134 réponses à ce sujet

[wizardryforever]

CalJones wrote...

I recruited her once to get Dominate, then reloaded. Even my most Renegade Shepard wouldn't have her on the crew - he might be able to resist her but she still poses a threat to other crew mates (like warm and welcoming Kelly). Can't have that!

I can just see it now. . .

Mordin: Shepard, discovered Yeoman Chambers dead in her quarters.  Appears she died of brain hemmorage.  Implications unpleasant.
Shepard:  Excuse me for a minute Mordin.
*storms down to the starboard observation deck*
Shepard: Damnit Morinth, what did I tell you about killing the crew with snu-snu?!  Kelly is dead from a "brain hemorrage."
Morinth: Hey, why does everyone assume that brain hemorrages mean that I killed them?  Did you ever consider that maybe it was a natural thing?  People die naturally from brain hemorrages, you know.
Shepard:  Don't give me that bull--
Mordin *over the intercom*: Shepard, just reviewed Yeoman Chambers' medical files, seems she had a family history of brain hemmorages, and she failed her first drug test for acceptance into Cerberus.  No cause for alarm.
Shepard: Oh, well, carry on then.
*a few hours later*
Mordin: Shepard, further autopsy on Yeoman Chambers' body reveals brain damage too extensive to be natural.
Shepard: That ****!
Mordin: Who do you mean?
Shepard: Nevermind. *storms out again*

[smecky-kitteh]

kerkegr06 wrote...

Has anybody selected Samara to die and saved Morinth. Holy Sh!t she disguises herself as Samara (so the team doesn't know) and talks about how you might be the only one she can have sex with and not worry about dying. So also says that Samara was evil and part of a group that wants the humans erased. Plus her fourth ability is sweet (controls humans and gives them a constantly regening barrier). My jaw dropped when all this happened. Has anybody else done this?...

lol.

[ThisIsMadness91]

I killed Samara once to unlock Dominate for Shepard to use. Afterwards, I immediately reloaded and killed Morinth. Morinth will die in each and every one of my playthroughs. She is pure evil, and her attempt to make me and Samara look bad at the end of the mission is laughable.

[Xeranx]

ThisIsMadness91 wrote...

I killed Samara once to unlock Dominate for Shepard to use. Afterwards, I immediately reloaded and killed Morinth. Morinth will die in each and every one of my playthroughs. She is pure evil, and her attempt to make me and Samara look bad at the end of the mission is laughable.

How exactly do you know that she is pure evil?  What facts are you given?  

[NICKjnp]

JohnnyDollar wrote...

STG wrote...

Shandepared wrote...

yorkj86 wrote...

Morinth is a murderous sociopath.

The apple didn't fall far from the tree.

One is a vigilante that fights crime and corruption.

Other kills for pleasure.

I'd say that in this case, apple did fall far from the tree.

A vigilante appoints one's self to punish summarliy.  Samara is not a vigilante, her authority and reponsibility is invested to her from Asari society.  A Justicar is the policeman, the judge, and the executioner rolled up into one.  Powers entrusted to them by the Asari people.

[Siansonea]

Xeranx wrote...

ThisIsMadness91 wrote...

I killed Samara once to unlock Dominate for Shepard to use. Afterwards, I immediately reloaded and killed Morinth. Morinth will die in each and every one of my playthroughs. She is pure evil, and her attempt to make me and Samara look bad at the end of the mission is laughable.

How exactly do you know that she is pure evil?  What facts are you given?  

Hmmm, the whole serial killer thing is kind of a big clue.

I can't believe people are talking about this like it's some new thing. How long has this game been out? And I suppose if I was a 13-year-old boy I'd think the Morinth stuff was cool. Being an adult, I find it preposterous that even a 'renegade' Shepard would allow the highly-respected Justicar to be killed at the behest of a known serial killer that Shepard has only known for a few hours. That simply defies basic logic.

That said, my idiot/psycopath Shepard, Ashley Shepard, did go for the deal with Morinth. But she's an idiot/psycopath.

[Panda Warlock]

Xeranx wrote...

ThisIsMadness91 wrote...

I killed Samara once to unlock Dominate for Shepard to use. Afterwards, I immediately reloaded and killed Morinth. Morinth will die in each and every one of my playthroughs. She is pure evil, and her attempt to make me and Samara look bad at the end of the mission is laughable.

How exactly do you know that she is pure evil?  What facts are you given?  

Her being a serial killer, soul-suckin succubus and trying to mind control and mind rape you after half an hour is kinda a giveaway.

[STG]

There is also that small issue of her actually, you know... killing you.

[SuperMedbh]

Siansonea II wrote...

Xeranx wrote...
How exactly do you know that she is pure evil?  What facts are you given?  

Hmmm, the whole serial killer thing is kind of a big clue.

This.

I could see it if Morinth had more time "on stage", where a renegade could see some grey in the moral choice.  There are hints at that plotline:  Samara's comment that she kills without question and might have to do that to Shepard, the fact that Morinth's only other choice to be a nun/hermit.  Essentially, Morinth is a victim of her own nature--  a nature that is pretty much Samara's fault (since she knew her children might very well become Ardat-Yakshi).

But none of that matters to sensitive and artistic girls named Nef. 

That said, Dominate is a fun ability and worth unlocking.  I actually like it best at level one, since lack of a barrier means that my dominated bad guy will usually get taken out by their buddies but will do enough damage to bring down the defenses of a future victim

[Tooneyman]

Nightwriter wrote...

Tooneyman wrote...

Yes, Morinth is freaking awesome. I like samara because of the whole honor bull, but Morinth was kind of just interesting to talk too. I never touched her with a ten itch pole, but she the fact she could manipulate people to advantage might come in handy in ME 3. Think about it. Morinth and her ability against the freaking council or even the illusive man. What she might beable to do to help convince them with her powers could be very useful. Its one of the reasons I've kept her around and as long as the B. Stays in her corridors I don't have a problem with her.

I want to know what a ten itch pole looks like. And how you use it. And what it does.

Is it bigger than a bread box? Does it have multiple attachments? Would Jabba the Hutt find it useful?

Her mind warp uses against you.

[Thompson family]

CalJones wrote...

I recruited her once to get Dominate, then reloaded. Even my most Renegade Shepard wouldn't have her on the crew - he might be able to resist her but she still poses a threat to other crew mates (like warm and welcoming Kelly). Can't have that!

I never recruited Morinth because she was evil, but even if you view her as an addict through no fault of her own, you still have to "feed" her. I don't think Samara was lying when she said the effect of killing was narcotic. Remember what Morinth said in her apartment. On chess, she said: "I love any game where your opponent thinks he's about to win right up to the point you kill him," or words to that effect. And on duelling with swords: She relishes "the look in your opponent's eyes when he realizes you're better than he is and he's about to die."

This woman's a killer. If she had some enormous power advantage that could help save the whole universe, I'd consider recruiting her, but obviously Samara is as powerful since it's up to me to break the deadlock when they fight.

And yeah, if Morinth comes aboard Yeoman Chambers is a dead woman.

Xeranx wrote...


How exactly do you know that she is pure evil?  What facts are you given?  

See above comments about chess and swords.

Modifié par Thompson family, 01 juin 2010 - 07:32 .

[FourSixEight]

Xeranx wrote...

ThisIsMadness91 wrote...

I killed Samara once to unlock Dominate for Shepard to use. Afterwards, I immediately reloaded and killed Morinth. Morinth will die in each and every one of my playthroughs. She is pure evil, and her attempt to make me and Samara look bad at the end of the mission is laughable.

How exactly do you know that she is pure evil?  What facts are you given?  

Morinth treated Nef basically like a toy, something to play with, drug up, and engage in snu-snu with. This is basically confirmed by everything Nef's mother says, and Samara says, "yeah, that sounds like something Morinth would do." Hell, even at the end where you choose Morinth she doesn't even bother to say, "I killed Nef by accident! It wasn't my choice, I swear!" At that moment Morinth is just trying to make you feel better about stabbing Samara in the back. She doesn't/didn't care about Nef and likely didn't care about the dozens of other victims she killed with snu-snu.

Also? When you engage Samara in conversation a few missions after that one, she mentions that she chased Samara to a colony. When there, Morinth did not simply try to hide. She used Dominate on everybody and hurled her new meat shields at Samara as a distraction. Everyone died except the kids, apparently.

You can make an argument for Morinth being more useful in the practical sense, but it's hard to argue that someone like her is anything other than sociopathic at best and diabolic at worst.

[Thompson family]

Also, even the Blue Sun mercenaries who smuggled her away from Samara called her a "filthy creature," a "scary lady" and inspired at least one member to choose death rather than have Samara "hurt me in ways you can't imagine." She's had a highly respected Justicar hunting her for 400 years.

[ThisIsMadness91]

Xeranx wrote...

ThisIsMadness91 wrote...

I killed Samara once to unlock Dominate for Shepard to use. Afterwards, I immediately reloaded and killed Morinth. Morinth will die in each and every one of my playthroughs. She is pure evil, and her attempt to make me and Samara look bad at the end of the mission is laughable.

How exactly do you know that she is pure evil?  What facts are you given?  

She manipulates people into having sex with her so that she can kill them and gain power. She believes she and all like her are superior to other asari. She tries to make herself look like the victim, being forced to choose between a life of solitude or death, but this falls flat due to her willingly murdering innocent people (and, judging from comments made by her, enjoying it). She cares nothing for her victims, and is unrepentant even in her final moments.

Also, all the reasons others have said before me. Morinth is evil, 'nuff said.

[precipitate8]

Hunh....I guess I'm the only one hoping they would come up with some plot device to give my super renegade femshep the ability to survive attempted murder from snu snu in ME3. Granted, that's far-fetched, but my femshep likes a challenge...what's a little mind rape amongst friends? Ok fine, her taste in women is...questionable.

[Anacoluthe]

Don't forget that Morinth's not only a sadistic serial killer, but that she's also an annoying science-fiction gothic wannabe with stupidly unoriginal and boring lines of dialogue.



Just those you quoted, Thompson family, for example:



"On chess, she said: "I love any game where your opponent thinks he's about to win right up to the point you kill him," or words to that effect. And on duelling with swords: She relishes "the look in your opponent's eyes when he realizes you're better than he is and he's about to die.""



NOW DATS AWESOME DIALOGUES!



She's like a teenage girl pretending to love "Death", hoping she'll sound cool, scary an' ****, and feel like she's a special snowflake.



"Sorry girl, I've seen some better dialogues in ****in' South Park, bye!"



Seriously, the killing thing isn't what repels me, it's the fact that she's a badly written character.



She's a piece of VOID filled with unoriginal gothic-themed BS and with lotsa points in her Renegade meter.

[TheZanSnake]

I did it with my renegade Senitel, and i have to say, dominate is really handy on the suicide mission.

[FourSixEight]

Anacoluthe wrote...

[snip]

Seriously, the killing thing isn't what repels me, it's the fact that she's a badly written character.

She's a piece of VOID filled with unoriginal gothic-themed BS and with lotsa points in her Renegade meter.

I'm pretty sure BioWare was poking fun at goths everywhere with the Morinth character. It's subverted though in that Morinth actually HAS the dark powers goths wish they did.

It's not that Morinth is badly written per se, it's that her *character* is that of a petulant woman-child whose redeeming factor is her Ardat-Yakshi prowess, which, again, can be easily matched by Samara's biotics.

[Xeranx]

Siansonea II wrote...

Xeranx wrote...

ThisIsMadness91 wrote...

I killed Samara once to unlock Dominate for Shepard to use. Afterwards, I immediately reloaded and killed Morinth. Morinth will die in each and every one of my playthroughs. She is pure evil, and her attempt to make me and Samara look bad at the end of the mission is laughable.

How exactly do you know that she is pure evil?  What facts are you given?  

Hmmm, the whole serial killer thing is kind of a big clue.

I can't believe people are talking about this like it's some new thing. How long has this game been out? And I suppose if I was a 13-year-old boy I'd think the Morinth stuff was cool. Being an adult, I find it preposterous that even a 'renegade' Shepard would allow the highly-respected Justicar to be killed at the behest of a known serial killer that Shepard has only known for a few hours. That simply defies basic logic.

That said, my idiot/psycopath Shepard, Ashley Shepard, did go for the deal with Morinth. But she's an idiot/psycopath.

Being an adult I find it preposterous to think that anyone would whole-heartedly take Samara on as a member of their crew considering the fact that when you meet Samara you see her kill an unarmed individual who is no threat to her or anyone else at the time, and who also expresses that she will kill any and all law enforcement if she feels she has to though the reason they want to detain her is because of the chaos she's caused.  Before that Samara threatens the eclipse merc with something along the lines of, "Your life for information" and she means it, which in my mind is nowhere near the height of honorable.  I expect the eclipse merc to that and not someone bearing the name Justicar.

Going back to the initial statement of Samara willing to kill cops to further her goals: if Samara had done so she would have left a void for more dangerous criminals to come in and start making a mess of everything.  Talk to Jack on Illium and she makes a comment about Illium and Omega.

Panda Warlock wrote...

Her being a serial killer, soul-suckin succubus and trying to mind control and mind rape you after half an hour is kinda a giveaway.

Considering she seems to be picky and your info from Samara paints Shepard as a perfect ideal for Morinth despite the fact that she (Morinth) went after Nef who seems to be the exact opposite of Shepard.  Shepard being "an artist on the battlefield" seemed too contrived for me to really take what she was saying seriously.

SuperMedbh wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

Xeranx wrote...
How exactly do you know that she is pure evil?  What facts are you given?  

Hmmm, the whole serial killer thing is kind of a big clue.

This.

I could see it if Morinth had more time "on stage", where a renegade could see some grey in the moral choice.  There are hints at that plotline:  Samara's comment that she kills without question and might have to do that to Shepard, the fact that Morinth's only other choice to be a nun/hermit.  Essentially, Morinth is a victim of her own nature--  a nature that is pretty much Samara's fault (since she knew her children might very well become Ardat-Yakshi).

But none of that matters to sensitive and artistic girls named Nef.  

That said, Dominate is a fun ability and worth unlocking.  I actually like it best at level one, since lack of a barrier means that my dominated bad guy will usually get taken out by their buddies but will do enough damage to bring down the defenses of a future victim

I agree.  The whole Samara/Morinth story wasn't deep enough to make any kind of decision, but up until that point everything I got from Samara seemed to not be all that up to fluff.  As soon as Samara told me she would kill cops to further her soltary goal despite the goal of law enforcement on a world she doesn't have residence in everything she said was suspect.  The only thing I did accept as the truth was that Morinth was intelligent and smart.  To evade someone that every Asari respects (despite their misgivings about what they do) for 400 years I'd imagine you'd have to be capable of losing a tail.

FourSixEight wrote...

Morinth treated Nef basically like a toy, something to play with, drug up, and engage in snu-snu with. This is basically confirmed by everything Nef's mother says, and Samara says, "yeah, that sounds like something Morinth would do." Hell, even at the end where you choose Morinth she doesn't even bother to say, "I killed Nef by accident! It wasn't my choice, I swear!" At that moment Morinth is just trying to make you feel better about stabbing Samara in the back. She doesn't/didn't care about Nef and likely didn't care about the dozens of other victims she killed with snu-snu.

Also? When you engage Samara in conversation a few missions after that one, she mentions that she chased Samara to a colony. When there, Morinth did not simply try to hide. She used Dominate on everybody and hurled her new meat shields at Samara as a distraction. Everyone died except the kids, apparently.

You can make an argument for Morinth being more useful in the practical sense, but it's hard to argue that someone like her is anything other than sociopathic at best and diabolic at worst.

We don't know how Nef was treated by Morinth.  Morinth could have been with Nef for months as far as we know and if that's the case then Nef wasn't a toy, but as I said we don't know how long Morinth was on Omega.  Could have been a few days, a few weeks, or a few months.  We were never able to identify who Jaruut was so we're left without any more information as to what was going on before Shepard got back to Omega.

[Jedi Master of Orion]

Even for Renegades, gaining the loyalty of a dangerous manipulative serial killer who not only tried to mind control you but is literally addicted to murdering people instead of a space knight who is sworn by an oath she takes more seriously than anything to help you with your mission is kind of a boneheaded move. At least when seriously role-playing. Sure you may know Morinth won't kill you and all your crew but that's meta-gaming. She tells you that she won't cause trouble with your crew, but is Shepard going to take her word for that seriously?

"Well she is hooked on murder like drugs and tried to kill me just now but I know despite just meeting her that she would never LIE to me!"

Modifié par Jedi Master of Orion, 01 juin 2010 - 08:30 .

[Xeranx]

Anacoluthe wrote...

Don't forget that Morinth's not only a sadistic serial killer, but that she's also an annoying science-fiction gothic wannabe with stupidly unoriginal and boring lines of dialogue.

As far as Morinth being a sadistic killer there's proof that she isn't.

Taken from merriam webster dictionary:

http://www.merriam-w...ctionary/sadist

Main Entry: sa·dism[/b] Pronunciation: \\\\ˈsā-ˌdi-zəm, ˈsa-\\\\Function: noun[/i]Etymology: International Scientific Vocabulary, from Marquis de Sade[/i]Date: 18881[/b] :[/b] a sexual perversion in which gratification is obtained by the infliction of physical or mental pain on others (as on a love object) — comparemasochism
2 a[/b] :[/b] delight in cruelty b[/b] :[/b] excessive cruelty— sa·dist[/b]  \\\\ˈsā-dist, ˈsa-\\\\ noun[/i]— sa·dis·tic[/b]  \\\\sə-ˈdis-tik also[/i] sā- or[/i] sa-\\\\adjective[/i]— sa·dis·ti·cal·ly[/b]  \\\\-ti-k(ə-)lē\\\\ adverb[/i] 

Morinth kills by giving incredible pleasure.  She says it herself, "they die feeling pleasure they can't even imagine". Where's the pain involved if all they feel is pleasure?  Where does Morinth become sadistic?

Anacoluthe wrote...
"On chess, she said: "I love any game where your opponent thinks he's about to win right up to the point you kill him," or words to that effect. And on duelling with swords: She relishes "the look in your opponent's eyes when he realizes you're better than he is and he's about to die.""[/b]

Chess is a battle of wits.  Dueling is a battle of skill.  Both reflect that she is contesting with the other and not that she takes advantage of the other person.  Those two pieces made me think that she knew there was something up, but wasn't quite sure what was happening.  Which leads me to:

Jedi Master of Orion wrote...

Even for Renegades, gaining the loyalty of a dangerous manipulative serial killer who not only tried to mind control you but is literally addicted to murdering people instead of a space knight who is sworn by an oath she takes more seriously than anything to help you with your mission is kind of a boneheaded move. At least when seriously role-playing. Sure you may know Morinth won't kill you and all your crew but that's meta-gaming. She tells you that she won't cause trouble with your crew, but is Shepard going to take her word for that seriously?

"Well she is hooked on murder like drugs and tried to kill me just now but I know despite just meeting her that she would never LIE to me!"

Who's to say she wasn't trying to find out what you were really doing there?  Keep in mind that when you first show up on Omega you're instructed to go to Afterlife and see Aria.  Why?  Because, if I remember the line correctly, Shepard "isn't as subtle as (s)he thinks".  Shepard shows up on Omega and is already a known quantity.  He/she gets involved in eradicating the plague and helping Archangel out.  

Aria knows everything there is to know on Omega and she's the sole owner of Afterlife.  You'd think word got around about who this person Shepard is.  Also considering that Morinth is a very intelligent person I would believe the first thing she would do in a new or previously visited area is find out any possible information that might be beneficial to her.  We already know what her pattern is...she would rather run from Samara than fight with her.

You're right that giving Samara the boot after she swore an oath to you may be a idiotic move to make, but who's to say that it's not just for show.  Only Justicars know about the sutras that the code encompasses.  Who says Samara couldn't have made it up and seeing as she's a Justicar and makes a grand show of it that it won't dazzle Det. Anaya and therefore make you think Samara's really on the level?

Modifié par Xeranx, 01 juin 2010 - 09:01 .

[Jedi Master of Orion]

Perhaps I'm remembering wrong but isn't there a Codex entry on the Justicar Oaths? Or at least covering them? And Morinth doesn't seem to know who you are even when you reveal yourself as more than just a random victim. So I get the impression she wasn't specifically investigating Shepard. Especially considering that Morinth shows up if you do the exact things Samara said would get her attention and doesn't if you don't.

Modifié par Jedi Master of Orion, 01 juin 2010 - 09:02 .

[Xeranx]

Jedi Master of Orion wrote...

Perhaps I'm remembering wrong but isn't there a Codex entry on the Justicar Oaths? Or at least covering them? And Morinth doesn't seem to know who you are even when you reveal yourself as more than just a random victim. So I get the impression she wasn't specifically investigating Shepard. Especially considering that Morinth shows up if you do the exact things Samara said would get her attention and doesn't if you don't.

I'll have to go back in-game and look at the Codex entry for Justicar Oaths.  However, I think the codex is part fact/part information you happen to learn along the way.  For instance, Zaeed being the leader of the Blue Suns is not common knowledge.  He even tells you that on Zorya and afterwards you get a codex entry.  Until you go to Zorya you never learn about such an important piece of information.  If you take him with you to get Archangel you find out that he was part of the Blue Suns, but not that he ran it.

Samara says that the Asari aren't going to put out information about the Ardat Yakshi.  Despite the Turian on the Citadel speaking about the monastary this information is supposed to be rare.  You don't get a codex entry after hearing the Turian mention it.  You get it only after Samara tells you.

Considering Morinth's speaking to you after you make a big spectacle of yourself...well that's all there is to say about it.  You make a spectacle of yourself and Morinth shows up to speak to you.  Samara tells you that you have to do this to get Morinth's attention.  That may have been the case a few hundred years ago, but maybe Morinth noticed that what you were doing is much like what her mother would instruct someone to do to get her attention.  Up until that point she doesn't know.  All she sees is someone getting involved in other people's business, goading people into fighting them and taking them down, or doing something completely out of character for Omega and buying everyone a round of drinks just because.  To Morinth, Shepard is an unknown quantity and to protect herself she has to be able to pin down who Shepard is and what (s)he wants.

[Jedi Master of Orion]

But Shepard can still make a spectacle of himself and not get her attention. And even if Shepard does get her attention, he can still lose it by talking about the wrong things can't he/she? If Morinth was aware of Shepard before meeting him/her at Omega then why would she have been surprised that he could resist her mental powers? She even asks "Who are you?" and doesn't realize Samara is behind it all until a second after that.