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The 'official' Ashley Williams support thread 1.1


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#10026
Hyper_gateway

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GuardianAngel470 wrote...

What did you guys think of my thread? Did it help any of you better understand the "opposition" as it were? Did any of you come away with a better sense of acceptance that, although you disagree with them, the "hate" against Ashley is so much the character but how she is presented?

Just looking for some feedback, the point of the thread wasn't to bash but to help you all understand.


Hey there, I would say why don't you just leave them at peace? People have different opinion and they wanted to keep in that way. As an 'outsider' of this thread, what you just said above seems like a provocation to me.

Why do you think they need your help to understand "what is right" in your point of view? <_<

Oh my! My first time make to the top, let me find a screenie with Ashley :)

Posted Image

Modifié par Hyper_gateway, 05 mai 2011 - 08:31 .


#10027
GuardianAngel470

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Hyper_gateway wrote...

GuardianAngel470 wrote...

What did you guys think of my thread? Did it help any of you better understand the "opposition" as it were? Did any of you come away with a better sense of acceptance that, although you disagree with them, the "hate" against Ashley is so much the character but how she is presented?

Just looking for some feedback, the point of the thread wasn't to bash but to help you all understand.

accidental snip, sorry


Yup, you missed the point of the post.

Have you ever heard of Stoicism? Ancient Greek and then Roman philosophy that held up reason over emotion and said that the key to avoiding anger or hatred was in understanding the cause of those feelings.

The point of the thread was to help Ashley fans understand why others felt the way they did, to understand the rationale and the causes just as they understand the character and her flaws and behavior.

Disagreeing with the detractors is perfectly fine and I never said that it wasn't.

I also want to say that I created the thread to be about Ashley for two reasons. First, all the points I made are things I've felt at some point since I played ME1. I have, through similar processes as the Roman Stoics did, put my initial feelings behind me and am now prettty much apathetic toward her. This means that I am able to explain in detail my reactions to help Ashley fans understand.

Second, it was because Ashley had become the topic of discussion due to photographs/concept art released of her. Her character had been brought to the forefront by the GI article.

Modifié par GuardianAngel470, 05 mai 2011 - 08:36 .


#10028
1Minsc1

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GuardianAngel470 wrote...

What did you guys think of my thread? Did it help any of you better understand the "opposition" as it were? Did any of you come away with a better sense of acceptance that, although you disagree with them, the "hate" against Ashley is so much the character but how she is presented?

Just looking for some feedback, the point of the thread wasn't to bash but to help you all understand.


I'm who i am :o and really enjoyed the discussion on the last pages. But i'm also a little disappointed, seems we "lost" some Ash-haters in your thread to the brand new "Is Ashley Williams racist"-thread.

Raanz wrote:
really? How many of these will there be? Just curious...so I can store my answer in a txt file and just copy and paste.


Still i can't understand why some people "hate" Ash, i got some new ideas why people might dislike her.
She is presented in a mistakable way, Chris L'Etoile uttered to that in an interview, i'm still searching for this and will post when i found. What can we really say about Ash's character? It depends on players attitude towards her, i think.
From the first moment i want to get to know her. I romanced her, i will do this again on EVERY playthrough :wub: and i missed her sooooo much in ME2:crying:.
Seriously: there's not only one Ash, there are so many Ashs as there are options to play the game. But i think we have good arguments to play it as we did to get a closer look an her.
Ash's worth it!

Modifié par 1Minsc1, 05 mai 2011 - 09:14 .


#10029
1Minsc1

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Hyper_gateway wrote...

GuardianAngel470 wrote...

What did you guys think of my thread? Did it help any of you better understand the "opposition" as it were? Did any of you come away with a better sense of acceptance that, although you disagree with them, the "hate" against Ashley is so much the character but how she is presented?

Just looking for some feedback, the point of the thread wasn't to bash but to help you all understand.


Hey there, I would say why don't you just leave them at peace? People have different opinion and they wanted to keep in that way. As an 'outsider' of this thread, what you just said above seems like a provocation to me.

Why do you think they need your help to understand "what is right" in your point of view? <_<


I never tried to persuade anyone to like Ash. I want to understand why they hate her and want them to understand why i like her.
On a meta level i'm arguing to have adult characters in RPGs not that stereotypical "Young girl needs help, where is my hero?" characters.

#10030
lawp79

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GuardianAngel470 wrote...

Hyper_gateway wrote...

GuardianAngel470 wrote...

What did you guys think of my thread? Did it help any of you better understand the "opposition" as it were? Did any of you come away with a better sense of acceptance that, although you disagree with them, the "hate" against Ashley is so much the character but how she is presented?

Just looking for some feedback, the point of the thread wasn't to bash but to help you all understand.

accidental snip, sorry


Yup, you missed the point of the post.

Have you ever heard of Stoicism? Ancient Greek and then Roman philosophy that held up reason over emotion and said that the key to avoiding anger or hatred was in understanding the cause of those feelings.

The point of the thread was to help Ashley fans understand why others felt the way they did, to understand the rationale and the causes just as they understand the character and her flaws and behavior.

Disagreeing with the detractors is perfectly fine and I never said that it wasn't.

I also want to say that I created the thread to be about Ashley for two reasons. First, all the points I made are things I've felt at some point since I played ME1. I have, through similar processes as the Roman Stoics did, put my initial feelings behind me and am now prettty much apathetic toward her. This means that I am able to explain in detail my reactions to help Ashley fans understand.

Second, it was because Ashley had become the topic of discussion due to photographs/concept art released of her. Her character had been brought to the forefront by the GI article.


Please dont take offence at this but there have been hundreds of these threads since the release of mass effect, I have heard every single opinion from those who do not like her, I have debated and on occassion enjoyed participating in them, but honestly I have had enough, I feel I have stated the same thing thousands of times and at times people like yourself have become more understanding of her character, others just hurl abuse.

TBH I just want to celebrate her return in 3 rather than read another character assassination of her.Posted Image

#10031
Balsam Beige

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GuardianAngel470 wrote...

grifter024 wrote...

ADLegend21 wrote...

grifter024 wrote...

Balsam Beige wrote...

Agreed.

When asked about the delay, EA boss John Riccitiello said, "Essentially, step by step, [BioWare is] adjusting some of the gameplay mechanics and some of the features that you'll see at E3 that can put this into a genre equivalent of shooter-meets-RPG, and essentially address a far larger market opportunity than Mass Effect 1 did and Mass Effect 2 began to approach."

This is quoted from Justin McElroy  article on Joystiq.


What do you mean you AGREE!

They basically just said that they are dumbing down the game even furthur just so EA can squeeze out even more money.

I wish they would have waited tillt he end of the trilogy before EA ruined Mass Effect as a franchise.

Mass 1 ....Ashley as squad mate entire game= Best damn game I've ever played
Mass 2....No ashley as squad mate= it was ok
Mass 3....NO decisions that mean anything anymore and generic 3rd person shooter with horrible dead space like multiplayer probably and ashley still remain to be seen on what she ACTUALLY does= Good job EA.

um what? Mass effect 2 was Okay? Mass effect 2 was an incredible game despite Ashley not being in it for more than 1 cutscene. but let's not turn this into a which game was superior arguement despite what Ijst wrote as the response to one.


This isnt a which games is superior since both games did damn well.

The only reason Mass 2 gets so much praise is because Bio dumbed down the entire game just so EA could try to woo the COD kids.

When did RPG's have to try to bring in FPS players?

Mass 1 is an RPG with shooting
Mass 2 is a 3rd person shooter with talking cutscenes .
Mass 3 as they say is going to be dumbed down even more and its not RPG first Shooter second its the opposite.

Thats like COD trying to bring in Mass Effect 1 players by throwing in some garbage RPG element....it makes no sense but to ruin an IP and show that all you care about now is money and not the legacy of your game.

Also I just put in Ashley because we are all die hard Ash fans...not that it had any merit to the argument..

As more and more time goes by it seems Bio has lost the idea of what they were trying to do with Mass Effect and are now in it just to make a profit.

Mass 1 ....the beginning of a Legacy
Mass 2....rushed for what? Oh thats right EA
Mass 3.... "Well we are trying ot bring in more people to play the game and alienate the ORIGINAL fanbase.." 

Might not even preorder anymore.


Someone hasn't watched many videos for ME3. Casey Hudson says flat out that the ME series as a whole was meant to appeal to a wider Audience, starting with ME1.


The Shooting mechanics of the first game were horrible. There needs to be a better balance of both elements (3rd person shooter, and RPG) for ME3. If they are spending more time to improve the overall game in both elements then I'm all for it. ME2 won "game of the year" and the bar is set pretty high for ME3. I think Bioware is just trying to get it right.

#10032
AresXX7

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Balsam Beige wrote...

Lee337 wrote...

I doubt any of the ME2 Characters will grace the cover because they can die. I'd expect it to be something different this time around, maybe the new characters or maybe just Shep on his own.


I agree.   I wonder if it might be the Virmire Survivor(probably Kaidan), Shepard and Liara like we saw in GameInformer?


Nice pic Auggy!


The only gripe I have, with that pic from GameInformer, is that they didn't have an alternate one to go with it showing Ash instead of Kaidan, that way both VS characters get equal love. (plus we'll know for sure if she wears actual armor or not)

#10033
lolwut666

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Since Ashley is a Spectre now, that means she has her own ship and crew, right?

I wonder if we're gonna meet with them at some point. Maybe Colonel Sanders is part of her crew.

#10034
TobiTobsen

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Who says that every Spectre has his own ship and crew? Had Saren a own ship before he discovered Sovereign? I never read the novels.

Modifié par TobiTobsen, 05 mai 2011 - 11:36 .


#10035
Antivenger

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Just used the bonus disk for ME1, turns out Ash apparently has several face models. I like her look better with short hair, though.

Also watched the documentary, "Vision for Mass Effect" and "Future of Mass Effect". I feel kinda sick knowing how much potential was wasted. Granted, both ME1 and 2 were good games, but in my opinion they could have been great.

#10036
BoogieBot

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/uploads_user/2994000/2993255/118808.jpg

Posted Image

#10037
grifter024

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GuardianAngel470 wrote...

grifter024 wrote...

ADLegend21 wrote...

grifter024 wrote...

Balsam Beige wrote...

Agreed.

When asked about the delay, EA boss John Riccitiello said, "Essentially, step by step, [BioWare is] adjusting some of the gameplay mechanics and some of the features that you'll see at E3 that can put this into a genre equivalent of shooter-meets-RPG, and essentially address a far larger market opportunity than Mass Effect 1 did and Mass Effect 2 began to approach."

This is quoted from Justin McElroy  article on Joystiq.


What do you mean you AGREE!

They basically just said that they are dumbing down the game even furthur just so EA can squeeze out even more money.

I wish they would have waited tillt he end of the trilogy before EA ruined Mass Effect as a franchise.

Mass 1 ....Ashley as squad mate entire game= Best damn game I've ever played
Mass 2....No ashley as squad mate= it was ok
Mass 3....NO decisions that mean anything anymore and generic 3rd person shooter with horrible dead space like multiplayer probably and ashley still remain to be seen on what she ACTUALLY does= Good job EA.

um what? Mass effect 2 was Okay? Mass effect 2 was an incredible game despite Ashley not being in it for more than 1 cutscene. but let's not turn this into a which game was superior arguement despite what Ijst wrote as the response to one.


This isnt a which games is superior since both games did damn well.

The only reason Mass 2 gets so much praise is because Bio dumbed down the entire game just so EA could try to woo the COD kids.

When did RPG's have to try to bring in FPS players?

Mass 1 is an RPG with shooting
Mass 2 is a 3rd person shooter with talking cutscenes .
Mass 3 as they say is going to be dumbed down even more and its not RPG first Shooter second its the opposite.

Thats like COD trying to bring in Mass Effect 1 players by throwing in some garbage RPG element....it makes no sense but to ruin an IP and show that all you care about now is money and not the legacy of your game.

Also I just put in Ashley because we are all die hard Ash fans...not that it had any merit to the argument..

As more and more time goes by it seems Bio has lost the idea of what they were trying to do with Mass Effect and are now in it just to make a profit.

Mass 1 ....the beginning of a Legacy
Mass 2....rushed for what? Oh thats right EA
Mass 3.... "Well we are trying ot bring in more people to play the game and alienate the ORIGINAL fanbase.." 

Might not even preorder anymore.


Someone hasn't watched many videos for ME3. Casey Hudson says flat out that the ME series as a whole was meant to appeal to a wider Audience, starting with ME1.

Mean to appeal to a wider audience starting with ME1 REALLY??? That's why they stripped almost the entire RPG elements of the game away and had to state AGAIN that they did that in order to appeal to a wider audience.
The very basis of your sentence makes absoultely no sense and would be redudant but then again you seem to be very thick headed but try to hide that with a false sense of compassion and understanding.

You  go on and on about how you at first didnt like the character then once you are done prattling on you say in more then a few instances that you reached some form of enlightment of the character and forgive her of being a racist. There is no concrete reasoning behind you plastering her a racist besides very weak arguments.

Really your going to base your argument that she is racist due to her reciting poetry....there is no other way to say that but that is just a flat out retarded argument that has no bearing on being racist and shows just how shallow the person that used that in an argument actually is.

I also like how you like someone else stated tried to provoke the ash fanbase by saying in not so many words and im just quoting what you reall meant:
"I made the topic to help ash fans learn why ash is hated but really I'm just flaming them with weak arguments."

Last I checked not everyone needs acceptance on what they do from ignorant people....then again you'll defend your actions with a false sense of superority again like you've done in the past I actually cant wait to see what nonsense you spew again.

Balsam- Get it right by dumbing down more rpg elements?....they are spending alot more time with the shooting mechanics then they are the RPG elements, because what they just said basically says that.
How do you reach a wider audience for an RPG? You dumb down the experience.

Modifié par grifter024, 05 mai 2011 - 04:27 .


#10038
Lee337

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Grifter....seriously. You obviously haven't been reading much about ME3. They are adding in more RPG elements. Not as much as ME1 but much more than ME2. A wider audience because it appeals to both RPG'ers and those who just love shooting.
I can't believe you managed to get "Mass 3....NO decisions that mean anything anymore" from the quote from Justin. Did you eat something funny today?

#10039
ADLegend21

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Lots of stuff was taken from ME2 that ws in Me1 because of complaining "We hate elevators" okay loading screens "we hate those too!" then it's "We hate the Mako" okay here'sthe Hammer head "We hate that, we want the Mako back!" Casey said they're bringing back some of the RPg elements from ME1 like weapon customization and they made it so Every class can carry every weapon, jsut not all at once for anything other than soldier. sounds RPG to me. Now let's all get a grip and talk about that 5'6" ish ieceof FOINE that is Ashley Madeline Williams. Before she pulls out her boomstick!

#10040
Lee337

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What is a FOINE?

#10041
ADLegend21

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Lee337 wrote...

What is a FOINE?

the exagerration of "fine"Posted Image

#10042
Krimson_Wolf

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BoogieBot wrote...

/uploads_user/2994000/2993255/118808.jpg

Posted Image


You know what. I kinda like this.

#10043
Antivenger

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ADLegend21 wrote...

 sounds RPG to me. Now let's all get a grip and talk about that 5'6" ish ieceof FOINE that is Ashley Madeline Williams. Before she pulls out her boomstick!

 5'6" (1.68m)? I say NEIN! My estimates for Commander Shepard are around 6'0" 6'2" (1.83-1.87m). Ashley's not much shorter than that, maybe 5'9" to 5'11" (1.75-180m).

#10044
Balsam Beige

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Ash:    "Are you talking about meeeeeeeeee??????"



Posted Image

#10045
BoogieBot

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Krimson_Wolf wrote...

BoogieBot wrote...

/uploads_user/2994000/2993255/118808.jpg

Posted Image


You know what. I kinda like this.

groovy

#10046
Shadow_82

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BoogieBot wrote...

Krimson_Wolf wrote...

BoogieBot wrote...

/uploads_user/2994000/2993255/118808.jpg

Posted Image


You know what. I kinda like this.

groovy


I like this as well for some reason...
I once tried to photoshop Ash with blonde hair but it turned out to be quite hideous looking.:blink::lol:

Modifié par Shadow_82, 06 mai 2011 - 02:21 .


#10047
Darius Vir

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Just thinking, I'm not one to give much credence to the whole "Haters gonna H8TE!!!" meme, but it may kinda sorta maybe apply with Ashley here a little bit. There's like three different threads on the character board about Racist Ash or why people hate Ashley, plus the talk about her ostensibly new appearance (which I love, btw) and Spectre status is still going on.

It's just kind of cool that she's being discussed so much. A lot of it is apparently negative, but you know what? She's getting a crapload of attention. She's a big deal, and on people's minds. In this case at least, I like that.

#10048
Jedi Master of Orion

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I think what's interesting about that is that they were still talking about theses exact things even 4 years after the game first came out, so she's obviously the type of character to stick with people.

#10049
Balsam Beige

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Darius Vir wrote...

Just thinking, I'm not one to give much credence to the whole "Haters gonna H8TE!!!" meme, but it may kinda sorta maybe apply with Ashley here a little bit. There's like three different threads on the character board about Racist Ash or why people hate Ashley, plus the talk about her ostensibly new appearance (which I love, btw) and Spectre status is still going on.

It's just kind of cool that she's being discussed so much. A lot of it is apparently negative, but you know what? She's getting a crapload of attention. She's a big deal, and on people's minds. In this case at least, I like that.


WOW!! SHE"S GETTING DISCUSSED SO MUCH AND GETTING A CRAPLOAD OF ATTENTION!!! ---REALLY???
SHE'S A BIG DEAL, AND ON PEOPLE'S MINDS.............WOW!!!...........like we (the Ashley fans) needed to hear this!!!
That is SOOOOOOOOOOO COOL!!!!................the last time I looked there was a TALI SUPPORT THREAD, a GARRUS SUPPORT THREAD, etc. etc........AND THEY WERE ALL BEING DISCUSSED!!!!!!..............but Oh???????........is it all negative???.........hm......let me think???? Most quote>unquote>Ash haters were thrilled that Ash didn't have a major role in ME2. They were also hoping the Bioware would reduce her role in ME3, so they could rub that in our ( her fans) faces. Now they are getting on this thread and trying to ENLIGHTEN us. HELP THE POOR, MIXED UP, ASHLEY FANS to see the TRUTH about their beloved character. LIKE THEY CAN CHANGE OUR MINDS!!!!!Posted ImagePosted ImagePosted ImagePosted ImagePosted ImagePosted ImagePosted ImagePosted ImagePosted ImagePosted ImagePosted ImagePosted ImagePosted ImagePosted ImagePosted ImagePosted Image

#10050
Orodreth7

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Warning, maybe spoiler!!!

"Garrus, Liara, Kaidan, Ashley, (and newly confirmed) Tali are all full-time members of your team if they survived the previous games."
"There will be no new love interests in ME3."
"If you coupled up in Mass Effect 1 and your partner is still alive, they're guaranteed to be a member of your crew."

                                                                                                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                                                                     PC Gamer
Yyyeeessss!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:o

Modifié par Orodreth7, 07 mai 2011 - 09:38 .