259 réponses à ce sujet

[Computer_God91]

Tirigon wrote...

Crimmsonwind wrote...

Tirigon wrote...

For f*cks sake, Asari aren´t female, they have no gender. Period.

I really tire of this bullsh!t claiming otherwise.

Ok, list your supposed facts or reasons of why they are not female, and I will do my best to pick them apart.

I'm seriously contemplating making a "why asari are really female" comic, now. Thanks for yet another idea.

Being female requires there to be males of the same species. Unless it turns out there are male asari somewhere the ones we see in the game are not female but simply asari. "Female" is a word that has no meaning if there is no opposite.

So then if you have everything a female has genetically (body parts), act like a female does, sound like a female, refer to yourself as female, but have no 'male' in your race your not a female. So then tell me what you are?

Edit: And how would you know anyway? we only know what we've seen on our home planet.

Modifié par Computer_God91, 31 mai 2010 - 08:32 .

[Crimmsonwind]

Tirigon wrote...

Crimmsonwind wrote...

Tirigon wrote...

For f*cks sake, Asari aren´t female, they have no gender. Period.

I really tire of this bullsh!t claiming otherwise.

Ok, list your supposed facts or reasons of why they are not female, and I will do my best to pick them apart.

I'm seriously contemplating making a "why asari are really female" comic, now. Thanks for yet another idea.

Being female requires there to be males of the same species. Unless it turns out there are male asari somewhere the ones we see in the game are not female but simply asari. "Female" is a word that has no meaning if there is no opposite.

They may not consider themselves female in that sense of the word, because they never had anyone to compare to. But they have boobs, they use feminine terminology to describe themselves, and then, there's the codex, which calls them an all-female race. There may not be meaning to the asari, but to all the other races in the galaxy that have male and female, they are indeed female. They were also designed by the character creators to be the "hot green alien babe" race, which says something. And that something happens to be "they're female."

@Les: Of course, that one is the first on my list. This one would be somwhere on the third or fourth spot.

[Computer_God91]

Tirigon wrote...
Being female requires there to be males of the same species. 

Apparently not.

[Tirigon]

Crimmsonwind wrote...


They may not consider themselves female in that sense of the word, because they never had anyone to compare to. But they have boobs, they use feminine terminology to describe themselves, and then, there's the codex, which calls them an all-female race. There may not be meaning to the asari, but to all the other races in the galaxy that have male and female, they are indeed female. They were also designed by the character creators to be the "hot green alien babe" race, which says something. And that something happens to be "they're female."

@Les: Of course, that one is the first on my list. This one would be somwhere on the third or fourth spot.

Other races consider them female because they look like female humans. Doesn´t mean they are female anymore than it means they´re humans.

And the whole "Boobs and genitalia" argument is invalid - most animals have neither but can still be female.

"Female" doesn´t describe anything in itself. It´s simply a word that marks the difference to the other part of the species, which we call male.

With asari however, there is no such difference, therefore there is no male and female either.

[Crimmsonwind]

Tirigon wrote...

Crimmsonwind wrote...


They may not consider themselves female in that sense of the word, because they never had anyone to compare to. But they have boobs, they use feminine terminology to describe themselves, and then, there's the codex, which calls them an all-female race. There may not be meaning to the asari, but to all the other races in the galaxy that have male and female, they are indeed female. They were also designed by the character creators to be the "hot green alien babe" race, which says something. And that something happens to be "they're female."

@Les: Of course, that one is the first on my list. This one would be somwhere on the third or fourth spot.

Other races consider them female because they look like female humans. Doesn´t mean they are female anymore than it means they´re humans.

And the whole "Boobs and genitalia" argument is invalid - most animals have neither but can still be female.

"Female" doesn´t describe anything in itself. It´s simply a word that marks the difference to the other part of the species, which we call male.

With asari however, there is no such difference, therefore there is no male and female either.

The other races have considered them female long before the humans got there. The humans are fairly new to the galactic community in Mass Effect. It's possible that the asari didn't really have a word for themselves other than "Asari" because they never had a comparison, but when they made contact with the other races, they also called them female. They don't call asari "it," they say "she." Having the genetalia of a female kind of points in that direction. And, again, you're forgetting that the very codex of the game calls them female. So deny it all you want, but as far as the game, the writers, and a good portion of the fans are concerned, the asari are an all-female race.

[Sago_mulch]

Tirigon wrote...

Crimmsonwind wrote...


They may not consider themselves female in that sense of the word, because they never had anyone to compare to. But they have boobs, they use feminine terminology to describe themselves, and then, there's the codex, which calls them an all-female race. There may not be meaning to the asari, but to all the other races in the galaxy that have male and female, they are indeed female. They were also designed by the character creators to be the "hot green alien babe" race, which says something. And that something happens to be "they're female."

@Les: Of course, that one is the first on my list. This one would be somwhere on the third or fourth spot.

With asari however, there is no such difference, therefore there is no male and female either.

KINDA REMINDS ME OF SLUGS, FISH AND SINGLE CELLS. THEY HAVE NO REAL GENDERS EITHER.

[Tirigon]

Crimmsonwind wrote...

the asari are an all-female race.

That is a meaningless statement that contradicts itself. If they are ALL the same there is no FEMALE. As said multiple times already, female only marks a difference that doesn´t exist for asari.

[Tirigon]

Sago_mulch wrote...


KINDA REMINDS ME OF SLUGS, FISH AND SINGLE CELLS. THEY HAVE NO REAL GENDERS EITHER.

Some fish have. But yea, that´s about it.

[Tirigon]

Eli-da-Mage wrote...

3. This is a pointless discussion because Asari are completely different from us.

Exactly.

[Crimmsonwind]

Tirigon wrote...

Crimmsonwind wrote...

the
asari are an all-female race.

That is a meaningless
statement that contradicts itself. If they are ALL the same there is no
FEMALE. As said multiple times already, female only marks a difference
that doesn´t exist for asari.

Oh, that's cool, don't read
everything else I wrote, just pull out one line of it. As also said multiple times already, you fail to read the codex of the game. You know, that thing that provides all sorts of useful background information?

You're also missing this: The ASARI may not consider themselves female, because, you're right, they are monogendered. They have nothing to compare themselves to, so gender has no meaning to them. But, as far as humans, turians, krogan, salarians, and just about every other race is concerned, the asari are female. Why? Because they look female, they sound female, the dress like females traditionally dress, they call themselves things like Matriarchs and Maidens and Matrons, and she and her.

Modifié par Crimmsonwind, 31 mai 2010 - 08:47 .

[Computer_God91]

Tirigon wrote...

"Female" doesn´t describe anything in itself. It´s simply a word that marks the difference to the other part of the species, which we call male.

looks like the dictionary has something to say:

Dictionary's Female Definition:
A person bearing two X chromosomes in the cell nuclei and normally having a vagina, a uterus and ovaries, and developing at puberty a relatively rounded body and enlarged breasts, and retaining a beardless face; a girl or women.

Hey look sounds like an Asari.

[Crimmsonwind]

Added note, I'm considering this all from a human perspective because a) we're human, Shepard is a human, it's a game so the creators are also human. Just saying, that could be why we are totally not seeing eye-to-eye.

[Tirigon]

Crimmsonwind wrote...

Oh, that's cool, don't read
everything else I wrote, just pull out one line of it. As also said multiple times already, you fail to read the codex of the game. You know, that thing that provides all sorts of useful background information?

There are too many inconsistencies in the codex to rely on it.

You're also missing this: The ASARI may not consider themselves female, because, you're right, they are monogendered. They have nothing to compare themselves to, so gender has no meaning to them. But, as far as humans, turians, krogan, salarians, and just about every other race is concerned, the asari are female. Why? Because they look female, they sound female, the dress like females traditionally dress, they call themselves things like Matriarchs and Maidens and Matrons, and she and her.

Asari can have children with women of other species. That is not possible for females.

[Tirigon]

Crimmsonwind wrote...

Added note, I'm considering this all from a human perspective because a) we're human, Shepard is a human, it's a game so the creators are also human. Just saying, that could be why we are totally not seeing eye-to-eye.

True. I do not think about that from a human perspective because asari are not human. It doesn´t make sense to see them as blue humans.

[Computer_God91]

Tirigon wrote...
Asari can have children with women of other species. That is not possible for females.

Because other females don't have the ability to mentally connect with other females.

[Crimmsonwind]

Tirigon wrote...

Crimmsonwind wrote...



Added note, I'm considering this all from a human perspective because a) we're human, Shepard is a human, it's a game so the creators are also human. Just saying, that could be why we are totally not seeing eye-to-eye.

True. I do not think about that from a human perspective because asari are not human. It doesn´t make sense to see them as blue humans.

Because they're not blue humans, they're just aliens that look suspiciously like hot blue chicks, which is pretty much their intended function in the game.



And asari don't reproduce through sexual organs, they reproduce through crazy mind sex. Humans can't reproduce with krogan either. The fact that an asari can even reproduce with other species PERIOD is unique.



We can only assume that the asari's nether-regions are intended more for baby delivery rather than intercourse, but that's just a bonus. But since you don't need sexual organs for your brain, that opens up the possibility for asari to pretty much nail anything and everything sentient.



The codex does need some ironing out, but the basics are there. Hopefully by ME3 they'll have everything sorted out, and the debate can really be put to rest.

[Tirigon]

Computer_God91 wrote...

Because other females don't have the ability to mentally connect with other females.

So it doesn´t make sense to apply human gender-terms to a race that is obviously so much different from humans.

[Computer_God91]

Eli-da-Mage wrote...

Computer_God91 wrote...

Tirigon wrote...
Asari can have children with women of other species. That is not possible for females.

Because humans don't have the ability to mentally connect with other females.

Fixed

I said other females because I'm pretty sure only the asari are able to do that, unless you've seen a salarian do it too.

[Tirigon]

Crimmsonwind wrote...
Because they're not blue humans, they're just aliens that look suspiciously like hot blue chicks, which is pretty much their intended function in the game.

I don´t argue that they LOOK female. But they aren´t.

And asari don't reproduce through sexual organs, they reproduce through crazy mind sex. Humans can't reproduce with krogan either. The fact that an asari can even reproduce with other species PERIOD is unique.

That, again, shows that human definitions of sex and gender can´t be applied to asari.

The codex does need some ironing out, but the basics are there. Hopefully by ME3 they'll have everything sorted out, and the debate can really be put to rest.

I agree. And I hope BioWare will then write down what they say in interviews and state that asari are NOT female.

[Computer_God91]

Tirigon wrote...

Computer_God91 wrote...

Because other females don't have the ability to mentally connect with other females.

So it doesn´t make sense to apply human gender-terms to a race that is obviously so much different from humans.

Well every other species does. Besides how different are they really? Blue, Melding, head tenticles.

[Computer_God91]

Tirigon wrote...

The codex does need some ironing out, but the basics are there. Hopefully by ME3 they'll have everything sorted out, and the debate can really be put to rest.

I agree. And I hope BioWare will then write down what they say in interviews and state that asari are NOT female.

They say that because they don't want to admit to a F/F relationship because they don't want to give a M/M relationship

[Tirigon]

Computer_God91 wrote...

Well every other species does.

I wonder why. It doesn´t really make sense for them, does it? Apparently their women are not much like asari. On the other hand maybe they consider them female because there are no krogan / salarian / turian women. We don´t see any, after all:police:

Besides how different are they really? Blue, Melding, head tenticles, not having a gender

[Crimmsonwind]

I'd keep going with this, but we just keep repeating ourselves. I've got to go anyway. I'll come back later and see if anybody's made any headway.