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The 'official' Ashley Williams support thread 1.1


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#7651
DWH1982

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I agree, Ash is the deepest of the LIs available for male characters.

I'm of the opinion that ME2 didn't invest enough time and effort in the LIs. With Ash (and Kaidan for female characters) you have a romance that develops over time, and you get to learn a lot about the LI through long discussions on politics, their background, and even the background of your Shepard.

In ME2, you get, what... two or three short conversations before you become "involved." Then they stop talking to you before the love scene.

I'm trying to romance Miranda on my current playthrough of ME2. I was enthusiastic about it at first, but I'm becoming less so. I keep wondering, why is it, exactly, that my Shepard wants to be with Miranda? Compared to Ash, whom he learned so much about, and with whom I feel he developed this great relationship, it feels like Shepard, and the player, really don't learn anything at all about Miranda, beyond the basics.

I'm a little depressed about our chances of seeing Ash return in any meaningful way, but a part of me really hopes that she does. Partly because she seems the best suited for the kind of Shepard I try to play (paragon alliance loyalist - she balances out his "head in the clouds" syndrome a bit, while, unlike Miranda, being a little closer to him in the "line I won't cross" department), but also partly because, unlike most of the other ME2 characters, I feel like my Shepard actually has a reason to be involved with her.

Modifié par DWH1982, 18 mars 2011 - 06:53 .


#7652
Guest_haynoats_*

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I have felt that ME2 relied upon the loyalty missions to supply the background info. for Tali, Miranda, and Jack. In a sense, they replaced the meaningful conversations you mentioned in ME1. The same would be true for the male LI loyalty missions.

Guess the writers figured that kind of content should supersede simple conversations. I don't. ME2 is too easy to get yourself hooked into a LI conversation trap where you end up having to dump them or just stick with them. I enjoyed the slower ME1 development of the relationship in ME1.

If Ash does not get similar treatment as Liara (whether in the new DLC or ME3) I would be disappointed in their choosing to not further develop a well written character. What a blown opportunity that would be!

#7653
DWH1982

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I mean no offense to Bioware, but if they wanted to use the loyalty missions to replace conversation for character development... they failed.

You do learn a little more about the characters in their loyalty missions, but not nearly enough to justify romancing them. If anything, it just makes it seem like, "Okay, you helped me out with one thing - now I want to sleep with you!"

I should note, I don't say this to knock the ME2 love interests. I know that there are people who prefer them. If anything, I feel they were rather shafted by the way ME2 handles its character development.

I also will be disappointed if Ash does not get the same treatment as Liara, but, to be honest, it's a disappointment I almost expect at this point. The general feeling I get is that Bioware is more interested in developing the other characters. I hope they prove me wrong, but I don't expect it.

The writer who was responsible for Ash's character in ME1 no longer works at Bioware, which is something else that has me worried. Even if the other writers DO want to take over someone else's character, will they be able to do her justice?

#7654
niravital

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DWH1982 wrote...

I keep wondering, why is it, exactly, that my Shepard wants to be with Miranda?


Well, her super sexy australian accent, of course. B)

DWH1982 wrote...
...If anything, it just makes it seem like,
"Okay, you helped me out with one thing - now I want to sleep with you!"


Wait, what?! Isn't it like this in real life also?? :huh: lol


DWH1982 wrote...

I mean no offense to Bioware, but if they wanted to use the loyalty missions to replace conversation for character development... they failed.

You do learn a little more about the characters in their loyalty missions, but not nearly enough to justify romancing them. If anything, it just makes it seem like, "Okay, you helped me out with one thing - now I want to sleep with you!"

I should note, I don't say this to knock the ME2 love interests. I know that there are people who prefer them. If anything, I feel they were rather shafted by the way ME2 handles its character development.

I also will be disappointed if Ash does not get the same treatment as Liara, but, to be honest, it's a disappointment I almost expect at this point. The general feeling I get is that Bioware is more interested in developing the other characters. I hope they prove me wrong, but I don't expect it.

The writer who was responsible for Ash's character in ME1 no longer works at Bioware, which is something else that has me worried. Even if the other writers DO want to take over someone else's character, will they be able to do her justice?


It's not like Ashley is the only character its writers changed between ME1 to ME2 (unless I'm wrong, which is possible, and please correct me if I do). I enjoyed most of ME1 characters in ME2, they seemed more mature, experienced, with stronger personalities and goals. The only exception was Liara who frightened me a little. As for Ash I think she was very much like how we knew her from ME1.

I agree with you that romance development in ME2 was superfast, except with Jack (Tali's was exceptionaly shallow). ME1 relationship development was way better in my opinion. As for character development, I think we learn more than just a "little" about the characters with their conversations leading to and during their loyalty missions. Most of them feature the most personal and sensitive situations for themselves:

Miranda's family - her father issues, protecting her sister, betrayel of her only friend she trusted...
Jack's going back for the first time to where she was a test subject and finding out new facts that shake her conception of what happened to her...
Tali's acknowledgment of her father's work and experiments with living Geth, and his death.

These are only examples of MaleShep LI but the rest of the characters are more or less the same. They overcome the difficult situations the loyalty mission throws at them and shape their character accordinally. I don't think we learn more about Ash in ME1 than we learn about Miranda in ME2, for example.
So in my opinion choosing character development through gameplay missions was interesting and a success. I somewhat expect to learn more about Ash in ME3 the same way, after reading about this idea somewhere else.

As for justifying romance - well, it's personal, we do learn about
characters' personalities and every guy has a different taste in women
(and vice versa). Some wouldn't even like Ash (God forbid!). I do think the writers gave us enough information about each character so Shepard could feel something towards them.

#7655
Homebound

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hail to the king baby

#7656
durchgefallen

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Why so negative? Didn't bioware confirm that people who remained loyal would be rewarded?
I'm new here so don't shoot me if I ask stupid questions

#7657
VutaatVerd

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durchgefallen wrote...

Why so negative? Didn't bioware confirm that people who remained loyal would be rewarded?
I'm new here so don't shoot me if I ask stupid questions


First welcome. Second yes that is what Bioware has said about the ME1 LI. It is that the VS has been really jacked up in ME2, one word....Horzion. The writing on ME2 sucked and lack of acknowledgment from Bioware other than "We have not forgot". Many do think that Bioware has forgotten about the ME1 LI, but we here remain faithful to the LI and hope Bioware does not jack up ME3 with ME1 LI. If that were to happen I think that would be the last straw for many and we just return to ME1 to play with our favorite characters and with a better storyline.

#7658
Telemachus78

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Ash blasting baddies with her boomstick for top of page.

Posted Image

#7659
niravital

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durchgefallen wrote...

Why so negative? Didn't bioware confirm that people who remained loyal would be rewarded?
I'm new here so don't shoot me if I ask stupid questions


I'm with you.

And don't worry, Ash people are nice people ;)
Welcome aboard.

#7660
niravital

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Telemachus78 wrote...

Ash blasting baddies with her boomstick for top of page.


Amm, not so much top of the page down here lol :lol:
But it's always nice to see more Ash pics.

#7661
lawp79

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Ok so Admiral Hacket is in the Arrival DLC according to the EA germany press release, pleeeeease let that mean we work with the alliance and *swoon* Ash....

#7662
Lord Zeuss

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lawp79 wrote...

Ok so Admiral Hacket is in the Arrival DLC according to the EA germany press release, pleeeeease let that mean we work with the alliance and *swoon* Ash....


Do you have a link for this?

#7663
VutaatVerd

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Hey all just wanted to let you know I added two new FanPic's to the OP, thank Domar everyone (Well I seen him post it first, correct me if I am wrong)

Side Note come on Hacket I need a door opener for the Alliance again.

#7664
durchgefallen

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lawp79 wrote...

Ok so Admiral Hacket is in the Arrival DLC according to the EA germany press release, pleeeeease let that mean we work with the alliance and *swoon* Ash....




TIM is mad at me for blowing up the collector base so it does make sense to rejoin with the alliance. But only if they transfer Ash back to the Normandy as my second in command.

Sorry Miranda! You can still be my Intel officer though

#7665
lawp79

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http://social.biowar...0/index/6628910



vg247.com/2011/03/18/ea-germany-confirms-march-29-release-for-mass-effect-2-arrival-dlc/

Sorry about the link my iPhone is being strange

Modifié par lawp79, 18 mars 2011 - 02:06 .


#7666
SilverRose208

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durchgefallen wrote...

Why so negative? Didn't bioware confirm that people who remained loyal would be rewarded?
I'm new here so don't shoot me if I ask stupid questions


Welcome to the group!  We're not all negative.  A lot of people are bitter because of the lack of Ash in ME2, etc. etc.  I, for one, am still looking forward to mah faithful Shep being rewarded.

#7667
Raanz

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lawp79 wrote...

Ok so Admiral Hacket is in the Arrival DLC according to the EA germany press release, pleeeeease let that mean we work with the alliance and *swoon* Ash....


I am 90% certain the "undercover operative" is the survivor.
Hackett, the Alliance, all of the things I said before.  I am even more convinced today with the news of the DLC.

#7668
Ty2011

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lawp79 wrote...

Ok so Admiral Hacket is in the Arrival DLC according to the EA germany press release, pleeeeease let that mean we work with the alliance and *swoon* Ash....

Was just about to say this ^

She better be in it. :pinched:

#7669
Lord Zeuss

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Raanz wrote...

lawp79 wrote...

Ok so Admiral Hacket is in the Arrival DLC according to the EA germany press release, pleeeeease let that mean we work with the alliance and *swoon* Ash....


I am 90% certain the "undercover operative" is the survivor.
Hackett, the Alliance, all of the things I said before.  I am even more convinced today with the news of the DLC.


I'm pretty sure it's Dr. Kenson, actually.:mellow:

#7670
Fiery Phoenix

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Undercover operative is obviously Amanda.

#7671
Guest_haynoats_*

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durchgefallen wrote...

Why so negative? Didn't bioware confirm that people who remained loyal would be rewarded?
I'm new here so don't shoot me if I ask stupid questions


Well I've been lurking here for what will soon be a year but prefer to stay quiet most of the time.  So I guess I'm new to making any comment at all.  Welcome!  Ash people are nice people, regardless if others tend to say we are a bit like the character we appreciate. Posted Image

I don't have a negative point of view regarding no further Ash content.  I'm sure the VS will reunite with us at least in some way.  As I said, my only disappointment will be if they drop the ball on further development and utilization of a character that stood out (for me) so much in ME1.

Why?  Ash is younger than Shep (as are some of the other female LI's).  She has her own ideas and opinions of things.  But!  I found that she (like Garrus and maybe Wrex) also thinks about your conversations and grows from them.  She deserves the opportunity to develop, especially when the writers obviously put a great deal of effort into the character in ME1.  I don't want to see that character left at the point of development where detractors can simply dismiss her as a surface bigot, religious freak, yada, yada, yada.

To be honest, Liara's development in ME2 was a bit scary.  Two years of mourning Shepherd made her shift her obsession with Prothean archaeology to destroying the Shadow Broker.  Does any manshep really think she could give up the power she has obtained to commit to any type of meaningful, lasting relationship?  Me thinks not.

But that's just my oppinion.  No need to go spreading it around.  Posted Image

#7672
Raanz

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Lord Zeuss wrote...

Raanz wrote...

lawp79 wrote...

Ok so Admiral Hacket is in the Arrival DLC according to the EA germany press release, pleeeeease let that mean we work with the alliance and *swoon* Ash....


I am 90% certain the "undercover operative" is the survivor.
Hackett, the Alliance, all of the things I said before.  I am even more convinced today with the news of the DLC.


I'm pretty sure it's Dr. Kenson, actually.:mellow:


Ok this coudl be a good discussion.  Why do you think it's the good doctor?  She is the one that published the paper about dust in the gravity wells.  We know she will be in the DLC, but I have seen nothing that tells me she is an undercover operative.    You might be right, but I'm not convinced yet.
I know everyone is trying to keep their expectations down for fear of being disappointed, so maybe I need to just shut up, and wait another week and a half. ^_^

#7673
Flamewielder

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My money's on the VS being the deep cover operative. Admiral Hackett obviously trusts Shepard still and the VS has obviously proved his/her loyalty to the Alliance after Horizon. Wanna bet he/she will be available as a squaddie on the way out of Batarian space? ;)

#7674
Lord Zeuss

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Raanz wrote...

Ok this coudl be a good discussion.  Why do you think it's the good doctor?  She is the one that published the paper about dust in the gravity wells.  We know she will be in the DLC, but I have seen nothing that tells me she is an undercover operative.    You might be right, but I'm not convinced yet.
I know everyone is trying to keep their expectations down for fear of being disappointed, so maybe I need to just shut up, and wait another week and a half. ^_^


One of the leaked Achievements for Arrival was "Rescue Dr. Kenson", and since this deep cover operative is also being 'rescued', this would seem to suggest their identity.

#7675
xxSgt_Reed_24xx

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HAHAHA!!!! very nice! XD