185 réponses à ce sujet

[Krystoh]

This isn't DnD. Dwarfs can use a sword. Live and let live.

[artmonster1967]

I demand Arcane Bolt to be renamed back to Magic Missle !!!!!!!



it is soooooo un-immersive to play a mage that casts Arcane Bolt...*pbbt !



so unrealistic....

[FlintlockJazz]

Spawn305 wrote...

In DnD lore from DnDv1 dwarfs had a racial bonus to axes and hammers. Axes need to cut the wood to fuel the
fire’s, Axe's cut the wood needed to support a mining tunnel until the dwarfs could work the stone to make it stable
I don’t mean dwarfs shouldn’t be able to use swords. Just in DnD no dwarf would be caught dead using a sword as a primary weapon.

And like I said I understand that there trying to make their own lore aside from DnD rules and such. But this is the core of the dwarf race living under ground working the stone and the best crafters in the world. Lord Of the Rings has nothing to do with this discussion because like I said in my first post that I played PnP DnD since V1.

But this isn't DnD, and Dwarves in this game are not based entirely around mining. 

Spaghetti_Ninja wrote...

Oh no, another fanboy who considers Lord of the Rings to be the fantasy bible.

As for the Lord of the Ring thing, I think Warhammer is more to blame for the stereotyping since they went above
and beyond with it.  In fact I do believe that the Dwarves used swords in Tolkien's work too.

Modifié par FlintlockJazz, 09 novembre 2009 - 02:54 .

[Spawn305]

Orofino wrote...

I would think that Dwarves would develop axes and hammers as utilitarian tools. Swords are just better for killing people. There is a reason throughout history swords in various shapes and sizes are prevalent as weapons.

One would think that dwarves, being the smart little buggers that they are would always want to be using the best tool for the job. That means picks and hammers for mining, swords for killing.

seems pretty simple to me.

So a sword can cut through plate armor?

I know an axe could chip out a nice chunk of durability from that plate armor in one hit. hell even a hammer could put a nice dent.

Put it this way. Get in a tin trash can. Let me beat on the side with a sword. not goin do much damage to you unless i can gut the tin away.

Now let me take an axe and let me beat the side. After 1 hit that trash can in going to be dented and will most likely do some damage to you.

Same goes with a hammer.

[FlintlockJazz]

Spawn305 wrote...

Orofino wrote...

I would think that Dwarves would develop axes and hammers as utilitarian tools. Swords are just better for killing people. There is a reason throughout history swords in various shapes and sizes are prevalent as weapons.

One would think that dwarves, being the smart little buggers that they are would always want to be using the best tool for the job. That means picks and hammers for mining, swords for killing.

seems pretty simple to me.

So a sword can cut through plate armor?

I know an axe could chip out a nice chunk of durability from that plate armor in one hit. hell even a hammer could put a nice dent.

Put it this way. Get in a tin trash can. Let me beat on the side with a sword. not goin do much damage to you unless i can gut the tin away.

Now let me take an axe and let me beat the side. After 1 hit that trash can in going to be dented and will most likely do some damage to you.

Same goes with a hammer.

Spear and shield is better.  There is a reason why most professional armies in history prefered to use them.

[The Observer]

i agree dwarfs should use hammers/axes more then swords etc, but you come across as a whiney little guy crying about something that isnt HUGELY important, theres a few one handed axes ingame and lots of shields i believe.

[artmonster1967]

Spawn305 wrote...

Orofino wrote...

I would think that Dwarves would develop axes and hammers as utilitarian tools. Swords are just better for killing people. There is a reason throughout history swords in various shapes and sizes are prevalent as weapons.

One would think that dwarves, being the smart little buggers that they are would always want to be using the best tool for the job. That means picks and hammers for mining, swords for killing.

seems pretty simple to me.

So a sword can cut through plate armor?

I know an axe could chip out a nice chunk of durability from that plate armor in one hit. hell even a hammer could put a nice dent.

Put it this way. Get in a tin trash can. Let me beat on the side with a sword. not goin do much damage to you unless i can gut the tin away.

Now let me take an axe and let me beat the side. After 1 hit that trash can in going to be dented and will most likely do some damage to you.

Same goes with a hammer.

hehe...bringing real life physics into an argument about fantasy combat...lol

good one.


that's gonna fly.

.

[Spawn305]

"But this isn't DnD, and Dwarves in this game are not based entirely around mining."


So what is it based on? Going to the surfaceand exploring?or  being exiled from the dwarf community because they stepped foot outside the tunnels? Because that’s the way it works in this game.

Once again I don't care that they can USE a sword just the fact that almost every dwarf uses a sword pisses me off. 

[artmonster1967]

Spawn305 wrote...

Once again I don't care that they can USE a sword just the fact that almost every dwarf uses a sword pisses me off. 

well.......


I guess we can;t help you in your rage...kinda weird that your getting all riled up over it.


good luck with that brah.


.

[Spawn305]

FlintlockJazz wrote...

Spawn305 wrote...

Orofino wrote...

I would think that Dwarves would develop axes and hammers as utilitarian tools. Swords are just better for killing people. There is a reason throughout history swords in various shapes and sizes are prevalent as weapons.

One would think that dwarves, being the smart little buggers that they are would always want to be using the best tool for the job. That means picks and hammers for mining, swords for killing.

seems pretty simple to me.

So a sword can cut through plate armor?

I know an axe could chip out a nice chunk of durability from that plate armor in one hit. hell even a hammer could put a nice dent.

Put it this way. Get in a tin trash can. Let me beat on the side with a sword. not goin do much damage to you unless i can gut the tin away.

Now let me take an axe and let me beat the side. After 1 hit that trash can in going to be dented and will most likely do some damage to you.

Same goes with a hammer.

Spear and shield is better.  There is a reason why most professional armies in history prefered to use them.

So I guess in the history oh man they had magic? dide the yanks bring ice bolts to the new world with them? Don't rationalize this with real life events. I’m also sure the red coats were not running around in Plate armor with a gun.


 
ALSO: Knights in the medieval times used swords because they were lighter then hammer/axes and such. And when you’re in a 80+lbs of armor a light weapon out weights the benefit from a heavy weapon.

SIDE NOTE: they took the normal racial abilites from DnD dwarfs but left out the axe and mace perfered weapons

EDIT: i had a GM once that wouldnt allow me to use a sword on a dwarf rune caster. best caracter iv ever made.
A Dwarf Rune mage that did all his magic based off tatoos:)

Modifié par Spawn305, 09 novembre 2009 - 03:05 .

[Spawn305]

artmonster1967 wrote...

Spawn305 wrote...

Once again I don't care that they can USE a sword just the fact that almost every dwarf uses a sword pisses me off. 

well.......


I guess we can;t help you in your rage...kinda weird that your getting all riled up over it.


good luck with that brah.


.

I'm not raging or anything. Just trying to have a constructive conversation. Now if I was cussing people out then I would agree that I’m raging. But trust me this is not raging.

[spool32]

Scottish accents too!

Modifié par spool32, 09 novembre 2009 - 03:34 .

[KatzBlackblade]

Sure, dwarfs usually cut a lot of wood. I mean, there are whole forests down in their mines, right?

As has been said before, there's a reason why swords always were the main weapons. We don't hear much about foot soldiers using axes in the medieval times... One reason for that might be that you can slash, pierce or even parry with a sword. Whereas with an axe, you're pretty much limited to slashing...

Anyway, if you don't like the lore in Dragon Age, you'd better indeed run back to WOW or any LoTR game...

[Spawn305]

KatzBlackblade wrote...

Sure, dwarfs usually cut a lot of wood. I mean, there are whole forests down in their mines, right?
As has been said before, there's a reason why swords always were the main weapons. We don't hear much about foot soldiers using axes in the medieval times... One reason for that might be that you can slash, pierce or even parry with a sword. Whereas with an axe, you're pretty much limited to slashing...
Anyway, if you don't like the lore in Dragon Age, you'd better indeed run back to WOW or any LoTR game...

um.. Wow your extremely off. Go to the medieval display at the art museum in PA. They have TONES of Medieval weapons including flails, swords, axes, hammers, pole arms, spears, Long bows, cross bows, and slings.

Axes are used to slash/blunt. Put a 200lb man behind a 2h axe and then put the same man behind a 2h sword. Sure the sword could cut though leather armor and would leave a nice cut. But an axe will cut though it and break your freaking bones at the same time.
Yes the sword would also break some bones. But would hardly hurt a plate wearing foot man, unless you get him between the armor plates.

What does WoW or LotR online have to do with any of this converstation. i remeber stating at least 3 times already that my judgment is based off DnD. Not mmo's..

Modifié par Spawn305, 09 novembre 2009 - 03:28 .

[FlintlockJazz]

Spawn305 wrote...



"But this isn't DnD, and Dwarves in this game are not based entirely around mining."


So
what is it based on? Going to the surfaceand exploring?or  being exiled
from the dwarf community because they stepped foot outside the
tunnels? Because that’s the way it works in this game.

Once again I don't care that they can USE a sword just the fact that almost every dwarf uses a sword pisses me off. 

Politics, surviving against the darkspawn, and honour for most, simple survival for the underclass (who would most likely use daggers and other concealable weapons more than big warhammers).  Swords are typically associated with nobility, hence the political elite dwarves who pride themselves on appearing honorable (even when they're not) and so would probably like to use them.

Spawn305 wrote...

FlintlockJazz wrote...

Spawn305 wrote...

Orofino wrote...

I would think that Dwarves would develop axes and hammers as utilitarian tools. Swords are just better for killing people. There is a reason throughout history swords in various shapes and sizes are prevalent as weapons.

One would think that dwarves, being the smart little buggers that they are would always want to be using the best tool for the job. That means picks and hammers for mining, swords for killing.

seems pretty simple to me.

So a sword can cut through plate armor?

I know an axe could chip out a nice chunk of durability from that plate armor in one hit. hell even a hammer could put a nice dent.

Put it this way. Get in a tin trash can. Let me beat on the side with a sword. not goin do much damage to you unless i can gut the tin away.

Now let me take an axe and let me beat the side. After 1 hit that trash can in going to be dented and will most likely do some damage to you.

Same goes with a hammer.

Spear and shield is better.  There is a reason why most professional armies in history prefered to use them.

So I guess in the history oh man they had magic? dide the yanks bring ice bolts to the new world with them? Don't rationalize this with real life events. I’m also sure the red coats were not running around in Plate armor with a gun.


 
ALSO: Knights in the medieval times used swords because they were lighter then hammer/axes and such. And when you’re in a 80+lbs of armor a light weapon out weights the benefit from a heavy weapon.

SIDE NOTE: they took the normal racial abilites from DnD dwarfs but left out the axe and mace perfered weapons

EDIT: i had a GM once that wouldnt allow me to use a sword on a dwarf rune caster. best caracter iv ever made.
A Dwarf Rune mage that did all his magic based off tatoos:)

You brought in real world mechanics, so I refuted you with real world mechanics, do not get aggressive with me.  Swords can also stab people in vulnerable spots such as where the armour joins together, and halberds were typically equipped with hooks that could be used to pry off armour.

Again, DnD is not applicable here as this isn't DnD, games do not have to be identical.

[Spawn305]

FlintlockJazz wrote...

Spawn305 wrote...



"But this isn't DnD, and Dwarves in this game are not based entirely around mining."


So
what is it based on? Going to the surfaceand exploring?or  being exiled
from the dwarf community because they stepped foot outside the
tunnels? Because that’s the way it works in this game.

Once again I don't care that they can USE a sword just the fact that almost every dwarf uses a sword pisses me off. 

Politics, surviving against the darkspawn, and honour for most, simple survival for the underclass (who would most likely use daggers and other concealable weapons more than big warhammers).  Swords are typically associated with nobility, hence the political elite dwarves who pride themselves on appearing honorable (even when they're not) and so would probably like to use them.

Spawn305 wrote...

FlintlockJazz wrote...

Spawn305 wrote...

Orofino wrote...

I would think that Dwarves would develop axes and hammers as utilitarian tools. Swords are just better for killing people. There is a reason throughout history swords in various shapes and sizes are prevalent as weapons.

One would think that dwarves, being the smart little buggers that they are would always want to be using the best tool for the job. That means picks and hammers for mining, swords for killing.

seems pretty simple to me.

So a sword can cut through plate armor?

I know an axe could chip out a nice chunk of durability from that plate armor in one hit. hell even a hammer could put a nice dent.

Put it this way. Get in a tin trash can. Let me beat on the side with a sword. not goin do much damage to you unless i can gut the tin away.

Now let me take an axe and let me beat the side. After 1 hit that trash can in going to be dented and will most likely do some damage to you.

Same goes with a hammer.

Spear and shield is better.  There is a reason why most professional armies in history prefered to use them.

So I guess in the history oh man they had magic? dide the yanks bring ice bolts to the new world with them? Don't rationalize this with real life events. I’m also sure the red coats were not running around in Plate armor with a gun.


 
ALSO: Knights in the medieval times used swords because they were lighter then hammer/axes and such. And when you’re in a 80+lbs of armor a light weapon out weights the benefit from a heavy weapon.

SIDE NOTE: they took the normal racial abilites from DnD dwarfs but left out the axe and mace perfered weapons

EDIT: i had a GM once that wouldnt allow me to use a sword on a dwarf rune caster. best caracter iv ever made.
A Dwarf Rune mage that did all his magic based off tatoos:)

You brought in real world mechanics, so I refuted you with real world mechanics, do not get aggressive with me.  Swords can also stab people in vulnerable spots such as where the armour joins together, and halberds were typically equipped with hooks that could be used to pry off armour.

Again, DnD is not applicable here as this isn't DnD, games do not have to be identical.

Sorry to burst your bubble here man. But you were the one brining in Real life events not me. I corrected you on your real life events.

I dont care if your agree with me or not. This this issue pisses me off to no end. Nothing u say will convince me other wise. just like how no matter what i say to you, you will always think your right. So..

[MrGOH]

Spawn305 wrote...

*monster quote boxes*

Sorry to
burst your bubble here man. But you were the one brining in Real life
events not me. I corrected you on your real life events.

I dont
care if your agree with me or not. This this issue pisses me off to no
end. Nothing u say will convince me other wise. just like how no matter
what i say to you, you will always think your right. So..

So obviously the only way to solve this is a fight to the death.

Modifié par MrGOH, 09 novembre 2009 - 03:35 .

[Trelow-LMG]

Because it's their world and they can do what they want.



Besides a sword is the most versatile melee weapon.



And several notable dwarves, including entire armies, used swords in JRR's world. He kinda wrote the book on fantasy, literally.

[Spawn305]

Trelow-LMG wrote...

Because it's their world and they can do what they want.

Besides a sword is the most versatile melee weapon.

And several notable dwarves, including entire armies, used swords in JRR's world. He kinda wrote the book on fantasy, literally.

once again LOTR has nothing to do with what im talking about. I'm comparing DA dwarfs to DnD dwarfs. that is all.

[Spawn305]

Crawling_Chaos wrote...

They do have axes and hammers and maces you moron.

Were at? because i have yet to see one. im 15 hours into the game and still useing the dwarf sword.

[danien.grey]

Spawn305 wrote...
...I dont care if your agree with me or not. This this issue pisses me off to no end. Nothing u say will convince me other wise. just like how no matter what i say to you, you will always think your right. So...

So that should spell the end of this discussion.  Neither school of thought will agree with the other and anything posted after this fact is moribund and simply an attempt to increase one's post count. (Including this post, har!)

[exerci]

Spawn305 wrote...

Orofino wrote...

I would think that Dwarves would develop axes and hammers as utilitarian tools. Swords are just better for killing people. There is a reason throughout history swords in various shapes and sizes are prevalent as weapons.

One would think that dwarves, being the smart little buggers that they are would always want to be using the best tool for the job. That means picks and hammers for mining, swords for killing.

seems pretty simple to me.

So a sword can cut through plate armor?

I know an axe could chip out a nice chunk of durability from that plate armor in one hit. hell even a hammer could put a nice dent.

Put it this way. Get in a tin trash can. Let me beat on the side with a sword. not goin do much damage to you unless i can gut the tin away.

Now let me take an axe and let me beat the side. After 1 hit that trash can in going to be dented and will most likely do some damage to you.

Same goes with a hammer.

You're right, yet wrong. True, against heavily armored foes, an axe/hammer would be great. (Axes are unlikely to be used in mines, really. No forests inside, and the dwarves in Dragon Age don't EVER go outside, as evidenced by Oghren's reaction "SO MUCH SKYYYYY") But... Looking at the darkspawn in general for a second, who are pretty much the only natural enemies of the dwarves, it seem, the darkspawn are generally not very heavy armored. And pretty much none of them bother wearing helmets. Hence they've got perfectly good unarmored parts to attack, which makes a sword perfect, because you don't have to hit properly with a sword to hurt someone. Swords are lighter, hence faster, and do a pretty constant amount of damage, no matter how hard you strike (unless you're aiming to cut them in half. But notice that a quick swipe across an unguarded stomach would pretty much result in someone bleeding to death within a few seconds.)

Also, someone mentioned spears + shields as being prevalent in medieval militaries... Newsflash, effectiveness is not the reason. The main reason was, quite simply, that it was the cheapest possible weapon to make (mostly wood with a metal tip) and that it required nearly no smithing skill to make, meaning that instead of having to seek out Bob, the master smith, you could instead just have Bob, John and Rick, the apprentice smiths, do the work. Faster, easier, and required no real skills to manufacture. That was the reason for the spear's prevalence.

Only the actual rich soldiers could afford actual swords. (Axes were cheaper)

In the context of the game, I assume metals are fairly prevalent materials in the dwarven caverns, so the soldiers there would probably have an easier time affording swords... and considering that none of the darkspawn seem to be wearing big suits of platemail, I think it's safe to assume that the sword is the best weapon for the task.

[FlintlockJazz]

Spawn305 wrote...

FlintlockJazz wrote...

Spawn305 wrote...



"But this isn't DnD, and Dwarves in this game are not based entirely around mining."


So
what is it based on? Going to the surfaceand exploring?or  being exiled
from the dwarf community because they stepped foot outside the
tunnels? Because that’s the way it works in this game.

Once again I don't care that they can USE a sword just the fact that almost every dwarf uses a sword pisses me off. 

Politics, surviving against the darkspawn, and honour for most, simple survival for the underclass (who would most likely use daggers and other concealable weapons more than big warhammers).  Swords are typically associated with nobility, hence the political elite dwarves who pride themselves on appearing honorable (even when they're not) and so would probably like to use them.

Spawn305 wrote...

FlintlockJazz wrote...

Spawn305 wrote...

Orofino wrote...

I would think that Dwarves would develop axes and hammers as utilitarian tools. Swords are just better for killing people. There is a reason throughout history swords in various shapes and sizes are prevalent as weapons.

One would think that dwarves, being the smart little buggers that they are would always want to be using the best tool for the job. That means picks and hammers for mining, swords for killing.

seems pretty simple to me.

So a sword can cut through plate armor?

I know an axe could chip out a nice chunk of durability from that plate armor in one hit. hell even a hammer could put a nice dent.

Put it this way. Get in a tin trash can. Let me beat on the side with a sword. not goin do much damage to you unless i can gut the tin away.

Now let me take an axe and let me beat the side. After 1 hit that trash can in going to be dented and will most likely do some damage to you.

Same goes with a hammer.

Spear and shield is better.  There is a reason why most professional armies in history prefered to use them.

So I guess in the history oh man they had magic? dide the yanks bring ice bolts to the new world with them? Don't rationalize this with real life events. I’m also sure the red coats were not running around in Plate armor with a gun.


 
ALSO: Knights in the medieval times used swords because they were lighter then hammer/axes and such. And when you’re in a 80+lbs of armor a light weapon out weights the benefit from a heavy weapon.

SIDE NOTE: they took the normal racial abilites from DnD dwarfs but left out the axe and mace perfered weapons

EDIT: i had a GM once that wouldnt allow me to use a sword on a dwarf rune caster. best caracter iv ever made.
A Dwarf Rune mage that did all his magic based off tatoos:)

You brought in real world mechanics, so I refuted you with real world mechanics, do not get aggressive with me.  Swords can also stab people in vulnerable spots such as where the armour joins together, and halberds were typically equipped with hooks that could be used to pry off armour.

Again, DnD is not applicable here as this isn't DnD, games do not have to be identical.

Sorry to burst your bubble here man. But you were the one brining in Real life events not me. I corrected you on your real life events.

I dont care if your agree with me or not. This this issue pisses me off to no end. Nothing u say will convince me other wise. just like how no matter what i say to you, you will always think your right. So..

You said...

"So a sword can cut through plate armor?

I know an axe could
chip out a nice chunk of durability from that plate armor in one hit.
hell even a hammer could put a nice dent.

Put it this way. Get
in a tin trash can. Let me beat on the side with a sword. not goin do
much damage to you unless i can gut the tin away.

Now let me
take an axe and let me beat the side. After 1 hit that trash can in
going to be dented and will most likely do some damage to you.

Same goes with a hammer."

It's right up there, the post I was responding to when 'I' apparently brought in real life mechanics, but I somehow I get the feeling you know this and are just lying.  As for respecting each other's opinions, you have been aggressive and nasty throughout the thread, but what more do we expect from a troll, so I say nee to you.

Nee!