130 réponses à ce sujet

[Tirigon]

So I wonder.. I am currently playing my City Elf and I´m close to the Landsmeet, and I´m not sure whether Alistair or Anora should rule. I tried making them marry, but Alistair refused.

The way I RP my elf she is not interested in human politics, and she hates all nobles due to her experiences with Vaughan. As this includes Alistair she can´t choose based on personal feelings but on what is best for the elves. Anora promises to improve the situation for them, and she has a point that she is stronger than Alistair. However, Alistair would be easier to influence, while I don´t know whether Anora is trustworthy or whether she will betray the elves once she has power.

So whom do you think should I choose?  (Note that I plan to recruit Loghain)

[Emerald Melios]

Just go with Alistair if you're in doubt. And you can arrange to be made a Bann of the Alienage.

[BHRamsay]

Some people really like to ride the Anora peace train since Ferelden under her rule does pretty well. I'm no fan of hers since she forces Alistair to renounce his claim to the throne on pain of death and she seems quite willing to betray you if you aren't doing her bidding... but since you have not hardened Alistair and intend to spare her father you will be fine ... If you have any trace of affection for Alistair whatsoever I would make sure your persuade is nice and high since Anora will try and kill him if she can't get him to bend to her will.

[Costin_Razvan]

Emerald Melios wrote...

Just go with Alistair if you're in doubt. And you can arrange to be made a Bann of the Alienage.

You obviously forgot the part where Tirigon was planning to recruit Loghain.

And how the hell did Alistair refuse? Your persuasion not high enough?

Anyway to answer your question: Yes she can be trusted, and no she will not betray the elves. 

[sonsonthebia07]

Alistair isn't a ruler. He even tells you so himself, and the only time he wishes to be is when you harden him and then spare Loghain. "I don't get things my way, so I'm going to do this now! Hmph!" Anora has basically been ruling Ferelden for 5 years and is a very effective and efficient queen, though perhaps a bit manipulative.



But would Anora hold through with promises to the elves once she has power? I doubt she would do anything against her word unless she was entirely sure that it wouldn't cause a significant uproar or threaten her hold on the throne. She does appear to be somewhat power-hungry but that isn't necessarily a bad thing.



I personally think you should choose Alistair to be king if you RP your elf that way.

[Arthur Cousland]

Anora and Alistair compliment each other. She rules, while he "leads".

[Nerevar-as]

Hardened Alistair + Anora marry and people will think the cilvil war was worth it. Unhardened Alistair is a popular king, but NOT a good king.

[Tirigon]

Costin_Razvan wrote...

You obviously forgot the part where Tirigon was planning to recruit Loghain.

And how the hell did Alistair refuse? Your persuasion not high enough?

I don´t know; I have lv 4 coercion and 80 cunning, so there are 3 possibilities: It´s either a bug (wouldn´t be too surprising, unfortunately), I picked the wrong of the 2 persuade options or Alistair can´t be persuaded when he´s at 90 hostile. I think that´s most probably - it would make sense, too. If I was him I´d tell my PC to f*ck off, too^^

[Tirigon]

sonsonthebia07 wrote...


But would Anora hold through with promises to the elves once she has power? I doubt she would do anything against her word unless she was entirely sure that it wouldn't cause a significant uproar or threaten her hold on the throne. She does appear to be somewhat power-hungry but that isn't necessarily a bad thing.

Well in the end I chose Anora, justifiying it with the crows. My PC was invited to join them, so if she DOES betray me I might get a truly royal first contract:devil:

[Costin_Razvan]

Alistair can´t be persuaded when he´s at 90 hostile.

Considering how you have defended Alistair in this forum, dare I ask what have you done so far in that playthrough?

[Tirigon]

Costin_Razvan wrote...

Alistair can´t be persuaded when he´s at 90 hostile.

Considering how you have defended Alistair in this forum, dare I ask what have you done so far in that playthrough?

I wanted to try something else. I had 2 playthroughs already with Alistair - in one I married him with my noble, in the other he killed himself because he couldn´t be with a mage as king.

This time I played an city elf who doesn´t like humans in general, and especially hates nobles and was annoyed with his bad jokes.

And it´s not hard to get his approval down anyways. Killing Isolde to save Connor gives -40 alone.



My main motivation, however, was to get the Loghain achievement and to learn his PoV from himself instead from you and KoP:)

Modifié par Tirigon, 22 mai 2010 - 04:15 .

[Belhene]

Arthur Cousland wrote...

Anora and Alistair compliment each other. She rules, while he "leads".

Alistair doesn't lead a goddamn thing. Why do you think you led the party the whole game, even though your character was a newbie and Alistair wasn't? He's funny and easy-going, that's all.

[Costin_Razvan]

My main motivation, however, was to get the Loghain achievement and to learn his PoV from himself instead from you and KoP

He won't give you any motivation unless you act nice with him...or well at least don't get him hostile in approval. Though you should take him with you to Ostagar when you return there.

I wanted to try something else. I had 2 playthroughs already with Alistair - in one I married him with my noble, in the other he killed himself because he couldn´t be with a mage as king.

What about your other game choices?

[KnightofPhoenix]

Tirigon wrote...
My main motivation, however, was to get the Loghain achievement and to learn his PoV from himself instead from you and KoP:)

A large part of my opinion is based on what David Gaider said.

[Sarah1281]

Anora is a fine ruler in regards to the elves if you ARE a CE but other than that if Alistair isn't ruling with her there are those pesky riots. And Alistair can't be solo king if you want Loghain on your side as if you try to spare him Alistair makes it a 'pick me so I can kill him!' thing and you either do that, choose Anora so you don't kill him, or make them marry (which only works in this case if he's hardened).

[Xandurpein]

Anora keeps her promises, at least up to the point where her rule is in danger. I don't think she will risk her thone on some principle to keep a promise, but beyond that she can be trusted.

Alistair all depends on if he is hardened or unhardened. Unhardened Alistair can no doubt be more easily influenced than Anora, but that also means that he can be influenced by others than you. So if you plan to stay in Denerim and spend a significant amount of time around court, then I'm sure unhardened Alistair can be persuaded to do more for the elves than Anora, but if you plan to stay away from human politics, then maybe making a deal with Anora is a safer bet.

A hardened Alistair will decide more for himself and won't be as easily influenced. He thinks more with his heart than Anora. I think that means that the key to making hardend Alistair do your bidding is high approval. A hardened Alistair with low approval would no doubt feel little inclination to make any promises to your elf.

Ultimatly it also depends on what you want for the elves. Alistair's strong points as ruler is creating stability and harmony. He is charismatic and aood listener so there is more harmony in the country. He is good for the present.

Anora on the other hand is all about progress, better trade, education and economy. Even if that is not aimed at the elves, everyone in Fereldan, including the poorest will benefit from that in the long run. Anora is good for the future. It's up to you to decide what is important to you.

Modifié par Xandurpein, 22 mai 2010 - 06:09 .

[Tirigon]

Costin_Razvan wrote...


What about your other game choices?

- Vaughan killed,
- Redcliff left for the undead,
- Connor saved, Isolde killed in the blood magic ritual
- Ashes defiled + Wynne killed, Genitivi killed
- killed the werewolves,
- circle freed,
- anvil of the void destroyed,
- Bhelen as dwarf king,
- Avernus left to study (not 100% sure anymore) and used his research for more power,
- Slaver in the Alienage killed
- Loghain´s little girl killed in Howe´s estate
- Dark ritual refused


Did I forget any major choice?

Modifié par Tirigon, 22 mai 2010 - 06:15 .

[Sarah1281]

Why'd you bother killing Genitivi if the ashes were already defiled?

[Tirigon]

Btw, I lol´d hard when Eamon told that the Orlaisian troops will come. Loghain tried to kill all wardens to avoid that, and now he just accepts that?! Great......





And Loghain should make the speech at Denerim´s gates, Anora is probably the worst speaker I´ve seen, and her voice gives me a headache.

[Tirigon]

Sarah1281 wrote...

Why'd you bother killing Genitivi if the ashes were already defiled?

My Elf hates the chantry, and besides she wanted to avoid that he tells about the sacrilege. The templars wouldn´t be pleased, I think.

[Costin_Razvan]

I prefer her versus Alistair truthfully.

[Xandurpein]

Belhene wrote...

Arthur Cousland wrote...

Anora and Alistair compliment each other. She rules, while he "leads".

Alistair doesn't lead a goddamn thing. Why do you think you led the party the whole game, even though your character was a newbie and Alistair wasn't? He's funny and easy-going, that's all.

When it comes to Alistair as king you really need to see Alistair as both hardened and unhardened. It's not really meaningful to discuss him as ruler unless you specify what Alistair you are discussing. It is a huge difference really.

Unhardened Alistair is still a good communicator, but he's probably mostly a puppet for Anora/Eamon/PC who really rules.

Hardened Alistair is no push over and has a lot more self confidence. He is still ruled by emotions and not as strategic and logical as Anora, but he clearly has a mind of his own.

Modifié par Xandurpein, 22 mai 2010 - 07:11 .

[Costin_Razvan]

Btw, I lol´d hard when Eamon told that the Orlaisian troops will come. Loghain tried to kill all wardens to avoid that, and now he just accepts that?! Great......

He doesn't have much choice at that point.

I think that Eamon was the one who was trying to orchestrate Eamon's marriage to Celene.

Modifié par Costin_Razvan, 22 mai 2010 - 07:10 .

[Xandurpein]

Costin_Razvan wrote...

Btw, I lol´d hard when Eamon told that the Orlaisian troops will come. Loghain tried to kill all wardens to avoid that, and now he just accepts that?! Great......

He doesn't have much choice at that point.

I think that Eamon was the one who was trying to orchestrate Eamon's marriage to Celene.

I think a lot of Loghain's fear was that he thought Cailan would be duped into giving up Fereldan's soveriegnty. He only respects strength and since the PC has proven his or her strength, maybe he believes that now Fereldan does at least have a strong leader who can defend Fereldan if needed. Fereldan is hard to capture and harder to hold, as long as it has a determined leader.

[Sarah1281]

Costin_Razvan wrote...

Btw, I lol´d hard when Eamon told that the Orlaisian troops will come. Loghain tried to kill all wardens to avoid that, and now he just accepts that?! Great......

He doesn't have much choice at that point.

I think that Eamon was the one who was trying to orchestrate Eamon's marriage to Celene.

Kind of doubt it. First, we don't even know that was happening and I think the presence of a letter from Eamon saying 'go find someone younger and preferably more noble' and one from Celene written in an informal tone =/= marriage. Second, if Eamon's letter was recent that means that he still didn't think Cailan would go for simply ditching Anora and you'd think that would be easier to convince him of then 'ditch Anora for the empress.' Three, we don't know that Celen was even single. Four, she's older than Anora so that wouldn't be any more likely to get an heir. Five, we have no reason to believe that Eamon is an idiot. Six, we have no reason to believe he wants Ferelden to become part of Orlais again. Seven, permanent alliances don't have to mean the marriage of two monarchs. Yes, marriage was often involved in medieval times but if Cailan were willing to ditch Anora and get married to an Orlesian it could just be a noblewoman.