excited to be marrying Soris. Now I wish I could go rescue her...

[Rhys Cordelle]

glenboy, it's just mathematics. It doesn't matter how small the percentage is of elves having children with humans, eventually it will permeate every elven family.



Look at the maori people in New Zealand. There isn't a single person alive today that is 100% maori. Each and every one of them has some european blood.

[Sarah1281]

But that's different because there is no recessive elf gene. If an elf had a child with a human, that child would be human. If twenty generations went by of that line only breeding with elves humans would still be the outcome.

[Rhys Cordelle]

Exactly. It means elven family lines could come to an end at any moment. Say you have a son and a daughter, and the daughter marries a human and the son never has children. That's the end of the line for that family. Now spread that out over generations, each generation being more and more integrated with humans and less and less bound as an elven community, and each generation brings with it a chance of only having human offspring.

[RogueWriter3201]

Rhys Cordelle wrote...

Exactly. It means elven family lines could come to an end at any moment. Say you have a son and a daughter, and the daughter marries a human and the son never has children. That's the end of the line for that family. Now spread that out over generations, each generation being more and more integrated with humans and less and less bound as an elven community, and each generation brings with it a chance of only having human offspring.

Sorry, but you're generalizing. Your assumption is based on the personel view that the number of Elven men and women marrying Human men and women would out number Elven men and women marrying other Elfs. That doesn't make sense.

Even if Soris ended up with a Human woman, he's in the Minority. The simple fact is that for the Elven Bloodlines to vanish the Elven/Human parings would have to be extremely one sided. You're claiming this is a Real World Fact, but if this was the case we wouldn't have Africans, Asians, Hispanics, and so on. Yes, the races will intermingle, but to believe that they will do so to the point where the Elven people would dissapear genetically is, sadly, extremely Myopic.

Perhapes several million years into Thedas's future there might be a single race, but even then A) The chances of that are slim given the variables of a High/Dark Fantasy Universe, and To assume that the one race will be Human is an arrogant viewpoint to have.

Modifié par glenboy24, 17 mai 2010 - 08:20 .

[Gilsa]

LOL, I see what Cypher is doing here. I'll play along. =p

- Did your CEF want to get married? Yes. This seemed to be the norm in the CE culture so I RPed her as someone that loved her dad. I would think that her dad would go out of her way to make sure she was matched up with a good man so she trusted him in this.  The wedding was to be the start of a new chapter in her life. Plus, with the knowledge that the fiance dies trying to rescue her, it's very difficult to play an origin where she pouts about having to marry him.

- Did you become the Bann or give the title to Shianni? Actually I did the Ultimate Sacrifice for two reasons -- 1) I didn't have the achievement yet and 2) this was right before Awakening was about to come out and I was highly amused by all the drama about importing a dead warden over like nothing happened. I was just going to import her over to Awakening like she never died and keep her story going, but lack of romantic acknowledgement in Awakening kept her dead. No point since I wanted to focus on my dwarves instead. BUT if she had lived, she'd probably give it to Shianni.

- How did you RP your CEF?
I RPed her as someone that needed a plan to follow. She was counting on getting married and getting settled in her new life, but she's been in a freefall since then since she didn't know what was coming next, which was unsettling to her. She'd even ask her romantic interest where their relationship was going and be frustrated by the uncertainity of it all.

- Do you prefer the MCE or the FCE?? Female. That sword being slid on the ground between the guards' legs is one of the best scenes in the game.

- What's your class? Warrior. Same as her mother before her.

- Post your pics/profiles of your CEs!


- who did your CE romance??  Zevran. Elves gotta stick together!

Modifié par Gilsa, 17 mai 2010 - 08:09 .

[Sarah1281]

Oh, very pretty Gilsa.

[Riot Inducer]

Interesting thread, I'll play along Cypher.

- Did your CEF want to get married? No, but she understood what it meant and that there was really no choice but to make the best of it.

- Did you become the Bann or give the title to Shianni? Shianni got the title, she was always better at dealing with people anyways.

- How did you RP your CEF? Mira is the classic vigilante character, delivering justice wherever she sees fit, usually in the most brutal manner possible. Her journeys as a Grey Warden forced her to change her views quite a bit however, and by the end she had mostly curbed her berserker-homicidal tendencies.

- Do you prefer the MCE or the FCE?? Female all the way, but then I find male characters generally less interesting on a whole. 

- What's your class? Warrior (and self-styled berserker to boot)

- Post your pics/profiles of your CE! Best pic I could find, wasn't nearly as pic happy with her as some other characters 


- who did your CE romance?? Leliana (this was actually pretty interesting to see play out as I actually didn't plan on her becoming involved with anyone. One of the odd cases of a character really coming to life...either that or my split personalities were acting up.) 


Also on a random note here's another CE I've started, she hasn't gotten very far but is a very different character from Mira, but I'm finding she's a lot more photogenic. Anywho, this is Selene.

[Hell Mutant]

CE and DN are my favorite origins, they are both really well developed and drive you to the end in a glorious, vengeful, blood lust. I was very dissapointed with the DC origin though, I was really looking forward to it and expected it to be totally brutal, but for some reason, it didn't really touch me.

This thread has inspired me to go through the CE origin as a male. And it's clear that I need to RP as wanting to be married, in my FCE game (which is also the first character that I went through Origins and Awakening with), I didn't want to be married. This will be even better!

Modifié par Hell Mutant, 17 mai 2010 - 02:54 .

[Suron]

glenboy24 wrote...

Rhys Cordelle wrote...

Exactly. It means elven family lines could come to an end at any moment. Say you have a son and a daughter, and the daughter marries a human and the son never has children. That's the end of the line for that family. Now spread that out over generations, each generation being more and more integrated with humans and less and less bound as an elven community, and each generation brings with it a chance of only having human offspring.

Sorry, but you're generalizing. Your assumption is based on the personel view that the number of Elven men and women marrying Human men and women would out number Elven men and women marrying other Elfs. That doesn't make sense.

Even if Soris ended up with a Human woman, he's in the Minority. The simple fact is that for the Elven Bloodlines to vanish the Elven/Human parings would have to be extremely one sided. You're claiming this is a Real World Fact, but if this was the case we wouldn't have Africans, Asians, Hispanics, and so on. Yes, the races will intermingle, but to believe that they will do so to the point where the Elven people would dissapear genetically is, sadly, extremely Myopic.

Perhapes several million years into Thedas's future there might be a single race, but even then A) The chances of that are slim given the variables of a High/Dark Fantasy Universe, and To assume that the one race will be Human is an arrogant viewpoint to have.

I wish there was some way we could live long enough to see it..but if you think that eventually, if the HUMAN RACE lives long enough, we wont' eventually all look like the same "mix" you're insane.

[mousestalker]

I think y'all are getting hung up on ethnography. Some ethnic groups have survived quite well despite being exclusive and insular. The Amish do not generally marry outside their group. When they do, it is very rare for the outsider to join the sect. It is much more common for the Amish partner to leave and join the outside society. They have increased their numbers fairly dramatically. They are also suffering from inbreeding.



Thedas being a fantasy world, the ethnic and racial populations will be whatever the writers require them to be.



We can only hope that means more rather than fewer elves.

[Avilia]

Did your CEF want to get married? - Not really but she accepted that it was going to happen anyway and was determined to make the best of it.

Did you become the Bann or give the title to Shianni?  - Shianni - she's the man (so to speak).  She has commitment and passion.

How did you RP your CEF? - Well I've started a few but they have common themes.  They hate humans and only reluctantly come to like Alistair.  Early in the game I take  a few intimidate choices and am rude when the chance is offered.  As the story progresses they soften a little in their attitude to humans.  Overall the goal for them is to save their own people - the only reason they care about ending the blight.  The humans could all die and they wouldn't lift a finger to help.

Do you prefer the MCE or the FCE??   - I only play female chars so have to say female.

What's your class? - Warrior and Rogue in equal numbers.  My avatar is the latest CEF and she's a rogue.

Post your pics/profiles of your CE! :



Who did your CE romance?? - Zevran - its always Zev for my CEF's - I sometimes plan it to be Alistair but it just doesn't fit with how I view them.  They end up liking him as I said but they'd never be able to bring themselves to love him.

Modifié par Avilia, 17 mai 2010 - 09:24 .

[Sabariel]

- Did your CEF want to get married?
Yes. She was looking forward to growing up and starting a family of her own.

- Did you become the Bann or give the title to Shianni?
Gave it to Shianni. Mimieux prefers to lop darkspawn heads off rather than immerse herself in politics.

- How did you RP your CEF?
At first she was very meek and obedient. She did pretty much anything anyone asked of her, human or not. However the wedding and the events afterward was the straw that broke the camel's back as it were. She shed her meek and obedient ways in a very violent and bloody fashion.

- Do you prefer the MCE or the FCE??
Female. Nothing more satisfying than stabbing your would-be rapist in the guts then chopping his head off.

- What's your class?
Rogue usually, but sometimes warrior. Mimieux specifically is a rogue.

- Post your pics/profiles of your CEs!
See avatar.

- who did your CE romance??
No one. Though Zevran is canonly bisexual I just can't romance him as a woman. It weirds me out (strange, I know). Alistair and Leliana are human and Mimieux is too bitter from her experiences in the alienage to be interested in a romance with either. She loved her Dog and that's about it.

Modifié par Sabariel, 17 mai 2010 - 11:31 .

[Rhys Cordelle]

glenboy24 wrote...
Sorry, but you're generalizing. Your assumption is based on the personel view that the number of Elven men and women marrying Human men and women would out number Elven men and women marrying other Elfs. That doesn't make sense.

Ah, no. I already pointed out that it doesn't matter how small the percentage is. I think it's pretty clear I'm not talking about a majority there.

You're claiming this is a Real World Fact, but if this was the case we wouldn't have Africans, Asians, Hispanics, and so on.

Again, no. For one thing, you've just named the more dominant races in terms of genetics. If a Caucasian and an Asian have children, yes the children will be half caucasian and half asian, but their physical appearance will most closely resemble a full blooded asian.

There is nothing racist about what I'm saying here. It's just reality. Google dominant vs recessive genes.

To assume that the one race will be Human is an arrogant viewpoint to have.

Wow, get over yourself. My reasoning has nothing to do with arrogance or narrowmindedness. It's about recessive genes. If an interracial coupling can only ever produce a human child, then that means that the elven population will inevitably decline.

With each generation a small percentage of them will not produce elven offspring. And the accumulation of those small percentages over generations will lead to a significant decline in the elven population.

[Verly]

but isn't that exactly why the City elves do arranged marriages in the first place?

[Rhys Cordelle]

Well, the discussion was about what would happen if the elves are given equal rights and no longer confined to an alienage. But yeah, the way things currently are, they are maintaining their population.

[Verly]

yeah, I know, I'm just thinking that traditions are hard to break even when things change around them. I think that the arranged marriage is one of those traditions and that most elves understand why they are needed.



Plus, if elves and humans are equal then the city elves would start talking more with their Dalish cousins who have been learning a lot more about the history of the elves and would cause the city elves to understand even more why elves should stick with elves.



I'm thinking if there was going to be an intermingling of elves it would be more likely with Dalish and City elves then humans

[RogueWriter3201]

Rhys Cordelle wrote...

glenboy24 wrote...
Sorry, but you're generalizing. Your assumption is based on the personel view that the number of Elven men and women marrying Human men and women would out number Elven men and women marrying other Elfs. That doesn't make sense.

Ah, no. I already pointed out that it doesn't matter how small the percentage is. I think it's pretty clear I'm not talking about a majority there.

You're claiming this is a Real World Fact, but if this was the case we wouldn't have Africans, Asians, Hispanics, and so on.

Again, no. For one thing, you've just named the more dominant races in terms of genetics. If a Caucasian and an Asian have children, yes the children will be half caucasian and half asian, but their physical appearance will most closely resemble a full blooded asian.

There is nothing racist about what I'm saying here. It's just reality. Google dominant vs recessive genes.

To assume that the one race will be Human is an arrogant viewpoint to have.

Wow, get over yourself. My reasoning has nothing to do with arrogance or narrowmindedness. It's about recessive genes. If an interracial coupling can only ever produce a human child, then that means that the elven population will inevitably decline.

With each generation a small percentage of them will not produce elven offspring. And the accumulation of those small percentages over generations will lead to a significant decline in the elven population.

Okay, first off, I'm completely at a loss as to *Why* you're so Hell Bent on proving the Elven peoples will vanish from the face of Thedas when the initial post from you folks Lamented this. I came along trying to show you, "Hey look at this point here, here, and right about here and you can see that there's a really good chance the Elven people will be able to endure for as long as Humans, even with intermixing of the Species." Then you spent several posts arguing with me over this.

So...basically you *Want* the Elfs to die out; is that it? If so, well, I guess that's your Karma for whatever reason. Personally, I see plenty of evidence, both in the Dragon Age Universe and in plenty of other Dark/High Fantasy Universes, to indicate that the Elven people will not only be able to maintain a stable population during Alistair's Reign, but that having a more peaceful Ferelden will allow the City Elven peoples to come back into contact more openly with the Dalish. These two once segregated populations coming together will cause a generational Blume, allowing thier numbers to swell to a point in a very short time where Genetic extinction is Highly Unlikely.

As to my having to, "Get over myself?" 

With all due respect, "Frakk You."  

My intent was to simply point out that it's Really Arrogant to assume that *Any* particular Race will become the sole dominant one; in *any* Universe. That's like saying everyone on Planet Earth will one day be White. Regardless of what Genetic Research at the present indicates, you *Can Not* take into account hundreds of random variables; things like Plagues, War, Famines, so on and so forth. Though Dragon Age is a ficitonal Universe, the Rules still apply if the writers want to attempt even a quasi-realistic approach to the DA world, which they've strived to due from the get go. Well, to an extent. In anycase, from my perspective, no one has to worry about the Elven people going the way of the DoDo or a million other species no longer with us. And, frankly, that's good news to me; though it doesn't have to be for you if you choose for it not to be. 
 

Modifié par glenboy24, 18 mai 2010 - 12:38 .

[Rhys Cordelle]

If you claimed that everyone on planet earth will one day be white you'd be a moron. If you claimed that one day nobody on earth will be white, you'd have a good chance of being right.



When I used the term "dominant" i'm referring to genes, not superiority of any particular race.

Okay, first off, I'm completely at a loss as to *Why* you're so Hell Bent on proving the Elven peoples will vanish from the face of Thedas when the initial post from you folks Lamented this.

Because we're talking about a hypothetical situation and applying what we know of reality to it. Just because the decline of the elves would be statistically likely doesn't mean I want it to happen.



You called me a narrow minded racist so frakk you too buddy.

[RavenousBear]

If the elves are going to be extinct, then you can say goodbye to the dwarves. With their "progressive" assembly and low fertility, Orzammar will be in ruins. I highly doubt Bioware is going to kill off these races with just humans and qunari as the only known races left in Thedas.

[Rhys Cordelle]

Of course not. We were just talking about what would likely happen to them in the future. Doesn't mean it will ever happen as part of the Dragon Age games/stories.