161 réponses à ce sujet

[Collider]

Some time ago, a developer revealed that players MUST act consistently ONLY paragon or ONLY renegade in order to use charm and intimidate. I played Mass Effect in the first place because I wanted to roleplay Shepard as how I want.

In the fight involving two human squad mates, I was unable to use either charm or intimidate, and therefore had to side with one or the other. For my Shepard, this was out of character. He had full persuasion skill, yet was unable to use charm and intimidate.

The system in ME1 was a million times better.

I don't want the game to tell me that I have to either be Paragon or I have to be Renegade.

I thought the main draw of the game was choice. I don't want to be forced to either be Space Paladin or Antisocial Jerk. Please fix the system Bioware in ME3, let us roleplay our Shepards. 

If you want more information, please visit this thread:

social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/105/index/2723147

The best way to do the choices in ME3 would be like Dragon Age: your ability to use charm or intimidate depends on a persuade skill and nothing else.

EDIT: The system in ME1 wasn't as good as I imagined. But something is wrong when you have full paragon yet are unable to use charm. Please make paragon and renegade not a requirement for charm or intimidate, Bioware. Just make a persuasion skill.

Modifié par Collider, 26 mai 2010 - 08:43 .

[TudorWolf]

I usually roleplay as a straight paragon anyway, but the point still stands, you are correct.



The new persuasion system was alright in theory ("reputation" based) but in actual gameplay all it does is restrict you to one moral alignment. ME1's charm/intimidate system was superior in that regard

[ObserverStatus]

I have to agree. I felt that needing high paragon or renegade to pass speech checks was unfair to moderate Shepards.

[praetor_alpha]

Indeed. the only thing good about the morality system in ME2 are the interrupts.

[Ashton808]

Either you play the way you want or play the easy way.

[Elvis_Mazur]

Do like me: don't bother if it is a "Paragon" choice or a "Renegade" one.

In the 2 conflicts I always have enough for a Paragon choice.



But I have to agree. This system forces the player to be Paragon or Renegade.

[Icinix]

I agree absoloutely. The beauty of the Charm / Intimiade options from ME1 was it allowed your chacter to play a paragon or renegade character, but still manipulate a situation to benefit yourself without going against your alignment.
For example, getting the special weapons license, or convincing a certain exogeni employee to take another option. These were very different paths to take, but straddled a more neutral / greyer territory.
Something which I think is very important in a role playing environment. Not everything needs to be black and white.

Modifié par Icinix, 26 mai 2010 - 02:15 .

[sonofalich]

i had no idea ME 2 was an rpg.

[Chala]

sonofalich wrote...

i had no idea ME 2 was an rpg.

why do you complain? at least is not an j-rpg.

[Icinix]

sonofalich wrote...

i had no idea ME 2 was an rpg.

LOL I was wondering how long it would take.

Modifié par Icinix, 26 mai 2010 - 02:29 .

[sodacatkun]

Icinix wrote...

sonofalich wrote...

i had no idea ME 2 was an rpg.

LOL I was wondering how long it would take.

thas wat yo momma said

[badkenbad]

Did you try going back to charm or intimidate Miranda or Jack after you sided with one? I'm pretty sure there's actually a lower threshold for regaining their loyalty after the fight than during the fight. Paragon or Renegade matters, too, I think it's easier to Paragon regain loyalty of Miranda and Renegade regain loyalty of Jack after the conflict.

[ReapersReign]

sodacatkun wrote...

thas wat yo momma said

Ugh..

Modifié par ReapersReign, 26 mai 2010 - 05:18 .

[Ecael]

Collider wrote...

The system in ME1 was a million times better.

Putting points into the Charm/Intimidate bars in ME1 was a waste, since you received 4 points in either bar with each playthrough (assuming you fill up either the Paragon or Renegade bar by the end). So in order to max out either Charm or Intimidate, you'd have to play through the game at least 3 times, only getting the alternate Saren ending by the 3rd playthrough.

However, I agree that the system needs to be revamped. It actually helped in ME2 because there were several mission options given to you to choose from at any one time, and the player shouldn't be penalized for doing them in the wrong order.

[Collider]

It actually helped in ME2 because there were several mission options given to you to choose from at any one time, and the player shouldn't be penalized for doing them in the wrong order.

Uh, they were.

[Jsmith0730]

They just need the paragon/renegade options to affect morality, not the other way around and no point system.



I can see Shep standing there, "Man... I really want to shake this guy down but... I just... I just can't!"

[Onyx Jaguar]

sonofalich wrote...

i had no idea ME 2 was an rpg.

Well, RPGs in Europe and America tend to cost quite a lot.  However you can probably find them at price in parts of Africa and the Middle East.  Sadly I've never heard of a ME 2 model, and I do not know why you are bringing this up on a Bioware forum, it would be intensely illegal for them to sell and ship RPGs in the countries that they operate in and with.

Besides, the western countries have access to better equipment.  I can only assume you would want an RPG to yourself, which I guess would make for a nice collectors item but I think it would just be too risky.  

[Captain_Obvious_au]

Really? Huh. I just imported a level 60 Shep from ME1, made both renegade and paragon decisions in ME2, and was able to pass all of the checks for the arguments etc.

[DK_DOOM]

They should let you use Charm or Intimidate options regardless of how many points you have and just give more for the respective alignment for using them.

[LPPrince]

I agree ME1's system was better.



ME2 forced you to stick to one side. That sucked.



My Shepard is a paragon with renegade tendencies every now and again, but I found myself in moments where I couldn't choose the renegade option I wanted to.



For example, the "I'm a Spectre, start talking" choice when interrogating Elias.

[Massadonious1]

I'm pretty sure they can do better than Dragon Age's system.

[LPPrince]

Neofelis Nebulosa wrote...

Actually I like the new system. That essentially enables to play five different playthroughs:

One Full Renegade (always choosing the bottom right answer/Intimidation and Renegade Action)

One Full Paragon (always choosing the top right answer/Charming and Paragon Action)

One indifferent playthrough (always choosing the middle answer and never use Intimidation/Charming or the respective actions)

One Mixed Renegade (Choosing between bottom right and middle answer aswell as taking the renegade actions only and ignore Intimidation/Charming)

One Mixed Paragon (Choosing between top right and middle answer aswell as taking the paragon actions only and ignore Intimidation/Charming)

That way you are going to enjoy to various different approaches and results, aswell as having several different playthroughs to choose from in both Mass Effect 2 and 3 to get the maximum out of the games.

Except people like me who want their characters to be Paragon AND Renegade(with varying amounts of the two) are screwed.

So ME1's system is better, since you can choose everything from your list AND mine.

[MPaBkaTa123]

Erm, you do know that unless you are replaying the game with the same character leveling both as well as choosing both options in ME1 will weaken your character in both areas.The difference between the two is simply that in the first one you have to devote points to it, and you don't have to do that in the second it's done for you.



I will agree though that lowering your scores depending on where the other is, as in ME2 was a ****** decision, leave it the system of ME2 (no need to have points for it when you get it automatically) but let the two bars count separately and not affect each other.