110 réponses à ce sujet

[Ischkwezrn]

I don't care much about the plot. I just want more fatal dismembering moves to execute upon my hapless enemies.

[b44l]

_-Greywolf-_ wrote...
What if you ARE the twisted god child?

I can work with that ...

[Kyda]

I don’t want another blight like the one we fought but since I like my char and I would like her to survive maybe there could be a journey to kill the sleeping arch demons and finishing the blights once and for all, and maybe that way the taint would disappear and the remaining greywardens could be cured from it. That would take the fights to another level since it is a different approach, I mean there will be darkspanws sure, but also you could find a lot of enemies and travel far away from Fereldem.

[Fntsybks]

_-Greywolf-_ wrote...

However I do wonder why the first Dragon Age was called Origins? Is it because of the fact that the game contains different player character origins to choose from or is it because the game was a set up for something bigger? Origins seems like a better name for a prequel or spin off that explains how the events of the first game/movie/whatever came to pass. For instance if you have seen the new Robin Hood starring Russell Crowe, Origins would have been a suitable subtitle. Of course I could be reading more into it and I probably am but it is an interesting thought eh?

I've thought about this too, and for me at least there are three possibilities - if you even think that "Origins" has any real meaning, except for maybe it being the "origin" of the Dragon Age series. The first is that Bioware was simply saying that you can choose an origin, but I think that is a little shallow. Second, it could be "origin" of your character (i.e. you will have other adventures and that was just the first one.) The last idea is that you will play as the Old God in DA2, and DAO was your "origin." Of course, I doubt that Bioware will just tell us, at least until they announce the sequel 

Edit: For anyone who would like a smaller, simpler plot: How would you get enough gameplay? It is hard to justify 50 hours of game for just a town or two, unless the game is 95% companion/plot oriented, which I doubt. Think of all the places in DAO, would you really just want to save Lothering?

Modifié par Fntsybks, 02 juin 2010 - 09:35 .

[maxernst]

Fntsybks wrote...



Edit: For anyone who would like a smaller, simpler plot: How would you get enough gameplay? It is hard to justify 50 hours of game for just a town or two, unless the game is 95% companion/plot oriented, which I doubt. Think of all the places in DAO, would you really just want to save Lothering?

I don't want a simpler plot, I want a plot that's not about saving the world.  And while I like the idea of one more centered around personal situations (like Torment), I really don't want to do the god-baby thing--it'sa retread of BG.  I want something fresh.  It's not as though the DA:O plot was really all that complicated, and almost all the sidequests were very small.  A political intrigue based plot could be full of twists and turns and have lots of different characters and factions to interact with.  Similarly, though technically the geographic scale of DA:O is all of Ferelden, a single city like Antiva or Val Royeaux could easily require more environments than were in the original game.

And honestly, I don't need 100 hours of gameplay.  I know I'm in the minority, but I'd prefer to have 20 hours of high quality gameplay than 10 hours of high quality game play and 90 hours of slogging through one interchangeable mob after another.

[Vicious]

I really don't want to do the god-baby thing--it'sa retread of BG.

I don't think you put any thought into that statement.



It's not even remotely similar.

[Aulis Vaara]

OnlyShallow89 wrote...
It doesn't have to be some huge world-sized event with legions upon legions of Conveniently Evil People to be epic.

Eh, yes it does. That's the definition of an epic fantasy. It has to be large in scope, the world has to be at stake.

As for the god baby, I made the tough choice to not survive, to make sure that child was never born, it would be a shame to throw that away.

[grieferbastard]

Trying to establish a bakery in Par Volen. Securing supply lines, hiring mercenaries to guard your qualify flour deliveries. Leveling up to find new ways to cream sugar and butter, establishing distribution channels and venues for advertisement. Avoiding the baked-goods black market and cut-rate cookies.

Then again, even playing a game designed around being a baker there would likely be like 2 apron options and 3 hats, then 47 suits of massive gothic Qunari plate to choose from.

DAO Fighter:  "Hey, wizard, how come you never change your clothes? I've got dozens of outfits, several suits of armor and I'm always upgrading to new gear depending on what I need to do.  There's like 4 or 5 warriors in the party and we share gear with the two rogues; yet we all have a half dozen or more individual suits of gear that look markedly different. You always look the same - and that hat? Dude, it makes you look like my swingin' cod."

DAO Mage: " Actually I have 6 outfits - just that they only have two real designs.  A Couple change the color a bit but you may have missed it. I don't change because I don't always feel like looking like the Master of Ceremonies at a BDSM convention. Hence of the two, yes two, different designs of clothing that anyone has ever made in the history of Thedas for mages only one of them only one of them is something I'll wear outside of a private ship with Liliana, Zevran and Isabella. It has two or three colors of belt but otherwise all mages dress exactly the same. As to the hat, well, that is our penance and the one true sign that the Maker hates all mages."

[Loerwyn]

Aulis Vaara wrote...
Eh, yes it does. That's the definition of an epic fantasy. It has to be large in scope, the world has to be at stake.

Then we agree to disagree.

[N7xWolf]

i would prefer another epic story with the darkspawn tbh. but i would also want twists and subplots that have a noticable impact on the story (political backstabing, emergance of a new enemy, etc.)

But on a side note ive also been thinking of a major plot twist that i havent seen in any game i can remember, and would like to see: What if... after the main plot plays out, your character FAILS, as in like he or she dont defeat the archdemon and their only choices at the end are:

a) *Ultimate Sacrifice ending* the PC sacrifices his/herself to save the party members and the blight spreads all over thedas (thus leaving room for a dark, hopeless situation for the third game where everyone is basically just fighting to survive let alone try to wipe out the darkspawn)

or *survival ending* the player escapes from the hopeless battle but is severely wounded and alot of NPCs are killed in the retreat, thus opening up a plot for DA3 where the PC has to fight for survival, try to rally an army to defeat this "blight of blights", and at the same time find a way to wipe out the darkspawn once and for all.

of course, this may sound like one crap of a twist but i just thought i put it out there. besides, its BW, im sure they have something planned.   

feel free to comment but please no bashing as this is just my opinion.

Modifié par N7xWolf, 04 juin 2010 - 01:06 .

[Vicious]

Sick of fighting Orks, I mean Darkspawn. How about an enemy that isn't automatically evil?

[maxernst]

Vicious wrote...

I really don't want to do the god-baby thing--it'sa retread of BG.

I don't think you put any thought into that statement.

It's not even remotely similar.

No, of course being the son of an evil old god is nothing at all like having the soul of a probably evil old god.  Let's think about what such a plot would entail, shall we?  You're going to have both a human nature and a divine nature, and somehow during the game the divine powers will gradually make themselves known...and with them darker impulses.  At some point I'll lay odds that you'll end up having the option of fully accepting your god status and immortality.  This doesn't sound at all familiar does it?

You can't have the game start with you fully aware of your status and ablities, so

1) Morrigan won't have told you yet, other than perhaps indicating that you're very "special" in some way
2) Something will happen to Morrigan to prevent her from imparting the knowledge in the way she planned.  Maybe she'll be posessed by Flemeth and you'll sense that something's wrong with Mommy or maybe you'll be kidnapped by Flemeth.  I'm kind of visualizing Flemeth playing an Irenicusesque role here.

The only really significant difference is that you won't have a bunch of siblings (probably)...unless there are other old gods out there.

[Dethares]

The main plot for DA 2....... if I could write out DA 2, the main plot would lead to the next game DA 3 in which answers the bigger question, the Maker's existence and why were the Old God's enprisoned. For DA 2 however, the burning question on the edge of most DA player's tongue is what about Morrigan's and the main character's child? The way I'd like to see it is that Morrigan's and the main character's "night to remember" was the begining of the end, but for who and which side? Since the child is an Old God, darkspawn would look for him since the calling is irresistable. Would they attack him though? This would surely interest the Architect and could this answer his question? Enable him to carry out his long forsought goal. I'd enjoy the smaller plots in which make connections to DA 1. However, this would be based on the desicions the main character has made in DAO and DAA, soo.... yeah. It's diificult to have a concrete plot for 2 considering that everything is based on what you did or didn't do previously. And if I could write out the entire story of DA, well my story goes like this..... 
      There are two grey wardens within game 1. A righteous knight in silver armor (human-noble) and a cold, calculative, power-lusting wizard (human-mage). Why humans? Humans are the center race of Ferelden society, Allistar's best bud would be human creating a paralell to Maric and Loghain, and only a cold hearted mage would be attracted (ulitmately falling in love) to another cold hearted mage. All recruitable character's live due to the desicion of one or the other grey warden, whether it be for personal agendas or intervention. Allies are created through the ideals of the true leader, the knight, the foreseen consequences by the mage and supported by the king. The ritual was made and Blight was stopped, questionably. The Heros become commanders and they rebuild. One learns of his true origins tied with the other warden, nothing is said. Wardens are recruited, the Architect is spared by the mage warden's intervention and the Mother is ultimately killed.  In the end, the mage leaves unknowingly most likely due to personal agendas and the noble stays due to honor and duty. This is the foundation for my DA 2. Any questions? Send me a message.  

[AT_Field]

kill off all the grey wardens and have them long forgotten for several centuries, then the protagonist stumbles upon the ultimate secret (drinking darkspawn blood) and rebuilds the wardens the way YOU want them to be (so you can make the new wardens evil bastards, holy knights, exactly like the old wardens or whatever)

[nuclearpengu1nn]

how about fighting new enemies far more evil and brutal and awesome than the darkspawn and you the grey wardens and your past companions sten dog shale oghren leliana etc.. work together with the darkspawn to defeat the new enemy oh and morrigan returns with your kid which the new enemy is drawn to, because they want to turn the kid into one of them and you have to protect the kid but if you did not have sex with her in the ritual and have some other warden do her you still have protect the kid because the world will end if the new enemy gets the kid and turns the kid into one of them also if you did not do the ritual with morrigan and died at the archdemon battle you start as a new character and a new origin and you can be like a grey warden or a recruit but after your origin go with the protect morrigan's kid and work with darkspawn to kill the new powerful enemies

[Lord Gremlin]

I don't mind Darkspawn as main enemy, but they need to change them... Problem with Darkspawn is that it's basically a brain-dead enemy. They don't plan any strategy, don't make allies, they just gather an army and charge forward as their brain-dead commander (Archdemon) wishes. Awakening took the right direction here, BTW.

[Knight_Quack]

For me a Dragon Age without Darkspawn or Dragons wouldn't be a Dragon Age. They should set this 40 years after the fifth blight (it's HAS to be the dragon age), new origin stories (this made me play the game multiple times) and a blight but this time with the twist that the one leading the blight is a Trevinter Mage riding the Archdemon, sort of a reunion of trevinter with their old gods. It would all began with the qunari being wiped out near Trevinter and since most nations don't care about the qunari it would go unnoticed except for a squad of grey warden stationed near there, from there i leave it up to your imagination.



Also a Darkspawn companion would be cool as well as a horde like mode (set in a thaig in the deep roads) for a multiplayer experience.

[Fntsybks]

Knight_Quack wrote...

For me a Dragon Age without Darkspawn or Dragons wouldn't be a Dragon Age.

Darkspawn an important part of the DA universe, but Thedas is more than just darkspawn. So yes, in DA2 darkspawn should figure into the plot somehow, maybe seeing how the Architect turns out, but it shouldn't solely be about darkspawn/ a new Blight. We've seen and beaten a Blight, we can move on and fight a new enemy. DA2 needs to show us something different from DAO, and it needs to be innovative and exciting. I just can't see a new Blight doing that, even with some plot complication - unless that complication completely transforms the plot. And so far we have only had one Dragon Age, so you shouldn't say it defines a series.

Whatever plot we get, it needs to be new. Whether that has to do with Morrigan/the Dark Ritual, is up for debate, although I personally want it to be. As long as DA2 is new/innovative, we will like it, but if it turns too similar to DAO, it will just get boring that much faster

[Diablocat]

I don't care about what the plot involves, but I want you to have several in-depth origins in the sequel such as being Morrigan's -untainted- child (If you sleep with her and refuse to a do the ritual, this is it) or be a newly trained grey warden in vigil's keep, sort of like the start of neverwinter nights 1.

[Aulis Vaara]

Vicious wrote...

Sick of fighting Orks, I mean Darkspawn. How about an enemy that isn't automatically evil?

You mean like the werewolves? Or Andraste's cult?

Lord Gremlin wrote...

Awakening took the right direction here, BTW.

I actually dislike the whole 'intelligent' darkspawn thing. Their leader is an idiot for one, and I don't think their species would work without a hive mind. If you look at the animal kingdom, every species where only a queen (broodmother) reproduces has at least a sort of hive mind.

There are possibly some things to play with though, like darkspawn abominations.

[Corker]

I suspect the branching factor on PC decisions is too large to make DA2 involve a previous Warden.  At best, I'd think one decision might port over (DR/no DR).  Otherwise, I'd expect it to be at least 30-50 years in the future, when (whomever ruled Ferelden in your playthrough) has died without heirs and all the Grey Wardens who Joined around your PC's time are dead in the Deep Roads.  Ferelden has a little civil war when there's no Theirin or Mac Tir to take the throne, a new line is established, and there's a more or less clean break from DAO.

I dislike it when world rules are established and then, shortly thereafter, are shattered.  "Darkspawn are mindless LOLNOWAIT some are intelligent."  So I would prefer to not focus on the Architect.

My dream game would probably be city-based.  Specific origins as in DAO, based on the major factions that will arise in the game.  I'd focus on lower-class origins, but a few 'fallen nobles' like HN or DN work just fine. 

I'm not sure I'd want a Grey Warden again.  If there's no Blight, what do they do, anyway? We've had the Big Grey Warden Story already.  Give me a cog in an unpleasant wheel - a Tevinter blood mage's slave or a new Crow recruit.  It's up to the PC: try and take the organization down, try and take it over to do good, try and take it over just to have the power.  Both the blood mages and the Crows are likely to have ties both to higher and lower places in society, sending the PC to seek allies or to defeat enemies in the Alienage organized crime boss, the sinister noblewoman, the strife-torn Dwarven Merchants' Guild, and so on.

Perhaps the twist/Kobayashi Maru comes as the PC is about to consolidate his or her power and eliminate the hub of that unpleasant wheel.  That's when someone claiming to be the Old Tevinter god of beauty shows up.  (If DR==TRUE, then OldGod = TRUE else FALSE).  Save your enemy as an ally against this new threat?  Or fight without her?  (And the fight will need to be materially different or else it's not really a choice since PC Always Wins.)

Now do I think I'll get this game?  Not really.  But it's not so different from the Standard Fantasy Potboiler as all that.  I think it's a plausible product.

[searanox]

I'm not a big fan of "epic" games; they strike me as silly and overly full of themselves, and they rarely have scale or storytelling to actually live up to their ambitions. I feel like Dragon Age got closer to some other games, but still came up short in the end. For an RPG to be epic is pretty difficult, I think, due to the personal nature of the genre... you need huge armies, battles across entire continents, etc. to really drive the point across. I just started playing King's Bounty the other day, and honestly that's about as close to an "epic RPG" as I've seen lately.

I'm much more a fan of games whose stories feature dire stakes and good motivations for the characters, but also know their limitations and stick to a small group of characters. I'd much rather get to know everyone in the game intimately. The quality of your writing isn't determined by how poetic your dialogue is, it's how interesting your characters are when the focus of the game moves to them. BioWare tends to have decent characters, but they're also usually one-sided, relying more on aesthetic quirks than their personalities to be interesting, or are only defined by one or two traits. Real humans are complex - they have secrets, they are prone to letting emotion or logic take over depending on the situation, they have grudges against people, their attitudes and opinions can change, etc. You can only really see this in games where you're in contact with a few people for long periods of time (and of course when the writers are good enough to know to do it).

I'm currently playing through Alpha Protocol and I'm finding it a far more satisfying game than Mass Effect, and in terms of characters, it probably beats out Dragon Age as well. Every conversation is tense, because you actually know that the things you're saying have a significant effect not just on those individuals, but other characters and the story as a whole. Some people like flirtation. Some people are patriots. Some don't tolerate bull****. Some like action instead of words. This is how people really are. The typical "I'm a lore bomb, interrogate me!" NPCs that populate most RPGs can only work so long as you have continually new aesthetics to distract players, and it's overall far more entertaining to let a story rely on characters that we grow to truly understand than it is to have an ambiguous bad guy that tries to get a pass because black = evil.

Lord Gremlin wrote...

I don't mind Darkspawn as main
enemy, but they need to change them... Problem with Darkspawn is that
it's basically a brain-dead enemy. They don't plan any strategy, don't
make allies, they just gather an army and charge forward as their
brain-dead commander (Archdemon) wishes. Awakening took the right
direction here, BTW.

The problem with the Darkspawn isn't so much that they are brain-dead, but that we learn nothing about them.  At all.  Ever.  We know that they have Archdemons, who might be Old Golds, and we know that they abduct women to become baby-makers, and that's about it.  There's mystery behind the Darkspawn that doesn't just go unrevealed, but it gets totally ignored.  It's obvious that the Darkspawn are a generic foe that BioWare are hoping people will want to kill simply because they look mean enough, but they don't actually have any real backstory for them worked out.  For a world so full and fleshed out as Thedas, it's really kind of sad that one of the most important parts of it is something so amazingly simplistic and uninspired.  If Dragon Age really wants to be interesting in the future, then we need to explore the Darkspawn - why they exist, what their intentions are, what their motivations are, etc.  The Architect was a step in the right direction, but even then Awakening felt far more like a side story than anything else.

Modifié par searanox, 06 juin 2010 - 02:02 .

[Arttis]

AT_Field wrote...

kill off all the grey wardens and have them long forgotten for several centuries, then the protagonist stumbles upon the ultimate secret (drinking darkspawn blood) and rebuilds the wardens the way YOU want them to be (so you can make the new wardens evil bastards, holy knights, exactly like the old wardens or whatever)

doesnt sound too bad.

[Lord Gremlin]

Ischkwezrn wrote...

I don't care much about the plot. I just want more fatal dismembering moves to execute upon my hapless enemies.

I want messy kills/dismemberment moves to be directly connected to character stats and skills. For example, character has a chance to smash enemy skull to bits with a maul = 0,5*strengh, or decapitation chance = 0,5*dexterity. And maybe special moves that decapitate/dismember enemies (if they're fatal of course).

[Wedger]

AT_Field wrote...

kill off all the grey wardens and have them long forgotten for several centuries, then the protagonist stumbles upon the ultimate secret (drinking darkspawn blood) and rebuilds the wardens the way YOU want them to be (so you can make the new wardens evil bastards, holy knights, exactly like the old wardens or whatever)

Sounds a little too "Dragons of Pern" for my taste