3478 réponses à ce sujet

[lovgreno]

Nightwriter wrote...

Well I had used the geth in my example because they would be at the least amount of risk of indoctrination from the base and thus the most fit to study it.

Now I realize the base should be handed over to the geth and the asari during a geth and human and asari PR campaign rally to encourage human-asari bonding and organic-synthetic relations.

Yeah, give it to Liara. She may have gone a bit nutty but I belive her expertise and contacts could start convincing the rulers of the galaxy of the threat with a piece of substantial evidence like the base. It would probably be best to leave Shepards tendency for smartassness and tantrums out of the political discussions though. But this would not be an option for the very insecure Shepard who thinks asking aliens for help is a sign of weakness of course.

[ThisIsMadness91]

Shandepared wrote...

If you've met one geth you've met them all.

If you've met one Cerberus operative you've met them all.

Shandepared wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...

Not technically true, in Legion's case.

Let me rephrase that.

You meet one heretic and you've met all the heretics. You meet one "true" geth and you've met all "true" geth.

And that's why they couldn't agree on whether to rewrite or destroy the heretics.

[Dean_the_Young]

ThisIsMadness91 wrote...

Shandepared wrote...

If you've met one geth you've met them all.

If you've met one Cerberus operative you've met them all.

Shandepared wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...

Not technically true, in Legion's case.

Let me rephrase that.

You meet one heretic and you've met all the heretics. You meet one "true" geth and you've met all "true" geth.

And that's why they couldn't agree on whether to rewrite or destroy the heretics.

Humans don't share identity, while Geth do. It is pretty accurate to say if you met one geth in a group you've met all those in that group: they are a single gestalt, even if it does have conflicting trends inside it. Legion not coming to a consensus is like someone torn between two choices: the lack of unamanity does not mean a lack of singularity.

[Mallissin]

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

WHAT DID HE SAY?! I must know!

Oh, and there's no way you could give the collector base to the "true geth" (using that phrase really makes the schism seem religious), since they won't leave the Viel.

[L3giticus]

Just read Retribution. THATS why you don't give TIM Reaper tech. its like giving a gun to a toddler and sending them off to daycare....nothing good will come of it

[L3giticus]

i agree that it should be studied. but in a much more controlled environment and by people who actually have morals.

[Dean_the_Young]

And the Council should be dissolved and a representative galactic cooperative organization should replace it, but that's not exactly an option either.

[Sajuro]

L3giticus wrote...

i agree that it should be studied. but in a much more controlled environment and by people who actually have morals.

Ah yes 'Morals' rules or principals that keep people from only acting on their own selfish desires, We've dismissed that claim.

[PWENER]

Sajuro wrote...

L3giticus wrote...

i agree that it should be studied. but in a much more controlled environment and by people who actually have morals.

Ah yes 'Morals' rules or principals that keep people from only acting on their own selfish desires, We've dismissed that claim.

Whatever in takes to keep humanity save, Cerberus understands this, because Cerberus is humanity!!!

[Pauravi]

Two reasons:

1: I consider the Geth to be, on the whole, possibly the wisest race in existence. Legion pointed out something that Sovereign said -- that by using their technology we "develop along the paths they desire". In fact, this makes an incredible amount of sense. The Collectors technology is advanced, but it is also REAPER technology. Who would know better how to counter it? Not only has using Reaper tech proved terribly dangerous so far, but I believe that using their own weapons against them is precisely what they'd want us to do. It is a folly that may very well make the battle even more difficult.

2: TIM is an evil motherf**ker.

[Valikdu]

Why do people destroy the Collector base?

Wizard's First rule works.

[lovgreno]

Pauravi wrote...
2: TIM is an evil motherf**ker.

Not realy evil but too idealistic for his own good. He and Cerberus is however inept wich is worse than being just evil.

[Inverness Moon]

Pauravi wrote...

Two reasons:
1: I consider the Geth to be, on the whole, possibly the wisest race in existence. Legion pointed out something that Sovereign said -- that by using their technology we "develop along the paths they desire". In fact, this makes an incredible amount of sense. The Collectors technology is advanced, but it is also REAPER technology. Who would know better how to counter it? Not only has using Reaper tech proved terribly dangerous so far, but I believe that using their own weapons against them is precisely what they'd want us to do. It is a folly that may very well make the battle even more difficult.

It doesn't work like that. You can't say that if other countries on Earth develop nukes that they're developing along the paths we desire and it somehow makes them weaker or anything, that is certainly not the case. If the Taliban or some other terrorist organization god its hands on top military technology like the latest tanks and stuff, we might know their capabilities, but that isn't going negate how dangerous they would be if they could roll around in tanks and learn how to use them to any degree. It's the same with reaper technology in Mass Effect. Implying that gaining weapons as powerful as what the reapers use somehow put at a disadvantage is ridiculous, especially considering how space combat works in Mass Effect. If we make something strong enough to penetrate their shields using their own technology, it doesn't matter how familiar with it they are, they're going to die.

Every time I see someone cite this example of why we shouldn't use reaper technology, I always get the feeling that they didn't put much thought into exactly what 'reaper technology' is and what impact it would make on the fight against the reapers.

Modifié par Inverness Moon, 31 juillet 2010 - 11:32 .

[MadCat221]

Another example why Cerberus is governed by folly:

If you complete Thane's loyalty mision with Talid surviving, Timmay's after-action report says the following:

"May have to support Elias Kelham and similar criminals to counteract anti-human bias."

Petty thug criminals.  To counteract bias against their species.  Wonderful logic there. 

As dope-slap-worthy as "Diplomacy is good but problematic when everyone already considers you a threat".  <_<

Tinkering with Reaper tech is dangerous enough, it's even moreso when done by an organization that sees prudent caution as an obstacle and has no self-accountability.  I see nothing but bad things happening with Cerberus having control of the Collector base.

Modifié par MadCat221, 01 août 2010 - 12:45 .

[Whatever42]

Any Renegade Shepard should give it to TIM in a heartbeat. Sure, TIM is a megalomaniacal retard with delusions of grandeur. However, you're going to end up killing him in the end and taking over anyway. With retarded Citadel Council dead and replaced with humans and with Cerberus's network, Shepard will be in charge and the galaxy will finally get some competent leadership.



We all know it. It's what we all really believe when we look deep into ourselves. We're the only intelligent, practical person in the universe and everyone else is a drooling idiot. It only makes sense that we take over.

[atheelogos]

Inverness Moon wrote...

Pauravi wrote...

Two reasons:
1: I consider the Geth to be, on the whole, possibly the wisest race in existence. Legion pointed out something that Sovereign said -- that by using their technology we "develop along the paths they desire". In fact, this makes an incredible amount of sense. The Collectors technology is advanced, but it is also REAPER technology. Who would know better how to counter it? Not only has using Reaper tech proved terribly dangerous so far, but I believe that using their own weapons against them is precisely what they'd want us to do. It is a folly that may very well make the battle even more difficult.

It doesn't work like that. You can't say that if other countries on Earth develop nukes that they're developing along the paths we desire and it somehow makes them weaker or anything, that is certainly not the case. If the Taliban or some other terrorist organization god its hands on top military technology like the latest tanks and stuff, we might know their capabilities, but that isn't going negate how dangerous they would be if they could roll around in tanks and learn how to use them to any degree. It's the same with reaper technology in Mass Effect. Implying that gaining weapons as powerful as what the reapers use somehow put at a disadvantage is ridiculous, especially considering how space combat works in Mass Effect. If we make something strong enough to penetrate their shields using their own technology, it doesn't matter how familiar with it they are, they're going to die.

Every time I see someone cite this example of why we shouldn't use reaper technology, I always get the feeling that they didn't put much thought into exactly what 'reaper technology' is and what impact it would make on the fight against the reapers.

I like everything you said good post:happy:

[V0luS_R0cKs7aR]

Inverness Moon wrote...

Pauravi wrote...

Two reasons:
1: I consider the Geth to be, on the whole, possibly the wisest race in existence. Legion pointed out something that Sovereign said -- that by using their technology we "develop along the paths they desire". In fact, this makes an incredible amount of sense. The Collectors technology is advanced, but it is also REAPER technology. Who would know better how to counter it? Not only has using Reaper tech proved terribly dangerous so far, but I believe that using their own weapons against them is precisely what they'd want us to do. It is a folly that may very well make the battle even more difficult.

It doesn't work like that. You can't say that if other countries on Earth develop nukes that they're developing along the paths we desire and it somehow makes them weaker or anything, that is certainly not the case. If the Taliban or some other terrorist organization god its hands on top military technology like the latest tanks and stuff, we might know their capabilities, but that isn't going negate how dangerous they would be if they could roll around in tanks and learn how to use them to any degree. It's the same with reaper technology in Mass Effect. Implying that gaining weapons as powerful as what the reapers use somehow put at a disadvantage is ridiculous, especially considering how space combat works in Mass Effect. If we make something strong enough to penetrate their shields using their own technology, it doesn't matter how familiar with it they are, they're going to die.

Every time I see someone cite this example of why we shouldn't use reaper technology, I always get the feeling that they didn't put much thought into exactly what 'reaper technology' is and what impact it would make on the fight against the reapers.

Well clearly you haven't thought too much, cause it doesn't work like that at all. All the examples you cite are examples of opposing forces with technological parity. Sure, the United States is advanced, but it's not that much more advanced than any other country/organization in the universe.

e.g. Contrary to what you say, we will never get a Thanix cannon as powerful as a Reaper gun on our ships. The mass effect drives that power the Reapers are just WAY more powerful than the drives that power our dreadnoughts.

Thus, the Reapers clearly enjoy an overwhelming technological dominance - they are that much more advanced than we are. An infinitely more relevant example would be the current day United States Air Force giving World War I Germany an F-16CJ jet fighter. Sure, the Germans would try to clone it - and let's say we give them 10 years to do so - but I bet my ass that the 2010 United States Air Force would absolutely destroy this hypothetical German Air Force.

This also illustrates that what we are researching from the Reapers may not necessarily be the best technology - for example, even if the Germans successfully cloned the F-16CJ, the USAF will just deploy the F-22 Raptor, which will massacre the F-16s - therefore the technological overmatch would be there and present regardless.

Modifié par V0luS_R0cKs7aR, 01 août 2010 - 03:54 .

[Giggles_Manically]

[Dean_the_Young]

...and if you don't, at least one major galactic species should be wiped out, a choice Shepard will have to make in the sense that his weaker armies can't be everywhere at once.



Which will it be? Can you not afford to reinforce the Quarian Flotilla as a Reaper fleet threatens to tear it to ribbons? Will you let Tuchanka be finally bombarded to dust?



Is protecting Earth at the cost of allien lives too racist?

[vehzeel]

I blew it up. Reaper tech is too dangerous to study. Who knows, if I don't destroy it, the Collectors maybe have some means to take it back. Collector cloning vats, another portal inside á la The Citadel, remote controls etc. And then maybe indoctrination devices. Definitely not worth the risk. Better to weaken them by destroying their base.

[Sajuro]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

...and if you don't, at least one major galactic species should be wiped out, a choice Shepard will have to make in the sense that his weaker armies can't be everywhere at once.

Which will it be? Can you not afford to reinforce the Quarian Flotilla as a Reaper fleet threatens to tear it to ribbons? Will you let Tuchanka be finally bombarded to dust?

Is protecting Earth at the cost of allien lives too racist?

What about not protecting earth?

[atheelogos]

vehzeel wrote...

I blew it up. Reaper tech is too dangerous to study. Who knows, if I don't destroy it, the Collectors maybe have some means to take it back. Collector cloning vats, another portal inside á la The Citadel, remote controls etc. And then maybe indoctrination devices. Definitely not worth the risk. Better to weaken them by destroying their base.

Collectors are dead no matter what you do so they can't take it back.

[Asheer_Khan]

atheelogos wrote...

vehzeel wrote...

I blew it up. Reaper tech is too dangerous to study. Who knows, if I don't destroy it, the Collectors maybe have some means to take it back. Collector cloning vats, another portal inside á la The Citadel, remote controls etc. And then maybe indoctrination devices. Definitely not worth the risk. Better to weaken them by destroying their base.

Collectors are dead no matter what you do so they can't take it back.

I wouldn't be so sure that all Collectors are dead.
Maybe that base was some kind of shipyard founded to build up reaper hosting necessary personel to handle such job when majority of converted Collectors can reside in other base or even on board of the Reaper ships.