14023 réponses à ce sujet

[Funkcase]

Cypher0020 wrote...

Hello fellow Ash fans. As a Femshep player, I humbly offer this token of 100% pure Ash awesomeness that I found

Either a good friend or a lover, we are united in our love for Ash. Cannot wait to see her in Mass Effect 3

I love this picture aswell. I love her bun and i hope she still has it in ME3, but for the love scene (im sure there will be one) i would like her to let her hair down for it, or for atleast one scene in ME3.

[SilverRose208]

Funkcase wrote...

KendallX23 wrote...

i'm not talking about Ashley shooting Wrex as it never happened to my SHeps....he and Wrex are like the guys in lethal weapon.....only in this case both Wrex and SHep are Riggs.....dunno i saw a video where Ash can shoot Wrex of her own accord....if i had that event...i would have liked the option to take her off the crew for doing something without beeing ordered..as much as i like Ashley..i like to be fair....Wrex deserves a fair death...not beeing shot from behind..not big on assasins..

So you disagree with defending your commanding officer? And Ash never shoots Wrex without Shepard telling her too. When Shepard said ''just be ready'' to Ash before he talked to Wrex that was his order for her to kill Wrex if Shepard was in danger. Where would Ash be if she did nothing and let Wrex kill Shepard? Plus if Wrex dies, it's the players fault, dont blame Ash for it.

Yeah, so, I've never liked her shooting Wrex either.  It just seems like a cheap gameplay mechanic and reeks of bad writing (to me, anyway). 

Ash is the only one told to watch Shep's back.  What does that mean?  Does the rest of the crew not care or does he not trust them?  I think it's strange, almost like the writers were like - LIGHTBULB!  This chick hates aliens, right?  So!  She can be the one to shoot Wrex and everyone knows she hates the aliens anyway, so it's toooootally IC!  Problem.  Solved.  Let's go drink Molsens. 

Don't get me wrong - I like that she's dedicated, but we already know she is without that action 'proving' anything ... And firing a 'warning shot' would've been just as effective because then Shep could work his Shepardly Magic (patent pending) and force Wrex back into line somehow (just like he's magically able to force everyone into line somehow throughout the game, even without passing charm/intimidate checks, and without deaths necessarily resulting).  I don't understand what shooting Wrex proves or what it's supposed to mean to the plot as a whole.  I think it's a throw-away, but I could be convinced otherwise.

It's sort of the same thing for me as the "Now, you know I'm no fan of aliens.." line on Horizon.  We can paragon the crap out of her, get to know her and understand some of her values and opinions better (like how she's actually not a racist), but then little blurbs and actions get thrown in by the Unseen Hand to undermine it.  The whole thing frustrates me.

I like Ash.  I don't like random plot devices and/or bad writing.

[KendallX23]

as i said..i never nedeed to have Wrex shot...i always do his personal quest...but just like silver..i see no reason for killing him...and in cold blood...again...not fond of asassination/execution...i want the victim to be able to defend itself....maybe like a duel...Klingon style....Ash seems to be designated to kill Wrex in case he dosen't like SHep idea....why not Kaidan...?
And Funk...Shepard says after that he had the situation under control and even if he dosen't say it i am sure SHepard thought of the discussion going bad part...SHep just told Ashley to keep an eye...not shoot when she feels like...dunno..maybe it's just me....but SHep in some cases never gives the exact order to kill Wrex...she just shoots him cause SHE thinks Shep is in danger...silver is right...bad writing..

Modifié par KendallX23, 24 juin 2010 - 04:25 .

[Lord Zeuss]

SilverRose208 wrote...

Funkcase wrote...

KendallX23 wrote...

i'm not talking about Ashley shooting Wrex as it never happened to my SHeps....he and Wrex are like the guys in lethal weapon.....only in this case both Wrex and SHep are Riggs.....dunno i saw a video where Ash can shoot Wrex of her own accord....if i had that event...i would have liked the option to take her off the crew for doing something without beeing ordered..as much as i like Ashley..i like to be fair....Wrex deserves a fair death...not beeing shot from behind..not big on assasins..

So you disagree with defending your commanding officer? And Ash never shoots Wrex without Shepard telling her too. When Shepard said ''just be ready'' to Ash before he talked to Wrex that was his order for her to kill Wrex if Shepard was in danger. Where would Ash be if she did nothing and let Wrex kill Shepard? Plus if Wrex dies, it's the players fault, dont blame Ash for it.

Yeah, so, I've never liked her shooting Wrex either.  It just seems like a cheap gameplay mechanic and reeks of bad writing (to me, anyway). 

Ash is the only one told to watch Shep's back.  What does that mean?  Does the rest of the crew not care or does he not trust them?  I think it's strange, almost like the writers were like - LIGHTBULB!  This chick hates aliens, right?  So!  She can be the one to shoot Wrex and everyone knows she hates the aliens anyway, so it's toooootally IC!  Problem.  Solved.  Let's go drink Molsens. 

Don't get me wrong - I like that she's dedicated, but we already know she is without that action 'proving' anything ... And firing a 'warning shot' would've been just as effective because then Shep could work his Shepardly Magic (patent pending) and force Wrex back into line somehow (just like he's magically able to force everyone into line somehow throughout the game, even without passing charm/intimidate checks, and without deaths necessarily resulting).  I don't understand what shooting Wrex proves or what it's supposed to mean to the plot as a whole.  I think it's a throw-away, but I could be convinced otherwise.

It's sort of the same thing for me as the "Now, you know I'm no fan of aliens.." line on Horizon.  We can paragon the crap out of her, get to know her and understand some of her values and opinions better (like how she's actually not a racist), but then little blurbs and actions get thrown in by the Unseen Hand to undermine it.  The whole thing frustrates me.

I like Ash.  I don't like random plot devices and/or bad writing.

Honestly, it does seem like it was something they just put in there to incite fans and give haters imaginary ammunition. Sometimes I think Bioware is like FIFA; they just love the controversy. Within a game like Mass Effect, which is supposed to be all about important decisions and the careful weighing of consequences, a cheap device like this just encourages lazy thinking and ignorant judgments. What they should have done, if Ashley being the one to shoot Wrex in the event of negotiation failure, was have her fire the first shot to take him down, and have Shepard fire the killing shots. It's the player's decision, so the consequences should be manifestly laid on the player. Shepard's (somewhat oblique) orders to Ashley to "be ready" works for me, because I'm able to put two and two together. People who choose to ignore this and claim malevolence, racial hatred, or downright genocidal psychosis on Ashley's part (after all, why stop at racist b**** when you can make so many other unbased allegations that sound so much more dramatic?) should have been forced to accept the consequences of their own actions or inaction. But instead, subverting the message of their own game, Bioware allowed people to turn their brains off and divert responsibility and blame onto a grunt who was following their orders.

Ashley's "I'm no fan of aliens" line on Horizon seems almost brutally calculated to inflame as much intolerance as possible. Bioware apparently think controversy is good business, and who knows, they may be right. That line is only barely within the boundaries of in-character, and the fact that it is so borderline makes me think it had to play into Bioware's scheme to push us all toward the new love interests. More calculated descredition, another cheap plot device, or incompetent writing.

Nope, won't work. I still love Ash.

[Lord Zeuss]

KendallX23 wrote...

as i said..i never nedeed to have Wrex shot...i always do his personal quest...but just like silver..i see no reason for killing him...and in cold blood...again...not fond of asassination/execution...i want the victim to be able to defend itself....maybe like a duel...Klingon style....Ash seems to be designated to kill Wrex in case he dosen't like SHep idea....why not Kaidan...?
And Funk...Shepard says after that he had the situation under control and even if he dosen't say it i am sure SHepard thought of the discussion going bad part...SHep just told Ashley to keep an eye...not shoot when she feels like...dunno..maybe it's just me....but SHep in some cases never gives the exact order to kill Wrex...she just shoots him cause SHE thinks Shep is in danger...silver is right...bad writing..

The way I see it, "Be ready" imparts some discretionary latitude to Ashley's range of possible actions. Clumsy plot device still prevails, though.

[KendallX23]

Lord Zeuss wrote...

KendallX23 wrote...

as i said..i never nedeed to have Wrex shot...i always do his personal quest...but just like silver..i see no reason for killing him...and in cold blood...again...not fond of asassination/execution...i want the victim to be able to defend itself....maybe like a duel...Klingon style....Ash seems to be designated to kill Wrex in case he dosen't like SHep idea....why not Kaidan...?
And Funk...Shepard says after that he had the situation under control and even if he dosen't say it i am sure SHepard thought of the discussion going bad part...SHep just told Ashley to keep an eye...not shoot when she feels like...dunno..maybe it's just me....but SHep in some cases never gives the exact order to kill Wrex...she just shoots him cause SHE thinks Shep is in danger...silver is right...bad writing..

The way I see it, "Be ready" imparts some discretionary latitude to Ashley's range of possible actions. Clumsy plot device still prevails, though.

Ashley still shouldn't have shot him without Shepard giving the order at that moment....well maybe it's not the fact that Ash shoots him..it's more that he shoots him from behind...i am all for beeing fair...even when threatened

[Lord Zeuss]

KendallX23 wrote...

Lord Zeuss wrote...

KendallX23 wrote...

as i said..i never nedeed to have Wrex shot...i always do his personal quest...but just like silver..i see no reason for killing him...and in cold blood...again...not fond of asassination/execution...i want the victim to be able to defend itself....maybe like a duel...Klingon style....Ash seems to be designated to kill Wrex in case he dosen't like SHep idea....why not Kaidan...?
And Funk...Shepard says after that he had the situation under control and even if he dosen't say it i am sure SHepard thought of the discussion going bad part...SHep just told Ashley to keep an eye...not shoot when she feels like...dunno..maybe it's just me....but SHep in some cases never gives the exact order to kill Wrex...she just shoots him cause SHE thinks Shep is in danger...silver is right...bad writing..

The way I see it, "Be ready" imparts some discretionary latitude to Ashley's range of possible actions. Clumsy plot device still prevails, though.

Ashley still shouldn't have shot him without Shepard giving the order at that moment....well maybe it's not the fact that Ash shoots him..it's more that he shoots him from behind...i am all for beeing fair...even when threatened

Eh, well, there's a wealth of practical reasons why attempting to shoot a krogan freakin warlord from the front is militarily unsound , and then the argument that life is rarely fair, life-and-death situations even less so, but I tihnk I've said enough on this subject now.

[KendallX23]

still like beeing fair..i am the hero(aka the loser of the galaxy..)...but well let's end it with..in some playthroughs Wrex lives..in some he dies...end of story

[ashlover mark 2]

this is what ashlover thinks of the motives behind the scene and belives that if wrex would not see reason ash would have every right too kill wrex......BUT of the entire scene altogther and  feels that ashley should not have been incorperated in the killing of a fellow team mate no matter how justfied it is.ashlover also feels that its very much out of charecter for her too be so cold blooded.But this is just ashlovers humble oppion.

Modifié par ashlover mark 2, 24 juin 2010 - 04:52 .

[Raanz]

 Sooooo....I noticed I don't have many if any Ash Fans in my friends list.   I'm a nice guy, no stalker....if any fellow Ashley Fanatics would send me an invite, I wouldn't mind. 

Here are a few pictures to bump the thread.


Ash and I going footloose on the Citadel:

[SilverRose208]

Thinking about the whole 'Wrex' thing makes me afraid of what liberties they would've taken if she were a squaddie in ME2.  Imagine Shep ordering Ash to stand-by on the SR-2, no other instructions given, and the writers being as they sometimes are ... 

Grunt pulls a gun on Shepard.  Shepard pulls one back.  Ash shoots Grunt from behind.  "He may be pure Krogan, but the Alliance is in my blood.  I am not in awe."

Garrus discusses reach and flexibility.  Ash shoots him.  "He was talking about sparring and, err, threatening you ... in some manner.  Looks like granddad just got his revenge."

Tali and Legion are fighting.  They won't listen to Shep.  Ash shoots them both.  "Damn geth and damn quarians .... nothing but over-talkative gypsies and synthetics anyway.  I'm no fan of aliens."

Samara admits her daughters are all succubi.  Ash shoots her.  "Monster-breeder.  I saw this in a horror vid once.  She killed you in the end."

Thane... Probably saw her coming, but probably didn't expect her to shoot.

Mordin - she keeps Mordin, but only because he sings and talks about 'holding the line'.  He's like a pet.

Jack and Miranda are fighting and won't listen to Shep.  Ash shoots Shepard in the back.  "Yeah.... sorry, Skipper.  C'mon girls, let's give 'em a reason to buy ME3!"  Joker breaks his thumb by taking one too many pictures.

Modifié par SilverRose208, 24 juin 2010 - 05:27 .

[ashlover mark 2]

Raanz wrote...

 Sooooo....I noticed I don't have many if any Ash Fans in my friends list.   I'm a nice guy, no stalker....if any fellow Ashley Fanatics would send me an invite, I wouldn't mind. 

Here are a few pictures to bump the thread.


Ash and I going footloose on the Citadel:

where and when was the top Green ashley pic taken....i like it.

[Funkcase]

SilverRose208 wrote...

Thinking about the whole 'Wrex' thing makes me afraid of what liberties they would've taken if she were a squaddie in ME2.  Imagine Shep ordering Ash to stand-by on the SR-2, no other instructions given, and the writers being as they sometimes are ... 

Grunt pulls a gun on Shepard.  Shepard pulls one back.  Ash shoots Grunt from behind.  "He may be pure Krogan, but the Alliance is in my blood.  I am not in awe."

Garrus discusses reach and flexibility.  Ash shoots him.  "He was talking about sparring and, err, threatening you ... in some manner.  Looks like granddad just got his revenge."

Tali and Legion are fighting.  They won't listen to Shep.  Ash shoots them both.  "Damn geth and damn quarians .... nothing but over-talkative gypsies and synthetics anyway.  I'm no fan of aliens."

Samara admits her daughters are all succubi.  Ash shoots her.  "Monster-breeder.  I saw this in a horror vid once.  She killed you in the end."

Thane... Probably saw her coming, but probably didn't expect her to shoot.

Mordin - she keeps Mordin, but only because he sings and talks about 'holding the line'.  He's like a pet.

Jack and Miranda are fighting and won't listen to Shep.  Ash shoots Shepard in the back.  "Yeah.... sorry, Skipper.  C'mon girls, let's give 'em a reason to buy ME3!"  Joker breaks his thumb by taking one too many pictures.

Aww you made Ash sound evil, but i see your point. Hopefully come ME3 they wont treat Ash like this.

[SilverRose208]

Funkcase wrote...
Aww you made Ash sound evil, but i see your point. Hopefully come ME3 they wont treat Ash like this.

Y'all know the depths of my girl-love for Ash knows no bounds... Sorry if my joke came off wrong. 

I just hate those OOC moments so much - it made me think about what it would be like if it were extended to other scenes and relationships in-game.  It's just absurd, right?  She wouldn't do any of those things that I joked about, but the writers sometimes portray her as if she's capable of all of it.  Grinds my gears.

Mmkay, I'll stop now.

[Clone 071]

SilverRose208 wrote...

Thinking about the whole 'Wrex' thing makes me afraid of what liberties they would've taken if she were a squaddie in ME2.  Imagine Shep ordering Ash to stand-by on the SR-2, no other instructions given, and the writers being as they sometimes are ... 

Grunt pulls a gun on Shepard.  Shepard pulls one back.  Ash shoots Grunt from behind.  "He may be pure Krogan, but the Alliance is in my blood.  I am not in awe."

Garrus discusses reach and flexibility.  Ash shoots him.  "He was talking about sparring and, err, threatening you ... in some manner.  Looks like granddad just got his revenge."

Tali and Legion are fighting.  They won't listen to Shep.  Ash shoots them both.  "Damn geth and damn quarians .... nothing but over-talkative gypsies and synthetics anyway.  I'm no fan of aliens."

Samara admits her daughters are all succubi.  Ash shoots her.  "Monster-breeder.  I saw this in a horror vid once.  She killed you in the end."

Thane... Probably saw her coming, but probably didn't expect her to shoot.

Mordin - she keeps Mordin, but only because he sings and talks about 'holding the line'.  He's like a pet.

Jack and Miranda are fighting and won't listen to Shep.  Ash shoots Shepard in the back.  "Yeah.... sorry, Skipper.  C'mon girls, let's give 'em a reason to buy ME3!"  Joker breaks his thumb by taking one too many pictures.

Hah, funny I can actually see that happening! She'll probably end up killing Mordin because he is "a hamster on coffee". If there's anyone that talks more than a quarian, it's Mordin.

[Errol Dnamyx]

SilverRose208 wrote...

Thinking about the whole 'Wrex' thing makes me afraid of what liberties they would've taken if she were a squaddie in ME2.  Imagine Shep or...

Don´t give them any ideas...

[ashlover mark 2]

@clone 071 ah a new member,welecome.i dont think even OOC ash would kill someone just beacuz shes annoyed with them lol.Now if renagaded shepard was annoyed with him and told her to be ready thats a whole diff story.

[Clone 071]

ashlover mark 2 wrote...

@clone 071 ah a new member,welecome.i dont think even OOC ash would kill someone just beacuz shes annoyed with them lol.Now if renagaded shepard was annoyed with him and told her to be ready thats a whole diff story.

That's quite true if it was renegade Shepard. Depending on the situation, she might just kill someone outright.
And thanks for the welcome.

[ashlover mark 2]

Clone 071 wrote...

ashlover mark 2 wrote...

@clone 071 ah a new member,welecome.i dont think even OOC ash would kill someone just beacuz shes annoyed with them lol.Now if renagaded shepard was annoyed with him and told her to be ready thats a whole diff story.

That's quite true if it was renegade Shepard. Depending on the situation, she might just kill someone outright.
And thanks for the welcome.

she would if he ordered her to,you know surpieror officer and all that.....unless he went ape **** and ordereed her too mow down a bunch of civilans then she might take issue with him.

[Clone 071]

ashlover mark 2 wrote...

Clone 071 wrote...

ashlover mark 2 wrote...

@clone 071 ah a new member,welecome.i dont think even OOC ash would kill someone just beacuz shes annoyed with them lol.Now if renagaded shepard was annoyed with him and told her to be ready thats a whole diff story.

That's quite true if it was renegade Shepard. Depending on the situation, she might just kill someone outright.
And thanks for the welcome.

she would if he ordered her to,you know surpieror officer and all that.....unless he went ape **** and ordereed her too mow down a bunch of civilans then she might take issue with him.

Heh, true that. Reminds me of her quoting regs against fraternization to Shepard. Then again, when you're searching for that lost data module in ME, you shoot the pyjaks instead of searching them, and she says, "Personally, I would've thrown a rock at him." I mean, they're harmless.

[ashlover mark 2]

you know this is leading off into a rather intersting Topic that i dont think weve disscussed before.so here it is ladys and gentlemen How far do you think ash would go in terms of following shepards orders?



As we all know she has religous belifes and ppl with those typs of belifes tend too try too live a moral lifestyle so they can go too heaven and all that good stuff.BUT ash kills ppl for a livieng which is a Sin in her religon and weve seen her swing both ways on the whole genocide of the rachni chocies.



So how moral do you think ashley is as a cahrecter and how far would she obey shepards orders?Disscus.

[SilverRose208]

I think she'd obey Shepard as part of the military mores and codes of conduct on most things, but I also think she wouldn't shy away from letting her opinions/objections be known. I can see her drawing the line at shooting unarmed civilians, for example - or at least demanding Shepard's justifications for his orders. If he ordered something that was outside of military conduct (like shooting civilians, or ordering her to kiss a superior officer), she'd probably have no qualms with relieving him of command.

[Raanz]

Killing in the line of duty is a whole 'nother can of worms. Many people in the military today are Christian.



Although her morals probably wouldn't align completely with that of a Renegade Shepard, he is her "Commander" and thus she feels the need, nay, the obligation to follow orders. I think SilverRose hit the nail on the head.

The whole Wrex thing was that of a loyal soldier watching over her commanding officer.



@ashlover: I believe that was during the second visit to the Citadel, in a conversation with Anderson at the club.

[Clone 071]

SilverRose208 wrote...

I think she'd obey Shepard as part of the military mores and codes of conduct on most things, but I also think she wouldn't shy away from letting her opinions/objections be known. I can see her drawing the line at shooting unarmed civilians, for example - or at least demanding Shepard's justifications for his orders. If he ordered something that was outside of military conduct (like shooting civilians, or ordering her to kiss a superior officer), she'd probably have no qualms with relieving him of command.

Pretty much sums up what I'd say. She even said that in the game.

Raanz wrote...

Killing in the line of duty is a whole 'nother can of worms. Many people in the military today are Christian.

Although her morals probably wouldn't align completely with that of a Renegade Shepard, he is her "Commander" and thus she feels the need, nay, the obligation to follow orders. I think SilverRose hit the nail on the head.
The whole Wrex thing was that of a loyal soldier watching over her commanding officer.

Yet again, true. I would have done the same if I was in her shoes.

[Kacynski]

Reading all the posts about Ash shooting Wrex on Virmire makes me want to play ME1 again to this point, just to see this scene once and make a better judgement on this. Persuasion is the very first thing I max out on my Shepards because in the end ME is still a RPG and I hate not having all dialogue options because my scores are too low, so I can allways convince Wrex, even without doing his armor quest.
Is there even a possibility for Ash shooting at Wrex if you made the armor quest before?
So, admiting I never did see the scene happen ingame, I still don't get why Ash is blamed for shooting Wrex ... it's all Shepards fault in my book. It's him not caring about a crew memeber (by not making the quest) or him not being a good leader (by lacking commanding skills he could have developed at this point) making Wrex go havoc at him. What should Ash do in this case?
Allthough I admit its kind of poor writing, that the player doesn't get it nailed to the face that it's his own fault. There should be the wheel with just two options at that point, like "all other options failed" which results in Ash shooting Wrex and "let it play out" with Wrex killing Shepard, resulting in a critical mission failure.
That's pretty much it - Ash saves Shepard from a critical mission failure, which he could have easily avoided by either paying attention to his crew or by developing his leadership skills. And Ash gets the blame for it

And I do think she's in character at that point. After Shepards ask "should I go talk with him?" She say's "Couldn't hurt, ...... well, actually it might hurt" and Shepard says: "Be ready". He doesn't say: "Whatever goes wrong, don't do anything foolish" he says "Be ready". So, what do you expect from a soldier which has been told by his commanding officer to be ready, and then the officer is attacked by an individual that is known for being: a) very skilled in combat, able to regenerate health in seconds, c) has multiple organ backups, d) can fall into a battle bloodrage and on top of it is in its worst mood ever? Do you really think a shot in Wrex feet would have solved the matters?
I'm sure Ash was thinking about her options from the second Shepard tells her to be ready. And she (as I assume any other soldier) came to the conclusion, that if Wrex is going to attack Shepard she will have to kill him. She then chooses the most safe method to kill Wrex quick, before he can do too much harm to Shepard.
Again, don't blame her for that - she did exactly what was expected from a good soldier and she did it exceptionally well.
Final line: The reason Wrex dies is not because Ash shot him, its because Shepard failed as a commander!