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[V-rex]

Okay, having now read 'Super Horizon' I now am forced to retaliate with a LOT of Ash hugs.









Love always trumps hate!!

:wub:

Modifié par V-rex, 14 mai 2011 - 12:55 .

[Paula Deen]

Errol Dnamyx wrote...

BornFree87 wrote...
Her views on aliens are naive and not an "acquired taste".

She's the only character, whose views are not naive. Just say'n.

Cynicism is niavete, just another form of it. If she were right in her views, then Garrus and Tali would have sent a bunch of data on the Normandy's systems/the Mako to their respective species' governments--canon shows this clearly to not be the case. Garrus is not an engineer, and the Flotilla would never be a threat to the Alliance--not that they could or would build an expensive stealth ship anyways.

Liara is undyingly loyal to your cause (she goes through hell to recover Shepard's corpse for a mere chance of his/her revival). Wrex, despite one very understandable outburst, always has your back.

Her views WERE naive. She expected all aliens to be entirely loyal to their species (to the point of doing betraying a cause they volunteered for and military competitiveness)...which turned out to be completely false. Racism is naivety, as you're making (likely very innacurate) assumptions about every individual of a race you meet. Period.

[Lord Zeuss]

Ashley's trust has to be earned, it's not something she gives out freely, even to Shepard. A lot of Paragons prefer just to trust everyone until given a reason not to. Both approaches have their merits, neither is necessarily naive, but both have the potential to be.

[Errol Dnamyx]

Paula Deen wrote...

Errol Dnamyx wrote...

BornFree87 wrote...
Her views on aliens are naive and not an "acquired taste".

She's the only character, whose views are not naive. Just say'n.

Cynicism is niavete, just another form of it. If she were right in her views, then Garrus and Tali would have sent a bunch of data on the Normandy's systems/the Mako to their respective species' governments--canon shows this clearly to not be the case. Garrus is not an engineer, and the Flotilla would never be a threat to the Alliance--not that they could or would build an expensive stealth ship anyways.

Liara is undyingly loyal to your cause (she goes through hell to recover Shepard's corpse for a mere chance of his/her revival). Wrex, despite one very understandable outburst, always has your back.

Her views WERE naive. She expected all aliens to be entirely loyal to their species (to the point of doing betraying a cause they volunteered for and military competitiveness)...which turned out to be completely false. Racism is naivety, as you're making (likely very innacurate) assumptions about every individual of a race you meet. Period.

You are correct, the alien squad members are loyal and do not betray Shepard.

But: You found out about that, after you finished the game. You could not know about their honesty, when you recruited them for your team. One or more of them could have just as well turned out to be traitors in the end. (The ~Yoshimo~)

That makes your conclusion completely wrong. She was not naive, she was careful and kept and eye on the new guise. That's exactly what I would expect and encourage her to do in this situation.
Blind trust leads only to a quick death for the individual and on a higher level to extinction for a species. Period.

Modifié par Errol Dnamyx, 14 mai 2011 - 05:40 .

[Lee337]

I agree with Errol. Not only because I disagree with Paula but also because Paula added "Period" to the end of the post. I hate it when people do that, implying that only their argument counts. People say hate is a strong word. That's why I used it.

[trucoolbrees]

VutaatVerd wrote...

lawp79 wrote...

KendallX23 wrote...

i keep wondering what will happen to the poor souls who cheated on Ash with a ME2 LI.....i am thinking it won't be very healty...but the story still needs a Shepard so how bad can it be ?
I am not talking about my SHep....he always loyal....

I have a cheater playthrough just for that reason, I think it will be similar to the triangle in me1 between Liara and Ash, I think Bioware will make the player choose between the 2 as I dont think they will want to ****** too many people off as they actively encouraged cheating imo. My main Shep is loyal though just incase

Pft, if they cheated on Ashley, then they do not need her. Ashley should just turn them down hard....Very Hard.

I can't really see, given her personality and character, Ashley forgiving Shepard being unfaithful.

[nickkcin11]

Paula Deen wrote...

Errol Dnamyx wrote...

BornFree87 wrote...
Her views on aliens are naive and not an "acquired taste".

She's the only character, whose views are not naive. Just say'n.

Cynicism is niavete, just another form of it. If she were right in her views, then Garrus and Tali would have sent a bunch of data on the Normandy's systems/the Mako to their respective species' governments--canon shows this clearly to not be the case. Garrus is not an engineer, and the Flotilla would never be a threat to the Alliance--not that they could or would build an expensive stealth ship anyways.

Liara is undyingly loyal to your cause (she goes through hell to recover Shepard's corpse for a mere chance of his/her revival). Wrex, despite one very understandable outburst, always has your back.

Her views WERE naive. She expected all aliens to be entirely loyal to their species (to the point of doing betraying a cause they volunteered for and military competitiveness)...which turned out to be completely false. Racism is naivety, as you're making (likely very innacurate) assumptions about every individual of a race you meet. Period.

I would say that Ash is the second most loyal squad member. When everyone else just expects you to deal with Wrex yourself, she makes sure Shep wouldn't get hurt. And she was distrusting of the aliens, like everyone in the Alliance was (that one guy who evaluates the Normandy, Pressley, amongst others). She never allowed it to affect the mission. It's not like she said, "Oh you better make sure Tali doesn't steal anything, you know how Quarians are..." Plus her family was DISGRACED because of aliens. She holds a grudge which is more than understandable. The indirect action of aliens has affected her entire life for the worse. Of course Wrex's outburst is understandable but Ash isn't... that is flawed logic.No one notices how Ash doesn't agree with Cerberus' and Terra Firma's ideas (because they aren't just trying to protect humanity, they are racist). Ash is the opposite of that. She just sees humanity first. I see the US first and would put it's safety before the rest of the world. Does that mean I hate Europe and Asia, no. Not in the slightest. I just have a sense of preservation for my homeland. Same concept.

We all know you hate Ashley already and there is no persuading "your kind" (Ash haters, a group I am racist against), especially when the argument is from hillbillies like us. You know Ash fans are all guntoating, racist, Southernerns, who aren't very smart right? I like how when people hate Ash for being "racist" they are racist themselves (like that one guy from Hong Kong).


/rant over. I know there is no persuading conspiracy theorists that we landed on the moon no mattter how much evidence. You are the same way.

Modifié par nickkcin11, 14 mai 2011 - 05:34 .

[PMC65]

Lord Zeuss wrote...

Ashley's trust has to be earned, it's not something she gives out freely, even to Shepard. A lot of Paragons prefer just to trust everyone until given a reason not to. Both approaches have their merits, neither is necessarily naive, but both have the potential to be.

Agreed!

[Balsam Beige]

[ADLegend21]

VutaatVerd wrote...

lawp79 wrote...

KendallX23 wrote...

i keep wondering what will happen to the poor souls who cheated on Ash with a ME2 LI.....i am thinking it won't be very healty...but the story still needs a Shepard so how bad can it be ?
I am not talking about my SHep....he always loyal....

I have a cheater playthrough just for that reason, I think it will be similar to the triangle in me1 between Liara and Ash, I think Bioware will make the player choose between the 2 as I dont think they will want to ****** too many people off as they actively encouraged cheating imo. My main Shep is loyal though just incase

Pft, if they cheated on Ashley, then they do not need her. Ashley should just turn them down hard....Very Hard.

So what about my Shep after Super Horizon?

[Shadow_82]

Balsam Beige wrote...

Ash has all the right moves!

[ADLegend21]

Does anyone have the picture of Hipster Ashley???

[Shadow_82]

ADLegend21 wrote...

Does anyone have the picture of Hipster Ashley???

Here you go ADL.I've found it.

Modifié par Shadow_82, 14 mai 2011 - 09:15 .

[Paula Deen]

Errol Dnamyx wrote...

Paula Deen wrote...

Errol Dnamyx wrote...

BornFree87 wrote...
Her views on aliens are naive and not an "acquired taste".

She's the only character, whose views are not naive. Just say'n.

Cynicism is niavete, just another form of it. If she were right in her views, then Garrus and Tali would have sent a bunch of data on the Normandy's systems/the Mako to their respective species' governments--canon shows this clearly to not be the case. Garrus is not an engineer, and the Flotilla would never be a threat to the Alliance--not that they could or would build an expensive stealth ship anyways.

Liara is undyingly loyal to your cause (she goes through hell to recover Shepard's corpse for a mere chance of his/her revival). Wrex, despite one very understandable outburst, always has your back.

Her views WERE naive. She expected all aliens to be entirely loyal to their species (to the point of doing betraying a cause they volunteered for and military competitiveness)...which turned out to be completely false. Racism is naivety, as you're making (likely very innacurate) assumptions about every individual of a race you meet. Period.

You are correct, the alien squad members are loyal and do not betray Shepard.

But: You found out about that, after you finished the game. You could not know about their honesty, when you recruited them for your team. One or more of them could have just as well turned out to be traitors in the end. (The ~Yoshimo~)

That makes your conclusion completely wrong. She was not naive, she was careful and kept and eye on the new guise. That's exactly what I would expect and encourage her to do in this situation.
Blind trust leads only to a quick death for the individual and on a higher level to extinction for a species. Period.

It was never blind trust. Shepard is given plenty opportunity to get to know each of the nonhuman squadmembers before they set out on the Normandy. Udina even orders Shepard to take Tali along (if I recall correctly). Restricting access to sensitive systems (such as Engineering) and monitoring communications (which is easy on a small frigate) prevents any real possibility of sabotage (all equipment they bring aboard is screened, for instance). Keeping an eye on them is fine, but being judgemental and mistrustful even when given only many examples demonstrating trustworthiness over time is called paranoia. Paranoia is not inherentlky bad; the CIA during the Cold War, for instance, rightfully practiced it. It's just that having an inherent mistrustful attitude towards any turian is illogical, as humans are just as capable of betrayal (as evidenced by her status as a Williams).

[Jedi Master of Orion]

I think the Virmire survivor confrontation on Horizon was written in such a way to present the player with a sort of gray area where Shepard could conceivably be forgiven for thinking that their relationship had ended but still have a hope to continue it later should they want. Meaning that Ashley or Kaidan could probably forgive Shepard for hooking up with someone else eventually.

[Cossack72]

nickkcin11 wrote...

Paula Deen wrote...

Errol Dnamyx wrote...

BornFree87 wrote...
Her views on aliens are naive and not an "acquired taste".

She's the only character, whose views are not naive. Just say'n.

Cynicism is niavete, just another form of it. If she were right in her views, then Garrus and Tali would have sent a bunch of data on the Normandy's systems/the Mako to their respective species' governments--canon shows this clearly to not be the case. Garrus is not an engineer, and the Flotilla would never be a threat to the Alliance--not that they could or would build an expensive stealth ship anyways.

Liara is undyingly loyal to your cause (she goes through hell to recover Shepard's corpse for a mere chance of his/her revival). Wrex, despite one very understandable outburst, always has your back.

Her views WERE naive. She expected all aliens to be entirely loyal to their species (to the point of doing betraying a cause they volunteered for and military competitiveness)...which turned out to be completely false. Racism is naivety, as you're making (likely very innacurate) assumptions about every individual of a race you meet. Period.

I would say that Ash is the second most loyal squad member. When everyone else just expects you to deal with Wrex yourself, she makes sure Shep wouldn't get hurt. And she was distrusting of the aliens, like everyone in the Alliance was (that one guy who evaluates the Normandy, Pressley, amongst others). She never allowed it to affect the mission. It's not like she said, "Oh you better make sure Tali doesn't steal anything, you know how Quarians are..." Plus her family was DISGRACED because of aliens. She holds a grudge which is more than understandable. The indirect action of aliens has affected her entire life for the worse. Of course Wrex's outburst is understandable but Ash isn't... that is flawed logic.No one notices how Ash doesn't agree with Cerberus' and Terra Firma's ideas (because they aren't just trying to protect humanity, they are racist). Ash is the opposite of that. She just sees humanity first. I see the US first and would put it's safety before the rest of the world. Does that mean I hate Europe and Asia, no. Not in the slightest. I just have a sense of preservation for my homeland. Same concept.

We all know you hate Ashley already and there is no persuading "your kind" (Ash haters, a group I am racist against), especially when the argument is from hillbillies like us. You know Ash fans are all guntoating, racist, Southernerns, who aren't very smart right? I like how when people hate Ash for being "racist" they are racist themselves (like that one guy from Hong Kong).


/rant over. I know there is no persuading conspiracy theorists that we landed on the moon no mattter how much evidence. You are the same way.

Dunno how that's possible with proof like this:

[Antivenger]

nickkcin11 wrote...

/rant over. I know there is no persuading conspiracy theorists that we landed on the moon no mattter how much evidence. You are the same way.

Isn't it mentioned somewhere that there are still conspiracy theorists that thinkthe Prothean Relics were a hoax? Maybe I just read that in a fanfic somewhere :S

Paula Deen wrote...

snip

We already know why people hate Ashley Williams.

What I don't get is how people see those reasons as valid. >:|

[ADLegend21]

Made this.

[Badpie]

V-rex wrote...








Love always trumps hate!!

:wub:

I adore this one.  <3

[nickkcin11]

Antivenger wrote...

nickkcin11 wrote...

/rant over. I know there is no persuading conspiracy theorists that we landed on the moon no mattter how much evidence. You are the same way.

Isn't it mentioned somewhere that there are still conspiracy theorists that thinkthe Prothean Relics were a hoax? Maybe I just read that in a fanfic somewhere :S

Paula Deen wrote...

snip

We already know why people hate Ashley Williams.

What I don't get is how people see those reasons as valid. >:|

There are people that still think the Earth is flat... really?

[Elite Midget]

Say good bye to the Ashley we once knew. Bioware seems intent on turning her into the new Miranda.

Remember when she said she wouldn't wear stupid things like catsuits in battle or doll herself up on the battlefield? Bioware has changed that and now she's Miranda now.

ME3 has lost much epicness in my eyes with this blantant character assassination all in the name of selling sex.

[IndigoWolfe]

I'm sure we're all well aware of your feelings on the matter, Midget. I'm leaving my judgements on hold for the time being.

[Badpie]

Elite Midget wrote...

Say good bye to the Ashley we once knew. Bioware seems intent on turning her into the new Miranda.

Remember when she said she wouldn't wear stupid things like catsuits in battle or doll herself up on the battlefield? Bioware has changed that and now she's Miranda now.

ME3 has lost much epicness in my eyes with this blantant character assassination all in the name of selling sex.

Ash never said that, 1.  And 2 I still don't get why everyone is up in arms about her getting an updated look.  And 3, changing her outfit and hair has nothing to do with her character, which is something we'll have to just wait and see about.

[V-rex]

I admit, I'm not the biggest fan of Ashley's new look because I preferred her as an attractive tough gal military chick. But I'm not about to leap up and shout "WAAAAA SHE IS A PROSTITUTE SPACE HOOKER MIRANDA CLONE ****!" on the basis of one standalone picture.
That could be her official off duty uniform now, it could be the stuff she wears under her armor. For now with very little to be seen of her full body outfit it's hard to tell what the full outfit would look like.

Don't make full judgements yet, we don't know if she's wearing high heels, has a cheesecake where her rump should be and doesn't wear underpants or anything else. It certainly isn't enough basis to complain that her character has done a complete overhaul.
Though I admit it does seem out of character for the girl who had no interest in looking pretty now glamming up but still, that's minor.
Besides, maybe in the last two years Ashley's views on things have changed a little. Who knows?

Yes, I do find it a bit annoying that Ashley had to change, but I'd still rather Ashley back with a few alterations then to not have Ashley back at all.

Incidently, no matter what she wears or how she looks Ashley will never stop being beautiful in the eyes of Commander James Shepard.